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Apple vs. Samsung docs reveal Galaxy Tab was a flop

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rezuth

Member
http://appleinsider.com/articles/14...eal-galaxy-tab-was-a-flop-and-samsung-knew-it

Over the past three years, IDC, Gartner and Strategy Analytics have generated data on the global tablet market which specifically conveys the idea that Apple's iPad business has been dropping into minority market share while Samsung and other Android tablet makers have been shipping astronomical millions of units.

Samsung's internal documents indicate that the company's own public representation of its competitive position in the tablet market was not true, and that the company appears to have intentionally misled its own investors and the analysts covering its business with false statements about the health of its tablet sales.

XdNUGGN.jpg


A slide (above), from Samsung's June 2011 chief executive presentation on the 2012 market, presented the company's understanding of the tablet market as increasing from 10.4 million in 2010 to 28.3 million in 2011 and estimated 41.2 million in tablet sales for 2012.

But of the Total Addressable Market, Samsung portrayed all Android devices as being a minority in the tablet market dominated by Apple's iOS iPad. For 2012, Samsung's data estimated that Android would make up 39 percent of the tablet TAM. In terms of dollar revenue, Apple's iPad market share was even higher, reflecting real world results in the form of profits earned.

A second "top secret" Samsung document from February 2012 (below) detailed the "strong competition from both the high end Pad and low tiered [Amazon Kindle} Fire/[B&N] Nook" in the U.S. market. In tablet units, Samsung spelled out Galaxy Tab quarterly sales in the low hundreds of thousands, adding up to total 2011 U.S. Tab sales of around 1 million.

ScrA1W7.jpg


Samsung contrasted Apple's 2011 U.S. sales of 17.4 million iPads, Kindle Fire sales of 5 million units, and 1.5 million Nook sales. That means Samsung itself knew it was selling fewer Galaxy Tabs than even the low end Nook, an embarrassing fourth place sales position one wouldn't expect from the world's leading electronics company with top volume sales in other mobile devices.

Samsung's tablet sales were behind the entry level attempts of a couple of bookstores to bang out a tablet device they could sell as a way to develop a market for ebooks. And Samsung not only had a year head start over them in building Android tablets, but also had a decades long legacy of building Windows tablets and all kinds of other hardware.

Globally, Apple sold over 32 million iPads in 2011, so Samsung's U.S. iPad numbers indicate that just over half of those were sold in the U.S. that year. Those 32 million iPads were also larger than the total number of tablets (28.3 million) Samsung had expected everyone to sell globally in 2011 in a document from the middle of that year.

Samsung wasn't just unable to make a tablet device that consumers wanted to buy; it was actually asleep at the wheel, failing to fully respond to the iPad in part because its leadership didn't even anticipate how quickly the market for iPads was increasing.

In terms of revenue, Samsung was also well aware that Apple's iPad was eating everyone's lunch, collecting over $10 billion in iPad U.S. revenues that year while Samsung earned less than $560 million on its own tablet sales, nearly half as much as Amazon brought in (and then lost) during just during the winter quarter alone. Even the low priced Nook was beating Samsung in both tablet unit sales and in revenues.

In early 2011, IDC's Loren Loverde made headlines by contradicting Steve Jobs' contention that iPad had claimed 90 percent of the tablet market in its first year. Instead, IDC insisted that Samsung by itself had taken a 17 percent share of the tablet market in the final quarter of 2010, based on Samsung's announcement that it had shipped 2 million Galaxy Tabs.

Neil Mawston, a director at Strategy Analytics, also repeated Samsung's 2 million figure for winter quarter 2010 tablet shipments, announcing that "the Samsung Galaxy Tab was the main driver of Android success," because it made up 2 million of the 2.1 million tablets that were said to have shipped with Android. Virtually all of them!

Strategy Analytics also assigned Samsung a 22 percent share of the entire tablet market, somehow reaching a different number than IDC even though both were working with just two significant numbers: Apple's officially reported iPad sales and Samsung's double-speak mumbling of an evasive answer given to analysts during an earnings call.

However, as the Wall Street Journal later reported, Samsung's "2 million" number for 2010 was merely shipments of initial inventory sell-in designed to fill the channel, not actual sales to actual buyers, a concept that has a casual nexus with the idea of a "market" one could have "share" in.

That 2 million figure was presented during Samsung's quarterly earnings call with investors, making the "quite smooth" slip not just misinformation for blogs to repeat, but a deception of the company's investors that led them to think that Samsung was enjoying strong tablet sales when it wasn't.

In fact, over the next year Samsung's entire U.S. tablet sales were on par with other major flops such as Microsoft's Zune and Surface, or Google's Honeycomb tablets, Google TV or Chromebook Pixel.

And as Samsung itself depicted in the above chart, it knew internally that in 2010, the full range of iPad competitors were barely a blip, rather than Samsung alone having the 17 to 22 percent share market researchers had advertised.

fmlYilr.gif


Previous Samsung tablet sales documents (above) which leaked during the first trial in 2012 harmonize with the U.S. numbers Samsung presented in the documents above: across all of 2011, Samsung sold just under 1 million tablets in the U.S.

None of the major market research firms appear to have issued U.S. market share data for tablet sales since the iPad was released, preferring to instead publish global market figures that incorporate vast numbers of "white box" devices built by unnamed "other" companies in unspecified markets. This is a marked departure from their PC industry reports, which detail both U.S. and global sales.

However, as noted by Apple's chief executive Tim Cook, there is no evidence among web usage stats or app sales that support the idea that vast numbers of unbranded tablets are eclipsing the iPad globally. Instead, iPad shows up in web logs as making up an astounding 84 percent of all tablet traffic.

"If there are lots of other tablets selling," Cook said on the subject, "I don't know what they're being used for. Because that's a pretty basic function: web browsing."

Instead, there is strong evidence supporting the idea that Apple's iOS continues to dominate as a mobile device platform, including Microsoft's decision to release Office as an exclusive title for the iPad first.

It also calls into question why IDC, Gartner and Strategy Analytics seem to carefully avoid mention of U.S. market share figures that would provide valuable insight into the domestic market for mobile apps and accessories and illuminate the threat iPads might pose to conventional PCs.

It certainly appears that these market researchers, just like every Android tablet manufacturer, doesn't want to talk about specifics because the facts have nothing good to say about the Android or Windows platforms that indirectly pay the bills of said market research groups.
 
Not surprising, their low end tablets are shit and the high end are overpriced. The author is reaching a bit at the end with the conspiracy theories about all Android sales though.
 
are there good enough reasons why people should buy any android device other than nexus? Are the extra gimmicks worth the hundreds of dollars more?
 

Nicktendo86

Member
I don't get the point of them, design is stupid (home button with menu and back in landscape?) build materials are questionable and the price is high. Nexus tablets offer far more value for money and if you want/need a tablet for drawing/productivity I would say surface is better. Who are galaxy tabs aimed at?
 
are there good enough reasons why people should buy any android device other than nexus? Are the extra gimmicks worth the hundreds of dollars more?

No, but then I don't think the Nexus 7 is worth the $100+ difference over the Nook HD. (I've actually bought 3 new Nook HDs for $200 total.)
 

Mindwipe

Member
are there good enough reasons why people should buy any android device other than nexus? Are the extra gimmicks worth the hundreds of dollars more?

I guess some people might feel more familar with Touchwiz as a UI, and there isn't a Nexus 8 to buy (or a modern Nexus 10) but that's about it.

I can only think that Google deliberately halfasses their marketing to keep Samsung happy, because they still sell a hell of a lot of phones.
 

Zeppu

Member
Wait, a fairly terrible device which gained injunctions and bans throughout many of what Apple themselves called not a tablet market but an iPad market wasn't a success? Shocker.
 

Talon

Member
In fact, over the next year Samsung's entire U.S. tablet sales were on par with other major flops such as Microsoft's Zune and Surface, or Google's Honeycomb tablets, Google TV or Chromebook Pixel.
lol. Zune.

I don't know why these two didn't just settle. Floating all this dirty laundry out in public, including internal practices, is more harmful than a billion bucks.
 

Vyer

Member
Not surprising that these market share 'estimates' from firms like Strategy Analytics are a little shaky.
 
Wasn't this the time when only the IPad was a popular tablet? This is not new news. There were reports around that time about how much they had the market locked at that time.

A few yrs later and now Tablets of all kinds?OSes are all the rage and Apple is losing their marketshare.
 
Just look around and see how many people are using iPads vs. "other" tablets. It's certainly no mystery that Apple is crushing them in that space.
 

Zeppu

Member
But I thought people were buying them instead of iPads because they look identical :S

Edit: damn ninjas
 

Talon

Member
Wasn't this the time when only the IPad was a popular tablet? This is not new news. There were reports around that time about how much they had the market locked at that time.

A few yrs later and now Tablets of all kinds?OSes are all the rage and Apple is losing their marketshare.
Marketshare is not a particularly useful metric when competing products are asymmetric. Marketshare is a great metric in packaged goods, such as soaps or toothpastes, where the competing items compete in an A/B context.

Doesn't work so well in the consumer tech industry due to wildly different price ranges and thus profitability.

Profit-share and usage statistics provide more context.
 

linsivvi

Member
Wasn't this the time when only the IPad was a popular tablet? This is not new news. There were reports around that time about how much they had the market locked at that time.

A few yrs later and now Tablets of all kinds?OSes are all the rage and Apple is losing their marketshare.

Yeah it's a hit piece. The writer trashed Samsung's US numbers while brushed aside the global numbers, which is where Samsung made up the difference.

Also it's stupid to call it a flop, when we have the benefit of history that Samsung's tablet sales acutally quadrupled in 2013.

It's AppleInside, no surprise of the bias though. Whatever that can make their readers happy.
 

Phoenix

Member
Just look around and see how many people are using iPads vs. "other" tablets. It's certainly no mystery that Apple is crushing them in that space.

They were, but that is no longer the case. The Android tablet market has grown substantially since those metrics were gathered.
 

TedNindo

Member
Is that only US? Because they are pretty popular here in Belgium. Tab2 and 3 sold like hotcakes during the holidays.
I work for Samsung in retail.
 

Somnid

Member
Yeah it's a hit piece. The writer trashed Samsung's US numbers while brushed aside the global numbers, which is where Samsung made up the difference.

Also it's stupid to call it a flop, when we have the benefit of history that Samsung's tablet sales acutally quadrupled in 2013.

It's AppleInside, no surprise of the bias though. Whatever that can make their readers happy.

But that's the problem. This quadrupling number now comes into question because clearly these analysts did not check and Samsung deliberately mislead. In the case in question the numbers were double what they should have been.
 

linsivvi

Member
But that's the problem. This quadrupling number now comes into question because clearly these analysts did not check and Samsung deliberately mislead. In the case in question the numbers were double what they should have been.

I see no actual presentation of misleading figure but a whole bunch of embarrassing, fanboy pleasing statements like "Samsung wasn't just unable to make a tablet device that consumers wanted to buy; it was actually asleep at the wheel, failing to fully respond to the iPad in part because its leadership didn't even anticipate how quickly the market for iPads was increasing. ".

The "big reveal" of the article was that Samsung sold less than $1M tablet in the US in 2011. No shit. That was 3 years ago, in Apple's strongest market. They couldn't even beat HP in 2011. It did absolutely nothing to dispute Samsung's global figure. Nothing.
 

kehs

Banned
This is preposterous.

I refuse to believe that cold calling surveys are less reliable than actual data.

This new lawsuit is going to do nothing but continue this recent trend of slandering Samsung that's being going alot here for some Unknown reason.
 

Somnid

Member
I see no actual presentation of misleading figure but a whole bunch of embarrassing, fanboy pleasing statements like "Samsung wasn't just unable to make a tablet device that consumers wanted to buy; it was actually asleep at the wheel, failing to fully respond to the iPad in part because its leadership didn't even anticipate how quickly the market for iPads was increasing. ".

The "big reveal" of the article was that Samsung sold less than $1M tablet in the US in 2011. No shit. That was 3 years ago, in Apple's strongest market. They couldn't even beat HP in 2011. It did absolutely nothing to dispute Samsung's global figure. Nothing.

My understanding of the article is that Samsung's "2 million" was a US number. Was this not the case?
 

linsivvi

Member
My understanding of the article is that Samsung's "2 million" was a US number. Was this not the case?

The article the writer called into question is this one:
http://appleinsider.com/articles/11/03/10/idc_apples_ipad_took_83_share_of_tablets_shipped_in_2010

It clearly said IDC's "Worldwide Quarterly Media Tablet and eReader Tracker", and then the poorly written article went on using Samsung's US sales figure.

It looks very clear to me the only person doing the deception is this AppleInsider writer.
 
Coulda told them that without a $1b lawsuit.

Samsung has done really well over the last few years, but nearly everything they've done with the Tab has been horrible.
 

Water

Member
The article the writer called into question is this one:
http://axxxxxxxder.com/articles/11/03/10/idc_apples_ipad_took_83_share_of_tablets_shipped_in_2010

It clearly said IDC's "Worldwide Quarterly Media Tablet and eReader Tracker", and then the poorly written article went on using Samsung's US sales figure.

It looks very clear to me the only person doing the deception is this AppleInsider writer.
Please don't give them page hits.
I used to post at AI forums way back when I got into Macs. They had a good membership with a lot of technically proficient people, most of whom recognized both the strengths and weaknesses of Apple's products, and didn't use them exclusively. "APPLE RULZ M$ SUX" idiots were laughed out very quickly. Newbies were educated. It was literally an Apple forum where people would advise others to get a Windows/Linux PC or an Android phone when appropriate, and advise on those things' interoperability with Macs and iOS stuff. Then it started going downhill, and some of the nicest people left to set up their own forum. AI's current state is saddening, it's just hit-trolling, slanted article after another on the front page, and the forums are an echo chamber. Last time I dropped in there, the current residents were bewildered because obviously I was a troll to say anything negative about Apple or to call people out on their obvious bullshit on competing products, yet I had years of posting history before they had even signed up.
 

Somnid

Member
The article the writer called into question is this one:
http://appleinsider.com/articles/11/03/10/idc_apples_ipad_took_83_share_of_tablets_shipped_in_2010

It clearly said IDC's "Worldwide Quarterly Media Tablet and eReader Tracker", and then the poorly written article went on using Samsung's US sales figure.

It looks very clear to me the only person doing the deception is this AppleInsider writer.

Ah, so they could conceivably have made up the missing 1 million elsewhere then. Ok well, I rescind my previous comments.
 

Madness

Member
Only recently has Samsung started to pay attention to tablets again with its improved 'pro' line, otherwise their tablets had been pretty low end. Some of the few decent ones always came from Asus or Sony, not counting the obvious superior Nexus line. The Nexus 10 is due for a refresh.
 

linsivvi

Member
Please don't give them page hits.
I used to post at AI forums way back when I got into Macs. They had a good membership with a lot of technically proficient people, most of whom recognized both the strengths and weaknesses of Apple's products, and didn't use them exclusively. "APPLE RULZ M$ SUX" idiots were laughed out very quickly. Newbies were educated. It was literally an Apple forum where people would advise others to get a Windows/Linux PC or an Android phone when appropriate, and advise on those things' interoperability with Macs and iOS stuff. Then it started going downhill, and some of the nicest people left to set up their own forum. AI's current state is saddening, it's just hit-trolling, slanted article after another on the front page, and the forums are an echo chamber. Last time I dropped in there, the current residents were bewildered because obviously I was a troll to say anything negative about Apple or to call people out on their obvious bullshit on competing products, yet I had years of posting history before they had even signed up.

Wow, that's bad. I used to go to ipodlounge (now renamed ilounge). It was pretty decent for news, I wonder if it's still the case these days.
 
They were, but that is no longer the case. The Android tablet market has grown substantially since those metrics were gathered.

I'm certainly not disputing any claims that the Android market is increasing, but until I see more than one person a week using them, I'll never be convinced of it. Also, this is primarily about the Galaxy Tab, though, which personally (NYC is my only benchmark here, sorry), I could count on one hand the number of them I've seen in average, every day use.
 

rezuth

Member
I'm certainly not disputing any claims that the Android market is increasing, but until I see more than one person a week using them, I'll never be convinced of it. Also, this is primarily about the Galaxy Tab, though, which personally (NYC is my only benchmark here, sorry), I could count on one hand the number of them I've seen in average, every day use.

Besides the obvious Apple circle jerking from the author it's highly doubtful they sold their 2 million tablets in six weeks.
 
Besides the obvious Apple circle jerking from the author it's highly doubtful they sold their 2 million tablets in six weeks.

Yeah, the blind circle jerking by Apple zealots is the most frustrating part of any of these articles. Fanboyism in general is the #1 way to discredit yourself in most arguments or discussions.
 

linsivvi

Member
I'm certainly not disputing any claims that the Android market is increasing, but until I see more than one person a week using them, I'll never be convinced of it. Also, this is primarily about the Galaxy Tab, though, which personally (NYC is my only benchmark here, sorry), I could count on one hand the number of them I've seen in average, every day use.

The US market will remain dominated by Apple products in the foreseeable future. Just look at the Whatsapp threads how everyone in the US is using iMessage while everyone overseas is using something else. Using NYC or America as a whole is a poor indicator of how Samsung or Android or even Windows mobile are doing globally.
 

see5harp

Member
Not surprising, their low end tablets are shit and the high end are overpriced. The author is reaching a bit at the end with the conspiracy theories about all Android sales though.

Agreed. It's pretty obvious Samsung is selling a ton of phones but I never see anyone with a Samsung tablet. Hell, I rarely see the google tablets and those actually sell a respectable number.
 
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