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[Shogmaster]

THIS THREAD IS FOR ARTISTS ONLY. IF YOU DON'T DO ART, DISREGARD THIS THREAD.

Why VAIO Z Canvas instead of Surface Pro 4? Because it's basically a SP4 on steroids!

- It has QUAD CORE i7 vs dual core u version in SP4.
- Same second gen N-Trig Duo Sense 2 digitizer and pen with 1024 levels of pressure.
- 3:2 Retina 12.3" IPS with 95% ADOBE RGB!!! (SP4 screen only manages ~80%)
- A better for art creation kick stand that let's you draw in any angle.
- Detachable BT keyboard cover that you can use to do keyboard shortcuts more ergonomically.

Anyways, it was about $400~500 more expensive than the SP4 but for TODAY ONLY (Dec 5th 2015), MS store is selling it for $500 less for all versions. This makes the 16GB RAM 512GB SSD version $100 less than the SP4 with 16GB of RAM and 512GB SSD. There is even a 1TB SSD version available.

http://www.microsoftstore.com/store...gnature-Edition-2-in-1-PC/productID.326191500

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AINamSXvSQ

 

[neogaffer1]

calling it better than the SP4 is highly misleading. the Surface keyboard is actually a detachable thing, this is just a bluetooth keyboard.

Also the SP4 also has an any angle kickstand, and has a nicer hardware design, is supported direcly by MS vs a small Japanese company that for all we know might not exist in a few years, etc.

edit: also the sp4 has a skylake processor, this is a haswell processor

 

[GSG Flash]

Detachable BT keyboard? That's not a SP4 on steroids.

 

[kudoboi]

from the pictures, this looks a lot thicker than the SP4

 

[Sealed]

I've been looking at this thing or the past month, but I just think it looks ugly and the keyboard seems flimsy.

no doubt it will be a good purchase for some, but I don't think it's for me, even though the deal is tempting

also doesn't have a skylake processor so it would make all the time I spent waiting for skylake to come out be a waste lol

 

[Cuyejo]

calling it better than the SP4 is highly misleading. the Surface keyboard is actually a detachable thing, this is just a bluetooth keyboard.

Also the SP4 also has an any angle kickstand, and has a nicer hardware design, is supported direcly by MS vs a small Japanese company that for all we know might not exist in a few years, etc.

wut

 

[Sealed]

wut

vaio got bought out

sony doesn't own them anymore

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaio

 

[Shogmaster]

YEESH~ SP fanboys are just as thickheaded as iPad fanboys...

This machine is for art. If you are not going to use it for art, you can disregard this thread.

For art, the magnetic attach or nothing keyboard on SP4 is terrible for ergonomic usage. Makes you use KB shortcuts with awkward arm positions. This is better for art.

And the kickstand hinge on this is better for drawing than SP4 because it is stiffer. In any angle, you can put more pressure on it than SP4.

I've been looking at this thing or the past month, but I just think it looks ugly and the keyboard seems flimsy.

no doubt it will be a good purchase for some, but I don't think it's for me, even though the deal is tempting

also doesn't have a skylake processor so it would make all the time I spent waiting for skylake to come out be a waste lol

Skylake U is absolutely DESTROYED by Haswell HQ. And since SP4 when using Photoshop gets you the same 5~6 hours that VAIO Z Canvas gets you, it doesn't even have battery life advantage.

Simply put, VAIO Z Canvas is a superior art machine to SP4.

 

[Totakeke]

You chose a bait topic title, you knew what you were going into.

 

[Sealed]

Skylake U is absolutely DESTROYED by Haswell HQ. And since SP4 when using Photoshop gets you the same 5~6 hours that VAIO Z Canvas gets you, it doesn't even have battery life advantage.

Simply put, VAIO Z Canvas is a superior art machine to SP4.

Oh I know that Haswell HQ is better than Skylake U. I'm in the market for something with Skylake HQ.

I think this is a great machine, just not something I'd be interested in buying really, and I would use my machine for art as well as general computing.

As of now I'm probably just going to get a Dell XPS 15 and continue using a separate wacom tablet.

 

[Shogmaster]

You chose a bait topic title, you knew what you were going into.

I wish we had more space in subject line but click bate is debatable. No one knows what VAIO Z Canvas is anyways. It's an informative topic title.

Oh I know that Haswell HQ is better than Skylake U. I'm in the market for something with Skylake HQ.

I think this is a great machine, just not something I'd be interested in buying really, and I would use my machine for art as well as general computing.

As of now I'm probably just going to get a Dell XPS 15 and continue using a separate wacom tablet.

I know that feels. I wish VAIO still make Flip 15 and stuck a Skylake HQ in it. That would be instant purchase for me. Almost bought a used Flip 15 for $600 but I can't deal with Haswell U...

 

[AlexMogil]

I wish we had more space in subject line but click bate is debatable. No one knows what VAIO Z Canvas is anyways. It's an informative topic title.

Oh it's bate all right.

In any case better is subjective. Different is objective. Some people may use the Pro more efficiently for art, some may use the Vaio. I like the idea of a remote keyboard for shortcuts.

I truly appreciate the correct capitalization of VAIO, though. Good work.

 

[Shogmaster]

Oh it's bate all right.

Well FINE. *pout*

 

[Evolution of Metal]

What? So small? Lenovo has a tablet for real men, i7 and all that good stuff.

On topic: the only use for such expensive device is if you are a traveling artist. It doesn't have dedicated graphics, which limits quite a few dcc applications. Things like painting in Mari or Substance go straight out of the window.

 

[AlexMogil]

What? So small? Lenovo has a tablet for real men, i7 and all that good stuff.

My brother has one of those Lenovo tablets. He's nearly blind so he uses it to surf and sing with - he can read the lyrics on it.

He also dropped it. :-/

 

[Shogmaster]

What? So small? Lenovo has a tablet for real men, i7 and all that good stuff.

On topic: the only use for such expensive device is if you are a traveling artist. It doesn't have dedicated graphics, which limits quite a few dcc applications. Things like painting in Mari or Substance go straight out of the window.

Iris Pro in it is probably good enough for your needs in those apps. Iris Pro is good as those lower end dedicated GPUs.

P.S. That's just a really tiny girl.

 

[3phemeral]

Shog, what's your opinion on this versus a T902?

 

[Fat4all]

So is this just gonna be a weekly thing now, Shog?

 

[Shogmaster]

Shog, what's your opinion on this versus a T902?

This destroys T902 in power. Also screen is so much better in color, contrast, and resolution.

But T902 has bigger screen so if you are a size queen when drawing like myself, then it gives you a pause. One of the reasons I went with Lenovo Thinkpad Yoga 14/460 to replace my T902 instead of getting this last month (also Yoga 14 was only $999 vs $2600 of this thing back then with 16GB of RAM).

The 6200U in Yoga 14 is actually same power as 3220M in my T902. It's just that it's twice as battery efficient. And slightly bigger screen than T902 is also a plus. And you can get inside relatively easily for upgrades. You just have to get use to Wacom AES vs Wacom EMR of T902.

Anyways, if you don't mind the smaller screen size and prefer the 3:2 aspect ratio, Z Canvas is a rock star. I wish I had enough to get this in my checking account right now. Can't justify dipping into the saving account, especially when I just got the Yoga 14, which is fast enough for my needs.

So is this just gonna be a weekly thing now, Shog?

I will pimp new digital art tablets whenever I get the chance.

 

[Totakeke]

I was actually passing by the store, it's heavy and thick as expected for the extra power, and with an awkward pen holder. Most people who buy surface pros aren't looking to buy something like this but you already know that.

 

[3phemeral]

This destroys T902 in power. Also screen is so much better in color, contrast, and resolution.

But T902 has bigger screen so if you are a size queen when drawing like myself, then it gives you a pause. One of the reasons I went with Lenovo Thinkpad Yoga 14/460 to replace my T902 instead of getting this last month (also Yoga 14 was only $999 vs $2600 of this thing back then with 16GB of RAM).

The 6200U in Yoga 14 is actually same power as 3220M in my T902. It's just that it's twice as battery efficient. And slightly bigger screen than T902 is also a plus. And you can get inside relatively easily for upgrades. You just have to get use to Wacom AES vs Wacom EMR of T902.

Anyways, if you don't mind the smaller screen size and prefer the 3:2 aspect ratio, Z Canvas is a rock star. I wish I had enough to get this in my checking account right now. Can't justify dipping into the saving account, especially when I just got the Yoga 14, which is fast enough for my needs.



I will pimp new digital art tablets whenever I get the chance.

I was totally with you until I checked the discounted price of $2000.00. ::dead::

I'll definitely be looking into this when it's cheaper.

 

[Shogmaster]

I was actually passing by the store, it's heavy and thick as expected for the extra power, and with an awkward pen holder. Most people who buy surface pros aren't looking to buy something like this but you already know that.

The pen holder is for those who don't trust the magnet. This did pen magnetic attachment before SP4. Those who are buying SP4 for art should look at this instead. But then again, most people aren't buying SP4 for art.

But guess what? This is for artists only thread. So suck it.

I was totally with you until I checked the discounted price of $2000.00. ::dead::

I'll definitely be looking into this when it's cheaper.

If you are looking to replace T902, Skylake Yoga 14 for $999 is infinitely a better deal. Pursue Z Canvas for THE POWAH~

 

[3phemeral]

If you are looking to replace T902, Skylake Yoga 14 for $999 is infinitely a better deal. Pursue Z Canvas for THE POWAH~

Now that I can stomach.

Of course, now that Windows 10 has fixed the T902's problem with palm rejection (via legacy Wacom drivers), I can finally use the T902 full time with only the repetitive cursor motion bug that happens occasionally. Still, though, I'm going to really look into that Yoga.

 

[Evolution of Metal]

Iris Pro in it is probably good enough for your needs in those apps. Iris Pro is good as those lower end dedicated GPUs.

Naaa... Iris might be good for 2D painting and some lightweight 3D. As soon as you try a decent viewport it is going to lag or crash. Anything from animation to 3D texturing to game engines simply need some real GPU power.

 

[Shogmaster]

Naaa... Iris might be good for 2D painting and some lightweight 3D. As soon as you try a decent viewport it is going to lag or crash. Anything from animation to 3D texturing to game engines simply need some real GPU power.

Well then. You are stuck with using a Cintiq on a rig, aren't ya? Worse things have happened.

Now that I can stomach.

Of course, now that Windows 10 has fixed the T902's problem with palm rejection (via legacy Wacom drivers), I can finally use the T902 full time with only the repetitive cursor motion bug that happens occasionally. Still, though, I'm going to really look into that Yoga.

Still on Win 8.1 on my T902. I think I'll leave it on 8.1...

 

[-COOLIO-]

What? So small? Lenovo has a tablet for real men, i7 and all that good stuff.

On topic: the only use for such expensive device is if you are a traveling artist. It doesn't have dedicated graphics, which limits quite a few dcc applications. Things like painting in Mari or Substance go straight out of the window.

would legitimately be great for board games.

 

[3phemeral]

Well then. You are stuck with using a Cintiq on a rig, aren't ya? Worse things have happened.



Still on Win 8.1 on my T902. I think I'll leave it on 8.1...

I find Win 10 to be better, unless you're devoid of palm-rejection issues on Win 8. Both Win 8.1 and Win 10 have that stupid "legacy GPU" designation for the Intel HD 4000, which limits it to Open GL 1.0 even though it's capable of 4.1 (I believe) but it's circumvented by going into the registry and adding a "Allow old GPUs" value

I'm surprised you didn't stick with Win 7 as that's what most of the artists on Tablet PC Review decided to stay with.

 

[my name is ed]

just want to say i appreciate your art tablet psas, shog. ill eventuallu have to replace/compliment my set up and your threads are always good for info.

 

[Shogmaster]

I find Win 10 to be better, unless you're devoid of palm-rejection issues on Win 8. Both Win 8.1 and Win 10 have that stupid "legacy GPU" designation for the Intel HD 4000, which limits it to Open GL 1.0 even though it's capable of 4.1 (I believe) but it's circumvented by going into the registry and adding a "Allow old GPUs" value

I'm surprised you didn't stick with Win 7 as that's what most of the artists on Tablet PC Review decided to stay with.

I think 8.1 is a far better tablet OS than 10. 10 went too far towards mouse usage. Charms on 8.1 makes it much more friendly for touch. I upgraded to 10 on my Surface 3, hated how cumbersome it became for touch use. Went back to 8.1 and it became awesome again. Tablet mode for 10 is not enough to compete.

just want to say i appreciate your art tablet psas, shog. ill eventuallu have to replace/compliment my set up and your threads are always good for info.

It's my pleasure. Cheers.

 

[Cpt Conifer]

I was about to create a new thread, but I found this one. This probably deserves its own thread, but whatever:


It's on sale again ALL THIS WEEKEND.

Anyway, here is a smackdown between the Z Canvas, SP4, and Surface Book:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBKJRxBBGp4


And the individual review:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_KfcUYvG1g

I bought a Cintiq Companion 2 last July, but then returned it to hold out for the Z Canvas, and have zero regrets. Among the reasons are I prefer the adjustable stand over the CC2's three fixed positions, and the digitizer performance is completely serviceable now that it's been bumped to 1024 levels of sensitivity. I didn't even have any real trouble working with the previous 256 back in 2013-era Ntrig devices (VAIO Duo13, SP3, etc). I also prefer the 3:2 aspect ratio for the added vertical space. Painting at 16:9 can feel cramped at times, it's great for movies and modern video games but not for a lot of productivity and web browsing.

To quote the moderator over at tabletpcreview.com:

Adding to this Weekend Deal discussion: I can understand that one might hesitate to invest ~$2000 in a tablet with "last years" CPU... but I have to tell you that head-to-head, and I have both tablets sitting right next to each other, the Z Canvas is in many ways superior to the i7 SP4. It is faster, the screen is simply gorgeous (far more vivid colors), the WiFi is faster and the system as a whole is more stable day-to-day. Microsoft will eventually fix the last issue, but the other factors will continue to be true.

IF the ZC fits your use case, you will not be disappointed nor envious of the SP4...

Anyone who takes a closer look will see it rocks hard. Dat 95% Adobe RGB.

It's also an absolute joy to play Raiden 4 (or any vertical shmup) on. I can run MGS Rising at a smooth framerate (looks like 60fps most of the time for me).

calling it better than the SP4 is highly misleading. the Surface keyboard is actually a detachable thing, this is just a bluetooth keyboard.

Also the SP4 also has an any angle kickstand, and has a nicer hardware design, is supported direcly by MS vs a small Japanese company that for all we know might not exist in a few years, etc.

edit: also the sp4 has a skylake processor, this is a haswell processor

What a bullshit post. The ZC's stand goes to almost any angle as well, and I prefer it because I can lay my arm directly behind the screen if need be. I find their method (the metal flap that lays flat on the tablet) preferable to a sharp edge sticking down into it, and it's even more convenient to adjust on the fly. The keyboard is actually RF. "Nicer hardware design" is subjective, the ZC is very impressive for what it's housing. The fans are quiet as fuck, too, build quality on the whole is very premium aside from the detachable keyboard being a little flimsy.

 

[Shogmaster]

GAH~ quad for i7 is so tempting...

But I already spent money on upgrading the Thinkpad Yoga 14 to 16GB RAM and 1.2 TB SSD...

I just got paid too. It's gonna take all my will power not to buy one this weekend...

 

[Social]

dont get the surface 4, it's too flawed, buggy and that fan...

 

[Shogmaster]

dont get the surface 4, it's too flawed, buggy and that fan...

Your missing "pro" started me thinking about what Surface 4 specs should be, but that's whole another thread.

Surface Pro 4 does need more stability but I don't think the current situation is nowhere bad as launch window.

 

[HideyoshiJP]

Also the SP4 also has an any angle kickstand, and has a nicer hardware design, is supported direcly by MS vs a small Japanese company that for all we know might not exist in a few years, etc.

How is that relevant to a PC purchase that nobody warrants past a year anyway? Any extra is paid support that usually goes through a provider like Unisys, and that will be around a while.Also, any machine like this with all Intel hardware should have no issues with Windows upgrades.
Just sayin'. Fair points on the design, though.

 

[Supa Necta]

Bumping for major price drop. Down to $997, $1197, and $1397 at MS store.

I bought the 16GB memory/512GB SSD model.