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JCreasy · Jun 20, 2009

Sony, SOCOM needs a real reboot. People need to respect that brand again. That game has to command respect the way God of War 3 does.

Wow us at E3 2011 with a brand new SOCOM game, third-person, Uncharted 2/God of War 3 level of graphics, character models and detail, awesome gun detail and texture like Killzone 2.

Oh, and call it SOCOM: Seal Team Six or SOCOM: DEVGRU. It's gotta be about the ELITE Navy Seals, the DELTA counterparts.

Ok, go . . .

Greg · Jun 20, 2009

Yeah, no one respects the brand... which is why Confrontation has 10k on at all times and is the best MP title for PS3.

JCreasy · Jun 20, 2009

Greg said:
Yeah, no one respects the brand... which is why Confrontation has 10k on at all times and is the best MP title for PS3.

It needs to move 4.5 mil like MGS4.

I think it's 820k right now . . .

Crisis · Jun 20, 2009

Greg said:
Yeah, no one respects the brand... which is why Confrontation has 10k on at all times and is the best MP title for PS3.

If Slant Six hadn't fucked it up so bad that number would be dramatically higher. Best MP for PS3 it isn't.

mr stroke · Jun 20, 2009

Greg · Jun 20, 2009

Crisis said:
If Slant Six hadn't fucked it up so bad that number would be dramatically higher. Best MP for PS3 it isn't.

It's ok... I understand that when you're terrible at a game you hate it.

The game definitely isn't for everyone, but it has nothing to do with the mechanics or Slant Six 'fucking up' - there wouldn't be so many people playing if that was the case.

nyprimus2 · Jun 20, 2009

JCreasy said:
Sony, SOCOM needs a real reboot. People need to respect that brand again. That game has to command respect the way God of War 3 does.

Wow us at E3 2011 with a brand new SOCOM game, third-person, Uncharted 2/God of War 3 level of graphics, character models and detail, awesome gun detail and texture like Killzone 2.

Oh, and call it SOCOM: Seal Team Six or SOCOM: DEVGRU. It's gotta be about the ELITE Navy Seals, the DELTA counterparts.

Ok, go . . .

All of your wishes are completely unnecessary, and I'm pretty sure the SOCOM franchise always has been and still is third person

. All Slant Six had to do was make a game that was accessible, not 50 patches later and still a shitty infrastructure.

Dead Man · Jun 20, 2009

Greg said:
It's ok... I understand that when you're terrible at a game you hate it.

The game definitely isn't for everyone, but it has nothing to do with the mechanics or Slant Six 'fucking up' - there wouldn't be so many people playing if that was the case.

People that pull the 'If you don't like game X it's just because you suck at it' angle always amuse me.

Unknown One · Jun 20, 2009

I'm with the OP. I want a real Socom sequel from Zipper, a true sequel.

Edit: I want a great single player experience, like the previous games.

BobTheFork · Jun 20, 2009

idahoblue said:
People that pull the 'If you don't like game X it's just because you suck at it' angle always amuse me.

What? he's right, don't get mad. I just started playing it two weeks ago, and if you think there is a problem with it, you are clearly wrong. Greg- 2pts for a takedown.

JCreasy · Jun 20, 2009

nyprimus2 said:
All of your wishes are completely unnecessary, and I'm pretty sure the SOCOM franchise always has been and still is third person . All Slant Six had to do was make a game that was accessible, not 50 patches later and still a shitty infrastructure.

I guess I was just brainstorming, thinking of elements that would really leave an audience in awe after seeing it.

I just feel as though gamers are luke warm on SOCOM titles when they should be thrilled. Considering how awesome first-party Sony games look these days, Sony could really put some development muscle behind the brand a blow it out. I mean with real profound production value.

After seeing the trailer, people just aghast, and then . . . "SOCOM: Seal Team Six" appears on screen . . . fuckin tight

Dead Man · Jun 20, 2009

BobTheFork said:
What? he's right, don't get mad. I just started playing it two weeks ago, and if you think there is a problem with it, you are clearly wrong. Greg- 2pts for a takedown.

I haven't played the game yet, it's just a weak argument in general.

DJ Crimson · Jun 20, 2009

WiCkEd_Co · Jun 20, 2009

I would be more than happy with Socom 2 remade into HD. I mean leave everything the same just update the graphics like Super Street Fighter HD did and make it a PSN download game for 20 bucks, Socom 2 was the best IMO.

I would be willing to even pay $30 for this, Socom 1 and 2 took many hours of my life away 2 even more so because it had the S1 maps too.

Greg · Jun 20, 2009

idahoblue said:
People that pull the 'If you don't like game X it's just because you suck at it' angle always amuse me.

Yeah, but it's completely valid in this case because the game has a ton of quirks and a pretty steep learning curve. I can see someone jumping into the game, becoming extremely discouraged by doing something stupid/getting voted off, and then blaming the mechanics of the game or lobby system for the game being terrible.

I think considering the lack of time, support, and funding compared to the big AAA titles (you're kidding yourself if you think it received MAG/KZ2-level support), Slant Six did a great job of capturing all of the elements that made S1/S2 so successful. The only thing the game lacks at the moment is maps, and the patches they've rolled out have been done in a timely fashion considering it took Zipper close to a year to release a patch for S2/S3 at one point.

Unknown One · Jun 20, 2009

DJ Crimson said:
I guess people are still bitter of how the beta turned out and the first month of its release. They fixed most of the issues and the game is a blast to play when not dealing with asshole teammates.

Not me I always like the single player experience more, that's why I didn't get the recent one.

Dead Man · Jun 20, 2009

Greg said:
Yeah, but it's completely valid in this case because the game has a ton of quirks and a pretty steep learning curve. I can see someone jumping into the game, becoming extremely discouraged by doing something stupid/getting voted off, and then blaming the mechanics of the game or lobby system for the game being terrible.

I think considering the lack of time, support, and funding compared to the big AAA titles (you're kidding yourself if you think it received MAG/KZ2-level support), Slant Six did a great job of capturing all of the elements that made S1/S2 so successful. The only thing the game lacks at the moment is maps, and the patches they've rolled out have been done in a timely fashion considering it took Zipper close to a year to release a patch for S2/S3 at one point.

That scenario is completely plausible, but to assume that everyone who doesn't like the game does so because they are not good at it is ridiculous. As I said, I haven't played the game yet, so I'm not making any statement about the quality of the game, only the argument!

Ballistictiger said:
Not me I always like the single player experience more, that's why I didn't get the recent one.

Same.

Greg · Jun 20, 2009

WiCkEd_Co said:
I would be more than happy with Socom 2 remade into HD. I mean leave everything the same just update the graphics like Super Street Fighter HD did and make it a PSN download game for 20 bucks, Socom 2 was the best IMO.

I would be willing to even pay $30 for this, Socom 1 and 2 took many hours of my life away 2 even more so because it had the S1 maps too.

I used to be in this crowd because S2 was my all-time favorite game for PS2, but then I put the game in recently and it's not as good as you remember. The hit detection and net code were absolutely terrible... the problems with that game are so far beyond the little complaints people have with Confrontation.

And you also have to take into consideration that giving the graphics an 'update' would also deal with improving the draw distance... which is why Slant Six had to tweak pretty much every corner of the old maps.

Ballistictiger said:
Not me I always like the single player experience more, that's why I didn't get the recent one.

And I think you can thank Sony on that one - it's pretty clear from the first showing at E3 that the game wasn't given the resources it deserved in favor of other titles.

idahoblue said:
That scenario is completely plausible, but to assume that everyone who doesn't like the game does so because they are not good at it is ridiculous. As I said, I haven't played the game yet, so I'm not making any statement about the quality of the game, only the argument!

The only reason I throw it out there is that the majority of the people that hate on the game have either read reviews about problems at release, watched youtube videos of problems exaggerated to a ridiculous level, or haven't played the game post-patch.

DJ Crimson · Jun 20, 2009

DemonSwordsman · Jun 20, 2009

DJ Crimson said:
I never met anybody who liked the single player more than the multiplayer. Single player was usually boring in my opinion.

You'd be surprised at how many people always played the single player for socom and then got around to MP.

And i have confrontation but it just did hold me like the old socoms did. I played socom 1 since the 1st day it came out till Socom 2 came out and then played that for probably till socom 3 and then was like WTF at socom 3...

But come on there is some sort of problem with confrontation otherwise 10k online is kinda abysmal for a socom game if you look at 1 and 2. They were one of if not the most played online games of the generation.

Seriously they need to go back to maps specific to a game type which made the maps infinitely better designed. The stupid addon shit for the weapons is stupid. I want my socom back!

Cruzader · Jun 20, 2009

Hey bob, you in a clan? I rare play due to clan members ganging up on me or kicking me due to their insecurities. :lol

I'd love to play with a clan. I really dont give a damn if we are the best or suck, I just want to know that if im ganged up, my peeps can kick the douche. KZ2 just doesnt interest me. Its always the same thing over and over again(clusterfucks,late deaths.etc)

shintoki · Jun 20, 2009

DJ Crimson said:
I never met anybody who liked the single player more than the multiplayer. Single player was usually boring in my opinion.

Socom had a Single Player!!!!? :lol

The brand needs to die, Its definitely a nostalgic trip were you do remember it fondly(Partially because what else was there on the PS2 online but also at the core of the gameplay, it was extremely fun and addictive). Yet it probably had some of the shoddiest programming you can find. Glitches, cheats, technical programs,etc. The retail releases were more like a Beta than a finished product. But...for some reason you couldn't stop playing it :lol

Kintaro · Jun 20, 2009

SOCOM is a hard sell now with the deluge of military/-ish shooters on the market now.

GeneralIroh · Jun 21, 2009

Try out Arma 2 in thirdperson mode. It looks really nice but its full of bugs.

Shins · Jun 21, 2009

Something something MAG something something.

Unknown One · Jun 21, 2009

DJ Crimson said:
I never met anybody who liked the single player more than the multiplayer. Single player was usually boring in my opinion.

I like it, I like how when I'm not doing something correctly my squad suffers. I like the fact that it involves a team not a 1 man army, I like that I have to be tactical.

Yes I tried GRAW and even owned the first one but it didn't feel right to me.

Not much game out anymore that requires tactics in a shooter.

TheSoed · Jun 21, 2009

DemonSwordsman said:
You'd be surprised at how many people always played the single player for socom and then got around to MP.

Agreed. I work big box retail and there were several customers who noticed a new Socom for PS3. When I told them it was online only, they put it back on the shelf, telling me they either only played single player or wanted a single player mode.

I'm also one of those, I would've liked a single player campaign. I still own and enjoy Confrontation, but MP-only games are rare for me to put a whole lot of time into. Beyond TF2 and Warhawk, I haven't put more than a few rounds into MP-only games.

ItAintEasyBeinCheesy · Jun 21, 2009

Fixing the existing version would be nice, so would the ability to reach through the screen and murder other players across the other side of the globe for real..... not to much to ask.

Darkpen · Jun 21, 2009

Kintaro said:
SOCOM is a hard sell now with the deluge of military/-ish shooters on the market now.

Not necessarily. The SOCOM community is full of roleplayers and you almost never have a problem with finding competant players who won't fuck the team over for shits and giggles. Or at least, that's how it was back in SOCOM 2 online. Haven't played Confrontation, so no comment there.

I'm a little shocked, though: Do you guys actually like the single-player aspects of the SOCOM games more than the online?

Either those are some awfully rose-tinted glasses, or I don't know what. If you ask me, the Modern Warfare franchise has officially filled the navy seal realism niche, though very poorly.

What's so hardsell about SOCOM Confrontation is the sheer fact that it has no singleplayer to fill out the price point. Its just not a worthwhile purchase because of that (and I regret my Warhawk purchase very much so as well).

Unknown One · Jun 21, 2009

I find nothing realistic in COD4, to me it's just a plain arcade shooter. I'm not talking about online.

Socom has consequences if you mess up and things can go bad fast in single player. That's what I like and there's no health pack nor regenerative health. I can remember a lot of replaying the same levels because of a stupid mistake.

Edit: Also the conservation of your ammunition magazines and ammunition in general.

Corran Horn · Jun 21, 2009

It would be nice once Zipper is done with MAG to have them work on the next true Socom. Socom Confrontation isnt bad....just needs more work done to it still.

Shurs · Jun 21, 2009

Corran Horn said:
It would be nice once Zipper is done with MAG to have them work on the next true Socom. Socom Confrontation isnt bad....just needs more work done to it still.

I hope that Zipper serves the MAG community with fixes and new content rather than jumping into a new SOCOM.

Quasar · Jun 21, 2009

Darkpen said:
Not necessarily. The SOCOM community is full of roleplayers and you almost never have a problem with finding competant players who won't fuck the team over for shits and giggles. Or at least, that's how it was back in SOCOM 2 online. Haven't played Confrontation, so no comment there.

I wonder if many of those guys will be trying out MAG. I wonder if Zipper is even courting those guys.

Corran Horn · Jun 21, 2009

Shurs said:
I hope that Zipper serves the MAG community with fixes and new content rather than jumping into a new SOCOM.

Dont think its gonna need the whole team to do that tho. Im not expecting the next socom ASAP.

Shurs · Jun 21, 2009

Corran Horn said:
Dont think its gonna need the whole team to do that tho. Im not expecting the next socom ASAP.

True.

J-Rzez · Jun 21, 2009

Zipper is busy on MAG at the moment. You want Sony to peddle the name off to another dev again like it did with Confrontation, which Slant 6 fucked that name up really good. I gave them the benefit of the doubt off the bat that they would address their major screw ups quickly. And then they dragged their feet. The game lacked guns, maps, working party system, and then there was the lag and other connection problems. There still isn't a content patch available yet, still "fixes" patches. It's a shame how the SOCOM name got dragged through the mud.

That enough is good reason for Zipper not to change the name of MAG to SOCOM something.

Once Zipper has the time, then let them work on it. Only if they peddle it off to another one of their proven top tier studios would I say get another SOCOM in the works even if Zipper is still busy.

Anyways, MAG is shaping up to be a killer shooter, and it "feels" like SOCOM as some people put it. That will quench my real next-gen SOCOM desires for now.

I wonder if many of those guys will be trying out MAG. I wonder if Zipper is even courting those guys.

The people I talked to on Confrontation not too long ago were all pumped for MAG. Some others didn't know Zipper was behind it, and once they found out they were, they're aboard the hype train.

AranhaHunter · Jun 21, 2009

JCreasy said:
It needs to move 4.5 mil like MGS4.

I think it's 820k right now . . .

Source?

Anyways, SOCOM is still respected, but SCEA should've never released Confrontations as broken as it was.

Unknown One · Jun 21, 2009

To me Mag seems to fit the role of Warhawk more then it does to Socom. Not like it's a bad thing, it's a good thing actually. My complaint is I want it in 3rd person.

Crisis · Jun 21, 2009

Greg said:
It's ok... I understand that when you're terrible at a game you hate it.

The game definitely isn't for everyone, but it has nothing to do with the mechanics or Slant Six 'fucking up' - there wouldn't be so many people playing if that was the case.

Dude I've played almost every SOCOM game there is starting with the first and I even had Combined Assault. I'm not terrible at any SOCOM game at all. But after I waited for months for them to fix the game to add trophies and to put it in a basically playable state only to see them dick around and not release necessary features they advertised on the box until WAY later I traded that in and haven't looked back. Confrontation is a game that sold on brand name and promise at the start because it was really fucking bad early on. I was also in the beta so I also know that it's not like they didn't have time to get some of that shit fixed too.

BobTheFork said:
What? he's right, don't get mad. I just started playing it two weeks ago, and if you think there is a problem with it, you are clearly wrong. Greg- 2pts for a takedown.

Bob I respect the hell out of you and all of that but if you just picked the game up two weeks ago then you didn't see how bad it was at launch and for months afterwards. I bought the game absolute day one. So it's a really ignorant thing to sit there and say that I'm clearly wrong. There WERE massive problems with the game and they didn't fix them for months.

J-Rzez · Jun 21, 2009

Ballistictiger said:
To me Mag seems to fit the role of Warhawk more then it does to Socom. Not like it's a bad thing, it's a good thing actually. My complaint is I want it in 3rd person.

How does it fit the role of Warhawk more than SOCOM?

Crisis said:
Dude I've played almost every SOCOM game there is starting with the first and I even had Combined Assault. I'm not terrible at any SOCOM game at all. But after I waited for months for them to fix the game to add trophies and to put it in a basically playable state only to see them dick around and not release necessary features they advertised on the box until WAY later I traded that in and haven't looked back. Confrontation is a game that sold on brand name and promise at the start because it was really fucking bad early on. I was also in the beta so I also know that it's not like they didn't have time to get some of that shit fixed too.

Bob I respect the hell out of you and all of that but if you just picked the game up two weeks ago then you didn't see how bad it was at launch and for months afterwards. I bought the game absolute day one. So it's a really ignorant thing to sit there and say that I'm clearly wrong. There WERE massive problems with the game and they didn't fix them for months.

It's a testament to the SOCOM name that it sold as well as it did despite people knowing the game was broken.

This is truth though, and that's coming from a hardcore SOCOM fan. Blind faith that Sony wouldn't let their biggest online franchise continue to be in the horrid state it was at launch, and months after, I was still disappointed. It's like they knew Slant 6 made such a mess of it, and they made a bad call letting them do SOCOM for their first PS3 attempt. I had faith they'd fix it, but it took so long to run properly that it really sapped the interest out of it for me. MAG is now my hopes for a serious and competent "current day-near future" shooter on the PS3.

BobTheFork · Jun 21, 2009

Crisis said:
Dude I've played almost every SOCOM game there is starting with the first and I even had Combined Assault. I'm not terrible at any SOCOM game at all. But after I waited for months for them to fix the game to add trophies and to put it in a basically playable state only to see them dick around and not release necessary features they advertised on the box until WAY later I traded that in and haven't looked back. Confrontation is a game that sold on brand name and promise at the start because it was really fucking bad early on. I was also in the beta so I also know that it's not like they didn't have time to get some of that shit fixed too.

Bob I respect the hell out of you and all of that but if you just picked the game up two weeks ago then you didn't see how bad it was at launch and for months afterwards. I bought the game absolute day one. So it's a really ignorant thing to sit there and say that I'm clearly wrong. There WERE massive problems with the game and they didn't fix them for months.

sorry, I didn't mean for that to sound serious. Greg is my clan leader so I was just sticking up for him

I have heard a great deal about the patches and trouble the game had. At least the have it in a good place now IMO

Greg · Jun 21, 2009

J-Rzez said:
Zipper is busy on MAG at the moment. You want Sony to peddle the name off to another dev again like it did with Confrontation, which Slant 6 fucked that name up really good. I gave them the benefit of the doubt off the bat that they would address their major screw ups quickly. And then they dragged their feet. The game lacked guns, maps, working party system, and then there was the lag and other connection problems. There still isn't a content patch available yet, still "fixes" patches. It's a shame how the SOCOM name got dragged through the mud.

That enough is good reason for Zipper not to change the name of MAG to SOCOM something.

Once Zipper has the time, then let them work on it. Only if they peddle it off to another one of their proven top tier studios would I say get another SOCOM in the works even if Zipper is still busy.

Anyways, MAG is shaping up to be a killer shooter, and it "feels" like SOCOM as some people put it. That will quench my real next-gen SOCOM desires for now.

I don't want Zipper to touch the series again - I just want Slant Six to be given the support and funding that the series deserves. It seems to me that Sony was running a bit short on the big-name titles, so they threw the series out there for the sake of the name while the funding was going elsewhere.

As much as I loved the series on PS2, Zipper had some of the worst net code and community support that I've ever seen.

Crisis said:
Dude I've played almost every SOCOM game there is starting with the first and I even had Combined Assault. I'm not terrible at any SOCOM game at all. But after I waited for months for them to fix the game to add trophies and to put it in a basically playable state only to see them dick around and not release necessary features they advertised on the box until WAY later I traded that in and haven't looked back. Confrontation is a game that sold on brand name and promise at the start because it was really fucking bad early on. I was also in the beta so I also know that it's not like they didn't have time to get some of that shit fixed too.

All I've gathered from this is that you haven't played the game in its current state, which is way beyond completion in comparison to the other titles in the series. To say that the previous games come anywhere close to Confrontation in terms of polish is a joke. The only thing the game lacks now is maps, and that completely falls on Sony in giving the studio both the time and the funding necessary to create them.

J-Rzez · Jun 21, 2009

Greg said:
I don't want Zipper to touch the series again - I just want Slant Six to be given the support and funding that the series deserves. It seems to me that Sony was running a bit short on the big-name titles, so they threw the series out there for the sake of the name while the funding was going elsewhere.

As much as I loved the series on PS2, Zipper had some of the worst net code and community support that I've ever seen.

And sadly, it ran the best out of all the PS2 online games. Fuck, even S3 for example has features that current gen games lack. Zipper is now also first party, getting the additional support that they made need, and considering that MAG isn't in beta yet, and it was running with minimal lag at E3 is surely a good sign.

IF Sony were to resurrect the SOCOM name, I hope they put it in the hands of one of their more competent developers, and properly allocate resources to make sure it's the best it can be. I gave S6 the benefit of the doubt, and they took way too long to address glaring issues, which they're still fixing to date. And we STILL don't have any new content (though it's coming "soon"). Not to mention the lack of weapons the game launched with, and is still suffering from.

Crisis · Jun 21, 2009

Greg said:
All I've gathered from this is that you haven't played the game in its current state, which is way beyond completion in comparison to the other titles in the series. To say that the previous games come anywhere close to Confrontation in terms of polish is a joke. The only thing the game lacks now is maps, and that completely falls on Sony in giving the studio both the time and the funding necessary to create them.

And I'm not going to play the game in its current state. I gave them enough chances to get it together. They got my $60 from when the game came out and they seemed pretty content with that for a long time. You talk about polish and all of that but at least the PS2 SOCOM games worked when I bought them. At least their community features were acceptable back in the PS2 era. So maybe Confrontation has more features than the PS2 titles did back then but polish is certainly not Slant 6's area of expertise. That game should have never released like that and it did a ton of damage to the brand coming out like it did. If I were Sony I would tell Slant 6 to stick to the PSP titles if they wanted and forbid them from ever touching a PS3 dev kit again.

DJ Crimson · Jun 21, 2009

DemonSwordsman · Jun 21, 2009

DJ Crimson said:
I don't mean to be ass but the SOCOM PS2 games had their glitches to and weren't as polish as you would remember. Hell, SOCOM 1 was fucking terrible with that and took a while for the other games in the series to get patches just like somebody else said.

Well that was because it was impossible to patch stuff on the PS2. A lot of the glitches in Socom one were patched in newer copies of the game so a lot of the older easier glitches can only be done if you have one of the very early copies of S1. Ofcourse there was also all those gamehacker things but you can't really blame zipper for that.

DJ Crimson · Jun 21, 2009

DemonSwordsman · Jun 21, 2009

DJ Crimson said:
Yes, I clearly understand that but there's no point in making it seem like the previous entries were perfect. Yes, it was possible to patch the games. They released patches and even downloaded maps that were only able to be downloaded if you owned the PS2 hard drive.

Yeah but i'm just saying how many people had a ps2 hdd? Not many.

I agree the first 2 weren't some perfect glitch free games. But they just had a certain quality that confrontation is lacking.

DJ Crimson · Jun 21, 2009

Ploid 3.0 · Jun 21, 2009

BobTheFork said:
What? he's right, don't get mad. I just started playing it two weeks ago, and if you think there is a problem with it, you are clearly wrong. Greg- 2pts for a takedown.

I saw a lot more people on my PSN playing it so I fired it up again. After a big update, I jumped into a game, and it just felt better. I probably didn't give the final game enough time (I got warhawk at the same time, and killzone was right around the corner) but Socom Confrontations put a big grin on my face. I just need a gaf clan

. Miss the Socom2 group.

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