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Opinion Game Dev Platform Xbox Series X: Phil Spencer Says You Haven't Understood The True Power Of Next-Gen Yet

azertydu91

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Sony fans love Mark Cerny. Can't XBOX fans like MS personalities? I'm sure you have harsh words for Cerny too.
Sure I don't get the praise cerny posts or the cerny god shit some posts and that road to ps5 was bad and boring.Just like Reggie fils aimé and his stupid body ready I don't understand the cult of personzlity
 

Casanova

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If they reduce input lag on consoles, I might switch back to consoles next-gen. Anyone have info on this? I don't really care about 60fps vs. 120fps as much - as long as all games are minimum 60pfs. Phil isn't a tech genius, nor is it his title to be a tech genius. For PR reasons, he also has to reduce inaccessible verbiage to the layperson, which is understandable. I'll wait for the games to make judgements about the company and their next-gen console launch. That's what it's all about.
 
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rofif

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MS has apologized for the Inside Xbox event though, mainly in mis-setting expectations and social media messaging. It's not like they constantly duck and dodge responsibility in admitting if they've messed up in terms of an event.

Right this moment you've got Sony and Naughty Dog DMCA'ing smaller Youtube channels over even posting memes related to TLOU II (that don't even use material from the game, even), and they don't seem to be owing up to the fact they're abusing their power on the YT platform in that regard.

So this isn't really a thing about one company willing to admit they've messed up and the other never does when we have examples in the past and current where all of these companies have messed up and failed to acknowledge it. But this thing with Spencer and the May 7th event isn't one of them; even before he said anything regarding difficulty in presenting next-gen gameplay, a TON of us were saying that immediately after the show, since places like YT, Mixer and especially Twitch compress the hell out of the streams and limit the bandwidth necessary for 4K adequately.

Spencer probably could've alluded to the idea of knowing them streaming the event was partially the problem, and double-down on skipping that and going with direct video uploads would work much better. Certainly did for Epic ;)



For competitive fast-action games like FPS and fighters, framerate literally makes or breaks the experience.
Maybe I am talking too much from my perspective.
I like single player games like Gears of war, Uncharted, God of War, Last Guardian Souls games. The nicer these games look, the better
 
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makaveli60

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Answering to everyone who quoted me: It's just so strange to me, while I was growing up we always talked about how good the graphics are in certain games and never about framerates. If it was not lagging, meaning if it was at least 25 fps we didn't care about that just drooled over the visuals. And it's so strange seeing so many people now whose main interest is high framerates. Does 120 fps really provide you that much more enjoyment as much it needs to be sacrificed to achieve it?
 

azertydu91

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Answering to everyone who quoted me: It's just so strange to me, while I was growing up we always talked about how good the graphics are in certain games and never about framerates. If it was not lagging, meaning if it was at least 25 fps we didn't care about that just drooled over the visuals. And it's so strange seeing so many people now whose main interest is high framerates. Does 120 fps really provide you that much more enjoyment as much it needs to be sacrificed to achieve it?
Yep I"ll finally see my health bar smoothly emptying against blood starved beast in Bloodborne.

Fuck that boss.
 

cyber69

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Answering to everyone who quoted me: It's just so strange to me, while I was growing up we always talked about how good the graphics are in certain games and never about framerates. If it was not lagging, meaning if it was at least 25 fps we didn't care about that just drooled over the visuals. And it's so strange seeing so many people now whose main interest is high framerates. Does 120 fps really provide you that much more enjoyment as much it needs to be sacrificed to achieve it?

For some it does. For me certainly, but not in a closed boxed that is budget limited. It’s a give or take situation. People were impressed by the UE5 tech demo by visual fidelity alone, not by framerate/resolution. I don’t expect developers to push for 4K at 60 FPS on either the PS5/XSX if they want to achieve visuals on par with the UE5 tech demo.
 
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ZywyPL

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Answering to everyone who quoted me: It's just so strange to me, while I was growing up we always talked about how good the graphics are in certain games and never about framerates. If it was not lagging, meaning if it was at least 25 fps we didn't care about that just drooled over the visuals. And it's so strange seeing so many people now whose main interest is high framerates. Does 120 fps really provide you that much more enjoyment as much it needs to be sacrificed to achieve it?

I remember those times as well. I think it all changed when we switched from CRT to LCD, when everything other than resolution went terribly downhill.
 

darkinstinct

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For some it does. For me certainly, but not in a closed boxed that is budget limited. It’s a give or take situation. People were impressed by the UE5 tech demo by visual fidelity alone, not by framerate/resolution. I don’t expect developers to push for 4K at 60 FPS on either the PS5/XSX if they want to achieve visuals on par with the UE5 tech demo.
Nobody is going to achieve visuals on par with the tech demo, that's why it is a tech demo. Add actual gameplay/physics/AI and you don't have the resources anymore to target those visuals. Spencer has been talking up framerate as the next big thing since four years ago and I am glad he is actually doing that. One X was the console that brought 4K. Series X will be the console that brings 60 fps at up to 4K. With those out of the way, we can look ahead for beautiful things to come. 60 fps games also play infinitely better on streaming services than 30 fps games do. So devs might want to target 60 fps even if they don't have to, just to get onto those services with their additional revenue streams.
 
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It is unbelievable to me that so many people would choose currentgen looking games at 120 fps instead of what we have seen in the UE5 demo. I just can't...
That's because you value quality over performance. I get motion sickness from games below 40 fps, Anthem on Xbox had me close to actually puking.
It's a very individual thing.
 

cyber69

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Nobody is going to achieve visuals on par with the tech demo, that's why it is a tech demo. Add actual gameplay/physics/AI and you don't have the resources anymore to target those visuals. Spencer has been talking up framerate as the next big thing since four years ago and I am glad he is actually doing that. One X was the console that brought 4K. Series X will be the console that brings 60 fps at up to 4K. With those out of the way, we can look ahead for beautiful things to come. 60 fps games also play infinitely better on streaming services than 30 fps games do. So devs might want to target 60 fps even if they don't have to, just to get onto those services with their additional revenue streams.

When you over indulge in snake oil.

X1X also promised 60 FPS. Enjoy Minecraft and Assassins Creed Valhalla at 30 FPS on the XSX (and PS5). And many more titles to target 30FPS on next gen consoles.
 

Rikkori

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There's only one sure road to smooth motion goodness.

 
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There's only one sure road to smooth motion goodness.

This is misleading.
Blue light is for cooling only. If you want more performance you HAVE TO go red.
I heard Sonys SSD solution is running on 7 internal extra bright red LEDs, that's why they have not shown the console yet; it's too obvious.
 

mrBarrelNut

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I don't think I'm ever going to play any sub 60fps first person shooters again. Doom 2016, Doom Eternal, Titanfall 2, Halo 5, Wolfenstains, COD:MW etc. have shown that great stable 60 fps experience was possible this gen on my X1X, so it should be standard feature when it comes to next gen. Same applies to racing games as well.
 
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JCK75

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Not everyone can see the difference. I know that I cannot.

The greatest impact is on controls and how quickly the character responds to what you do on the controller..
When I play an online shooter, I won't settle for less than 144 fps these days.
 

scalman

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Yes i wanna feel that next gen power all over pls show it to me soon.. give it to me.. where is it?
 

mckmas8808

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This is true we have so many new options for how a game can be made & as time go by & devs try new tricks like the using ML , Raytracing , precomputeing , volume rendering , image based rendering , photogrammetry & even remote processing things are going to look a lot different from what we are seeing now.

And all of the bolded are things that can be shown in a video. Hmmmmm......
 

DeepEnigma

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Why are there Sony fanboys claiming that MS needs to show games? If I remember correctly, and please tell me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it ONLY MS that had the balls to show off not only gameplay, but the console, AND controller? While Sony has only tweeted a controller? No gameplay, no nothing?

I'm a PC gamer, so I'm not biased to either console, but it's funny how some fans can shit on another company, yet their company of choice hasn't shown shit?

Your “disclaimer” is so full of shit.
 
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Boss Mog

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News flash Phil you can demonstrate faster frame rates via videos. And if the person's screen can't process high framerate videos above 60 then they won't be able to play at those framerates either, so it's moot. Seems more like excuses because they have nothing compelling to show.
 

Lethal01

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I would prefer 60 FPS and toned down graphics a little, playing an action game or shooter on a high difficulty is more difficult at 30 FPS to get timing correct and reactions are too slow at 30 for any fast paced game.

Most COD players prefer 60 fps for sure, I am one.

However, high quality visuals at 60 FPS is still a challenge as you have half the frame time.

But I think any more frame rate is a waste on console, we are not using gaming mice anyway.

On a shooter or something that relies heavily on camera movement I agree. But tons of actions games feel great at locked 30fps. Astral Chain and even Bayonetta for example. You can increase responsiveness without increasing framerate. Games can register your inputs faster than they display them.
 
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HighResTomato

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He’s not talking to the PC crowd here.

He’s talking to the people who just buy consoles to play video games and don’t know about all this next gen talk.

When he said “how do you show how something feels?” That’s a tricky thing to do when the selling point of your new games do not come across on the devices people watch content on.

A lot of people don’t even know you can adjust playback settings on YouTube For mobile in regards to frame rate or how many people have ever experienced video games like PC gamers do?

I finished Shadow of Mordor on console and loved it, then played it on a friends PC at Max settings and 60 FPS. Ordered a gaming PC (with the help of the gaming pc builders thread here) the next week.

Mainstream console players have no idea how far behind consoles were up to this point.


News flash Phil you can demonstrate faster frame rates via videos. And if the person's screen can't process high frame-rate videos above 60 then they won't be able to play at those framerates either, so it's moot. Seems more like excuses because they have nothing compelling to show.

Nonsense.
 
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Lethal01

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Nobody is going to achieve visuals on par with the tech demo, that's why it is a tech demo. Add actual gameplay/physics/AI and you don't have the resources anymore to target those visuals. Spencer has been talking up framerate as the next big thing since four years ago and I am glad he is actually doing that. One X was the console that brought 4K. Series X will be the console that brings 60 fps at up to 4K. With those out of the way, we can look ahead for beautiful things to come. 60 fps games also play infinitely better on streaming services than 30 fps games do. So devs might want to target 60 fps even if they don't have to, just to get onto those services with their additional revenue streams.

The Unreal Engine Ps4 tech demo was surpassed in a couple years, as was the ps3 demo. Thinking that a tech demo's visuals will be the limit of the consoles graphics is silly.
 

leo-j

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Yes, because computers can’t show video at 120fps.....

I guess they shouldn’t show anything at all.
 

azertydu91

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Nobody is going to achieve visuals on par with the tech demo, that's why it is a tech demo. Add actual gameplay/physics/AI and you don't have the resources anymore to target those visuals. Spencer has been talking up framerate as the next big thing since four years ago and I am glad he is actually doing that. One X was the console that brought 4K. Series X will be the console that brings 60 fps at up to 4K. With those out of the way, we can look ahead for beautiful things to come. 60 fps games also play infinitely better on streaming services than 30 fps games do. So devs might want to target 60 fps even if they don't have to, just to get onto those services with their additional revenue streams.
Oh no it will be surpassed, in the first couple of years probably only by first party studios from both sides, then slowly by the rest when they get used to the consoles.Look at the Unreal demo in the beginning of this gen.I thibk it has been far surpassed by first and third parties (even without the midgen refresh).Hell Ryse and infamous looked better to me and they were launch window titles.

Unreal is like the pilot of a new car it did an amazing first run but isn't used to the car yet, it will do better later.
And other pilots will try those new cars and some will discover thing they can do now that wasn't possible before.

I just hope there will be enough time before other mid gen refresh.To avoid splitting the work for too much SKUs.It is what happened this gen ps4pro and x1x aren't used to their full potential so we lost a bit of optimization there.Maybe more scalable engines will help but will it be enough?

But we will definitely be getting better looking games and maybe even better engines even though Unreal 5 seems amazing maybe some others will do even better (I hope frostbyte will follow as well as others).

I'm optimistic for this gen way more than with ps4/x1 that seemed to up a bit Ram and Gpu but were really meh on the cpu side.

I also really want to see what Nvidia is cooking with their next cards dlss seems really good and sometimes I feel like I bought my RTX 2080 a bit too early.
 
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Reggie asked Phil the question so I'm not sure why Sony are being bought up at all.

MS have invested lot into Dynamic Latency Input so this isn't just about frame rates.

Phil has talked about it previously:
 
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Rac3r

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When will this guy shut the hell up? Stop talking and show us something.
 
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DeepEnigma

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Someone sounds triggggggered! Lol, didn't know you were interested in Xbox at all?

Oh yeah, I’m so “triggered”. Get over yourself.

I’ve been PC gaming since the C64 on up. I can get all of their games on the PC now which I am thankful for.

But continue with your “pretending to hide behind your PC” as a “neutral” stance when it comes to console wars.
 

cyber69

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The Xbox Series X is technically capable of delivering frame rates of up to 120 FPS, but developers will ultimately get to decide what works best in terms of the balance between visuals and frame rate.

"Sony Computer Entertainment boss Ken Kutaragi has claimed that the PlayStation 3 will run games at an unprecedented (and perhaps rather pointless) 120 frames per second. "
 
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Gavon West

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Why are there Sony fanboys claiming that MS needs to show games? If I remember correctly, and please tell me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it ONLY MS that had the balls to show off not only gameplay, but the console, AND controller? While Sony has only tweeted a controller? No gameplay, no nothing?

I'm a PC gamer, so I'm not biased to either console, but it's funny how some fans can shit on another company, yet their company of choice hasn't shown shit?
Right??
 

DoctaThompson

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Oh yeah, I’m so “triggered”. Get over yourself.

I’ve been PC gaming since the C64 on up. I can get all of their games on the PC now which I am thankful for.

But continue with your “pretending to hide behind your PC” as a “neutral” stance when it comes to console wars.
You'll see me give equal shit to both Sony and Microsoft, so I'm unsure why you thought you could try and call me out, but EPICLY failed? Look at my post history, as I've argued with both camps equally as much.

I don't care how long you have been PC gaming, as you are currently a warrior for your favorite console now, so all of that is irrelevant.

And I'm exactly that, neutral. I'll be playing exclusives from both Microsoft and Sony. It you don't like what I say, I can help you navigate the way to ignore my posts. It's really simple, I promise.
 

DeepEnigma

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You'll see me give equal shit to both Sony and Microsoft, so I'm unsure why you thought you could try and call me out, but EPICLY failed? Look at my post history, as I've argued with both camps equally as much.

I don't care how long you have been PC gaming, as you are currently a warrior for your favorite console now, so all of that is irrelevant.

And I'm exactly that, neutral. I'll be playing exclusives from both Microsoft and Sony. It you don't like what I say, I can help you navigate the way to ignore my posts. It's really simple, I promise.

 

Justin9mm

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Anything would be a true leap over the OG Xbox One lol.. I truly believe their exclusives for the next 2 years supporting that piece of shit will not be good for them.