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[KRod-57]

We're now coming to the end of Obama's second term in office. After this, the outlook of his presidency changes from job performance to historical impact. The purpose of this thread is to start a political conversation, and to gage the highs and lows of Obama's presidency, based on political significance and historical impact.


The five greatest accomplishments of Obama's presidency in my opinion are: (note, I do not include the killing of Osama Bin Laden in my list of accomplishments, as ultimately this did not end the war on terror)


5. The Iran nuclear agreement

This agreement lifted international sanctions on Iran in exchange for setting a cap on Iran's use of enriched uranium (so they do NOT build a nuclear weapon). Iran agreed to allow transparency in their nuclear research, and to allow international inspectors into their nuclear facilities. Iran has so far honored their agreement.

4. Justice reform

Obama has commuted more than 1,100 prison sentences, has pardoned more than 140 American citizens, and signed the Fair Sentencing Act, which set in motion the end of the sentencing disparities between crack cocaine and powdered cocaine offenders. It's chip damage to the US's overall broken justice system and overcrowded prisons, but it's also more than any other president has ever done.

and I must also give credit to Obama for banning the federal government's use of torture early in his presidency.

3. Decreasing the national deficit by $900 billion

This is the single biggest deficit DECREASE that any administration has ever produced, however, it came at a time when the national deficit was at an all time high. Thus Obama is leaving office with national deficit of over $500 billion

2. Improving LGBT rights

Obama ended the Defense Of Marriage Act, ended Don't Ask Don't Tell while maintaining the right for gays, lesbians, and bisexuals to serve in the US military. He also became the first sitting president to come out in support of same sex marriage, which may or may not have influenced the supreme court ruling in Obergefell v. Hodges.

Regardless of whether or not his announcement influenced the court's decision, his position set a precedent for our political system as a whole. Obama has been perhaps the most pro-LGBT president in US history.

1. Putting the end of the Cuban embargo in motion

Every UN member country with the exception of Israel has condemned the US's long standing embargo on Cuba. Ending the embargo is long overdue, and Obama has set in motion the first major steps towards finally putting an end to it. The upcoming administration has expressed their desire to continue in this direction, so as of now, it appears Obama will fulfill his efforts at finally ending the embargo on Cuba.



The five biggest failures of Obama's presidency in my opinion are: (note, some of these failures have less to do with his performance as president, and more to do with political gridlock)


5. Not closing GITMO

One of the more glaring campaign promises Obama made in 2008 that has not been fulfilled is his promise to close down Guantanamo Bay. The biggest obstacle has been coming to an agreement with what to do with the remaining prisoners at GITMO. One idea is to have them moved to a maximum security prison in Fremont County Colorado, which is also said to be significantly cheaper than keeping Guantanamo Bay Prison open.


4. Extending and expanding the Patriot Act

In May of 2011 Obama signed the Sunset Extension Act, effectively extending the patriot act for another 4 years and expanding its scope. That same year Obama signed the 2011 NDAA which permitted the federal government to indefinitely detain suspected terrorists, including US citizens without due process of law. In 2015 Obama renewed the Patriot Act again through 2019


3. Jailed whistle blowers

Not only has Obama jailed more whistle blowers than any other president, but he has sentenced whistle blowers to more jail time than the prior 43 presidents COMBINED. Meanwhile the administration insiders who committed illegal actions during the Bush presidency remain completely unscathed

2. Deporter in chief

We often hear about the president's "open border" policy from convertivitive opisition. In reality, he has spent more money on border security than any other president in US history, and has conducted more deportations than any two presidencies combined

1. War, war, and more war

No president in US history has ever spent the entirety of a two term presidency at war until now. On top of this, Obama has bombed more countries than any other president since Harry Truman/WWII, nearly doubling the overall number of countries that were bombed under the Bush administration, leaving office with a staggering 7 countries bombed overall. One of his first actions as president was tripling the number of troops in Afghanistan, which lead to the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th deadliest years of that war. More than 2/3rds of all US casualties in the Afghanistan war occurred as the result of this troop surge, which ultimately failed to accomplish any of its goals.

Military action without congressional authorization, failed exit policies, bombed hospitals, bombed funerals, bombed weddings, and the assassination of US citizens without any legal charges or legal due process are just some of the atrocities that have been committed during this extended period of war. The US has been at war for 15 years straight now (8 of which were under Obama), making it the longest war in US history, that to this day has no end in site.



So that's my list, what do you view as the 5 highs and lows of Obama's presidency?

Also feel free to give me your feedback on my list, I am open to discussing any criticisms you may have on my selections. Again, the purpose of this thread is to start a political conversation

 

[VendettaRed07]

Biggest accomplishment

Getting the ball rolling on healthcare. It was neutered but he still managed to do what no one else had been able to do before. It might get repealed but I think it will play a role regardless in changing people's position on government involvement in healthcare.

Biggest failure:

Syria. Largest human displacement crisis since World War 2 happened under his watch and aided in destabilizing the west politically.

 

[ant_]

I thought he was "deporter in chief" merely because the definition of deportation changed, causing more people to be classified as "deported." He didn't actually deport more people.

I think Obama has been an amazing President domestically. He's pushed America in the right direction and really been a huge benefit to Americans.

I think he's been generally quite poor when it comes to handling the Middle East & Russia. Foreign policy in general has been a weakness for him.

 

[KRod-57]

I thought he was "deporter in chief" merely because the definition of deportation changed, causing more people to be classified as "deported." He didn't actually deport more people.

I think Obama has been an amazing President domestically. He's pushed America in the right direction and really been a huge benefit to Americans.

I think he's been generally quite poor when it comes to handling the Middle East & Russia. Foreign policy in general has been a weakness for him.

This claim has been repeated many times. It has been fact checked, and it is not true. Under Obama's presidency the use of deportations were expanded onto people who previously would have only been subject to returns, however the deportations still took place. The federal government's definition of deportations did not change.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfac...bbs-obama-administration-manipulated-deporta/
https://www.dhs.gov/immigration-statistics/data-standards-and-definitions/definition-terms#3

Biggest accomplishment

Getting the ball rolling on healthcare. It was neutered but he still managed to do what no one else had been able to do before. It might get repealed but I think it will play a role regardless in changing people's position on government involvement in healthcare.

Biggest failure:

Syria. Largest human displacement crisis since World War 2 happened under his watch and aided in destabilizing the west politically.

I have mixed feelings about the ACA given that it's the only for profit mandate plan in the world, and it fails to accomplish universal coverage. On the other hand, many people have benefited from it (particularly those with preexisting conditions), and simply repealing it without replacing it with a more effective healthcare policy would be devastating for many Americans.

In regards to Syria, I see that more as an international failure more than anything else. I don't know if there is anything Obama could have done to prevent the atrocities of Syria from occurring. It is said that at one point Russia offered to have Assad removed, but this was ignored by the US and the west. I would have included that in my list if I was more certain on whether or not this was something Russia was willing to do, or if this was something that was simply discussed, but not considered.

 

[Skinpop]

biggest accomplishment: being a genuinely decent person. One of few world leaders I actually respect as a human being.

Biggest failure: being a weak leader - like all recent american presidents.

 

[KRod-57]

biggest accomplishment: being a genuinely decent person. One of few world leaders I actually respect as a human being.

Biggest failure: being a weak leader - like all recent american presidents.

Can you elaborate what you mean by him genuinely being a decent person, are you referring to his positions on social issues? And what do you mean by he is a weak leader, is that in reference to foreign policy, or what?

You got to give us more to understand your reasoning. I don't mean to criticize, but simply leaving it at "he's a decent person" and "he's a weak leader" is too vague.

 

[Shaanyboi]

Drone strikes on countless innocents will always be a big bloody stain on whatever legacy he leaves behind.

 

[RedHill]

I just really wish Michelle would've went all in on the food industry

 

[Damaniel]

His biggest failure is picking James Comey to run the FBI.

EDIT: I should say that that's part of a larger set of Obama failures - the ones that center around actually believing that Tea Party Republicans could be reasoned with.

 

[zero_suit]

I would say Obama's biggest failure was constantly trying to reach across the aisle to a party beyond salvation at this point.

 

[Goodstyle]

Jailing whistle blowers is a good thing. You don't get to complain about Wikileaks and then say shit like that.

Obama's greatest failure was his pathetic attempt to appease Repubs who were never going to accept him no matter what. Appointing Comey to the head of the FBI was a boneheaded decision any way you slice it.

 

[TheWasTheJoke]

Jailing whistle blowers is a good thing. You don't get to complain about Wikileaks and then say shit like that.

Obama's greatest failure was his pathetic attempt to appease Repubs who were never going to accept him no matter what. Appointing Comey to the head of the FBI was a boneheaded decision any way you slice it.

No way, the corruption up the top is terrible and whistle blowers play an invaluable role in exposing it. I can't think of a more selfless act then what Snowden did. What wikileaks was a bit differant but I still wouldn't mind if they exposed some of the more flagrant indiscretions of Clinton (Paid speeches, Kaine promise, Brazile question)

 

[massoluk]

I would say Obama's biggest failure was constantly trying to reach across the aisle to a party beyond salvation at this point.

yeah, I feel most of his failures were more or less due to this

 

[Abounder]

Greatest failure is more or less contributing to the collapse of the Dem party for the foreseeable future. Didn't help the party enough, and there's just no getting around to how important the Supreme Court/etc are, but to be fair he had a recession to fight. Really should've used populism to the DNC's advantage especially against the wolves on Wall Street

Definitely agreed that Cuba was long overdue.

 

[Goodstyle]

No way, the corruption up the top is terrible and whistle blowers play an invaluable role in exposing it. I can't think of a more selfless act then what Snowden did. What wikileaks was a bit differant but I still wouldn't mind if they exposed some of the more flagrant indiscretions of Clinton (Paid speeches, Kaine promise, Brazile question)

Wikileaks is literally an agent of a foreign government working to undermine America. What Clinton said during those paid speeches and her promise to Kaine is none of anyone's business. The Brazille question was worthless to begin with, and only reveal a profound craven stupidity on Brazille's part.

As for Snowden, well, the sooner people realize what a rat he is, the better. I'm just gonna give you all time just like I gave everyone time to come around on Wikileaks being trash.

 

[KRod-57]

Drone strikes on countless innocents will always be a big bloody stain on whatever legacy he leaves behind.

I agree, it's an unfortunate era of constant warfare we are stuck in. My nieces and nephews haven't lived a single day of their lives where their county was not at war

Jailing whistle blowers is a good thing. You don't get to complain about Wikileaks and then say shit like that.

Obama's greatest failure was his pathetic attempt to appease Repubs who were never going to accept him no matter what. Appointing Comey to the head of the FBI was a boneheaded decision any way you slice it.

1. Not all whistle blowers are hacktivists, in fact most of them are not
2. None of the jailed whistle blowers are hackers who are affiliates to wikileaks
3. Whistle blowers have exposed many illegal activities within our own government, none of which have been held to justice under this administration.

Whistle blowers expose illegal activity within our government, and it's the whistle blowers who are punished.

 

[Skinpop]

Can you elaborate what you mean by him genuinely being a decent person, are you referring to his positions on social issues? And what do you mean by he is a weak leader, is that in reference to foreign policy, or what?

You got to give us more to understand your reasoning. I don't mean to criticize, but simply leaving it at "he's a decent person" and "he's a weak leader" is too vague.

no I don't mean it in terms of social policies. With politics, if anything I think he is a person who just goes with the wind. wasn't he against gay marriage not too long ago?
I mean in terms of being honest to himself. Obama strikes me as the kind of person who recognizes his own shortcomings in terms of reasoning and knowledge and then seeks to remedy that - not dig his heels in to save face or "win" the argument. That's my impression.

In terms of being weak it's not unique to him. In fact I can't think of an american president for the last few decades I'd consider strong(in terms of imposing his will and getting things done to significantly advance usa for the better in terms of social economics, education, healthcare and so on). imo usa looks like a damn third world country unless you are middle class or up, it's a disgrace.

 

[TestOfTide]

Best 5:

5: LGBTQ Rights (such as repealing DADT)

4: Creating enthusiasm for the Democratic Party to some degree

3: Kagan and Sotomayer

2: Stimulus (studies show it helped the recovery)

1: ACA (a program so good the GOP doesn't know how to repeal it)

Worst 5:

5: Trying to appease the GOP

4: "Red Line" and not immediately getting involved in Syria after Assad crossed that red line

3: NSA shit

2: Giving Romney shit for suggesting that Russia is our biggest foe

1: Rahm Emanuel. FUCK RAHM EMANUEL.

 

[KRod-57]

no I don't mean it in terms of social policies. With politics, if anything I think he is a person who just goes with the wind. wasn't he against gay marriage not too long ago?
I mean in terms of being honest to himself. Obama strikes me as the kind of person who recognizes his own shortcomings in terms of reasoning and knowledge and then seeks to remedy that - not dig his heels in to save face or "win" the argument. That's my impression.

In terms of being weak it's not unique to him. In fact I can't think of an american president for the last few decades I'd consider strong(in terms of imposing his will and getting things done to significantly advancing usa for the better in terms of social economics, education, healthcare and so on). it's not that people don't know what's broken - usa looks like a damn third world country unless you are middle class or up.

That makes a lot of sense actually. Many of our presidents are bigger joiners than they are leaders, they come around to progress when the political climate is right for them, but they don't exactly lead the charge.

 

[The Hermit]

I am agree a lot with the OP.

Being one of the most charismatic Presidents l ever tend to make people look past some of his biggest mistakes.

Still, he showed a lot of balls to implement the so called Obamacare.

 

[OldMan]

Obama not growing an Afro is his biggest crime.

Obama blasting people with drones and capturing Bin Laden are some of his biggest achievements.

 

[KRod-57]

Obama blasting people with drones and capturing Bin Laden are some of his biggest achievements.

I'm not sure if this is sarcastic or not, because 1. We didn't capture Bin Laden, he was killed

2. Terrorism has only increased in every country we have bombed so far

Afghanistan

http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/search/Results.aspx?search=afghanistan&sa.x=44&sa.y=22&sa=Search

Iraq

http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/search/Results.aspx?search=iraq&sa.x=17&sa.y=17&sa=Search

Yemen

http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/search/Results.aspx?search=yemen&sa.x=27&sa.y=10&sa=Search


Pakistan

http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/search/Results.aspx?search=pakistan&sa.x=29&sa.y=13&sa=Search

Libya

http://www.start.umd.edu/gtd/search/Results.aspx?search=libya&sa.x=0&sa.y=0&sa=Search


and 3. It's been 15 friggin years we have been at this war, and we haven't subdued a single terrorist organization, we have only added more and more terrorist organizations to the list of people we are at war with.. but at least we got to kill a lot of people in that time, right?

 

[Rymuth]

I would say Obama's biggest failure was constantly trying to reach across the aisle to a party beyond salvation at this point.

Came here to post this.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Appointing Comey. Playing ball with the Repubs.

 

[Leyasu]

The main thing for me was actually seeing a poodle (US president) standing up against It's masters (Israel).

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Can anyone explain why they're blaming Obama for the war that he inherited from the Bush administration? You can say that he might not have cleaned up the mess well enough, and that's fair, but the way I'm reading some posts it's almost as if the entire war was his fault. Like c'mon is your memory that short?

 

[Detox]

Biggest failure is not laying the smackdown on Wall St when they were begging him to save them.

 

[Karu]

Can anyone explain why they're blaming Obama for the war that he inherited from the Bush administration? You can say that he might not have cleaned up the mess well enough, and that's fair, but the way I'm reading some posts it's almost as if the entire war was his fault. Like c'mon is your memory that short?

Eight years, he had eight years. "Thanks Bush" won't quite do it here.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Greatest Accomplishment: Getting us to move forward in every area, rarely moving backwards except with the Patriot Act.

Greatest Failure: Trying to work with republicans early on, not getting more out of ACA and the economy.

 

[KRod-57]

Can anyone explain why they're blaming Obama for the war that he inherited from the Bush administration? You can say that he might not have cleaned up the mess well enough, and that's fair, but the way I'm reading some posts it's almost as if the entire war was his fault. Like c'mon is your memory that short?

No one is saying he started these wars, but it doesn't take 8+ years to end a war, it takes 8+ years to extend and expand it. As I posted in my OP, we nearly doubled the number of countries bombed under Obama(7) than we did under Bush(4), and one of the first things Obama did as president was triple the number of troops in Afghanistan, which lead to the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th deadliest years of that war, and ultimately failed to accomplish any of its goals.

Obama is the first and only president to spend the entirety of a two term presidency at war. The closest any prior president has come to this is LBJ, who did not serve a full two terms because he was replacing an assassinated president. In my opinion, George W Bush is one of the worst presidents in US history. However, at a certain point you need to hold the president currently in office responsible for the actions taken under his terms as president. You simply cannot blame every action taken during the 8 years of Obama's presidency on Bush

Biggest failure is not laying the smackdown on Wall St when they were begging him to save them.

If you are referring to the TARP bailout, that took place under Bush's presidency, not Obama's

 

[Morat]

A good list, OP, although I would switch the positions of Cuba and Iran on your positives list. He talked the US down from getting involved in yet another war over Iran, facing down warmongers on both sides of the US political divide, including a certain Mrs. Clinton. Important as improving relations with Cuba is, I think that beats it for importance.

 

[The Chosen One]

PUSH

I think Syria is one of these things that will definitely look like a failure in the short-term and something we'll never know if it was right in the long-term.

If we began a conflict with Syria, we could have potentially been fighting 3 simultaneous wars and drove us further into debt with financing new wars not to mention the cost of American lives. Unfortunately, Obama saved American money and American lives but it was at the expense of the Syrian people and also somewhat destabilizing Europe in the short-term. We'll never truly know if Obama made the right decision unless we got into a time machine and went into a reality where Obama enforced the redline. Ultimately he was faced with two bad options. Whatever he picked was going to have adverse effects. Also the international community at large shares a lot of responsibility as well.

POSITIVE

I credit Obama for literally saving Cot Dam economy from the brink of catastrophe. I liked that Obama moved the ball forward with healthcare. The fact that Republicans are forced to have a "Replace" option that maintains many (or all) of the benefits of ACA, means Obamacare is here to stay in some form for generations. It just may have a different name. Like FreedomCare.

Obama was also the most scandal free President in recent memory. Most of the investigations were just like the kids at the back of the classform firing spit balls. They were mostly just annoyances, I don't think Obama was losing sleep over any of them.

As a black man, I think Obama did a fine job as the first black President. His family carried themselves perfectly and Obama was able to have a real dialogue with at least 60 - 65% of the country. I don't think the public at large will be afraid to vote for a black President again in the future. That 's big accomplishment in itself.

NEGATIVE

I think he believed his own hype for much of his first term. It's not about appeasing Republicans, he didn't understand the current gerrymandered world we live in now. Bi-partisanship as a normal course of business is dead. It doesn't matter how transformational a Presidential candidate might be. Nowadays there's almost zero incentive for a Republican congressman to work with a Democrat President. If he had that kind of understanding, then he might have approached working with Republicans more strategically and pragmatically. He should started negotiations on the Left and thereby eventually ending somewhere in the middle. But instead Obama's opening offer was often Center or Center-Right. And Republicans often would still reject it. By the time Obama got wise on how to work with Republicans, Democrats already lost both Houses of Congress.

No progress on immigration is definitely a big black eye considering he had a 8 year term. The executive order was just a short-term bandaid that could easily be overturned. In the end, Democrats could once again be accused of just paying lip-service to Hispanics for votes. It also might be why Hispanics did not come out as strong for Hilary as everyone expected despite Trump's divisive rhetoric. Ultimately, Obama had a window where he could have done something on immigration in his first term, but spent so much political capital on healthcare, he and Democrats didn't want to use their last remaining on immigration, so they put it in cold storage where it remains. It's possible we may not address immigration in a comprehensive way for another generation. That's a shame.

 

[KRod-57]

A good list, OP, although I would switch the positions of Cuba and Iran on your positives list. He talked the US down from getting involved in yet another war over Iran, facing down warmongers on both sides of the US political divide, including a certain Mrs. Clinton. Important as improving relations with Cuba is, I think that beats it for importance.

A big reason why I didn't rank that deal higher is the next administration is saying they're going to back out of it as soon as they take office. We'll see what happens once they're in office, but whether or not they back out of it or not, I do think the deal signed by Obama sets a precedent for the coming administration to at least negotiate with Iran.

We'll see what the long term effects are, I agree that the Iran deal COULD be his biggest accomplishment.

As for the Cuban embargo, we've had a very rocky relationship with Cuba since 1959 (the year my mom was born). This embargo is something that has lasted for generations, and at the latter years become just outright childish. Unlike the Iran nuclear deal, the upcoming administration says they wish to continue in the direction set by Obama, but they're going to "make a better deal" for the US out of it.. whatever that means

I feel ending the Cuban embargo is one of his better accomplishments, because its one of those things that has lasted so damn long, it wasn't going to end until we got a president with big enough balls to get it kick started, and ultimately he's creating a better future for Cubans and Americans. I feel like the last two years of Obama's presidency have been closer to what his 2008 campaign was. The last two years of his presidency are easily my favorite years he has been in office

 

[KRod-57]

5: Trying to appease the GOP

Greatest Failure: Trying to work with republicans early on, not getting more out of ACA and the economy.

I would say Obama's biggest failure was constantly trying to reach across the aisle to a party beyond salvation at this point.

I should say that that's part of a larger set of Obama failures - the ones that center around actually believing that Tea Party Republicans could be reasoned with.

I'm noticing this is a common answer in this thread, but are there any decisions or signed pieces of legislation that can be referred to as an example?

You'll notice that in my OP I made a dedicated paragraph explaining specific decisions/actions made by Obama during his two terms as president. I was kind of looking for more specific answers than "he should have been a stronger leader" or "he shouldn't have tried to appease to Republicans"

 

[KRod-57]

Al Jazeera America did a good bit on Obama's recording setting deportations. They point out the fact that he has actually deported more people than every 20th century presidents combined.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CMjw-ibKtQ

This is the kind of thing that is hardly talked about because it doesn't correspond with the assumptions of Republicans who want to believe he has been too lenient on illegal immigrants, nor does it correspond with the assumptions of Democrats who want to believe he's treated immigrants better than George W. Bush