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Yoshi vs JordanN Debate Apocalypse Episode 1: "Stop calling Republicans Racists"

Yoshi

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Get rid of the word "Racist" and the Democrats have nothing left going for them.

Not all republicans are racists. You are not being called a racist for supporting Republicans, but for your racism. Everything you post in terms of politics is about race, the dying out of your preferred race, the inferiority of certain races. You are the most racist person I have ever conversed with over an extended period of time. I would have no trouble naming quite a few Republicans or Republican supporters who are not racist (to my best knowledge).
Like holy shit, I really do hate Western politics. Everything is about fucking race. We can't talk about anything else anymore?
I do not know if you even realise how ironic that is.
 

JordanN

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Not all republicans are racists. You are not being called a racist for supporting Republicans,
My chronicles of Resetera hot takes disagrees.

Yoshi said:
You are the most racist person I have ever conversed with over an extended period of time.
Riddle me this.
What racist person has publicly came out in support of Native Americans on Neogaf like I have?

You have 5 seconds to name 5 users who have campaigned for Native Americans. Don't google it, I'm giving you 5 seconds from the time you read this post to answer.

Can't do it? Then I contradict all your claims I am "the most racist person you've conversed with".
 
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Yoshi

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My chronicles of Resetera hot takes disagrees.
No. It is true that some people call all Republican voters racists, but you are not being called racist because of that, but because you make everything about race and identify superior and races (and ones to protect) on top of that.
What racist person has publicly came out in support of Native Americans on Neogaf like I have.
Are you fucking kidding me? Do you not feel that this is slightly specific? On top of that, keep in mind what you said positively about native Americans. You basically used them as a racist talking point against Blacks and Hispanics because of their lower fertility rate. On top of that, separating people by their race and deeming them protectable based on that is racist, even if used in a positive connotation.
You have 5 seconds to name 5 users who have campaigned for Native Americans. Don't google it, I'm giving you 5 seconds from the time you read this post to answer.
THe funny thing about your racism - if there ever is anything funny about racism - is that you manage to even make your arguments against being racism racist. Not being racist is not being exemplified by saying something in support of one race in comparison to others. On the contrary.
 
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I can't wait to read more. I'm going to hit the bed now, but I expect both of you - Yoshi and Jordan - to continue the battle. Tomorrow, I want to read pages of back and forth!
 

JordanN

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Why is it ok to be extremely pro-immigrantion, but not the opposite?
Something something "we gotta help people of the world!".

Even though in places like Toronto, 40% of homeless shelters are now populated by immigrants/refugees.


The meme about the left wanting to create more poor/impoverished people is ringing more true. Gotta keep the misery engine well oiled.



 
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LegendOfKage

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I appreciate that you two guys are doing this, but I'd like to see more questions and fewer accusations. If JordanN is a racist, let his values and beliefs inform us of that fact, as we hear them from Jordan himself.

Jordan, I've seen you make a lot of comments about statistical differences as they relate to race. First an acknowledgement. I think I've seen you make the claim that white people are statistically inferior to at least two or three other races, in various aspects of intelligence and such. Assuming I'm remembering correctly, perhaps you view this as proof that you couldn't be a racist.

Personally, I've always viewed racism as taking generalizations about a group and applying them to individuals in a group. Not that the generalizations are okay in the first place, because they're not. So a few questions:

Do you feel that is a fair description of racism?

Do you ever find yourself doing that?

Do you dislike like it when others generalize straight people, white people, men, or any other group?

Do you feel what you're doing is different because of statistics that you've found?

What do you feel separates the beliefs you've formed based on statistics you've read, and the beliefs of people with opposing ideology based on the statistics they've read?

I think there's a real danger in looking at statistics, and then forming negative views on groups of people simply because they're supported with research. I think I've seen you engaging in what I consider statistical racism, but I don't mean that as an attack, and I'm happy to hear your side of the issue.
 

DESTROYA

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Talking about race doesn’t mean your a racist . JordanN does bring race up a lot of times but that’s generally the topic in the OP.
He/She does not come across as a racist person though.
 
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prag16

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separating people by their race and deeming them protectable based on that is racist
This would get you banned (again) on resetera, if said regarding almost any minority race. Just pointing that out.
 

Boss Mog

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JordanN? Racist?


I am shocked. Shocked I say!
Can you actually show us something blatantly racist that @JordanN has said? Please don't pick something fact based, like him saying blacks commit more violent crime per capita than whites. I wanna see something that proves to us without a doubt that he is clearly racist. Something like "all _______ people are scum and should be killed" or along those lines.

To people like you a "racist" person is a white person (obviously) that doesn't buy into the bullshit narrative that people like @Slayven are putting forward, which is that black people are "surviving on knife's edge" in the US, even though it doesn't stop him from spending his days chilling, posting about comic books on Era all day. I don't think black people have been worse off since Trump took office, I think most average Americans, black or white, saw little to no change to their daily lives.
 
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AfricanKing

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Can you actually show us something blatantly racist that @JordanN has said? Please don't pick something fact based, like him saying blacks commit more violent crime per capita than whites. I wanna see something that proves to us without a doubt that he is clearly racist. Something like "all _______ people are scum and should be killed" or along those lines.

To people like you a "racist" person is a white person (obviously) that doesn't buy into the bullshit narrative that people like @Slayven are putting forward, which is that black people are "surviving on knife's edge" in the US, even though it doesn't stop him from spending his days chilling, posting about comic books on Era all day. I don't think black people have been worse off since Trump took office, I think most average Americans, black or white, saw little to no change to their daily lives.
What was JordanN banned for this year ?
 
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Shaqazooloo

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I do remember JordanN getting banned for racism in that thread about genetics or something? It did seem kind of racist yeah, because of the wording and him refusing to answer yes or no to whether he thinks certain races are inferior to another and then the following response suggests that the answer would've been yes but he didn't want to say that because it would be a gotcha.

Edit: Couldn't find the post or the ban message? I was pretty sure it happened in late January?
 
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Shmunter

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Being a republican has nothing to do with being racist or elitist or discriminatory in any way. The conservative idea of equality is 'equality of opportunity'. An egalitarian ideology where every individual is treated exactly the same and judged by their character not their gender, race or sexual orientation. No favors played.

Progressive idea of equality is 'equality of outcome' aka 'the end justifies the means' and applies to identity groups, not individuals. To give a minority group equality, they must be elevated up and those deemed above need to be brought down so things can be balanced. This is where things like racism towards whites is perfectly fine, believe all women, Islamophobia, punching down, etc comes from. Its authoritarian, and completely justified in the pursuit of 'equality'.

I believe in the conservative idea of equality, and at the same time acknowledge support for the less fortunate is important to allow them to succeed. But not at any cost.

Whats happened here unfortunately is that the Progressive ideology has spun out of control and become a toxic and vile movement that has overreached significantly and evolved to a cult like state. If you're not hard-line with them you are essentially worthless in their eyes and are treated as such. People do not like being labeled racist, misogynist, etc. especially when they know full well they are not. This constant overreach and overreaction by progressives is creating the ever wider rift between them and everyone else.

I hold the progressives wholly responsible for the toxicity in today's political climate. They are a cancer and must be removed for a healthy society. Hitler wanted an ideal united Europe, people bought into it - but this goal could never justify his means.
 
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Whitesnake

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I still have yet to see anyone give even a single example of JordanN being racist.

Screenshot, thread link, anything?
 
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I'm waiting for proof Jordan is racist too.

No doubt he enjoys threads involving whites and minorities and he'll do his cut and paste articles saying whites are doing better, but all he's really doing is pasting info that whites might be doing better or have lower crime rates.

If someone wants to interpret that as racist, go ahead. You might want to claim the source of the info (likely some database or government stat tracking census) is racist too.

Just because a stat metric says one group is doing better than another in some regard doesn't mean it's racist.

Believe it or not SJWs, the world isn't 100% equal to a T. SJW lefties should already know that as that's why they fight so hard to equalize things with a snap of the finger instead of working for it.
 
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kegkilla

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No. It is true that some people call all Republican voters racists, but you are not being called racist because of that, but because you make everything about race and identify superior and races (and ones to protect) on top of that.
Are you fucking kidding me? Do you not feel that this is slightly specific? On top of that, keep in mind what you said positively about native Americans. You basically used them as a racist talking point against Blacks and Hispanics because of their lower fertility rate. On top of that, separating people by their race and deeming them protectable based on that is racist, even if used in a positive connotation.
THe funny thing about your racism - if there ever is anything funny about racism - is that you manage to even make your arguments against being racism racist. Not being racist is not being exemplified by saying something in support of one race in comparison to others. On the contrary.
Post some examples of him being racist, or shut the fuck up.
 
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Boss Mog

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Jordan, like a lot of posters here are oddly obsessed with the destruction of the white race, but I guess that's just about power preservation.
More like preservation of civilized society. I could care less what somebody's skin color or ethnicity is, all I care about is what they think, how they behave. People whose beliefs and behavior go against that of civilized society shouldn't be allowed to live within a civilized society, this goes for whites, blacks and all the colors in between.

I can't help it if the vast majority of illegal immigrants to the US and Europe aren't white. I just think everybody wanting to move to a country should have a love for the country and its culture, be at least somewhat proficient in its language and willing to master it, they should have qualifications and employment prospects and most importantly they should go through the process of legal immigration and be thoroughly vetted before being allowed to enter said country.

You and your fellow clowns here only care about skin color. YOU ARE THE RACIST ONES. You have no fixed morals or ideals. In every situation it's back the brown person. He's a thug, doesn't matter, he's a rapist, doesn't matter, he's a murderer, doesn't matter, he's an ISIS member, doesn't matter, etc... Always champion brown is your creed. People like me champion good people, no matter what race they are, we want people that will make our societies better, not worse. You want open borders, well what if the US suddenly took in 100 million white Europeans, people that were vetted, spoke English well and could find work and make positive contribution to the US. You guys would be outraged and want the border closed immediately, so the issue for you is about taking in brown people and nothing else.

Should first world countries try to do more to help the third world, absolutely, but when we want to do it, people like you shout out "exploitation" and "colonialism" and convince the third world countries not to take our help. Instead you call for brown people to come in en masse which cripples our countries in terms of finances and crime and creates the racial tensions we have now and helps no one, not the people in first world countries, not the migrants that come and not the people in the third world countries, everybody loses. If we actually want to help people in third world countries we need to make sure our own countries are doing well and then go help them develop their own countries. It's like on a plane, the flight attendant tells you to make sure to secure your oxygen mask before trying to help out somebody else, because you can't help somebody if you need help yourself. We already know what happens when civilized society completely collapses because it happened when the Roman Empire collapsed after being invaded by barbarian hordes. Humanity lost over 1000 years living in the dark ages. Countless technologies such as aqueducts, irrigation and sewage systems, cement were lost. Gone was the first senate and political system that is the basis of our democracies, replaced by tyranical mornarchies.
 

Yoshi

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Before I start answering on the various postings, let me highlight that the first part of the thread title is not from me. It is not intended by me as an ongoing debate. I was forbidden to react to JordanN's sheer endless racist talking points in the Resetera thread, but am allowed to answer in separate thread(s) in Politics. The only alternative would be to let JordanN's racism uncommented, but I am culturally primed in a way that letting racism slide is extremely dangerous. In no community I respect I would do that. (This also serves as an answer to @eclipze )

@Yoshi should define racism before his 'debate' starts I think
Racism is the belief, that humans can and should be separated by race and that these races are superior/inferior to each other (in various aspects) or should receive preferential treatment on the basis of their race. It is expressed, also in race-based generalisations.

Why is it ok to be extremely pro-immigrantion, but not the opposite?
Being extremely pro immigration is not disrespectful or harmful to others. Being extremely contra immigration, even in cases with legitimate reasons for asylum, is jeopardising other people's life.

Look at this.



Look at how many times the word "race" is repeated. Does anyone see any facts/statistics/data presented? Nope.

So what's there left to debate? This topic is over man.
(also answering to)
@Yoshi Can you give some specific examples of JordanN saying racist things?
So what do you want, that I make a statistic how often you bring up race-based talking points in political contexts? Almost all of your political statements (including those made in the Resetera thread) focus very strongly on race. In fact, you are very much aware of your own racism, even though you want to deny it here:
The examples I have are not based on individual anecdotes. But I cannot discuss it further without risking ban territory.
From the same thread (in a post you recycle every now and then), arguing for worth of immigrants based on their race:
Previous immigration policies before the 1960s still allowed people of all races to move to Western countries.

There are Chinese, Indian,Black, Jewish communities that are hundreds of years old and obviously required permission to be there.

I see nothing wrong with going back to those policies compared to today, where most endless migration is coming from Asia.

The best indicator for your deeply ingrained racism of course is your month long obsession with posting about fringe intelligence research. A search for ?q=iq+black+white&c[users]=JordanN yields three pages of postings! Postings such as this:
There's nothing to ignore. Your data simply doesn't follow reality.



Again, they've tested for over a 100 years, black IQ has only gone up 2 points. From 83 (World War 1 army testing) to 85 (1979 court ruling). Saying they're going to overtake whites in a matter of days when they're 1 standard deviation behind is nonsense.
That's the genetic difference.

And to not stop there, if black IQ really was rising and overtaking whites, that wouldn't explain why we still see big differences in SAT scores. They would have to be over-represented or be at the top, instead of averaging lower scores than both whites and Asians.

Now in the Resetera thread you are in an endless monologue about white genocide, to the absolutely insane point of fear-mongering that white genocide actually means people will go out and hunt white people:

You also continue to struggle with the definitions for racism, because you happen to match them so well:
I looked up the definition of white nationalism.

"White nationalism is a type of nationalism or pan-nationalism which holds the belief that white people are a race[1] and seeks to develop and maintain a white national identity.[2][3][4] Its proponents identify with and are attached to the concept of a white nation.[5] White nationalists say they seek to ensure the survival of the white race, and the cultures of historically white states. They hold that white people should maintain their majority in majority-white countries, maintain their political and economic dominance, and that their cultures should be foremost.[4] Many white nationalists believe that miscegenation, multiculturalism, immigration of nonwhites and low birth rates among whites are threatening the white race,[6] and some argue that it amounts to white genocide.[6] "

Honestly, that's a weird definition since are we suppose to ignore that white people literally came from Europe and started nations there? Am I a Japanese nationalist for saying that Japan has been mostly Japanese since prehistoric times and remains so today?
That in no way should imply some kind of racism unless it's now considered racist to look at history. Am I a racist for saying the Roman Empire inhabited Europe and not South America, and the Romans were mostly Native Europeans and not Koreans, Mongolians, Aboriginals or Bantu?
Yet see yourself as an actual moderate anti-immigration voice:
If I'm the moderate voice of anti-immigration, imagine the hard liners that will eventually emerge because they will feel frustrated no action is being done.
Luckily though, you are wrong in calling yourself moderate.

So what do you do on the Resetera thread? You just whine endlessly because people who fight systematic suppression use inconsiderate (I agree in some cases, also racist) wording to express their frustration and anger about systematic oppression. Is it OK to call out particularly distasteful generalising comments against white people? Of course it is. But you, as an exemplary racist are not the right messanger there.
Something like "all _______ people are scum and should be killed" or along those lines.
He hasn't said anything like that here to my knowledge. If he did and it was not met with a permanent ban, I would have requested an immediate deletion of my account here.
This would get you banned (again) on resetera, if said regarding almost any minority race. Just pointing that out.
Why is that important? Resetera operates with a different definition of racism, which is not a definition I agree with, but one that does have its merits to some degree (still, as I said, I do not agree with this redefinition of the term. Racism + power is just racism + power, not the meaning of racism). In terms of JordanN' s racism is does not make a difference either way though. Since I am banned for lifetime at Resetera, I do not think I would be well-adviced to adjust my speech here to the rules of the other forum.
To people like you a "racist" person is a white person (obviously) that doesn't buy into the bullshit narrative that people like @Slayven are putting forward, which is that black people are "surviving on knife's edge" in the US, even though it doesn't stop him from spending his days chilling, posting about comic books on Era all day.
This is wrong.