Saint Gregory
Member
Xisiqomelir said:
People buy different stuff.
Excellent selection for both consoles IMO
Innotech said:
Based on my observations you're giving him too much credit...
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NYT on Wii Software Sales According to (banned site) and Pacter. guess which first?
- Thread starter Gaborn
- Start date
Excellent selection for both consoles IMO
Based on my observations you're giving him too much credit...
CrapSandwich said:
Well, hell they can't do it all...
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
ExciteTruck
Warioware Smooth Moves
Wii Play
Big Brain Academy
Mario Party 8
Super Paper Mario
Mario Strikers Charged
Metroid Prime 3: Corruption
Donkey Kong Barrel Blast
Battalion Wars II
Super Mario Galaxy
Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn
Super Smash Bros. Brawl
Mario Kart Wii
That's quite a catalog of games first party wise within just a year and a half or so of the system being on the market. (and I'm sure I forgot some games up there)
Well I think the way Nintendo are looking at it...they are giving developers and publishers support throughout on many levels technical and financial. Plus Wii as a platform has a massive base for them to make games for and growing. What more can they offer? Fund an entire development of a game?:lol
Nintendo doesn't need to be reaching out for support...their hands have been reaching out for developers from day 1...but they are being left hanging whilst third-parties supposedly wait for the bottom to fall out in Wii sales and market...
Nintendo's E3 conference will be very interesting...maybe there will be some announcements that go against the current stance that is being held? I atleast hope so as a Wii owner...but I very much doubt it.
Nintendo doesn't need to be reaching out for support...their hands have been reaching out for developers from day 1...but they are being left hanging whilst third-parties supposedly wait for the bottom to fall out in Wii sales and market...
Nintendo's E3 conference will be very interesting...maybe there will be some announcements that go against the current stance that is being held? I atleast hope so as a Wii owner...but I very much doubt it.
Gaborn said:
Hmm...Nintendo has quantity on their side and has never been an issue. I think the issue and concerns people bring up is the quality aspect. I mean look at how many small developer games are on the Wii. There are tons of games on it by big and small developers and publishers. But very few are worth putting money down for...
MedievalManIII
Member
ruby_onix said:
MUDSLINGING!
HEY GUYS, LETS GO PLAY IN THE MUD! MUMS JUST WASHED MY SHIRT!
Mudslinging aside, they do make some good points about themselves and GAF, albeit biased towards themselves. Also, the immense amount of animosity from GAF really got to ioi. :C
Version 3.0
Member
Dot50Cal said:
Like I said in my post a couple pages back, he adjusts the numbers as he sees fit. Hell, it's only the first rule of independent tracking. But who cares? Throw it out the window!
F#A#Oo said:
True enough. It may be harder to measure in some ways, but to clarify, I wonder which system will see the best newly announced third party games. And by "best" I'm talking more about major franchises and such. For example, during the N64 days we saw Final Fantasy and a host of other big series jump consoles. This generation we've already seen MH3 jump. Will Sony see more franchises jump consoles than are announced to be returning to the PS3? To me, if and when that happens that will be when it well and truly is "Game Over" for the PS3 this generation.
Golden Darkness
Member
Gaborn said:
Well before that you have the mainline Dragon Quest jumping to the DS. But then Dragon Quest didn't have many high profile releases on Playstation platforms compared to Final Fantasy.
I don't think we'll see another big franchise shift to Nintendo platforms in a while, manly because the people behind them want the hardware power to make their games look as "realistic" as possible...
QuickKick89
Banned
tabsina said:
For some reason, whenever somebody bashes Nintendo, it is automatically guaranteed a 20-page thread. There is no doubt that the company brings about the most polarization in not just the gaming industry, but the tech industry altogether - there is no fucking doubt.
Oh, and Xisiqomelir, where is Brawl?
One more thing, John Dvorak gave his thoughts on this in his podcast, and he makes a good point. It's right here: http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=17372
somewhat random aside, but I'm soooooo sick of people passing along that tired 'fact' the Wii buyers only bought the Wii for Wii Sports, have never bought a game since and their Wiis are now sitting, covered in dust, in their closets. Oh, and that the reason for that neglect is that Nintendo hasn't put out enough appealing software to appease the masses.
it isn't a fact - it's just something MS, Sony and their fanboys and girls say over and over and over again in the hopes that the masses will believe it and will ditch the Wii. thankfully, I don't think too many people are paying attention.
personal experience: I've bought more software this generation (for the Wii and other consoles) than I ever bought last generation. I've already bought 11 games (MK will make it 12) for the Wii this generation, compared to the 5 I bought for the GC (I have a woeful 7 for the PS2 right now, though I used to have more...).
it isn't a fact - it's just something MS, Sony and their fanboys and girls say over and over and over again in the hopes that the masses will believe it and will ditch the Wii. thankfully, I don't think too many people are paying attention.
personal experience: I've bought more software this generation (for the Wii and other consoles) than I ever bought last generation. I've already bought 11 games (MK will make it 12) for the Wii this generation, compared to the 5 I bought for the GC (I have a woeful 7 for the PS2 right now, though I used to have more...).
QuickKick89
Banned
Ventrue said:
I don't see people trolling Apple on message boards, do you?
Golden Darkness
Member
QuickKick89 said:
No. But you do have high profile critics.
And incidently John C. Dvorak, who has infamous criticisms on Apple, stated today that the stories out there are being twisted to hurt the Wii. http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=17372
Golden Darkness said:
You know, I've been thinking about that, and it's all well and good that you want your game to look good, that that's a big selling point. But if there aren't enough people buying the console in the first place what does it matter if a game looks good? Some developers seem to want it both ways, they want their games to "look good" but they want to have an established user base that justifies their support of the console. *eyes Square-Enix*
At some point I wonder how much economics is going to come into play. I don't get the sense developers are very willing to take risks, so in one sense I suspect they'll devote more attention to the 360 (since the PS3 is floundering and the Wii is "different" but at the same time, they simply can't ignore the Wii's user base. Perhaps games like Monster Hunter will pave the way for other games?
rohlfinator
Member
Most of the reaction here seems to be due to the chartzzz citing, not the Nintendo bashing (and the article itself isn't even "bashing" the Wii, really... it's just poorly written and sourced).QuickKick89 said:
That's a valid point, but games like CoD4 are showing that you don't have to target the largest userbase to be wildly successful. We'll see how Final Fantasy fares, but I think this generation is going to be more about third parties targeting the correct market, rather than simply looking at userbase.Gaborn said:
Phife Dawg
Member
Oh, which newspaper was this?Cosmozone said:The banned site was also cited in my local newspaper (one of the biggest newspapers in Germany).
:lolsupermario128 said:
Version 3.0
Member
QuickKick89 said:
Nintendo makes it easy to argue--although that's not what this thread is about.
Nintendo makes excellent games, have contributed as much or more to this industry as any other company has (and they obviously know how to make money at it), but they also are very obtuse and make illogical and frustrating decisions. The latest in-your-face example would be the lack of (usable) storage on the Wii, but also things like bashing online play last gen, or smaller, odd things like not allowing character selection in Mario Kart Double Dash LAN games, or forcing players to watch Link get the same item dozens or hundreds of times over the course of the last decade of Zelda games.
In any case, they're a very 2-sided coin, but you have people on both sides who will swear they can do no wrong, or do no right. So yeah, you nailed it: polarization.
_Alkaline_
Member
CrapSandwich said:
Oh come on, in 1 and a half years, Nintendo have given you a new Zelda, a new Mario, a new Metroid, a new Mario Kart, a new Paper Mario, a new Fire Emblem, a new Smash Bros, a new WarioWare, a new Battalion Wars, and more, plus new stuff like Wii Sports, Wii Fit, etc.
Nintendo is giving you more than enough software.
rohlfinator said:
Well sure, I agree a game can be successful (both as multi platform and just flat out on a less popular console) in differing situations that weren't as common in previous years, but the thing is AAA titles aren't really the best measure of a system's success in my opinion, at least to a point. I mean, don't get me wrong, I think that AAA titles, like any other title will tend to do best with the system with the largest number of people in the demographic they're targeting, but at the same time those games CREATE their own userbases, that's why they're system sellers.
I'd be shocked if FF13 fails, even if, say, it was the Godfather 3 of the series. At the same time there are a lot of quality, lets say AA titles (Uncharted for example, or HSG mainly in Japan) that AREN'T living up to expectations even though they're in the same vein of titles that would traditionally appeal to the Play Station user base.
viciouskillersquirrel
Member
It's essentially because for the most part, they march to the beat of their own drummer, external trends or criticism be damned. The gamer*, a creature that has grown accustomed over the years to having its opinions listened to, might find this frustrating and if its needs are not being served by Nintendo, perhaps even offputting. Even Nintendo fans find Nintendo's decisions frustrating at times.Leondexter said:
* When I say "the gamer", I refer to the gesaltic aggregate of every avid gamer in existence.
the Pokemon battle game is the sketchy one. for what it is, Links Crossbow Training is a phenomenal little game. So fun. and it presents a unique solution to FPS style movement.Avrum said:Bah, see? I knew it. I also forgot, Pokemon Battle Revolution and Link's Crossbow Training... well, that last one is a bit sketchy I suppose.
theguy said:
So is the problem with the site that the numbers are inaccurate, or that they base their numbers on proprietary data from market research firms?
I don't really see how it can be both, wouldn't that mean the problem is that the proprietary data itself is inaccurate?
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
There is the possibility that ioi gets data from NPD and selectively changes his forcast. He makes his predictions based on whatever but routinely changes it when it doesn't vibe with what people think is the most sound data (NPD, media create, etc). Since he SELECTIVELY makes his guesses on weird rules, he probably selectively changes the data based on limited NPD data. No, that doesn't mean NPDs data is false. NPD's data is what it is: estimates based on statistical sampling. Companies feel comfortable with NPD's data sampling and estimates. But they are transparent. ioi wouldn't stand up to scrutiny from any company.xbhaskarx said:
Since they are reading this thread, I'd like to reply.
You're right. We're so jealous that the New York Times quoted you.
So hey VG Chartz, how many game developers, industry insiders, and game journalists post on your forums?
Huh?
What's that? I can't quite hear you. You'll have to speak up.
You're right. We're so jealous that the New York Times quoted you.
So hey VG Chartz, how many game developers, industry insiders, and game journalists post on your forums?
Huh?
What's that? I can't quite hear you. You'll have to speak up.
The Faceless Master
Member
what happened was he pooled the data from the marketing research firms, then put his own spin on the formula to get his "real" numbers, then maybe a year or more later, months after being after being banned from gaf, he started predicting sales, so it actually is both, just not at the same time.xbhaskarx said:
frankie_baby
Member
rohlfinator said:
but a pleased as acti-blizz probably are with with COD4's sales they're probably kicking themselves for not having a wii version as i may be wrong but i believe the wii version of 3 outsold the ps3 version (despite being crap)
The Faceless Master said:
I see, different time frames.
So is the site banned because he used marketing research data a few years ago, or because his current data is inaccurate?
Also, is there evidence/proof that he used proprietary data? Did he admit it? Is that why he got banned?
The Faceless Master
Member
it's banned because the current data is just guessing on the same level that people who particpates in the NPD prediction threads are capable of, and some people always kept trying to use them as "real numbers" in arguments.xbhaskarx said:
as far as the data goes, he didn't just admit, he discussed how he adjusted things up or down a bit as he saw fit due to what he felt were inaccuracies in the numbers of various marketing research firms.
Example of ioi numbers:
Ammount of consoles produced: 1 million
Ammount of consoles sold according to NPD, M-C etc. : 950k
Ammount of consoles sold according to ioi: 1.1 million
He just pulled 150k out of his ass.
At one point WiiSports sold more than the Wii itself in NA and Europe. (MIND BLOWN!)
Ammount of consoles produced: 1 million
Ammount of consoles sold according to NPD, M-C etc. : 950k
Ammount of consoles sold according to ioi: 1.1 million
He just pulled 150k out of his ass.
At one point WiiSports sold more than the Wii itself in NA and Europe. (MIND BLOWN!)
It's from ssj12 on page two of this thread that I'm not linking to.theguy said:
http://www.________.com/forum/thread.php?start=0&id=24618
Because the banned site still thinks we're the ones who need more education on the subject...xbhaskarx said:
Ioi was a Gaffer with the same info as the rest of us nobodies (it's called Sales-Age). He took the info we had and changed it (without any facts to back it up) into something he thought was more "real". People told him that adding random, arbitrary crap to facts doesn't make new facts. He wouldn't listen and got into fights with those people. It was the fights that got him banned.
Then he made his own site and forum and found some lackeys with probably more talent and credentials than himself and used them to spread his brand of crap across the internet. Somewhere along the line he supposedly managed to get some illegal sales info that the rest of us don't have, which might make his info slightly real and newsworthy, although he's almost certainly doing the same old arbitrary crap to the data before releasing it.
His site was banned because noobs were increasingly bringing his crap in here and calling it news and using it as fact in arguments without knowing that we already know all about Ioi's numbers. When it got annoying enough, the site was banned. It was the noobs who caused the site banning, not anything Ioi's site did in particular (unless you want to count misguiding the noobs).
Ioi is proudly fooling major institutions into believing he's a professional, credible authority on videogame sales data, he uses each sucker as proof that he's somehow right, and is probably making some decent money on a bucketful of lies mixed with a dash of illegal data.