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I'm pretty sure the VGA (Video Game Grading Authority) hurts game + collector value

Not Spaceghost

Spaceghost
So this is a topic I don't really think I've seen discussed on GAF more than a handful of times, but I was on ebay the other night looking for copies of Mega Man 64. While I saw that sealed copies usually went for about 100-170 or so the VGA rated copies all pushed 350-450.

Here is an example

None VGA rated FACTORY SEALED Mega Man 64

Versus

VGA rated SEALED Mega Man 64

So I got a bit curious about what the VGA charges to get games rated and what services they offer.

On their very website you see this criteria for grading costs.
http://www.vggrader.com/submission_packagedpricing.aspx

You can do different levels of stuff to your game when you get it graded and cased, the price varies on the value of the product. Now what's funny as hell here is if the guy who hadn't VGA rated his game wanted to get his sealed copy of Mega Man 64 rated, all the services would probably be priced in the under $400 or under $1000 category.

Why? Well because the other VGA rated games are going for 350-450 dollars. Which makes sense but here is where the issue comes into play. Those values are already heavily inflated thanks to the VGA

Say the game was actually worth 170 sealed and in great condition like the non VGA seller says. If you went to rate that game, it would be rated as an under 200 dollar game. Say you got 60 dollars worth of services done, and then you decide to sell it. Now if you wanna make your money back your game has to be sold for 230.

Now some one else who has sealed copy wonders how much their game is worth and the see it's worth 230! So they list their for 200 or so, then eventually the price is inflated to 200-230 just because that's how much people believe it's worth. Eventually some of those people want to get their sealed Mega Man 64's VGA rated...well now the game is valued as an under 400 game which jacks up the costs of their rating so they might have to sell the game for 300 to make their money back.

See the issue? The VGA distorts prices and value in an ever increasing way over time. However this is only one issue, there is a second issue that is a little bit more jarring. On their website they say that they leave a small slit in their sealed non-reopenable acrylic cases for minor airflow. Yet while the goal of the case is to protect the game, all this does is potentially cause damage over time. With that airflow perspiration can seep in which over time can damage the shrink wrap and eventually damage cardboard boxes or jewel case art.

I understand the point behind wanting to protect and rate your games, if they're rare or have a lot of value to you personally it's nice to want to protect them. Or if you want to sell to people I can see the VGA as a nice little vote of confidence to buyers. However, in the long run it might just totally crash the retro gaming market, and I'm pretty sure they're part of the reason as to why people think it's okay to sell Conkers Bad Fury Day (a game that even during the PS2 era would routinely sell for 5 dollars a cart) for over 100 dollars.

Yeah but this is all just like my opinion, man. I could be totally off base and if you think I am just tell me.
 

Krejlooc

Banned
The funniest part is that their sealing process destroys the box. You can't "unseal" a vga game without ruining the packaging.

Vga is garbage.
 

atomsk

Party Pooper
I didn't know VGA suggests a price. I thought they just give a score.

It's not the suggestion, it's the fact people tack the services fee on the auction price to recoup what it cost to get graded... and then even people who didn't have it graded jack their prices up into the same range.

Personally I find collecting sealed games weird, I buy these things to play them.
 
I have never even batted an eye at VGA-rated items. Granted, I don't really have a huge CIB or sealed collection, but when I do aim to buy something like that, they're not even considered. Everything you point out seems just inherently known to me when "shopping" for retro games-- it's a waste of time and money. I guess I just assumed everyone who was in the collecting circle felt the same way, and that the VGA was for people who aren't familiar with the hobby or the market trying to bolster their product or squeeze some extra value out.
 

Peltz

Member
It's not the suggestion, it's the fact people tack the services fee on the auction price to recoup what it cost to get graded... and then even people who didn't have it graded jack their prices up into the same range.

Personally I find collecting sealed games weird, I buy these things to play them.

Oh I see. I agree. The fetish for factory sealed retro games is a bit weird.
 

Not Spaceghost

Spaceghost
The funniest part is that their sealing process destroys the box. You can't "unseal" a vga game without ruining the packaging.

Vga is garbage.

YEAH THIS TOO!

Those cases literally require a hammer and a crow bar to disassemble, so if you decide you wanna play the game and ruin its value you run the risk of destroying the game.
It would be nice if there was a removable plate on the bottom of the case or something, it's not like the thing is in a vacuum or in a controlled environment because the fucking case has airflow going into it.

I can understand the appeal of wanting to buy a factory sealed retro game, but if you wanna play it and it's VGA sealed? Good fucking luck.
 

RinSatori

Banned
The funniest part is that their sealing process destroys the box. You can't "unseal" a vga game without ruining the packaging.

Vga is garbage.

Lol what.. What a scam

Why are people using their service. *sigh*
-
I will never understand why people buy games to keep it sealed on a shelf
 

Vodh

Junior Member
It's a free market, people will sell and buy shit at whatever price points they want. Let's not act like suddenly $200 or $300 for a game isn't completely arbitrary in the first place.
 

Not Spaceghost

Spaceghost
Please watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BbHDMXxm04

It's an episode of Game Rave that explores the business practices of such companies. You're basically right on the mark.

Wow, the thing that happens to his sealed copy of MGS1 + guide book is disgusting, fuck...if the packaging wasn't totally sealed he might actually be able to save the guide book from that damage. The fact that he has many of the same complaints is also pretty nuts, and relieving because now I know I'm not crazy.

Man the more I think about it it's really shitty that VGA gets away with this, his complaint about a panel of experts is great too, there is no way these people are experts in counterfeiting, plus the chances they'll have to UNSEAL it to verify the contents aren't a misprint or anything are basically 100%. How does that not hurt the value?

Great video thanks for sharing!
 
What's the point of owning a videogame if you can't experience it?

That's a pretty narrow way of looking at it. How do you know people haven't played the games they're buying in this kind of condition?

Perhaps they're doing it out of love for the franchise, or for the art value, or because they have a copy that's old and worn and would like to have a complete, sealed version to show off or cherish. What happens if I played a beat-up cartridge of Super Mario RPG to death, and want to have a nice CIB copy to display on a shelf somewhere? I have the same copy of SMRPG that I got as a present as a young kid, but now that I've grown older, I've got CIB (not sealed, mind you) copies of both the NA and EU versions. I can't really see how it's any weirder than any other collector's item out there.

Edit: I guess I overlooked the whole sealing it off permanently aspect in favor of collecting in general-- yeah, that is kind of shitty.
 

Not Spaceghost

Spaceghost
What's the point of owning a videogame if you can't experience it?

I guess the idea is kind of like it being the ultimate collectible. You may already have a beat up copy of the game but having a sealed factory new box on display could be of appeal to big fans.

Still though, it's ridiculous that you can't unseal a VGA case easily.
 

tmarg

Member
YEAH THIS TOO!

Those cases literally require a hammer and a crow bar to disassemble, so if you decide you wanna play the game and ruin its value you run the risk of destroying the game.
It would be nice if there was a removable plate on the bottom of the case or something, it's not like the thing is in a vacuum or in a controlled environment because the fucking case has airflow going into it.

I'm not going to defend their business model, I think it's garbage, but if they are going to have those cases, they have to be difficult to remove, or else people could take things out, lower the grade, and then attempt to reseal the game and sell it at the original grade.
 
Personally I find collecting sealed games weird, I buy these things to play them.

It's a dumb collectors thing. Only reason I would buy a sealed old game would be to open it. Nothing like ripping the seal off of new old stock. Also would only do this if what I am buying is reasonably priced.
 
What's the point of owning a videogame if you can't experience it?

It depends. I'll never get my stuff graded because of crap like this. But I am someone who collects games and keeps them sealed. But I still get to play those. (For example the limited Edition for Bayonetta 2). I'm just gonna buy it twice.

Yeah some of the collector culture is pretty disgusting.. Particularly this part of it. You are free to do whatever you want but you know, you still suck.

It's not though. I'd argue that it's an appreciation for your hobby and items. As I've said before, I'm someone who collects games(and comics) but I'm not one of those obsessive arseholes who only think about the money and value and all that shit. That's a bonus, but having a sealed copy of a rare game is always nice to have. See the speculator boom for comics. It's a pretty interesting insight on comic collecting and why comics are so over inflated now. It's someone I'm often in moderation with, not getting obsessed with the money aspect but being able to appreciate the collectibles a bit more. I'm pretty proud of my boxed complete mint condition Pokemon games. It's nice. But I'm not one of those people who will get weird about collecting.
 

Not Spaceghost

Spaceghost
I'm not going to defend their business model, I think it's garbage, but if they are going to have those cases, they have to be difficult to remove, or else people could take things out, lower the grade, and then attempt to reseal the game and sell it at the original grade.

It would be fine if they had a small little latch or something that you had to break if you wanted to reopen it. Like the tamper proof caps on food jars and stuff.

Also the unreoponable cases make little sense when the game isn't even fully sealed in.
 

TSM

Member
What's disgusting is that these "collectibles" are encased in such ugly cases. Look at the Megaman 64 encased in the op. Someone paid to have that done to what is supposedly a collectors item. Someone would only buy that to have a copy sitting on a shelf or in a box. These things are not the slightest bit presentable. I especially like how they put a bag over the protective case to protect the protective case which has now become the majority of the value of the item.
 

Krejlooc

Banned
That's a pretty narrow way of looking at it. How do you know people haven't played the games they're buying in this kind of condition?

Because to get the game out of "this condition" requires physically destroying the box in the first place, the box you just bought for several hundred dollars.
 

GnawtyDog

Banned
They are a pest. Same with the puppets that propped them up at NintendoAge - it's been a long war raging - of which one side has lost. Then again, free-will, free-market and all of that. Sealed games skyrocketed....hec, I still need Megaman X (made in jap) and Super Mario World (black label). Def not willing to pay on-going prices for sealed copies. Got my sights set on DKC 3 if budget allows. $150 for an OK copy in the 75's-85 range is still going to be an issue. No, I don't grade them.
 

Zaku

Member
Yeah some of the collector culture is pretty disgusting.. Particularly this part of it. You are free to do whatever you want but you know, you still suck.

My only problem with people collecting sealed copies are the ones complaining about reissues or remasters lowering value, as if the value of their sealed copy of the game is more important that making sure people have access to some of the classic titles which have contributed to gaming culture as a whole.

Or the people claiming that Atari 2600/NES emulation is ruining the collector hobby, as if the two are directly related.
 

Alec

Member
Why does everything have to get generalized into a "culture"?

That's what really bugs me about forum culture.
 
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