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[Roubjon]

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[adamsapple]

Playing as Sarcastic Female Hawke made Dragon Age 2 bearable, so no, I can't relate.

Holy shit, I did the exact same thing lol. The VA is great, the same actress who did Ciri in The Witcher 3 if I'm not mistaken.

 

[Sheentak]

You know what when I was a kid I couldn't play as female charecters mainly because girls made me uncomfortable.
Maybe his a child!

 

[Elandyll]

#shrug

Had no problem relating to Aloy, B2, Max or multiple other female characters as long as they are at least somewhat well defined and consistent with themselves and their environment.

 

[Zafir]

I mean as a woman, I really wouldn't play many games if I couldn't....

Personally I'm not sure you need to be able to totally relate anyway, a character can still be interesting, and you can still be invested in their struggles. It's called empathy.

 

[Nheco]

If I need to relate to a char, the only game I would had played was... Alan Wake... maybe? A kinda fat white dude who can't run.

 

[Impetuous Imp]

I don't see how it /can't/ be sexist, especially if the person is - as OP states - a decent person by other metrics.

I mean, he could be in denial to the point he's unaware of his sexist ideals, but surely being unable to relate to a female protagonist means difficult or inability to relate with women in general?

That has to come from a sexist place.

I've been trying to put myself in OP's friend's shoes to see if there would be some reasonable explanation that doesn't point to some kind of subconscious sexism (for all that OP states his friend is generally very accepting and inclusive in everyday life).

I mean, I've put down books that many of my friends have loved because I found the female protagonist completely "unrelatable" - maybe that's due to poor writing, but I just found it impossible to identify with the character's motivations and reactions despite being the same gender. So I won't write off the possibility that OP's friend finds some things in certain female characters' motivations that don't really mix well with how he'd react to things. That seems like it would be more on a case-by-case basis rather than as a general rule, however. Maybe he got burned by it before and just projects onto all of them now?

 

[Gai Murakumo]

The characters sex, race, ethnicity and age does not matter to me as long as the character is written well. I do not see how your friend cannot relate to a character because they are of the opposite sex.

 

[NinjaMouse]

I treat the main character in every game basically the same...I don't care much about the sex or race of the character if the overarching story is interesting, environments are well done, and the game is fun to play. I very rarely get emotionally invested in characters in games or movies.

 

[Lothar]

I've been trying to put myself in OP's friend's shoes to see if there would be some reasonable explanation that doesn't point to some kind of subconscious sexism (for all that OP states his friend is generally very accepting and inclusive in everyday life).

I mean, I've put down books that many of my friends have loved because I found the female protagonist completely "unrelatable" - maybe that's due to poor writing, but I just found it impossible to identify with the character's motivations and reactions despite being the same gender. So I won't write off the possibility that OP's friend finds some things in certain female characters' motivations that don't really mix well with how he'd react to things. That seems like it would be more on a case-by-case basis rather than as a general rule, however. Maybe he got burned by it before and just projects onto all of them now?

You're making a mistake thinking of it in terms of a book. You're not being a character in a book. You're supposed to be pretending to be a character in a game. I prefer to play as opposite sex, opposite personality, opposite everything because I prefer to step into the shoes of someone as far from me as possible because I'm me all the time. What's wrong with someone who thinks differently and would rather step into their own shoes inside of a video game world? Nothing.

 

[Impetuous Imp]

You're making a mistake thinking of it in terms of a book. You're not being a character in a book. You're supposed to be pretending to be a character in a game. I prefer to play as opposite sex, opposite personality, opposite everything because I prefer to step into the shoes of someone as far from me as possible because I'm me all the time. What's wrong with someone who thinks differently and would rather step into their own shoes inside of a video game world? Nothing.

That first part seems like a pretty blanket statement - I'm not sure it's always so generalized. A lot of it probably comes down to personal approaches to both gaming and reading. Some people don't feel a need to identify with a character's motivations in either books or games. Others get emotionally involved with either or both. For some games, you may be directing the actions of a character, but the story is still pretty scripted and the outcome can't be changed by much, if at all - not unlike a book. See all the people who have complained they didn't get a choice at the end of TLOU, for example. For all the dialogue options you have in Horizon, I don't find the way I'm experiencing Aloy's story much different than how I would experience it in written form.

In reference to your last sentence - unless you were being sarcastic, it seems like we were making the same point. I can't definitively say that OP's friend is or isn't sexist but was pondering other reasons for not being able to relate to a character of the opposite gender.

 

[Fuchsdh]

I mean as a woman, I really wouldn't play many games if I couldn't....

Personally I'm not sure you need to be able to totally relate anyway, a character can still be interesting, and you can still be invested in their struggles. It's called empathy.

Yeah, this is a big point too. Most games outside the RPG mold have moved beyond "this shell is you"-type characterization, so I don't really see why you have to deeply relate to them. I have boundaries where I stop giving a shit about characters who are completely unlikeable to me (looking at you, Walter White) but otherwise I'm just along for the ride.

For the romance stuff, I'm straight as can be but I don't see what the issue with a heterosexual romance with a female lead is. I'm not aware of any game forcing you into sex scenes or something similar. If you're made uncomfortable by PDA then you've got bigger issues.

Romance in games (hell, most media in general) is almost universally poor, so I can see eschewing that by the numbers, but on the other hand you're never going to get good romance elements if no one ever tries to add them. (In some ways Oxenfree had me kind of disappointed there was no romance option for the main character Alex, it was that good with all the characters and you got to dick around with everyone else's love life.)

 

[ResidentWeevil13]

To be absolutely honest, I have NEVER related to any video game protagonist; male, female, human, or alien.

I'm hearing great things about "Night in The Woods," though, so maybe that'll change my tune.

 

[N7.Angel]

I prefer playing a male 99% of the time, I don't mind playing sometime with girls protagonist but only if I'm forced too, that's probably why I never go Femshep or Femryder.

To be absolutely honest, I have NEVER related to any video game protagonist; male, female, human, or alien.

I'm hearing great things about "Night in The Woods," though, so maybe that'll change my tune.

That's me as well, it's the same for movies and everything, I'm playing/watching a character that I enjoy but I don't identify to him or her.

 

[Mozendo]

For me sex has nothing to do with it, personality/traits does.

 

[Soriku]

Poor side characters, with the main character getting all the attention, who can relate to them?

 

[Octavia]

I need a blank slate character or someone I can relate to. Race/gender/species doesnt matter to me in that however, but demeanor and motivations do.

Yes, some will argue that games give you the chance to be other people, but that doesn't interest me when I find a character's personality insufferable, or their motivations dubious and shallow.

 

[Zakalwe]

I've been trying to put myself in OP's friend's shoes to see if there would be some reasonable explanation that doesn't point to some kind of subconscious sexism (for all that OP states his friend is generally very accepting and inclusive in everyday life).

I mean, I've put down books that many of my friends have loved because I found the female protagonist completely "unrelatable" - maybe that's due to poor writing, but I just found it impossible to identify with the character's motivations and reactions despite being the same gender. So I won't write off the possibility that OP's friend finds some things in certain female characters' motivations that don't really mix well with how he'd react to things. That seems like it would be more on a case-by-case basis rather than as a general rule, however. Maybe he got burned by it before and just projects onto all of them now?

Yes, this is entirely possible. There's a distinct lack of decent protagonists in gaming in terms of writing and actually pulling the character off in general, and when we consider female protags we have even less to work with.

It's entirely possible the guy could have played a series of games with female leads that were written poorly which has helped shape this preference.

What is more difficult to understand is a life spent devouring all types of fiction across every medium (which I'm sure he has), and in all that time failing to realise women can be written well too.

I think there /has/ to be something blocking the ability to recognise that, and I can't imagine something that would do that that wasn't at least partially rooted in sexism.

 

[Peltz]

I don't understand why you'd even need to "relate to" a videogame character to play a game. It's not a book or a movie.

Do you need to relate to the racecar to play monopoly?

 

[Zakalwe]

I felt this way when I was younger. I think it speaks to a very immature world view...

"Boy are better than girls!"
"Girls are gross!"

Yeh, I think most people go through a phase where they can't relate to things they're not, but thankfully if I did feel that I grew out of it.

I think this is bang on. It very likely doesn't come from a place of mean-spirited sexism, just institutionalized sexism. It doesn't make the OP's friend an awful human being, but it does speak to some form of prejudice that they aren't able to empathize with someone that belongs to another gender.

Yeh, I think this is accurate.

 

[Trogdor1123]

I don't like playing as a female in games if I have the choice. Never have and probably never will. I don't think it's a big deal though and I'm not against female characters, it's just not what I want to play as.

 

[Zakalwe]

I don't like playing as a female in games if I have the choice. Never have and probably never will. I don't think it's a big deal though and I'm not against female characters, it's just not what I want to play as.

Have you ever asked yourself why this is?

i'm not calling you out, I just think these things deserve scrutiny.

 

[ResidentWeevil13]

That's me as well, it's the same for movies and everything, I'm playing/watching a character that I enjoy but I don't identify to him or her.

I've definitely been able to relate to characters portrayed in other mediums (film & books), but the video games that I enjoy playing usually have stories that range from terrible to non-existent to big-blockbuster-nonsense. I can't relate to that shit. And any games I've seen that look like they have stories that are more down to earth and character-driven, seem to be devoid of any gameplay that interests me.

 

[Trogdor1123]

Have you ever asked yourself why this is?

Cause I don't want to play as one. That's all. Just my preferred way to play. Im not against it, when my girls are around when I make a character in a game they usually want a girl which I make. It's no biggie. A game with a female star wouldn't even cross my mind as a reason not to buy either. Just not my preference.

Didn't think you were calling me out at all. Totally fair question.

 

[Octavia]

I don't understand why you'd even need to "relate to" a videogame character to play a game. It's not a book or a movie.

Do you need to relate to the racecar to play monopoly?

Um... what? Did you stop gaming in 1980?

 

[InsaneFandom]

Well, if I refused to play games with male protags I'd be rather limited indeed

It's always a stupid argument though - unless your some kind of sociopath you should be able to relate and empathise with pretty much anyone and anything.
Getting to know characters from different walks of life is pretty much the best thing about fiction imo, it'd be incredibly boring if you limited TV shows, books, games & movies to only those who starred protagonists similar to yourself.

It's pretty telling how this argument usually comes up regarding female or coloured protagonists. Like, you can relate to a bionic super soldier clone whose spent their whole life fighting to defeat some robot apocalypse on Mars but a woman or black man? hell naw

 

[Adam_Vania]

first game i ever played had me controlling a yellow sphere with a mouth that ate ghosts. i'm not an anthropomorphized sphere and yet i had no problem with this.

second game i ever played had me controlling an Italian plumber. again, not a plumber, not Italian, no problem. i have also never broken a brick by punching it.

it's almost as if videogames are about experiencing the fantastic.

 

[Nottle]

I feel like people view entertainment in different ways.

A father of a friend I have seems to put himself in the shoes of the main character. They become the protagonist of the book or show they watch.

For me I view myself as playing or viewing a character. I never become the character in my mind. I think well what would this character do in this situation.

I feel like the prior way of viewing a story is more likely to make someone not sympathize with characters that are "different" it's why the Everyman trope exists.

Personally I find it really absurd that one can't relate to black spiderman compared to white spiderman or watch foreign films.

In my mind just because spiderman is white isn't enough to be relatable. Whiteness does not equal my entire personality, just as blackness isn't enough to make a characters story so alien to me that I don't care about it anymore.

Also I would love another persona where I can be a cool girl. That would be rad. Date some cute boys.

 

[Oscar]

I have this issue.

I like to essentially role play the character while i'm all in/immersed during my time playing. Samus and Ellie from TLOU have been the only exceptions. Mostly because I couldn't see Samus' face, and well, you're kind of forced to play Ellie in the middle of the game.

I don't have this issue with multiplayer games like Overwatch where I'm more focused on abilities than trying to jump into that character's story.

Ethnicity doesn't matter to me, I'm Mexican af but I think I'm Geralt while playing The Witcher. Gender is what seems to be the hurdle for me.

My gf has suggested I try to view it more like a movie/story that I'm controlling the camera/perspective on. Like, bigger picture shit and not just focusing on the main protagonist.

 

[Jakoo]

Holy shit, I did the exact same thing lol. The VA is great, the same actress who did Ciri in The Witcher 3 if I'm not mistaken.

I swear that I have a better opinion of that game then the majority of this board based on the sheer strength of that permutation of Hawke. It made me take the game a whole lot less seriously, which in turn made it a lot more enjoyable.

 

[LinkSlayer64]

Sounds a little like he just didn't care for the game, lol, and wanted to let you down easy.
Either way still odd.

 

[galvatron]

As a black guy I've been forced to relate to white male protagonists for the last two decades. Playing as a woman ain't so bad.

I also don't treat video games as self inserts (unless that's the purpose of a game)

Add another decade for me...I'd go even further and say it's made me never expect to relate to a character based on appearance since playing as someone who doesn't look like me is the cost of entry to the hobby.

Besides, I'm mostly in it for the gameplay...this focus on mediocre stories is making me play fewer big budget games.

 

[Onivulk]

I never even self insert into games. I never even try to relate to Nathan Drake or Ellie or any character for that matter.

As a white guy though I never make white male characters and if I can help it they won't even be human!

Give me a female Draenei or a Khajiit any day. I play games for escapism. I want to be the furthest thing from me possible.

 

[Impetuous Imp]

I don't understand why you'd even need to "relate to" a videogame character to play a game. It's not a book or a movie.

You're making a mistake thinking of it in terms of a book. You're not being a character in a book. You're supposed to be pretending to be a character in a game..

I find it interesting that these two quotes are so opposite each other, and it really speaks to the different ways people approach different forms of media, including gaming. Have people taken as hard a look at movie-goers and readers to see if there are perhaps just as many people who perhaps don't consume specific pieces of media due to the gender of the protagonists, or do we require more justification for refusing to play a particular game as opposed to someone saying "nah, that book/movie just didn't interest me" ? For every person who says "that game didn't look interesting," how many of them actually feel the same way and either won't or can't articulate that it's due to gender?

Not sure I really have a point but I find it curious.

 

[Sparkedglory]

No. I don't even think I really relate to characters I'm playing as. And if I do then it's because of their actions and personality. Not really their looks or gender.

That being said. I am happy when I can get a character that looks like me.

 

[NoMoreTrolls]

I totally understand this stance. As a short, fat guy with asthma, I can't relate to any game character ever, and hate videogames as a result. I also only read books and watch movies about short, fat, asthmatic people, in service to my complete lack of connection to anyone that doesn't physically resemble me.

 

[Gnome Scat]

So long as she is well written I have no problem relating to her.

 

[ResidentWeevil13]

Um... what? Did you stop gaming in 1980?

The medium is still way behind books and film when it comes to story and characters. There have been improvements sure, but it's still hasn't reached its potential. And when there are other mediums that do storytelling so much better, I tend to agree with the poster you were replying to.

 

[maxmars]

Never had this issue. I like to have a great story narrated to me whatever the characters. I didn't think this could be an issue for other people frankly!

 

[kunonabi]

Nope, I always gravitated towards female protags in video games, books, films, etc and none of my friends have trouble with it either. I've never met anyone who has a problem with such things.

 

[Beth Cyra]

I can relate to males just fine.

I'm just bored as playing them so unless they have a cool design or are made by Nomura I will pass on a game that stars a male if it has a strong romance plot.

 

[Bloodporne]

I can't relate to that either as I just don't relate to/put myself in a videogame protag's shoes. They're just random avatars to me I guess but I've never really thought about it particularly.

I've arbitrarily made male and female characters in the Souls games and so forth just to 'see something different' and that's about as deep as it gets for me. It may be a generation thing and probably the same reason I don't care about stories in games and things like that.

 

[the-pi-guy]

I don't really understand...
It's not like women are aliens or anything....


I don't have any difficulty with relating to characters of the opposite sex. In some cases I might even relate better. Aloy and Ellie from TLoU are vastly more relatable than most because of how well they are written.

How do people relate to sackboy?

 

[benicillin]

I'd be missing out on a lot of really great and important experiences if I lacked the empathy or desire to relate to anything other than my IRL gender and race.

 

[RedHill]

"I can't play a female character because I can't relate to her, but a blue hedgehog..."

It's just a dumb excuse used by men that think anything remotely female near them emasculates them in some way and think they relate to macho fictional characters.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

Doesn't take effort, and I don't need to relate to enjoy anyway. Doesn't have to have anything to do with me.

 

[Mzo]

Never had this problem, don't understand it at all.

 

[prag16]

Personally, I find this to be absolutely absurd. Does he also not watch films where the main character is a woman, or refuse to read books with a female main character? That's a lot of great media he's missing out on

This. It's completely absurd. I actually at as a female more often than not when there's a choice.

Only caveat for me is in games with romances, my female protagonist will be a lesbian. Otherwise, give me that vagina. No issues there.

 

[Obliterator]

To be fair to him this somewhat works both ways. My wife for example doesn't really like playing as men. It's not something she hates or anything but she seems to enjoy games quite a bit more when she can play as a woman. I don't think there is anything particularly wrong with it really, people all have their own tastes. Ironically that's how she fell in love with the Gears of War franchise, was by being able to play Horde as the female characters. She never got into the campaign really as she didn't like playing as Marcus or Dom but she RAGED Horde on Gears 3. To the point she got all the Onyx medals for Horde. I don't think that would have happened if she could only play as hugely jacked dudes.

On a personal level I love playing as all different types of characters though. Male, female, doesn't matter at all to me.

 

[Mash83]

I would think that a younger version of myself might feel this way but now, I might actually like playing as a female more than a male.

I absolutely loved Horizon Zero Dawn and I cant remember a single instance where I thought, "I wish I was playing as a male."

Im also currently playing Dishonored 2 as Emily and I love the fact that Im running around as the former empress just slaying people left and right. I think its awesome.

I originally planned on playing Mass Effect Andromeda as Sarah but decided against it at the last minute. I cant imagine enjoying the game any less playing as Sarah though.

Rise of the Tomb Raider is also one of the best games Ive played this gen.

Im glad I dont have an issue with this, I would be missing out on some awesome games.