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Yogscast accused of fishy behavior with Yogsventure money, refuses to explain

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
But they are willing to explain they have no obligation to do anything.

Following that blunder, Vale says Lewis Brindley, one of the two Yogscast founders, "lost faith right away in my ability to run the company from a business standpoint." Brindley, Vale said, then demanded that "all the rest of the Kickstarter money that hadn't been spent be transferred to them right away." That amounted to about $150,000. Vale said Yogscast was supposed to use the money to create and ship the physical rewards promised to donors, and then hire, at $100,000, the lead programmer the project still lacked.

Yogscast Kickstarter failure is a painful reminder of the risks of crowdfunding
That person apparently was never hired. "We began developing in earnest but without our main programmer and no funds to hire one it became clear that more of that role was going to be filled by me than I ever intended," Vale said.
He says he "worked tirelessly for the next 18 months," and the project didn't lose another person, but "too many design changes and my in-experience as a project lead and programmer were what's to blame for our company never really making what it was we set out to make."

Polygon has reached out to Yogscast for comment about Vale's version of events, and what the $100,000 was spent on if not the salary for a lead programmer. In a comment published to the Yogscast subreddit, Brindley said "We're not ready to make a detailed statement about what happened with Yogventures!. Winterkewl's statement omits much and I would disagree with a number of points, but there's no value in going into detail." He added that "Any monies the Yogscast have received in connection with this project has been spent on this project."
Source: http://www.polygon.com/2014/7/20/5920079/yogscast-kickstarter-canceled-yogventures-winterkewl
 

eot

Banned
Whitney-Receipts.gif


No point in going into detail? Erm
 
Aren't Yogscast the ones demanding money from indies for covering their games? Yeah... they kinda seem shady now that they're big, or at least greedy.

Earlier this week, the folks of Yogscast debuted a perplexing new revenue sharing system, one that revolves around taking a cut of the sales of some games featured on their massively popular YouTube show. Specifically, the model is set up so that if a game in the new “YogDiscovery” program sees a sales spike after its appearance on the show, the creator of the video in question gets a percent of the revenue from all new copies sold.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertc...verage-youtube-debate-seems-pretty-clear-cut/
 

Skyzard

Banned
Tbh both sides sound a bit fishy.

If Yogscast didn't sort out the programmer, why didn't the manager of the project slam them for it in his response. All he did was point out that he gave them the money to do those things but seemingly blamed himself overall.
 

OnPoint

Member
Aren't Yogscast the ones demanding money from indies for covering their games? Yeah... they kinda seem shady now that they're big, or at least greedy.



http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertc...verage-youtube-debate-seems-pretty-clear-cut/

Well, to be fair, they're not "demanding" it. It's part of the agreement you make with them. We were considering it for our game, but we didn't feel comfortable with the idea. Then all this Kickstarter stuff came to light like 2 days later, and we felt better about our decision.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Tbh both sides sound a bit fishy.

If Yogscast didn't sort out the programmer, why didn't the manager of the project slam them for it in his response. All he did was point out that he gave them the money to do those things but seemingly blamed himself overall.
This is part of his overall write up on where the money went. He explains he can't account for this money due to handing it over and not receiving what was expected.

He openly admits his own failures and how much each cost. Yogscast won't do the same.

Like did the rewards cost three times as much as expected? Why not explain?
 

Halcyon

Member
I like Lewis and most of the yogscast in general so I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that it was just a failed project and nothing really unethical.
 

redhood56

Banned
I haven't watched the yogscast in a while, but I used to really like their videos. Now they are a business and it isn't the same. This is really disappointing.
 

darkside31337

Tomodachi wa Mahou
This is part of his overall write up on where the money went. He explains he can't account for this money due to handing it over and not receiving what was expected.

He openly admits his own failures and how much each cost. Yogscast won't do the same.

Like did the rewards cost three times as much as expected? Why not explain?

Because they pocketed the rest of the money?

I really don't know how people are still giving them the benefit of the doubt.
 

Tripon

Member
...So where did the money go Yogscast? Are they refusing to admit they received the money or are they refusing that they allocated to what it was supposed to be?
 

Skyzard

Banned
The person they hired to create the game gave one of the artists $35k upfront for his work and he had to leave the project two weeks later :lol.

I remember...the concept artist who went to Lucas Arts or something shortly after...being paid in full (to start... :S).
This is part of his overall write up on where the money went. He explains he can't account for this money due to handing it over and not receiving what was expected.

He openly admits his own failures and how much each cost. Yogscast won't do the same.

Like did the rewards cost three times as much as expected? Why not explain?

Damn right they ought to explain to their fans, if no explanation is coming that's pretty shameful.

If what he says is true (the 100K he gave to yogscast to get a main programmer didn't happen (although he doesn't actually specify- he just says he ended up having to do a lot more of the work himself than he realised, iirc) - then Yogscast is to blame overall for this project failure imo.
No main programmer? Seems like he gave them the money pretty soon after the $35k guy ran off at the start.
 

Applebite

Member
Yeah, this is sketchy to say the least. "..but there's no value in going into detail" probably means "..but there's no value in going into detail for us".
 
Well, to be fair, they're not "demanding" it. It's part of the agreement you make with them. We were considering it for our game, but we didn't feel comfortable with the idea. Then all this Kickstarter stuff came to light like 2 days later, and we felt better about our decision.

I'd say that's a demand of their contract, yeah. It's not illegal or anything, just greedy and sorta stupid.
 

Prophane33

Member
Never heard of these guys outside of that Sonic Racing DLC awhile back; I can't say this incident is endearing them to me.
 

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
I remember...the concept artist who went to Lucas Arts or something shortly after...being paid in full (to start... :S).


Damn right they ought to explain to their fans, if no explanation is coming that's pretty shameful.

If what he says is true (the 100K he gave to yogscast to get a main programmer didn't happen (although he doesn't actually specify- he just says he ended up having to do a lot more of the work himself than he realised, iirc) - then Yogscast is to blame overall for this project failure imo.
No main programmer? Seems like he gave them the money pretty soon after the $35k guy ran off at the start.
Yes, the sequence of purported events is:

1.) 35K artist blunder.
2.) Yogscast demands remaining $150K. According to the original budget, $50K should be spent on rewards and $100K on a lead programmer.
3.) The programmer is never hired so the project lead who has some programming experience tries to fulfill the role unsuccessfully himself.
4.) Yogscast is asked what happened to the remaining $100K and refuses to explain anything.
 
I like Lewis and most of the yogscast in general so I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that it was just a failed project and nothing really unethical.

Just a failed project where they toyed with $500k of other peoples money, and then refuse to acknowledge any responsibility and explain what really happened. Yeah, no problems there.
 

JDSN

Banned
Thieves, not another word for those assholes, their explanation of "That dude is lying but we refuse to say what really happened" makes me think their PR departament is the same one handling AC: Unity.

And yes, they will get away with it and probably sue the guy for libel, laws protect only people with money. And their fanbase is prone to comments like:

I like Lewis and most of the yogscast in general so I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that it was just a failed project and nothing really unethical.
 

Amir0x

Banned
I'm totally more inclined to believe Vale's account, because he acknowledges his own fault in the situation, saying his inexperience as a project leader was a big factor in why the game failed. Yogcast seems like they're trying to hide misconduct.
 
It's becoming pretty clear that Yogscast are a deeply unethical company, from vaguely worded and hard to find disclaimers about 'advertorial' content to the way they have failed to make clear what portion of the moneys on this project they have retained. It's one of the cheapest tricks in the book to say 'I could explain exactly what happened but I don't want to make others look bad' as it both makes you seem like a martyr while avoiding actually refuting the claims made by others (and thus being caught out on lies or half truths).

Honestly if you are a UK resident who sunk money into this and want to see any real response from Yogscast get onto BBC Watchdog. They'll eat up the 'abusing the trust of kids' angle combined with the waffly BS out of Yogscast like it was manna from heaven.
 

Salaadin

Member
I'm totally more inclined to believe Vale's account, because he acknowledges his own fault in the situation, saying his inexperience as a project leader was a big factor in why the game failed. Yogcast seems like they're trying to hide misconduct.

I agree with this. Vale doesn't seem to be running away from anything. Yogscast just seems to be taking the silent approach and hoping the whole thing blows over. They're looking pretty suspicious.
 

Tommy DJ

Member
Don't you have contracts so contractors are obligated to complete their work with an accepted amount of care and effort? That's literally Management 101.
 

Coxy

Member
between this and yogdiscovery its pretty clear they're scummy but they probably have enough idiots who love them for farting and burping at minecraft to get away with these things
 

liquidtmd

Banned
Gross incompetence or fraud - they are still dicks who promised something for cash they did not deliver.

This 'b-b-but we're sorry / not obliged to do anything / we're nice guys' spiel doesnt change the end result.

there's no value in going into detail.

Trolololololol
 
With the recent news about Yogscast, Notch's comment from his twitter meltdown about Yogscast @ Minecon comes to mind; "an isolated island of ego's".
Unfortunately they seem to have a fanbase that will stand by them no matter what, so they don't really have to care.
 
It's becoming pretty clear that Yogscast are a deeply unethical company, from vaguely worded and hard to find disclaimers about 'advertorial' content to the way they have failed to make clear what portion of the moneys on this project they have retained. It's one of the cheapest tricks in the book to say 'I could explain exactly what happened but I don't want to make others look bad' as it both makes you seem like a martyr while avoiding actually refuting the claims made by others (and thus being caught out on lies or half truths).

Agree with this.
 
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