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Why Sonic the Hedgehog is 'incorrect' game design

oni-link

Member
Source
In April, the pop musician Lorde gave an interview to the New York Times where she talked about a meeting with famed song writer Max Martin. The genius who helped create Katy Perry’s “I Kissed a Girl” and Taylor Swift’s “Blank Space”, referred to Lorde’s song Green Light as “incorrect songwriting”. He saw its early key change, weird melodics and the lack of drums until the chorus kicks in, as improper. “It wasn’t an insult, just a statement of fact,” said Lorde. “It’s a strange piece of music.”

Weirdly, as soon as I read the fascinating little snippet of song craft theory, I thought of Sonic the Hedgehog. The legendary platformer, in which a spiky creature sprints furiously through a series of multi-levelled environments is incorrect game design. It shouldn’t work. It’s wrong.

If you take a classic platform game design, such as Super Mario Bros – the player is always given the chance to read the level: to look ahead and assess every new piece of scenery or patrolling enemy. Then you get a series of neatly placed hazards that present discrete challenges.

In his excellent book on game design, A Theory of Fun, Raph Koster, says the essence of good game design is teaching – a well constructed level slowly introduces you to its themes, and shows you how to beat them. Learn, test, master.

Sonic doesn’t do this – all it establishes at the beginning is that speed is important. In a single playthrough, you only ever get a passing feel for the levels; you miss vast areas – all the rules are broken. As in Green Light, the melody and the maths are wrong; new players always find it hard to read the screen, because it’s not working like a good game.

Even the influences behind Sonic are incorrect. Designer Naoto Ohshima, who sketched all the zones out by hand, was influenced by pinball table design, filling each stage with flippers and bumpers to project Sonic in new directions like a ball-bearing. But pinball doesn’t work like video games.

In pinball you understand that you never really have full control over the protagonist (the ball), you are attempting to influence its speed and direction through secondary inputs, through deft touches. But video games are all about control. Players want to inhabit the avatar, ideally with a symbiotic relationship. Sonic even mocks this whole idea, by having the lead character tap his feet impatiently when the player dares to stop for a few seconds. Sonic tells you you are not really in control.

Sonic the Hedgehog punishes the player by manipulating their sense of momentum, by frustrating them into unexpected starts and stops. It is awful to be stuck at the base of a ramp in Sonic, unable to jump your way out, having to wait for the character to accelerate; trying to read the angles so that you spin out of a rut rather than straight back into it.You’re always fighting the system. The maths feels wrong, or at least it feels like the maths is against you.

Sonic is incorrect game design and yet, like Green Light, it’s a masterpiece. As Lorde sings, you want to just let go, but you can’t – you’re not really free. Yet sometimes in Sonic, when you get better, or through sheer luck, things take off, every jump is right, every loop-the-loop is perfect, and you’re in the flow, sailing above the game’s strange structure. Like the bridge in a brilliant pop song, it’s an exhilarating rush. It’s incorrect, but holy crap, when it works, it works.

I thought this was an interesting take on the Sonic series, and I think this is partly what those people who say "Sonic was never good" are getting at.

On paper, it's not great level design and it doesn't do a great job of teaching the player how to play or what to expect, but that's not really the type of game it is

What do you think, GAF?
 

oneida

Cock Strain, Lifetime Warranty
i've seen variations on this song and dance for years
honestly it's sophomoric game design criticism, speed is a reward for learning to play the games, it is not the goal of the games. this is a fundamental point this argument fails to acknowledge
 

RRockman

Banned
I think its straight up hogwash.


"correct" is what works. Not every game needs to be Megaman in order to be "correct". That initial assumption is what makes this article the hottest garbage I've seen in a long time.
 

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I think that this article is reductive in its claim what a videogame needs to do to be good. Sonic has a different approach than Mario, it is more of an arcade game, a genre which tends to teach by failure rather than applying safety guards. Both approaches have merit.
 

Mesoian

Member
I don't know man, I see this all time, people talking about sonic's gameplay as speed first, platforming/exploration second, but that's not really the case. Outside of Green Hill Zone in sonic 1, almost every level in every classic sonic game rewards tight platforming and slow sequences with huge bursts of speed where the spectacle of going fast can take over. Speed is the carrot, platforming is the cart.

I'd say the first time that changed was with Sonic Advance, which honestly could have benefited from the screen being pulled out a bit mroe considering the level design splits off from high, medium, low route formula to more specific routes based on hazards formula.

Then you reach 3d sonic and it all sort of goes out the window.

But I never really considered it to be wrong, just faster, different. Don't think about all the moments where you going through loops or launching yourself using boosters, think about allt he moments you're standing perfectly still, waiting for a floating box or an enemy to get into the right position so you can propel yourself to a temporary goal. That's why classic mania style sonic works so well.
 

dafodeu

Member
Games are art. Sure there are best practices but no correct/incorrect game design. Sonic is fun, the sense of speed when the original sonic came out was something new and exciting after slow paced platformers. It was a breath of fresh air.
 

Lunar15

Member
I wonder if people will actually read the article. Probably not.

Sonic is incorrect game design and yet, like Green Light, it's a masterpiece. As Lorde sings, you want to just let go, but you can't – you're not really free. Yet sometimes in Sonic, when you get better, or through sheer luck, things take off, every jump is right, every loop-the-loop is perfect, and you're in the flow, sailing above the game's strange structure. Like the bridge in a brilliant pop song, it's an exhilarating rush. It's incorrect, but holy crap, when it works, it works.

Either way, it's a weird conceit.
 

Aeana

Member
If you guys aren't going to actually read the article, we're just going to close the thread. The thread title does not hold all of the information you need to respond to this.
 

Mesoian

Member
I wonder if people will actually read the article. Probably not.



Either way, it's a weird conceit.

I know he's going for a, "there's nothing wrong when a song ends in a minor key" type mentality, but to refer to it as incorrect when it's merely a different tempo is an odd thing to do.
 

Aeana

Member
I know he's going for a, "there's nothing wrong when a song ends in a minor key" type mentality, but to refer to it as incorrect when it's merely a different tempo is an odd thing to do.

It's a reference to a quote from a songwriter about the Lorde song. It's right at the top of the OP.
 

RRockman

Banned
I wonder if people will actually read the article. Probably not.

Ummmmmmm, broham? That doesn't change the fact that he's saying it's incorrect game design. The problem is the fact he thinks it's incorrect in the first place and no amount of complements he shoves in at the end addresses that.

It feels incredibly elitist.
 
Well, the Genesis games and CD reward you for mastering the level in my opinion. Speed isn't necessarily the first objective. You can complete the game and do quite well, but what's really helpful is multiple playthroughs. I never saw speed as the main objective. I always thought timing and platforming were more important, with speed being the fruit of your labor. So no, I don't think this is "incorrect" game design, even if I appreciate the thought put into the article.
 

Fireblend

Banned
Really good article. I love games analysis like this.

It's a shame people won't really read the whole article and react to the title.
 

DeathoftheEndless

Crashing this plane... with no survivors!
I know the games work for people like the author, but I never really got it. I like more traditional platformers where you actually have time to react to what's ahead.
 
Ummmmmmm, broham? That doesn't change the fact that he's saying it's incorrect game design. The problem is the fact he thinks it's incorrect in the first place and no amount of complements he shoves in at the end addresses that.

It feels incredibly elitist.

He's using "incorrect" when what he means (and in fact what the person criticizing Lorde probably meant) is "unconventional". That's why your response comes off as knee-jerk and not having read the article.
 

Fularu

Banned
Interesting article but the premise is wrong, Sonic isn't about going as fast as you can. It ´s going to actually punish your recklessness if you play that way.

It's definitely faster paced than Mario but it's not the zooming game many people see in it. This is also probably why the last two decades of games failed so miserably, they took the speed and forgot everything else
 
I think people who are judging design based on an overall objective standard of a "good" game rather than whether or not it works for individual games and what they're trying to achieve is an unduly narrow way to look at things in general. At best, people are kind of kidding themselves, and at worst, such arguments are harming game discourse. As the quotes say there, Sonic is "incorrect" based on certain standards, but it still works, it's still fun, and it still accomplishes what it set out to do. It's not really incorrect then, it's just different.

Using labels like correct or incorrect in something as open-ended as game design just doesn't make sense to me. It's just like other fields like writing or art. Having some base sense of "rules" to ground design is nice, but it should never be a limiter to something different. Particularly, the main argument of "good" design being that the game always teach the player, but that's just one way to design a game. Sometimes games that follow the rules are not well-liked. Sometimes games that break the rules are loved.

It's an interesting subject, but I do kind of get off-put by some of the discussions when people start bringing "objective" standards into it.
 

pswii60

Member
The Genesis games were as much platforming as speed, it's only the more recent shitty 3D iterations that have forgotten about the platforming and focused on speed at any cost.
 

Mesoian

Member
It's a reference to a quote from a songwriter about the Lorde song. It's right at the top of the OP.

I get that, I think it's a reference that doesn't actually work, in this example or in the case of the Lorde song.

Art isn't clinical. There is no perfect. Right and wrong is always subjective. It's a silly thing to say about anything that requires a persona to be applied to it. And I get he's using it as a bridge to define the parallels between two different art forms, but man, It's such a silly thing to say. It's like using the concept of right and wrong to edgily distance yourself from the status quo.
 
I always felt this way as well.

Go fast and you end up running into a wall or an enemy and losing all momentum.

Go slow and the game is no fun.

Turns out the game just isn't fun in either case.
 

AALLx

Member
Just because you're correct doesn't mean you're right.

Hedgehogs die when they are killed... do gold rings isolate Sonic into a separate reality when he gets hit?

On-topic: I think the design of Sonic games work due to the excitement of rushing into the unknown, and having only split second of decision making to choose the right path. I really like both 2D and 3D Sonic, and thought Sonic Generations was amazing in that regard.
 

Freshmaker

I am Korean.
Sonic' s set up more like a racing game. You learn the course as you go, and are rewarded for your attention/skill by finding alternate routes through the level.

It has a very different focus than Mario, but it's not incorrect design.
 

NotLiquid

Member
I feel like the entire article and in fact most hot takes about Sonic's design in the Genesis days (or how design is supposedly meant to work) usually boil down to one simple misconception.

People just don't get why or how Sonic's roll is supposed to work.
 
I get that, I think it's a reference that doesn't actually work, in this example or in the case of the Lorde song.

Art isn't clinical. There is no perfect. Right and wrong is always subjective. It's a silly thing to say about anything that requires a persona to be applied to it. And I get he's using it as bridge to define the parallels between two different art forms, but man, It's such a silly thing to say.

Drawing this parallel and calling a franchise "incorrect" probably generates a lot more traffic than calling that franchise "out of the box" or "unconventional". That's the best excuse I can see for this otherwise strained and weak parallel that frankly didn't have a fantastic basis in the original quote.
 

Mesoian

Member
Whats the reward for mastery o.o? I've watched Sonic speedruns and the ending they gets the same as mine. No bonus content unlocked, no nothing.

I mean, if you perfect the overaching goals a sonic game has for you, you're generally rewarded with a form that has super speed, damn near flight and invincibilty.

I'd go as far as to say that time, interestingly enough, was never a main goal in a sonic game.
 

Wamb0wneD

Member
That's what I and others have been trying to argue in some Sonic related threads that revolved about gameplay, just not as well put. I'ts flawed on a basic level, doesn't make it a bad game.
 

Lindsay

Dot Hacked
Speed runs aren't mastering a level. The whole chaos emeralds/bonus stages/Super Sonic...
Are ya saying speedrunners haven't mastered the game? Not even ones doing 100% speedruns? If mastery means going super slow an cautiously so as not to get hit by dozens of jerkish enemy/obstables placements in order to try and wins at usually awful bonuses stages... then I'm a Sonic master! Cause I got all the emeralds an junks on all those early Sonic games! It wasn't fun but I did it!
 
"Sonic is incorrect game design and yet, like Green Light, it’s a masterpiece."

The entire article is a very interesting comparison. The "once everything starts flowing" part is totally true. When everything comes together and you're flying through a section of the level.
 

RRockman

Banned
He's using "incorrect" when what he means (and in fact what the person criticizing Lorde probably meant) is "unconventional". That's why your response comes off as knee-jerk and not having read the article.

Thanks for adressing me as someone who has read it. I get really annoyed at people who just assume I didn't read the article.


But then the question becomes why not simply say it's unconventional if you mean it that way? Incorrect is synonymous with wrong period.

The other problem I had with the article is in one of the paragraphs he makes the claim that it's all about speed. It's like he ignores there are several traps especially in the first one that would immediately kill you if you are holding right and mashing jump. He makes the assumption that you have to rush instead of taking your time and learning the levels and then speeding up when you have mastered it.
 

Camjo-Z

Member
The article is inherently flawed because it implies that a game that doesn't give you all the info you need to perfectly succeed the first time you play it is "incorrect". If that were true the current trend of games with roguelike-esque "the more you die the more you learn" gameplay wouldn't be as popular as it is.

I always felt this way as well.

Go fast and you end up running into a wall or an enemy and losing all momentum.

Go slow and the game is no fun.

Turns out the game just isn't fun in either case.

Or you could just learn how to go fast while not running into walls and enemies aka the entire point of a Sonic game? This is like saying "Mario sucks. Jump too much and you fall into pits. Don't jump enough and you run into enemies."
 
The idea that Mario is "correct" and Sonic is "incorrect" fits perfectly with the narrative that Sonic is whatever Mario isn't. Sonic felt like punk rock to my kid self. Sonic has the confidence that you're going to play it again and that is where the mastery and fun kick in for me.
 

Mesoian

Member
Are ya saying speedrunners haven't mastered the game? Not even ones doing 100% speedruns? If mastery means going super slow an cautiously so as not to get hit by dozens of jerkish enemy/obstables placements in order to try and wins at usually awful bonuses stages... then I'm a Sonic master! Cause I got all the emeralds an junks on all those early Sonic games! It wasn't fun but I did it!

I would say that speedrunners probably never interact with, or even see, 40% of what a sonic game has to offer, because it is slower.
 

Toxi

Banned
The article is weird because it realizes that Sonic succeeds despite its unconventional design, but it doesn't really describe why. And the answer is simple: It's a game designed to be mastered over multiple playthroughs. Unlike Mario where stages are 1-and-done, Sonic stages are about mastery over multiple runs as you gain more knowledge of the level design, hazards, different paths, and physics.

Sonic doesn't deny you control so much as it forces you to take control.
 

Wamb0wneD

Member
The idea that Mario is "correct" and Sonic is "incorrect" fits perfectly with the narrative that Sonic is whatever Mario isn't. Sonic felt like punk rock to my kid self. Sonic has the confidence that you're going to play it again and that is where the mastery and fun kick in for me.

And Mario hasn't?
 

jman2050

Member
I thought this was an interesting take on the Sonic series, and I think this is partly what those people who say "Sonic was never good" are getting at.

No, see, this article is pointing out the unconventional mechanics and design philosophy underlying the structure of the classic Sonic games and why it comes together to form an exhilarating and unique experience that resonates with players. The "Sonic was never good" people have a naive, surface level understanding of all these things and make sweeping generalizations about the games and why people enjoy them based on their own rigid and myopic experiences.

The components of the argument are similar but the premise and conclusion aren't anywhere near the same.
 

Dusk Golem

A 21st Century Rockefeller
I think it's a good read, but the article's basis is off-point talking about game design like it can only be something. I understand this was inspired by a musician talk on incorrect songwriting, but I think creative things are broader than many often think.

He mentions Sonic doesn't teach anything, but this also isn't true. Look at the first zone of nearly any Sonic game and you'd be surprised how much they teach you rather quickly. Green Hill Zone Act 1 is the easiest example, before they give you any rings there's an enemy right in front of you, you will likely run into the enemy the first time and learn touch an enemy means death. You can then either jump or spin on the enemy or jump on the platform above to get rings, you will almost certainly get rings before the first bridge where a few enemies come you can be hit by to learn how the ring system in the game works, and the game right before this establishes that collecting rings is important to gameplay. The game doesn't teach you everything but it very quickly teaches you the basics so you pick up on it very quickly (it also helps older Sonic games literally only have four directions to move and one single button for jumping, and that's it, so they're simple enough to quickly grasp).

I love the horror game genre, I don't hide this. But so much about the horror game genre goes against what many who teach game design will pin as 'bad design', things being intentionally unintuitive at times, limited or even frustrating at specific points, or in some cases you can put yourself in a situation is play unwisely in certain games with scarce supplies to be in a situation where it's nigh impossible to progress if you've played especially poorly. What I listed is some of the worst things, but there's a lot more. Silent Hill 2 purposefully makes combat not fun, but that adds to the experience. Resident Evil penalizes the player for situations they couldn't have seen coming beforehand, but it's somewhat about the player reacting to the unknown which benefits it.

I think Game Design too often gets caught up in the mechanical aspects of it rather than strictly the artistry of flexibility of design. Game mechanics are important, but I think something Sonic has in common with horror games which is a less tangible thing that game mechanics is resonating a feeling within the player and working off of a reactionary game design motif. It's less explored because it's much harder to explore for game design talk, but I think following the tried and true formulas of game design isn't strictly "correct", it's just what's been easily identifiable at this point. I think there's a lot of forms of game design that's been far less explored than mechanical design. The mechanics in Sonic game's are important, but often the games are built in such a way they more explore players highs and lows in an interesting way that's both tied to the mechanics but also more reactory to the player's personal experience rather than strictly making sure every player is at the same skill level at the same time, learning how things work through experimentation rather than making sure you upfront understand them. Exploring the unknown in many ways. Also I'd argue Sonic is not simply about going as fast as you can, that is one aspect of it but there's a lot more to the games than that.
 
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