• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII Import Thread

HTupolev

Member
I am alluding more to the lack of polish than content though. Suspect textures do not bother me but other people have far more issues with them. I guess the Crystal Tools just didn't cut it in the end and that must be disappointing to the designers.
Did SE actually make any kind of serious attempt to make it seem like the game would be polished? I'm extremely baffled by anyone whose expectations were of a "AAA" seventh-gen production.

Heck, part of why I'm cautiously excited for LR is that's it's a AA title that remembers its AAA roots. It's a rare situation in this day and age. Sloppy shenanigans were inevitable, but it always had potential to be interesting in its own right.

People complaining of graphical tackiness is like, preorder not cancelled news.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I played the demo, I really liked it (the game play at least). Am I doing something wrong ? Why did I enjoy the demo so much .. :(
 

LuuKyK

Member
I played the demo, I really liked it (the game play at least). Am I doing something wrong ? Why did I enjoy the demo so much .. :(

Why are you blaming yourself for enjoying something though? Its not because someone else didn't like it that you are forced to do the same. If you liked it, you liked it, regardless of others opinions, so chances you are going to enjoy the full game are great, which means = go for it and form your own opinion after playing the full game yourself.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Why are you blaming yourself for enjoying something though? Its not because someone else didn't like it that you are forced to do the same. If you liked it, you liked it, regardless of others opinions, so chances you are going to enjoy the full game are great, which means = go for it and form your own opinion after playing the full game yourself.

I know, but after reading sooooo many negative things you kind of create a mental image and when something opposing happens, you just think maybe it's you :p

Again, I quite enjoyed the demo, I can totally see how the story/characters of the game might turn out to be completely stupid, but the game play itself seemed entertaining and fast paced and I enjoyed the brief demo.
 

Ninjimbo

Member
A good battle system can save a game.

RoF was more confusing and repetitive to me than fun though, although I have it, like it, but hardly play it.
I don't really like the game. Even though the battle system is interesting, I couldn't get over the fact that the game felt purposeless. There was nothing pushing me forward in terms of rewards and unlockables except for maybe buying clothes for the party. I played it for about 20 hours, got stuck in what was going to be a grueling side quest and decided to quit.

I was kind of disappointed with it after hearing how better it was than FFXIII. FFXIII, for as much as it gets dogged, at least it felt like it was building towards something the whole time both in story and in gameplay. It's one of the reasons why I like it. It's very focused. RoF needed some of that.
 

Kagari

Crystal Bearer
I know, but after reading sooooo many negative things you kind of create a mental image and when something opposing happens, you just think maybe it's you :p

Again, I quite enjoyed the demo, I can totally see how the story/characters of the game might turn out to be completely stupid, but the game play itself seemed entertaining and fast paced and I enjoyed the brief demo.

The demo shows only a tiny tiny sliver of what you do in the full game.
 
D

Deleted member 20920

Unconfirmed Member
I wonder if Kagari would have given the game a higher score had she played through the whole thing on Normal. It wouldn't have fixed the story or anything, but making clock management more difficult might have cut down on the amount of time spent doing mind-numbing fetch quests before the end arrived.

Well, that sucks. What's the point of a time-limited real-time clock if it's just gonna leave you waiting around most of the time?

They did say they made adjustments to the whole time mechanics. On Normal I started out thinking that I didn't have time but once you get used to using Chronostasis it becomes quite easy to abuse the system. And I don't think a "don't abuse the system" restriction on your own playthrough would work because sometimes you just have to use Chronostasis when you have time-locked doors and events. Missing a timing for a main quest meant you needed to wait till the next day. If you don't have other things to do or not know what to do in the mean time you might end up wasting time. What I think should have happened was that instead of stopping time, they should have let Lightning be able to reverse or advance time instead at a higher GP cost.

I played the demo, I really liked it (the game play at least). Am I doing something wrong ? Why did I enjoy the demo so much .. :(

The battles and customisation are the best parts of this game, a game that is unfortunately too small and brief to allow it to breathe. The demo didn't have any of the annoying quests. I was mostly alright with the quests but I can see how some of them can deter players from wanting to continue playing.

One downfall of the game is that its scope made the interesting parts less effective than it would have been. The game is obviously too small, so much so that they had to lock weapon customisation to new game plus, so small that they needed you to run through the game and all its quests at least twice to get the full rewards. Want a better accessory than this one that gets you 15% increase in magic? Run through the game again and open the same chest to get the upgraded version! Want better weapons? They are only buyable in Hard Mode. Rank4 is the max you can go in Normal. Rank 5s are only in Hard and from what I heard some of the weapons are really expensive. Want more gil? Kill monsters to get them but ops, you managed to fight them into extinction now so either you go next playthrough or fight mobs that give less gil. The option to skip to the next playthrough but it becomes rather tedious as the collecton would probably amount to nothing. Maybe Hard mode's harder monsters might justify it but I haven't tried it so I can't comment.
 

adamsapple

Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
The demo shows only a tiny tiny sliver of what you do in the full game.

If that means there's more VARIETY in game play, that's good then ..

The battles and customisation are the best parts of this game, a game that is unfortunately too small and brief to allow it to breathe. The demo didn't have any of the annoying quests. I was mostly alright with the quests but I can see how some of them can deter players from wanting to continue playing.

Yikes, do you mean the contents of the quest themselves, or how they're presented (as in stupid acting, non-sensical plot points etc) ?
 
I conquered the Ultimate Lair, and it wasn't that ultimate...I had more difficulty on some Last Ones than on the final boss of that bonus dungeon.
But hey now I can cast Ultima! (I don't use it though...)

I'm now in the final dungeon, I'll stay a while there so I can get the 3 final Last Ones of the game.

So yeah, I guess the only real problematic trophy is going to be the one to kill Aeronite. Not only does it have A LOT of HP, but he deals massive damage too. It's going to take some strategy and stat/equipment farm I think. Any other trophy I'm still missing is easy to get.
 
D

Deleted member 20920

Unconfirmed Member
Yikes, do you mean the contents of the quest themselves, or how they're presented (as in stupid acting, non-sensical plot points etc) ?

Like Kagari has said, they can be quite fetch questy. One quest required the following steps:
1. Talk to quest giver (let's call him A)
2.Find the person that the quest giver wants you to find (let's call him B)
3. B wants you to go find out the secrets to all the food stalls in the food street.
4. Goes and eats at all 6 stalls.
5. Goes back to B and B asks that you kill a monster for its drop.
6. Kills monster, gets drop and then goes back to B.
7. B gives you an item that you in turn give to A. A then gives you an item to give to B.
8. Gives item to B and the quest is complete.

And all these happen in a section of one of the maps. It's just a lot of running around in a small area.
Plot spoilers for the side quest:
A is a cook who came up with a new recipe and needs help refining it. Business has been bad. B is some well known food critic and wants Lightning to find out about the secrets of the 6 food stall. B tells Lightning that the secret to good food is always a secret ingredient or some rubbish like that. Lightning goes off to hunt for that secret ingredient (which is just a few tens of steps away). B later gives Lightning the newly improved recipe. A is grateful about the it and wants to thank B. Turns out that B is actually A's son, who left the father years ago to pursue his own career. Happy family reunion happens!. And all the while both of them have been long lost or something, despite being just a minute's walk away from each other. I can't remember whether the son knew he was helping the dad but secretly pretended not to know. Too many subquests plots about families.
 
Hmmm that review confirms a few of my fears. Namely that the environments are sort of badly planned. A lot of the screens, while pretty impressive, nevertheless made the environments seem like big, bland expanses with things of interest sort of plopped here and there really conspicuously. There's an image of the Dead Dunes that exemplifies this. I don't care about graphical quality, but the quality of the design is kind of important.

The side quests sound similarly mundane to XIII-2's. So many of the sidequests in that game felt like the kinds of challenges you'd make in the park creator in a Tony Hawk game.

I thought the story in XIII-2 had some really strong points. The showdown at the end was really well executed, and despite the fact that the convolution of the plot sometimes made it difficult to really know what was at stake, the end game still managed to be really powerful. What I can't gather then from any of the reviews and impressions is whether LR's narrative has similar "good moments" or whether it's just a mess through and through.

It also seems like Lightning's become less of a character or a person and more of a sex-object, not to mention that any nuance in the script seems to have been replaced with action-hero one-liners that most western games are pretty intolerable because of.

Finally, I can't really ascertain from the reviews and impressions whether or not the doomsday clock is frustrating or not really much of an issue. How you cope with it seems to depend on how you play.

I feel sort of obliged to play this game eventually, but I might just stick with the soundtrack until the actual game's going cheap. Actually, the thing I'm looking forward to most is the soundtrack.

Nevertheless, I kind of feel that if you want this game to fail, you shouldn't really be reviewing it. I think wanting a game to fail and reviewing it is fine if that game ought to fail (perhaps it's horrendously sexist or racist, or just distasteful in general), but I don't necessarily think LR is one of those games. FF games have always been about doing and trying new things, and even if those new things don't turn out to be that good, I still think the effort should be appreciated. It's very unusual to see a triple-A company experiment or migrate outside of comfort zones. It goes without saying then that such conservatism is not a good thing - it's only practiced for the sake of profit, not creativity.

One last thing: people complaining about Ali Hillis' voice work should really be directing the blame towards the directors, not Hillis herself - we already know she's talented enough. Good direction plays a huge part in the quality of a performance.
 

RangerBAD

Member
If Kagari wants to do the OT, what's the problem? Someone has to do it. It's just a matter of being informative and that's it. It doesn't have to be radiating with love, but that it never hurts if it is. :p
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Wow, was kinda put off by that 50%.

Then I read the review and...

-Excellent OST
-Great artistic direction
-Great battle system
-Deep customization system
-Bloated JRPG story

Everything I look forward to in a JRPG is right there. I guess I'm going to enjoy this one?

With Kagari's reviews about the XIII trilogy I always find it easy to filter her comments to my needs. If she says story sucks, I'm going to expect an excellent emotional journey for example. You know she dislikes the series and the staff behind it, so more she bashes on it more must be good to me. It's that easy. I also find myself in disagreement when I read the 9.5 she gave to ARR mentioning of all the things the quality of its story/script when I did find it the most offensive in the franchise after I, II and III (that were justified for their time). I can't take her reviews in regards to XIII seriously, even if the reviews don't make any unrealistic assumption, you can feel all her dislike applied to every single element. There's always a feeling of free negativity filtering everything, so it's difficult for me to sympathize with the reviewer. I appreciate her efforts, but all in all it's exactly as if I'm going to write a review about the game giving 10/10. You know it can't be.

If the DEMO and first hour of the game is anything close to what I can expect for the rest of the game, then I'm sure this is going to be my favorite in the trilogy.
 

Mr. RHC

Member
Jesus H Christ to the comments section on Kagari's review.

This is a disgusting review and this site is undeserving of its name.


lol this is unbiased review? This Erren Van Duine hates Lightning, what else do you expect? Not only that, a nonsensical story from XIII-2 deserves an 8/10??? Don't make me laugh. I've played LR myself, it's in no way a 5/10. This is like giving Dragon's Dogma Dark Arisen a 5/10 and everybody knows how fun and addicting that game is. Dumb score is dumb.


5/10 . Stil too high .
= 12 Downvotes


Rejoice, this pile of salt will get us through winter!
 

Asd202

Member
With Kagari's reviews about the XIII trilogy I always find it easy to filter her comments to my needs. If she says story sucks, I'm going to expect an excellent emotional journey for example. You know she dislikes the series and the staff behind it, so more she bashes on it more must be good to me. It's that easy.

God damn it Perfo. I would like to live in a world you live in! :p
 

Lain

Member
Finally got my OST! I must say I'm disappointed with the packaging, though I should have expected it considering it's not a limited edition type of thing.

I've read Kagari's review. Nothing really controversial in it that I can see, especially after having followed this thread.
Even if negative, it's informative, and that's what I expect out of game reviews (the best review for Blood Omen: Legacy of Kain for me, for example, was a negative but informative review that gave it a 6 and reinforced my decision to buy the game on release) so good work Kagari.
 

dramatis

Member
I wonder if Kagari would have given the game a higher score had she played through the whole thing on Normal. It wouldn't have fixed the story or anything, but making clock management more difficult might have cut down on the amount of time spent doing mind-numbing fetch quests before the end arrived.
It depends on how hardcore you are, I suppose. Guy running on Normal said:
Here's the result of a recent test: I did 101 (about 95%) quests by end of Day 5, slept from Day 6 to 12 then Day 13 unlocked
That means if you're a maniac you can probably complete all the quests super early.
 

raven777

Member
finished the main quest for 2 cities on day 3.

So far I am really enjoying the battle. Its somewhat challenging on normal difficulty and its quite fun so far. Could get boring later on though...

And the story and writing....I think it is a lot worse than XIII and XIII-2 which were already bad. A lot of the cutscene dialogues are cringeworthy.
 
I think NPCs having schedules and times when they appear for quests is neat in theory, but only if they do it like Xenoblade where you can adjust the time of time whenever you want.
 

Wagram

Member
I also find myself in disagreement when I read the 9.5 she gave to ARR mentioning of all the things the quality of its story/script when I did find it the most offensive in the franchise after I, II and III (that were justified for their time). I

While she's certainly entitled to her opinion, the ARR review from her has vastly impacted my ability to take her reviews seriously.

I've been a player of 1.0 since launch, and have dealt with the drudgery. There is no way in hell ARR is a 9.5 by any means.

The majority of the plot is: can you fetch me a bottle of honey, can you slay 3 dodos, can you go slay titan, BUT FIRST A FEAST!

Hilariously bad writing on their part, which makes me question how good the story in LR just might be.
 

Whompa

Member
That means if you're a maniac you can probably complete all the quests super early.

I mean, this is the third time I've heard this happen. Not sure if it's the player who's at fault, or the game just having total shit pacing...probably the latter though.
 

Kagari

Crystal Bearer
I mean, this is the third time I've heard this happen. Not sure if it's the player who's at fault, or the game just having total shit pacing...probably the latter though.
I had a ton of quests done early too. The game's pacing is just bad.
 

Whompa

Member
It's a real shame too. Square was criticized for having their game be too linear, then the third game where they finally open it all up, it has nothing to do after a few side quests...sigh....
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
While she's certainly entitled to her opinion, the ARR review from her has vastly impacted my ability to take her reviews seriously.

I've been a player of 1.0 since launch, and have dealt with the drudgery. There is no way in hell ARR is a 9.5 by any means.

The majority of the plot is: can you fetch me a bottle of honey, can you slay 3 dodos, can you go slay titan, BUT FIRST A FEAST!

Hilariously bad writing on their part, which makes me question how good the story in LR just might be.

ARR lacks a story, characterization, good writing, cutscene direction and everything that makes a tale entertaining. The XIII series surely doesn't have the best writing ever seen in a game, but keeps you interested in the events and characters at least have a (thin sometimes perhaps) personality instead of having 0 of it like every single main character in Eorzea. I keep saying this but it didn't surprise me seeing Lightning's FATEs writing more interesting than everything else preceding it in ARR. It's just so boring that even a character that doesn't have anything to do with the game sounds more interesting than what's there already. That's how bad it is. Luckily ARR is a funny game so I can forget about that. It's just that through all this I can't agree with Kagari when she speaks badly of the XIII series in regards to the story. She's very informative when speaking of gameplay aspects and all, but as for the story I tend to skip everything she says.
 

Mr. RHC

Member
ARR lacks a story, characterization, good writing, cutscene direction and everything that makes a tale entertaining.

With all due respect , but you're are just wrong.

ARR
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
somewhere, somewhere... XIII

ARR will be forever and ever be a better game than XIII and sequels.
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
With all due respect , but you're are just wrong.

ARR

.
somewhere, somewhere... XIII

ARR will be forever and ever be a better game than XIII and sequels.

I think ARR falls behind XIII in regards to art direction, presentation, soundtrack and story. Gameplay though is largely better I can give you that.
 

Mr. RHC

Member
I think ARR falls behind XIII in regards to art direction, presentation, soundtrack and story. Gameplay though is largely better I can give you that.

pokemon-red-battle-o.gif

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Jmty_NiaXc
FF XIII uses corridor map...... it's not very effective...

ARR uses beautifully crafted HD towns and Ul'Dah Night Theme! OH, it's super effective, who would have expected that?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6imm8t4B0o


FF XIII fainted... into a deep crystal slumber.

Toriyama runs to the next Gamestop Center to return Lightning.
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
lol ARR vs. XIII. Apples and Oranges there. I will say that the little Lightning storyline in ARR was well done. However, holding up ARR as a bastion of storytelling and character is folly. It is poor. Especially compared to XI and even to 1.x. So, compared to XIII in terms of story? It's probably a push.
 

Mr. RHC

Member
lol ARR vs. XIII. Apples and Oranges there. I will say that the little Lightning storyline in ARR was well done. However, holding up ARR as a bastion of storytelling and character is folly. It is poor. Especially compared to XI and even to 1.x. So, compared to XIII in terms of story? It's probably a push.

Everything is a bastion compared to XIII's story.
 

Mr. RHC

Member
I dunno. When the better rerelease has a worse storyline than the absolutely catastrophic original... =/

I did not play 1.0, be it as it may. But at least it probably had a story, so did ARR.

The thing XIII produced.. you can barely call that a story.. more like swiss cheese.
 

Burbeting

Banned
Still wondering that should I try ARR (jsut for the main story). Might wait for the PS4 edition.

Your LR review was a good read, Kagari. Seemed pretty fair.
 

Beth Cyra

Member
Hmm not shocking for Kagari's score.

Certainly not going to act like she isn't right. That said her 9.5 for ARR was way to high for me(I did like it, and am capped, but I can't agree it's story is good and it's VA is some of the worst I've heard in a long time) and I find XIII to be alot more enjoyable then XIII-2 so I'm not to sure how much I will agree with her on this one.

That said everything I've seen makes me think 6 at the highest, still though so long as Serah isn't in it for the most part it will be far and above XIII-2 to me.
 
I'm a little surprised ARR was so highly rated when it suffers from some of the same problems as LR apparently does. Boring MMO-fodder sidequests (ARR is FULL of these even in the main storyline - I'm sure it has more of those quests than LR does, too) and a subpar story that doesn't really go anywhere interesting. The story of ARR pales in comparison to FFXI's storyline (especially Chains of Promanthia) due to lackluster villains who barely get any screen time (they look cool at least, eh?) and questionable motivations. ARR does have phenomenal art direction, though.
 

zroid

Banned
any review which uses the word "stodgy" gets an A+ from me

Also does anyone find it interesting how this is coming out in NA mere days after Bravely Default? I know Nintendo is publishing that here, but still...
 

dramatis

Member
It's a real shame too. Square was criticized for having their game be too linear, then the third game where they finally open it all up, it has nothing to do after a few side quests...sigh....
The problem lies in the fact that the main story symbolically requires 13 days for progression to ending. I would say in this instance the blame lies on the writers for insisting on a specific number of 'days' to make the story meaningful, but then failed to create enough main quest content to fill out 13 days. Supposing that the ending comes along on the sixth or seventh instead, giving even bad players reasonable time to complete the main story quests while also tackling some side content (but not all), I think in that way the game would have more replay value because then people could run again and try different side content at least, along with the new game bonus stuff.
 
Top Bottom