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Xbox Series X WDSN530 has custom ASIC to support PCIe 4.0 (Tweaktown corrects PCIe 3.0 claims)

Mr Moose

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...you realize that MS contracted out Seagate to develop these drives for Hotswaps right? Parity is paramount, there's no gen 3 internal Gen4 external trickery from MS. It's looking desperate at this point Gaf
So the tear downs are wrong and the consoles don't have PCIe 3.0 2.4GBs WD drives?
The tweet is talking about Seagate, which are PCIe 4.0 SSDs external.
 
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The_Mike

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Would it not be better to compare the same game doing the same thing on XSX and PS5?

No. They did with bc and the PS5 lost despite the ssd is faster.

People are saying the games aren't coded for the ssd, while forgetting xbox one x has an ssd.

And even if the PS5 has some sort of secret sauce, it would only benefit first party games. No third party game developer want to spend extra time on a game for one platform.

Or... Maybe that's why games costs 80 euro on ps5?
 

cyber69

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People are saying the games aren't coded for the ssd, while forgetting xbox one x has an ssd.


 

ethomaz

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I'm a big confused about that.
You show a expansion SSD teardown to debunk the internal SSD part?
I mean all the videos until now points to the internal SSD being a WD SN520.

There are theories about that only being the SSD on demo/preview Xbox send to journos and the retail uses another SSD but nobody showed a tear down of the SSD in the retail unit to be sure.

Same for these out of context Jez (usual) twitters lol
 
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cyber69

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I'm a big confused about that.
You show a expansion SSD teardown to debunk the internal SSD part?
I mean all the videos until now points to the internal SSD being a WD SN520.

There are theories about that only being the SSD on demo/preview Xbox send to journos and the retail uses another SSD but nobody showed a tear down of the SSD in the retail unit to be sure.

Same for these out of context Jez (usual) twitters lol

Confused on this bit as well. Regardless, the drives Microsoft is using fall within PCIe gen 3 specs. So it really doesn't matter if its Gen 3 or Gen 4 slot. Gen 4 is backwards compatible with Gen 3 drives.
 
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ethomaz

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Confused on this bit as well. Regardless, the drives Microsoft is using fall within PCIe gen 3 specs. So it really doesn't matter if its Gen 3 or Gen 4 slot. Gen 4 is backwards compatible with Gen 3 drives.
Yeap there is no issue for performance... an PCI-E Gen4 controller can works without any issue with a PCI-E Gen3 SSD.
 

scydrex

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No. They did with bc and the PS5 lost despite the ssd is faster.

People are saying the games aren't coded for the ssd, while forgetting xbox one x has an ssd.

And even if the PS5 has some sort of secret sauce, it would only benefit first party games. No third party game developer want to spend extra time on a game for one platform.

Or... Maybe that's why games costs 80 euro on ps5?

Mmm dosen't NBA 2k21 load faster on PS5? Or they said something like it would use the SSD?
 

ethomaz

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Because the topic is about the internal SSD that come with Series X and not the expansion SSD sold by Seagate.
I'm really confused how the people are twisting that to the external expansion SSD sold by Seagate... that one is obvious a Seagate one.

Below is is the internal SSD that two teardown showed... if you look at the other said you will see the seal with WD SN530 OEM part.

Some are saying that is the SSD that are present in the review/preview units and not the retail ones... but nobody showed the SSD on retail unit being different... instead keep quoting guys on twitters spinning the talk to the teardown of the Seagate expansion SSD that has nothing with the subject lol




So for now all the people saying it was debunked is just lying or spreading FUD.
 
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ReBurn

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time to find something else to fucking whine and complain about....did anyone look at the holes on the top of the XsX? Too big? Too small? Let's run with that for a bit, warriors.
We really need to talk about how they cheaped out and painted the holes green instead of including an led.
 

Thirty7ven

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I like the quick resume time.

Quick resume is a good way to shorten the load time compared to a cold boot but it won’t do anything to fast travel loadings.

Personally think that we should be seeing better performance here. 16 seconds for fast travel is beyond what should be expected from next gen.
 
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AgentP

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What is the published speed? 2.4GB/s? If they meet that, it doesn't matter if it is 3.0 or 4.0 right? Not sure how it matters.
 

A.Romero

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Well, now I'm curious. Not that really matters but the wording in the website posted in the first page clearly refers to the SSD array. It'd be OK if they don't mention it is 4 and just focus on the 2.5 spec they mentioned before.
 

Spukc

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So how much is the bullshit disney card from microsoft priced vs the actual pc part ?
 

Andodalf

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What are the odds of this thread dying a quiet death, now that some of the worst FUD in all of 2020 has been thoroughly debunked?

Did you know that the PS5 has 13 TF, to pair with its 24gb of HBM2? Makes the XSX’s 10TF look bad!


But if you dare imply that the PS5s variable clocks are variable I will post pictures of me shitting in every thread until you get banned.............
 

ethomaz

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To the surprise of absolutely no-one in their right mind, this was a non-story from the start.

Time to eat crow. You know who you are.
That is interesting.
The SSD is indeed the SN530 like the OP state (it was never debunked because it is indeed true) and they used a custom ASIC to support PCI-E 4.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Is MS confused?



And no one said it's not supporting PCIe 4.0, because it needs to be slightly customized to run through 2x PCIe 4.0 lanes instead of naturally 4x lanes like all m.2 SSD's. This will ensure that you can't upgrade the internal storage cheaply as all of them are meant to run through 4x lanes.

The off the shelf one runs through 4x lanes:

  • Read speeds up to 2,400 MB/s and low power consumption leverages both the PCIe Gen3 x4 interface, as well as sophisticated NVMe power management


My Samsung 970 Pro PCIe 3.0 can work natively on PCIe 4.0 motherboards. So the only customization done here is more like "castration". Now we understand why it's using 2x lanes, which was pretty weird to read in the hot chips.

Keep that crow in the fridge in the meanwhile. :lollipop_tears_of_joy:

EDIT:

Like PCIe 3.0, PCIe 4.0 is forward and backward compatible. This means that PCIe 4.0 can be used as a direct replacement for PCIe 3.0, but it also means that if you connect a PCIe 3.0 card to the PCIe 4.0 slot, the card will perform to the PCIe 3.0 specs.

 
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DrAspirino

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And no one said it's not supporting PCIe 4.0, because it needs to be slightly customized to run through 2x PCIe 4.0 lanes instead of naturally 4x lanes like all m.2 SSD's. This will ensure that you can't upgrade the internal storage cheaply as all of them are meant to run through 4x lanes.
May I present to you...THE CHINESE!!!!


The "original" Apple PCIe SSD that came with my Macbook Air uses 4-lane m.2 PCIe slot, yet I can use it on my own PC USING A F*CKING PCIe 1X SLOT.

AND IT WORKS.

And you know how much I had to pay for that adapter? 20 USD. t w e n t y b u c k s.

So... on XSX AND XSS people should be able to use "off the shelves" parts for internal storage as well as expansion using adapters that basically just change the pinout in connections (which is cheap af).

In fact, on the x360 era, you could upgrade the internal storage using a fairly common WD blue hard drive that you could buy for cheap. You just had to change the firmware and that was it. The chinese even sold those enclosures for around 10 bucks iirc.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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May I present to you...THE CHINESE!!!!


The "original" Apple PCIe SSD that came with my Macbook Air uses 4-lane m.2 PCIe slot, yet I can use it on my own PC USING A F*CKING PCIe 1X SLOT.

AND IT WORKS.

And you know how much I had to pay for that adapter? 20 USD. t w e n t y b u c k s.

So... on XSX AND XSS people should be able to use "off the shelves" parts for internal storage as well as expansion using adapters that basically just change the pinout in connections (which is cheap af).

In fact, on the x360 era, you could upgrade the internal storage using a fairly common WD blue hard drive that you could buy for cheap. You just had to change the firmware and that was it. The chinese even sold those enclosures for around 10 bucks iirc.



Those mofos got answers for everything, but COVID-19. :lollipop_tears_of_joy: Someone needs to test that.
 
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Allandor

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Is MS confused?



And no one said it's not supporting PCIe 4.0, because it needs to be slightly customized to run through 2x PCIe 4.0 lanes instead of naturally 4x lanes like all m.2 SSD's. This will ensure that you can't upgrade the internal storage cheaply as all of them are meant to run through 4x lanes.
Actually, no, that's wrong.
Yes I presume you cannot add every SSD into the box. But every SSD should also work with just 2 lanes if the system doesn't offer more. It is the same like with graphics cards. You can stick a x16 card into an x1 slot (if it is open) and use the card. It works. It won't be fast, but it works.

So if you stick a x4 nvmessd into the slot, it should work (in theory). There still can be a software side problem (no supporting drivers, etc) but the lanes should not be the problem.

So the teardown confirmed the OP.
It is a WD SN530 drive.

These that said it was debunked or FUD are eating crow right now :D
it's a customized drive. yes. But it supports PCIe gen4 with 2 lanes. That's what many people here (including yourself) just don't want to admit.
Just keep your little fanboy warrior inside yourself away from the keyboard ;)
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Actually, no, that's wrong.
Yes I presume you cannot add every SSD into the box. But every SSD should also work with just 2 lanes if the system doesn't offer more. It is the same like with graphics cards. You can stick a x16 card into an x1 slot (if it is open) and use the card. It works. It won't be fast, but it works.

So if you stick a x4 nvmessd into the slot, it should work (in theory). There still can be a software side problem (no supporting drivers, etc) but the lanes should not be the problem.

Has anyone tested that? It's not that simple.
 
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Allandor

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Have anyone tested that? It's not that simple.
From the specification of the m.2 slot this should work. From the software-side it might not. So even if you try it you may fail ;)
But it would be interesting for sure to test it with a 2TB SSD. But how many so small 2TB SSDs are there that are that fast.
 
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ethomaz

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it's a customized drive. yes. But it supports PCIe gen4 with 2 lanes. That's what many people here (including yourself) just don't want to admit.
Just keep your little fanboy warrior inside yourself away from the keyboard ;)
It is the same drive... any teardown will show the same drive SN530.
WD chanced the ASIC controller to support PCI-E 4.0.

People were calling the teardown in this thread to be fake or debunked when it was not.
 

Bo_Hazem

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From the specification of the m.2 slot this should work. From the software-side it might not. So even if you try it you may fail ;)
But it would be interesting for sure to test it with a 2TB SSD. But how many so small 2TB SSDs are there that are that fast.

If there is enough headroom you can use a larger one without bolting it + 4x lanes to 2x lanes adapter + pray that there is nothing in the system that is meant to disapprove non-proprietary SSD's.
 
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