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Hazaro
relies on auto-aim
(01-23-2013, 11:27 AM)
Hazaro's Avatar
>>>Part 2<<< (20,000 post courtesy limit)


Use Ctrl+F or your search function to help find what you are looking for

Laptop-GAF and TechSupportGAF - Visit our friends here
2013 High-res PC screenshot thread + PC Down / Super Sampling Thread + PC Bullshot Thread (Amazing) - Beautiful candy for your pupils
Race your PC Thread - Benchmark and Overclock (With Guides) your new or old PC here
Mechanical Keyboard Talk - Talk about buying expensive and loud clacky things here
Online Security Thread - Surf safe


This OP is a constant work in progress. If you have something to correct, add, or critique please PM me or msg @HazardVG on Twitter.


06/11/2013: Nvidia 320.18 WHQL Display Drivers CAUSING ISSUES. Uninstall them in safe mode and go back to 314.22(Download Win7-64Bit)
06/05/2013: Build Sheets updated with preliminary motherboard guesses.
06/03/2013: Intel's new CPU architecture 'Haswell' launches June 3rd (Shows 5-10% performance increase, same overclocks, runs 30C hotter, much higher loaded power draw, and being $30 more expensive. Possibly best worst overclocking chip in years)
04/26/2013: Anandtech new heatsink coolers and AIO water roundup (Featuring actual good charts!)
03/28/2013: Frame times and observable FPS through FCAT will new mark a new era of benchmarking (And why you should avoid CrossFire for now). PCPER (7950 and 660Ti) // TechReport // Anandtech
02/28/2013: PCPer does a great job explaining Frame Time vs FPS (and perils of multi GPU setups)
08/04/2012: Two useful cooling articles: Case Fan Temps and Positioning - (Bit-Tech), 60 Fans Tested (Vortez)
09/09/2011: Inside the second: A new look at game benchmarking Why FPS isn't everything, and Multi-GPU still has issues.



If you want help with a build fill this out AND try making one of your own from the resources in the OP :)
Use PCPartPicker to find the best prices and have a nice list of parts (Check if items are in stock!). I highly recommend Amazon, Newegg, and NCIXUS in North America.

Basic Desktop Questions:
  • Your Current Specs: CPU / RAM (DDR2/DDR3) / Motherboard / GPU (Graphics) / PSU (Power Supply) / Case
  • Budget: Price Range + Country
  • Main Use: Rate 1-5. 5 being Highest: Light Gaming, Gaming, Emulation (PS2/Wii), Video Editing, Streaming games in HD, 3D/Model work (and what program), General Usage (Word, Web, 1080p playback).
  • Monitor Resolution: What resolution will you be playing your games at? Are you going to upgrade later? Are you buying a new monitor?
  • List SPECIFIC games or applications that you MUST be able to run well: Is 30FPS acceptable? 60? 120? Will you use CUDA accelerated software?
  • Looking to reuse any parts?: List make and model (e.g. Corsair 520HX 520W, 640GB SATA HDD, Antec 900)
  • When will you build?: What time frames are doable? Are you building this weekend? Do you need it in a week or so? Can you wait a month or two?
  • Will you be overclocking?: Yes, No, Maybe (This means yes!)

PICKING YOUR PARTS

Anandtech's 'Bench' CPU and GPU Benchmarks - A great resource. Helpful for getting a general idea of performance or comparing hardware.
How much power do I really need? - For Low-Mid systems a good PSU with 380W on the 12V is enough. For Mid-High systems a solid 550W is enough due to lower power use now.
Above that 650W-750W for systems looking for dual GPUs. 850W-1200W for enthusiasts. Check the News + Review section below for more info on PSUs.


NeoGAF PC Builds:
Mkenyon's Small Form Factor Build Sheet - http://bit.ly/GAFBoxOne



Hazaro's PC Build Sheet - http://bit.ly/GAFPC2013



[QUIET OPTIONS]
$60 - BitFenix Shinobi . $80 - BitFenix Ghost . $100 - Define R4 . . . $130 - Fractal Define XL R2
[BUDGET]
$40 - NZXT Source 210 $50 - BitFenix Outlaw $60 - CM HAF 912 . . . $60 - Corsair 200R
[ENHANCED]
$80 - CM 690II Adv. . . $100 - CM Scout II . . $110 - Lian Li PC-7HX $110 - Fractal Arc Midi R2
[EXCELLENT]
$130 - CM HAF XM . . . . $140 - Shinobi XL . . $160 - Switch 810 . . . $160 - CM Storm Stryker/Trooper
[Micro ATX]
$75 - Silverstone PS07 $100 - Corsair 350D $100 - Define Mini . . . $120 - Silverstone SG10

These headphones are chosen for positional quality. No budget headsets since they are garbage (Unless someone has one to share). Zalman clip mic is garbage too.
[HEADSETS]
$100 - SteelSeries Flux $250/300 - Sennheiser 350 SE / 363D - 363D are open ear, include virtual 7.1 DAC, and are USB.

[HEADPHONES]
$30 - MonoPrice DJ 8323 $100 - ATH-AD700 $250 - AKG Q701

[MICS]
$33 - ModMic 2.0 . $15 - Logitech USB Mic $3 - DX Clip-on mic (2-6 Week shipping)

[KEYBOARDS]
Mechanical switches are referred to Cherry MX switches. MX Brown = Quiet tactile, MX Blue = loud tactile, MX Black = stiff linear, MX Red = soft linear. Cooler Master University.

$10 - Rosewill RIKB . . . $25 - Logitech K200 . . . $44 - Razer Arctosa

$80 - CM Quickfire Rapid $65 - Logitech K750 . . . $65-110 - Rosewill RK-9000's

$90 CM Quickfire Stealth $100 - Noppoo Choc . . . . $110 Vortex KBT Race

[MICE]
Xornet is great for the price, but the Spawn has a better sensor. Customization on Sensei is unparalleled.

$30 - CM Storm Xornet . . . $40 - CM Storm Spawn $60 - SteelSeries Sensei RAW (Rubberized imo)



[BUDGET]
$150 - ASUS VS229H-P
And any $100-$120 monitor that has decent reviews and is not an lesser brand. Many of the higher monitors also go on steep discounts.
[STANDARD]
$170 - ASUS VH236H . . . . . $185 - ASUS VS247H-P . . $185 - ASUS VS239H-P
[ENHANCED]
$250 - ASUS VG23AH . . . . . $300 - Dell U2412M (16:10, no 1:1 scaling)

ASUS VG23AH if you don't wear glasses or glasses with any sort of filters/polarizers. It might be IPS/PLS but it has the best 60hz performance of ANY monitor on the market and can be driven to run at 72hz or 75hz with this program and these settings. Go for the Dell if you want 16:10 and super crisp colors.
[120Hz]
$270 - ASUS VG248QE. . . . . $350-400 - BenQ XL2420T . .

BenQ has more options and a better stand, ASUS has a better response time and better colors. Both can be used with Lightboost to achieve CRT quality smoothness of motion. Hopefully there will be some gloss/semi-gloss panels released from Samsung soon.
[2560x1440 IPS]
$400 - MonoPrice IPS-ZERO-G $800 - Viewsonic VP2770-LED

Crossover is available through Ebay, pixel perfect versions come at a premium. It has the same panel as the Apple Cinema Display. The VP2770 has a lower input lag at 7ms. Both are 1440p.





Amazon (Parts)
Newegg (Parts)
NCIX.US (Parts)
Performance-PCs (Cases, Fans Acessories)
Micro Center (Parts and great IN STORE deals)
AVADirect (Custom Built)
Falcon Northwest (Custom Built)
MAINGEAR (Custom Built)




NCIX (Parts, Assembly, Price Match)
Amazon.CA (Parts)
Canada Computers (Parts)
DirectCanada (Parts)
Memory Express (Parts, Assembly, Price Match)
Newegg.CA (Parts, Ships from US)
DealGenius (Price Comparison)
Shopbot (Price Comparison)




Novatech (Parts)
Overclockers UK (Parts)
Aria PC (Parts)
Ebuyer (Parts, Custom Built)
Microdirect (Parts)
HardwareVersand (Parts)
Misco (Parts)
Scan (Parts)
Dino PC (Custom Built)
YoYoTech (Custom Built)




PC Case Gear (Parts, Best Online Retailer)
PCDIY (Parts)
CPL (Parts)
Umart (Parts, Cheaper Shipping Outside Victoria)
Scorpion Technology (Parts)
MSY (Parts)
staticICE (Product Finder)



AnandTech
The Tech Report
TechPowerUp
X-bit labs
HardOCP
Hardware Canucks
Jonnyguru + HardwareSecrets = Legit PSU reviews
Silent PC Review = The quiet side of computing


Ninite A batch downloader and installer for popular programs. A fantastic time saver for any new PC build.
Steam Mover tool for moving Steam games to a different HDD/SSD
Steam Tool Another tool for moving steam games.

MSI Afterburner (aka RivaTuner) allows you to manage GPU overclocking, fan speed/profiles and chart many aspects of your GPU.
CPU-Z - gathers information on your Motherboard, BIOS, CPU, FSB, VCORE voltage and memory timings.
GPU-Z gathers information (Speed, architecture, temps) on your video card and GPU.
Real Temp allows you to monitor the temperature of your CPU core(s).
HWMonitor allows you to monitor fan speed, temperature, voltage, etc.
CrystalDiskMark Tests read and write speed of your hard drives.

nVidia Inspector allows you to optimize the display, improve the performance and fully utilize your NVIDIA graphics card.
Radeon Pro allows you to optimize the display, improve the performance and fully utilize your AMD graphics card.
Dxtory / nVidia driver options allows you to limit the frame rate on most games. Excellent for older games or just getting a locked framerate.
Fraps allows you to record real time video, take screen captures and display your FPS.
Open Broadcast Software a streaming program for things like Twitch.TV A free and better competitor to XSplit.

OCCT allows you to stress test your CPU and GPU, along with GPU memory.
Prime95 allows you to stress test your CPU and RAM for stability.
FURMark allows you to stress test your video card.
Memtest86+ allows you to run a full memory scan to deal with the blue screen of death and system errors.




2013 Thread Part 1
2012 Thread Part 1 + Part 2
2011 Thread Part 1 + Part 2
2010 Thread / 2009 Thread / 2008 Thread
Last edited by Hazaro; 06-22-2013 at 12:06 PM.
Hazaro
relies on auto-aim
(01-23-2013, 11:29 AM)
Hazaro's Avatar
Placeholder 2nd segment. Guides will go here. With shiny image buttons. Hopefully.

General guides:
FALCON GUIDE (Logical Increments) – This is a general ~monthly updated guide with lots of price segments and a ton of accessible information at the bottom.
Tech Report System Guide (April 2013) - Updated once a season, it proves I'm not crazy by picking things I usually agree with.

Putting it all together
Thermal Paste: Apply as a ~4mm ball to the CPU. Press the heatsink down and tighten. Line method is ok. Application matters way less than you think. If you take the heatsink off, clean it with alcohol and reapply or you will trap air.
mkenyon(ZFZ) - Build Guide & Cable Management Guide
Video Build Guides: TechReport PC Building Guide 15 minute video how-to / 40 Minute how-to / Tested March 15th $1,500 build (100 minutes, but entertaining) / How to Build a Gaming Computer 2012 (Carey Holzman - 150 minutes) / Newegg - 40 minutes / TimeToLive Build (75 minutes)
Socket 1155 Overclocking Guide (Sandy, Ivy, 2500K, 3570K, 3770K, all motherboards): Guide: http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews/c...ocking_guide/1 Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBEeXajbG2o

SSD Setup and Tweaking

Help! PC won't Turn on/POST/Boot
Under construction
Read yo manual
No really. Read it.
Is your PSU switched to your correct Voltage? (120 or 240?) Is it on I for power?
Ok what did you leave unplugged? Double Check all wires are plugged. Trace them physically with your hand.
Any loose screws around? What about screws behind the motherboard?
You did put in thos standoff screws so the motherboard is risen off the case... right?
etc.

Video Card Cooler Guide by mkenyon(ZFZ) - Picking a GPU cooler right for you
Intro to dual cards: SLI & Crossfire - I'd only suggest dual cards if you are willing to plunk down $400+ for each GPU. Otherwise go single.

__________________

MedIC86's Advanced Information Guide - Ctrl + F is your friend.



Current mainstream sockets:
Intel: LGA1155/2011
AMD: AM3/AM3+

Overclocking:

Is it safe? Mostly. Computer parts are pretty damn durable and there are a ton of safeguards in place to auto throttle down a CPU, increase fan speed, and even shut down before any harm happens.
How hot is too hot? In general it is wanted to keep temperatures under 65C using a CPU load program (Like in the OP, Prime95). A little over is fine. Idle temperatures are not that important and are often reported inaccurately. Temperature variation across cores is normal.
My CPU is not fast as others It happens. Every person is not going to get 4.8Ghz out of an i5 2500K. 1.3V and 4.4Ghz is a good benchmark for many though.

In general, the most resources you want are found by simply using Google. 'Processor + Motherboard' will give you a lot of good results. 'How to overclock (processor)' as well.

A Sandy and Ivy Bridge Overclocking Guide (Socket 1155, 2500K, 3770K, etc.)



Motherboards:

- Socket Type (Which processors will work with your motherboard. Make sure it matches or is compatible with the CPU you are buying.)
- Chipset (Different chipsets (H67,P67,Z68,770,880,990) determine what possible connections and extras motherboards can support. In general the performance gains are not noticible and it is used mainly to tell how many PCI-E lanes a motherboard can support)
- Memory (Does it use DDR2 or DDR3? 1.5V or 1.65V? Most use 1.5V DDR3 today)
- Expansion slots (How many expansion slots do you need? PCI-E x16? PCI? Do you want two GPU's and a wireless PCI-E card? A PCI sound card?)
- Connectors/features (Do you need HDMI out? USB 3.0 ports? On board digital out?)
- Formfactor (Your case will have room for a certain formfactor of motherboard (ATX[normal], mATX[small]. Some cases only fit mATX and are labeled as such)
- Compatibility (On rare occasions there are incompatibilities between certain cards and memory with motherboards)
- Brand (Most brands on the market today are solid. Newegg reviews are generally helpful to determine a DOA rate. MSI, ASUS, ASRock, and Gigabyte in no particular order are some of the most known.)
- Quality (You pay more for more features. Higher end boards will also have more power regulations, use less power, and keep voltage in check more than cheaper boards)
- Overclock-ability (Usually nearly equal across the board. If you want a slightly higher overclock, you can pay more for a motherboard with better power regulation)
- Price (Always try to find the best bang for your buck, don't buy a mobo with features that you will never use!)

So in short, when buying a motherboard try to follow these points:
1. Determine the platform (Chipset + Socket)
2. Determine what functions you deem necessary for the motherboard to have
3. Make a shortlist of all motherboards that have your demands
4. Pick the board that has good reviews and has the best price



Speed and latency for RAM (e.g. 1333 9-9-9-24 vs 1666 8-8-8-24) is not a big deal. In many cases it is just 1-4% difference. 1333Mhz DDR3 is perfectly fine for most. Save your money unless a sale is on, our you want to buy neat looking RAM. Just make sure the tall RAM heatsinks don't block your CPU heatsink!
4GB is enough for gaming. 8GB if you do a lot of multitasking or video work.
DDR3 prices are currently quite low and shouldn't drop much farther.

CAS vs. SPEED
DDR2 & DDR3
Memory Overclocking



When you are in the market for a new GPU follow the same rules as with the motherboard. Determine your budget, features that you need etc.**CHECK REVIEWS FROM OP SITES!**

Question: There are many different brands in videocards, do they differ?
Answer: Most cards are very similar. Brands are there for warranty and support. Sometimes a brand will use a custom cooler.
If the card uses the reference PCB, there is **NO** difference per brand, its the same card they just slap a different sticker on it.
But if you have a pre-factory overclocked card or they are using another cooler then the reference design there might be a difference, check hardware review sites for these GPU's.


Imaging your old HDD to your SSD
Some SSD Setup and Tweak guides in this post
Crucial Firmware
Samsung Support

SSD is a abbreviation for 'Solid State Drive': a 'drive' with no mechanical parts, but with a conventional disk-interface (usually SATA).
An ssd contains memory chips (flash memory) to store the data.
The biggest advantage is data is almost immediately available, without the need of moving a mechanical head to the area on the hard drive where the desired data is stored.
At this moment pc-components such as the processor, memory (ram), graphics processor and other components, perform well enough to meet the demand of the most users. Still we have to wait while using a computer...
So where can performance still be increased dramatically? The answer: SSD's!

Terminology:

- Garbage collection: part of the functionality of the firmware of ssd's that automatically merges fairly unused memory blocks for better performance
- Under-partitioning: leave blank space for better performance
- Wiping: OCZ method (tool) to improve performance
- Aligning: creating a partition with a size that is exactly the cluster size multiplied by a factor
- TRIM: a ATA (contoller) command from the operating system to an ssd, that can tell that a memory block on the ssd can be erased to improve write performance - It's a feature of Windows 7 but keep in mind that your SSD must support it!
- Wear leveling: spreading write-actions on memory cells evenly over the whole ssd - this prevents wear of the flash cells increasing their lifetime
- MLC / SLC: Multi Level Cell or Single Level Cell - the latter lasts longer, is theoretically faster but more expensive, so mlc-based ssd's are now sold more, especially to consumers.

Tips for SSD's on a Windows based system:

- Firmware: YES (check if there is new firmware out and if so install it, usually gets speed increases)
- Partition alignment: YES (Windows Vista (SP1 and later) and Windows 7 always create aligned partitions.)
- Defragmentation: NO (it's important that you turn off automatic defragging on the SSD. see below)
- Indexing: NO (its better for the drive durability + speed to turn this off. right click on the SSD in "my computer" and uncheck "Allow files on this drive to have contents indexed in addition to file properties" you will probably get some error for some files that cant be accessed just skip them)
- AHCI: preferably enabled (this is a bit tricky since not all motherboards can actually do this. To enable ACHI also differs from pc per pc but there are some steps that are necessary. you can google this easily enough. -> be warned tho! there is no guarantee that this will speed up your SSD, also enabling ACHI requires to be done before installing Windows, you can hack it into the registry later but that can make your system unstable, so read up if you want to do this)

How to check if TRIM is enabled in Windows 7?
Go to the command prompt (run -> CMD) and key in "fsutil behavior query DisableDeleteNotify" if you get a 0 (zero) TRIM is working. To enable it key in "
fsutil behavior set disabledeletenotify 0"

Here is a list with some good tweaks for your SSD (*WARNING* as always be careful what you change, most of these are quiet harmless but there are never guarantees!)

Disable indexing
Description: Indexing creates and maintains a database of file attributes. This can lead to multiple small writes when creating/deleting/modifying files.

Searching for files will still work.
Instructions: Start Menu -> Right-Click Computer -> Manage -> Services and Applications -> Services - > Right-Click Windows Search -> Startup type: Disabled -> OK

Disable defragmentation
Description: Defragmenting a hard disk's used space is only useful on mechanical disks with multi-millisecond latencies. Free-space defragmentation may be useful to SSDs, but this feature is not available in the default Windows Defragmenter.
Instructions: Start Menu -> Right-Click Computer -> Manage -> Services and Applications -> Services - > Right-Click Disk Defragmenter -> Startup type: Disabled -> OK

Disable Write Caching (Depends on SSD. Crucial M4 SSD leave on (as of 9/19/2011)
Description: There is no cache on the SSD, so there are no benefits to write caching. There are conflicting reports on whether this gains speed or not.
Instructions: Start Menu -> Right-Click Computer -> Manage -> Device Manager -> Disk drives -> Right-Click STEC PATA -> Properties -> Policies Tab -> Uncheck Enable write caching -> OK

Firefox - Use memory cache instead of disk cache
Description: If you use Firefox, there's a way to write cached files to RAM instead of the hard disk. This is not only faster, but will significantly reduce writes to the SSD while using the browser.
Instructions: Open Firefox -> Type about:config into the address bar -> Enter -> double-click browser.cache.disk.enable to set the value to False -> Right-Click anywhere -> New -> Integer -> Preference Name "disk.cache.memory.capacity" -> value memory size in KB. Enter 32768 for 32MB, 65536 for 64MB, 131072 for 128MB, etc. -> restart Firefox

Free up extra drive space
Disable the Page File
Description: Eliminate writing memory to the SSD, free over 2GB of disk space. Warning - If you run out of memory the program you're using will crash.
Instructions: Start Menu -> Right-Click Computer -> Properties -> Advanced System Settings -> Settings (Performance) -> Advanced Tab -> Change -> Uncheck Automatically manage -> No paging file -> Set -> OK -> Restart your computer
Alternatively, if you want to play it safer, you can set a custom size of 200MB min and max.

Disable System Restore
Description: Don't write backup copies of files when installing new programs or making system changes. Can free up between a few hundred MB to a couple GB. Warning - Although unlikely, if a driver installation corrupts your system, there won't be an automatic way to recover.
Instructions: Start Menu -> Right-Click Computer -> Properties -> Advanced System Settings -> System Protection Tab -> Configure -> Turn off system protection -> Delete -> OK

Disable Hibernate
Description: You may free up 1GB of space on the SSD if you have 1GB of memory, 2GB of space if you have 2GB memory. You will lose the hibernation feature which allows the equivalent of quick boots and shutdowns.
Instructions: Start Menu -> Type cmd -> Right-Click the cmd Icon -> Run as Administrator -> Type powercfg -h off -> Type exit

And finally the ever important question: What SSD should i buy ?

Unfortunately there is no definitive answer for this question, technology changes and evolves all the time. So if you are planning on buying an SSD read up some reviews on trusted sites (see the websites in the link section).

Links to useful SSD tools:
Crystal Mark Bench + NFO Tool
AS-SSD TOOL
Steam Mover Tool
Last edited by Hazaro; 06-22-2013 at 12:00 PM.
Hazaro
relies on auto-aim
(01-23-2013, 11:30 AM)
Hazaro's Avatar
So this past year I didn't get around to helping as much. I'd really like to thank mkenyon for doing a large part of the revisions for this thread and helping out in general. Scogoth as well for swinging by and doing a lot of graphic work. Whiteshirt for double checking the monitor selections and giving recommendations.

Apart from that, the PC GAF regulars I know by name and posted to help in the thread in no particular order:
TheExodu5, fiest, kharma45, NoReN, LiquidMetal14, Jtwo, Koroviev, MrBig, Sk3tch, Smokey, Corky, Sethos, claviertekky, Shambles, n0n44m, Wolf Akela, MisterNoisy, Hawk269, Ceebs, 1-D_FTW, RedSwirl, and others I may have missed.

Feel free to post now!
*Oh and this is the time to point out ANY and ALL mistakes. :D
Last edited by Hazaro; 01-23-2013 at 12:00 PM.
abunai
Member
(01-23-2013, 11:41 AM)
abunai's Avatar
Nice work on the update haz
pc pc pc
kharma45
Member
(01-23-2013, 11:49 AM)
kharma45's Avatar
Bravo guys.

You spelt NZXT wrong in the budget column :P
Hazaro
relies on auto-aim
(01-23-2013, 11:55 AM)
Hazaro's Avatar

Originally Posted by kharma45

Bravo guys.

You spelt NZXT wrong in the budget column :P

Tits. Fixed.
kinggroin
Banned
(01-23-2013, 11:58 AM)
kinggroin's Avatar
I'm looking to go smaller with my current. If anyone else is needing bigger, i have a Raven II case for sale.
Sethos
Banned
(01-23-2013, 12:00 PM)
Sethos's Avatar

Originally Posted by Hazaro

Tits. Fixed.

Another small thing, under 'Terminology' a few of the entries aren't fully bolded.

Otherwise a fantastic OP as always.
Hazaro
relies on auto-aim
(01-23-2013, 12:04 PM)
Hazaro's Avatar

Originally Posted by Sethos

Another small thing, under 'Terminology' a few of the entries aren't fully bolded.

Otherwise a fantastic OP as always.

Fixed.

The 2nd post of the OP will be retooled for visible and helpful guides. A lot of that text wall will be axed and rechecked for relevancy, but the OP was basically done so I wanted to get this up tonight rather than continue waiting to fix a lot of relatively not as important things.

Now it's 4am so I'm going to bed.
kharma45
Member
(01-23-2013, 12:07 PM)
kharma45's Avatar
Also for custom builds in the UK I'd advocate sticking these guys in the OP, did one for us and I've had a few people buy through them too and they've all been very happy http://cougar-extreme.co.uk/. I'd also stick CCL and Amazon UK in the UK section for parts.

Overclock3D is also good imo for reviews and videos.

Also, my last thing would be this mobo seems quite a good fit for the standard build ASRock Z75 Pro3 LGA 1155 Intel Z75 and it reviewed well enough on TweakTown. Pretty good bargain in my books anyway.
Last edited by kharma45; 01-23-2013 at 01:41 PM.
abunai
Member
(01-23-2013, 12:11 PM)
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Originally Posted by kharma45

Also for custom builds in the UK I'd advocate sticking these guys in the OP, did one for us and I've had a few people buy through them too and they've all been very happy http://cougar-extreme.co.uk/. I'd also stick CCL and Amazon UK in the UK section for parts.

Overclock3D is also good imo for reviews and videos.

Also, my last thing would be this mobo seems quite a good fit for the standard build http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813157304 and it reviewed well enough on TweakTown.

Gonna have to say scan for UK parts are excellent too. Really great service.
kharma45
Member
(01-23-2013, 12:15 PM)
kharma45's Avatar

Originally Posted by abunai

Gonna have to say scan for UK parts are excellent too. Really great service.

Yeah Scan are pretty good for the most part, was just looking through the OP to see who we were missing for us guys in the UK.

Dabs.com is another but then I guess we risk making the OP too big with more suggestions :P
Hazaro
relies on auto-aim
(01-23-2013, 12:16 PM)
Hazaro's Avatar
If you can settle on who you would actually buy from, and who you rate the highest that would help.
I trimmed some of the US stores that don't matter.

Oh and lets see how many months it takes for Google to put this at the top instead of the 2012 thread :/
Last edited by Hazaro; 01-23-2013 at 12:18 PM.
mere_immortal
Junior Member
(01-23-2013, 12:17 PM)
mere_immortal's Avatar
Right monitors.

Gonna be running a 670 and 3750k, in general people who use a 120hz monitor do say they can see a difference, but reviews also mention they need a lot of tweaking and overall the colours aren't as good as other panel types (viewing angles aren't an issue).

IPS gets fantastic reports for colour and image quality, but still seem to suffer from slow response times and ghosting.

What are your guys thoughts? Basically I would be looking for a 24" monitor, don't care about 3D, viewing angles are not a problem as I will be using it head on on a desk. Budget anywhere up to 250 and ideally I would want 16:9, I know 16:10 gives me that extra space but I already have a second monitor for webpages or music or whatever.

Help me obi-gaf, you're my only hope.
sorijealut
Member
(01-23-2013, 12:21 PM)
sorijealut's Avatar
The new thread is just BEAUTIFUL. Thank you!
kharma45
Member
(01-23-2013, 12:22 PM)
kharma45's Avatar

Originally Posted by Hazaro

If you can settle on who you would actually buy from, and who you rate the highest that would help.
I trimmed some of the US stores that don't matter.

I'd probably jettison MicroDirect from the UK bit and stick Amazon in their place for parts, and HardwareVersand too since they're not a UK site, Dabs.com could go in their place.

I'd be tempted to as well to say to swap YoYoTech for Cougar-Extreme, I've dealt with them myself and reviews wise they're a lot better too. Link for Yoyo and Cougar.

If it's 4am now Haz go to bed :P you can deal with suggestions later!
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
(01-23-2013, 12:31 PM)
LiquidMetal14's Avatar
Not a week too late!

Looks nice. I worry for when I get income tax back as I've got half my components ordered except the huge ones like the CPU,MB, and GPU. Hopefully the government doesn't delay things for more than 21 days.

It's gonna be frustrating sitting here with a bunch of things but no meat and potatoes components.
kennah
(01-23-2013, 12:32 PM)
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WOOOOOOOO NEW THREAD! I love the new year. Big year with Titan, Haswell and who knows what other improvements.
Whiteshirt
Member
(01-23-2013, 01:16 PM)

Originally Posted by mere_immortal

Right monitors.

Gonna be running a 670 and 3750k, in general people who use a 120hz monitor do say they can see a difference, but reviews also mention they need a lot of tweaking and overall the colours aren't as good as other panel types (viewing angles aren't an issue).

IPS gets fantastic reports for colour and image quality, but still seem to suffer from slow response times and ghosting.

What are your guys thoughts? Basically I would be looking for a 24" monitor, don't care about 3D, viewing angles are not a problem as I will be using it head on on a desk. Budget anywhere up to 250 and ideally I would want 16:9, I know 16:10 gives me that extra space but I already have a second monitor for webpages or music or whatever.

Even if you look head on, TN panels have problems with displaying content in a uniform manner. Blow up a solid colour on your TN monitor and you'll see what I mean. The top and bottom will be noticeably different.

The best all round monitor is the Asus VG23AH so long you don't wear polarized/filtered glasses. It not only has great motion performance out of the box, it can be pushed to 72/75/76hz if you adjust your driver's timings.

The myth that IPS monitors are bad for gaming is not remotely true, their performance is more than adequate and you typically don't need to do a lot of tweaking to get the settings right. Dreamhack uses the Eizo FS2332 and I don't see any progamers complaining about them.

For 250 quid, I doubt you can get a 120hz monitor. They're not cheap and you might find it difficult to get the most out of it with just a GTX670. That being said, 120hz monitors are plug and play. The only thing that needs tweaking are 3D settings, if you plan on using it.

Edit:
With monitors, don'tbelievehislies.jpg is 100% relevant. A lot of work goes into the electronics and tweaking of the monitors. Two monitors using the same panel can have wildly different real-life motion performance and input lag. A specsheet can't tell you this.
Last edited by Whiteshirt; 01-23-2013 at 01:38 PM.
Rflagg
Member
(01-23-2013, 01:23 PM)
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Awesome work everyone, stuff like this really puts Neogaf in a whole other class. :)
legacyzero
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(01-23-2013, 01:24 PM)
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Even though I've already built my new PC (thanks to the previous glorious thread), I'm still subbing. Thanks Hazaro!
electricpirate
Member
(01-23-2013, 01:26 PM)
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Very cool :).

Anywho, I have a couple of more questions.

Newegg has a corsair 750w PSU. I was figuring on an antec 550W PSu for my build, but this is 30 dollars cheaper. So two questions, are Corsair PSUs any good? And will it be a moot point because the extra wattage will just eat the savings over time from my power bill?

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.99 @ Microcenter)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($169.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($46.98 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($103.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 830 Series 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($199.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: HIS Radeon HD 7870 2GB Video Card ($209.99 @ Newegg)
Case: BitFenix Shinobi ATX Mid Tower Case ($69.98 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: Antec TruePower New 550W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($89.65 @ NCIX US)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.98 @ Outlet PC)
Total: $1100.53
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-01-23 08:25 EST-0500)

Here's the PSU that's on sale, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...m-_-17-139-006
Last edited by electricpirate; 01-23-2013 at 01:31 PM.
Prozel
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(01-23-2013, 01:31 PM)
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The best thread just got better.

xoxo guys!
kharma45
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(01-23-2013, 01:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by electricpirate

Very cool :).

Anywho, I have a couple of more questions.

Newegg has a corsair 750w PSU. I was figuring on an antec 550W PSu for my build, but this is 30 dollars cheaper. So two questions, are Corsair PSUs any good? And will it be a moot point because the extra wattage will just eat the savings over time from my power bill?

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.99 @ Microcenter)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($169.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($46.98 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($103.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 830 Series 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($199.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: HIS Radeon HD 7870 2GB Video Card ($209.99 @ Newegg)
Case: BitFenix Shinobi ATX Mid Tower Case ($69.98 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: Antec TruePower New 550W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($89.65 @ NCIX US)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.98 @ Outlet PC)
Total: $1100.53
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-01-23 08:25 EST-0500)

Here's the PSU that's on sale, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...m-_-17-139-006

Looks good, only things I'd look at are the PSU which you could maybe change to this and your GPU, as for not too much more you can get a 7870 XT from Sapphire or the PowerColor equivalent.
Soka
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(01-23-2013, 01:39 PM)
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Excellent new thread. Thank you to all of you that put in effort and time for this.
electricpirate
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(01-23-2013, 01:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by kharma45

Looks good, only things I'd look at are the PSU which you could maybe change to this and your GPU, as for not too much more you can get a 7870 XT from Sapphire or the PowerColor equivalent.


Ahh yea, after reading reviews I meant to change the card in the build.

What about the Corsair PSU I posted, any reason not to jump on a 750W corsair for $60?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...m-_-17-139-006
legacyzero
Member
(01-23-2013, 01:48 PM)
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I hope they drop the price on the 670 sometime soon. I'd love to buy another one..

Then the challenge is trying to figure out how to install and utilize two..
kharma45
Member
(01-23-2013, 01:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by electricpirate

Ahh yea, after reading reviews I meant to change the card in the build.

What about the Corsair PSU I posted, any reason not to jump on a 750W corsair for $60?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...m-_-17-139-006

I didn't notice that part of your post, forgive me! Bar the fact it's not modular there ain't much to complain about, especially if you can get it for $60 then it's a really, really good buy.
Whiteshirt
Member
(01-23-2013, 01:51 PM)

Originally Posted by electricpirate

Ahh yea, after reading reviews I meant to change the card in the build.

What about the Corsair PSU I posted, any reason not to jump on a 750W corsair for $60?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...m-_-17-139-006

It'll be inefficient for your system but I guess if you want to go nuts in the future you've got some headroom.

Something like a Rosewill Capstone 450 is probably more suitable for your system if you don't plan on going dual GPU in the future.
mere_immortal
Junior Member
(01-23-2013, 01:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by Whiteshirt

Even if you look head on, TN panels have problems with displaying content in a uniform manner. Blow up a solid colour on your TN monitor and you'll see what I mean. The top and bottom will be noticeably different.

The best all round monitor is the Asus VG23AH so long you don't wear polarized/filtered glasses. It not only has great motion performance out of the box, it can be pushed to 72/75/76hz if you adjust your driver's timings.

The myth that IPS monitors are bad for gaming is not remotely true, their performance is more than adequate and you typically don't need to do a lot of tweaking to get the settings right. Dreamhack uses the Eizo FS2332 and I don't see any progamers complaining about them.

For 250 quid, I doubt you can get a 120hz monitor. They're not cheap and you might find it difficult to get the most out of it with just a GTX670. That being said, 120hz monitors are plug and play. The only thing that needs tweaking are 3D settings, if you plan on using it.

Edit:
With monitors, don'tbelievehislies.jpg is 100% relevant. A lot of work goes into the electronics and tweaking of the monitors. Two monitors using the same panel can have wildly different real-life motion performance and input lag. A specsheet can't tell you this.

The one 120hz I had in mind was the BenQ XL2411T, but as you say I don't know how much I would actually benefit from it. I play a lot of L4D but not massive on twitch stuff so would I really need it?
Whiteshirt
Member
(01-23-2013, 02:00 PM)
If you play a lot of slower paced games or games that are difficult to maintain huge frame rates in, IPS is better. The Asus VG23AH can do 75hz so you can get the best of everything.

If L4D is the fastest game you play, then I'm not sure you'll get too much out of the Benq 120hz monitor. Compared to an IPS monitor, it'll look trash simply because Benq calibrate their monitors for what they think is good for gaming (debatable) and not for good image quality.
WhatRobEats
Member
(01-23-2013, 02:00 PM)
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Great thread. Bravo to all involved.

Signed up for my upcoming new build. Already have the workings of "Excellent - Best Overall" going now. I'm doing this one piece by piece since I already have a perfectly capable PC this time.
AScotAbroad
Member
(01-23-2013, 02:01 PM)
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Great refresh for the new year, but I'm curious why you didn't include the Antec P-280 case this time? I did a new build in December with it and love it - pretty quiet and the chunky top-side power button is a nice touch. Lots of space to work in when putting everything together too.
kharma45
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(01-23-2013, 02:03 PM)
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From AMD's Facebook

Our game technology engineers are working with a major developer to create a never-before-seen DirectX 11 technology. What do you think it is?

Wonder what they've got in store.
electricpirate
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(01-23-2013, 02:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by kharma45

Looks good, only things I'd look at are the PSU which you could maybe change to this and your GPU, as for not too much more you can get a 7870 XT from Sapphire or the PowerColor equivalent.

Originally Posted by kharma45

I didn't notice that part of your post, forgive me! Bar the fact it's not modular there ain't much to complain about, especially if you can get it for $60 then it's a really, really good buy.

Originally Posted by Whiteshirt

It'll be inefficient for your system but I guess if you want to go nuts in the future you've got some headroom.

Something like a Rosewill Capstone 450 is probably more suitable for your system if you don't plan on going dual GPU in the future.

You are good people. Thanks for the advice. I decided that a Modular PSU was important, so I switched up the build a bit, droppped the antec for a Rosewill Hive Modular, switched to an Asus GPU, added the CPU cooler and went to a cheaper case, keeping the total cost about the same.

Hopefully picking up the PC/Mobo/Case at Microcent this weekend, which should knock ~$120 off the listed price here :).

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.99 @ Microcenter)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($24.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($169.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($46.98 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($103.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 830 Series 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($199.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Asus Radeon HD 7870 GHz Edition 2GB Video Card ($238.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Case: Cooler Master Elite 311 (Blue) ATX Mid Tower Case ($34.98 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: Rosewill Hive 550W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($49.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.98 @ Outlet PC)
Total: $1079.85
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-01-23 09:05 EST-0500)
herod
Member
(01-23-2013, 02:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by electricpirate

Very cool :).

Anywho, I have a couple of more questions.

Newegg has a corsair 750w PSU. I was figuring on an antec 550W PSu for my build, but this is 30 dollars cheaper. So two questions, are Corsair PSUs any good? And will it be a moot point because the extra wattage will just eat the savings over time from my power bill?

they only draw what they need. It's possible that a higher powered one is actually more efficient (wastes less as heat for example).
Dynoro
Member
(01-23-2013, 02:10 PM)
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Such an amazing thread - its a goldmine for helping the colleagues out with cheap parts and builds
Eideka
Banned
(01-23-2013, 02:19 PM)
Incredible OP.
AuthenticM
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(01-23-2013, 02:25 PM)
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Love these threads.
kharma45
Member
(01-23-2013, 02:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by electricpirate

You are good people. Thanks for the advice. I decided that a Modular PSU was important, so I switched up the build a bit, droppped the antec for a Rosewill Hive Modular, switched to an Asus GPU, added the CPU cooler and went to a cheaper case, keeping the total cost about the same.

Hopefully picking up the PC/Mobo/Case at Microcent this weekend, which should knock ~$120 off the listed price here :).

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.99 @ Microcenter)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($24.99 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($169.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($46.98 @ Amazon)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($103.98 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 830 Series 256GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($199.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: Asus Radeon HD 7870 GHz Edition 2GB Video Card ($238.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Case: Cooler Master Elite 311 (Blue) ATX Mid Tower Case ($34.98 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: Rosewill Hive 550W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($49.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($19.98 @ Outlet PC)
Total: $1079.85
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-01-23 09:05 EST-0500)

Whilst that 7870 GHz edition is a good card the 7870 XT is so close in price to it you might as well get it, it is essentially 7950 performance at 7870 money.
Azzurri
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(01-23-2013, 02:29 PM)
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Is it worth waiting for Haswell?

edit: June 2nd seems so far away.
Last edited by Azzurri; 01-23-2013 at 03:04 PM.
Isaccard
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(01-23-2013, 02:32 PM)
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I've been away from this thread for too long.
Dr Stabbingworth
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(01-23-2013, 02:40 PM)
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This is my current rig I built about 2.5 years ago. I'm thinking up upgrading the graphics card to a 6870 or 7850, like the OP recommends on the lower builds. I also want to add an SSD in the near future.

Any thoughts? Will I need a new power supply too? Is upgrading the ram to 8GB worthwhile?

PCPartPicker part list / Benchmarks

CPU: AMD Athlon II X4 645 3.1GHz Quad-Core Processor
Motherboard: Asus M4A87TD/USB3 ATX AM3 Motherboard
Memory: Mushkin Essentials 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR3-1333 Memory
Video Card: MSI Radeon HD 5670 1GB Video Card
Power Supply: Antec EarthWatts Green 380W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply
Optical Drive: Samsung SH-224BB/RSBS DVD/CD Writer
1TB HDD
MMBosstones86
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(01-23-2013, 02:50 PM)
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amazing thread. last one helped me out a TON building my first pc last year. incredible work
Whooter
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(01-23-2013, 02:58 PM)
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Yay! New OT! Thanks for all you do Hazaro and crew!
Dave_6
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(01-23-2013, 03:03 PM)
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New thread! Awesome! Thanks Hazaro, mkenyon and everyone else involved!

Here is my current 'planned' build, as of today at least: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/yZo7

I change my mind quite a bit so that could change before the week is over...
scogoth
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(01-23-2013, 03:04 PM)
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Nice! Can't believe I'm so late to the party
Whooter
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(01-23-2013, 03:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dave_6

New thread! Awesome!

Here is my current 'planned' build, as of today at least: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/yZo7

I change my mind quite a bit so that could change before the week is over...

It looks pretty good right now. :)
MajorPain
Member
(01-23-2013, 03:07 PM)
Awesome Thread!

Nice job, subscribing now.
claviertekky
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(01-23-2013, 03:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by Hazaro

NeoGAF PC Builds:
Mkenyon's Small Form Factor Build Sheet - http://bit.ly/GAFSFF

Y U NO HAV Fractal Design Nodal 304?







Last edited by claviertekky; 01-23-2013 at 03:13 PM.

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