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The Last Guardian - Spoiler Thread

Just finished the game. A magnificent experience. I can't remember the last time a game has made me feel such sense of wonder, desperation, triumph, and sadness as this has.

I feel so fractured though :( As a dog lover this was often a brutal experience and the end was just horrific. It's not a sad ending but it's not a happy ending either. Why couldn't the boy go find trico after they all recover? Maybe he did.

All I want to do now is hug my dog close.

This is a spoiler thread, so you don't have to mark spoilers. =P

I think what it shows is that the villagers won't accept Trico due to the history of them abducting kids and being beasts. Notice how he's telling this story to the kids, not the adults.

However, it looks like Trico is likely happy where he is, and you're happy where you are. So in a way, it's a happy ending, though I know the two of them being together was an ending a lot of us would have loved since Trico was so endearing to us.
 

B-Genius

Unconfirmed Member
Finished the game about an hour ago.

Phenomenal game, this ones for the ages. Theres so much to think about and take in. As with many classic works of art, they're divisive at first. TLG is divisive due to some having issues with the controls and camera. Over time, people will truly come to appreciate the masterpiece that is The Last Guardian.
I read your post, then I saw your avatar, and I knew you were someone of good taste :)

I binged the last few hours of this game before jumping on a train to join the family for New Years. Clocked in at somewhere under 15 hours according to the trophies. Very satisfied with the length and overall experience. It was much longer and richer than I expected.

In fact, assigning some arbitrary value like length or "bang for buck" feels dishonest with this game. I really felt it was something special. I have friends who can't get over the "condescending hint system" or "nausea inducing frame rate" and I just...don't know how to relate. I really hoped to share my thoughts with people who are close to me, but so far everyone is treating it like just another action/adventure game or something.

I don't mean to put it on a pedestal or anything - obviously it has its flaws, but it should be so easy to look past them and enjoy it for its strong points, which it does far better than the vast majority of games out there. I'm just in such turmoil from the ending and the implications of your journey with Trico right now, I just needed somewhere to gush. Hopefully GAF is willing to listen... Happy to see some really positive vibes on here for the most part.
 
I read your post, then I saw your avatar, and I knew you were someone of good taste :)

I binged the last few hours of this game before jumping on a train to join the family for New Years. Clocked in at somewhere under 15 hours according to the trophies. Very satisfied with the length and overall experience. It was much longer and richer than I expected.

In fact, assigning some arbitrary value like length or "bang for buck" feels dishonest with this game. I really felt it was something special. I have friends who can't get over the "condescending hint system" or "nausea inducing frame rate" and I just...don't know how to relate. I really hoped to share my thoughts with people who are close to me, but so far everyone is treating it like just another action/adventure game or something.

I don't mean to put it on a pedestal or anything - obviously it has its flaws, but it should be so easy to look past them and enjoy it for its strong points, which it does far better than the vast majority of games out there. I'm just in such turmoil from the ending and the implications of your journey with Trico right now, I just needed somewhere to gush. Hopefully GAF is willing to listen... Happy to see some really positive vibes on here for the most part.

I played it in one sitting - only interrupted by sleep - with a friend. He was just as blown away as I was! In the end we agreed that the controls work in favour of what the game tries to convey. The boy is struggling and you feel it.

As far as I'm concerned you can put the game on a pedestal - TLG is a grand adventure that's totally unique in terms of scale and ambition. Some people have different preferences when it comes to game mechanics. Not everyone will get it... It really hurts with this one, though ha ha.

This will sound strange but I think the drastically different perceptions of the game kinda tell me a little something about the person playing it. Hell, Last Guardian really made think about life and humanity itself.

Ueda, you crazy genius!
 
I had the impression that the White Tower predates the rest of the city that's inside the valley, from the way the other buildings seem built around it, and the sort of haphazard bridges connecting to it.

Granted, the Master of the Valley didn't seem particularly intelligent or "thinking", and I don't discount that it was a construct of some kind, but I don't think the people that built the city are the ones that made it.

That's a good point. I wonder if the master of the valley created the nest it arrived like a meteor or something, since the nest almost looks like a massive crater.
 
Oooooh, I need to see that! All the points above are just my personal speculations, I should have pointed that out more clearly. ;)

No worries. I just spent a good amount of time sussing that particular detail out so might as well correct where I can. Depending on how you layout the starting cave, which is tricky because there are quite a few angles and turns, then the shield room is at the base of the coliseum where you use the cart to launch yourself into the upper rafters.

It could also just be buried sort of by itself. The screen SirNinja took has a great view of it all on the right. You catch a glimpse inside the buildings at the base of the coliseum during the cutscene with the armors carrying and dropping Trico off in the starting cave. You can see the rigging for the mount if you look up in the starting cave.

u3xD9zF.jpg
 

watershed

Banned
So, seriously who is in that coffin? The circular pool of water has to be a callback to SOTC and I think Ico? But that coffin is new.
 
What I think is happening post game- is the boy becomes one of the chiefs of his village.

He uses the shield to reconnect to his friend that he thought had been long gone.

With the bond and the bat signal like effect that TimeEffect mentioned earlier- it sort of calls upon Trico.

Trico and family fly to the village and the boy shows how they are friendly and can live amongst them in the village.
 

acklame

Member
I like the happy interpretations in this thread. I was in tears towards the end and damn I just wanted to destroy all those who brutally attacked Trico throughout. This game really makes you feel powerless and panic like no other.
 
I like the happy interpretations in this thread. I was in tears towards the end and damn I just wanted to destroy all those who brutally attacked Trico throughout. This game really makes you feel powerless and panic like no other.

The one-on-one fight and final confrontation were heart-rending for me. I got panicked, agitated and angry.

I just felt like... I couldn't do anything.

No game has elicited such emotion from me.
 
I really enjoyed the ending for the game especially the after-credits scene with the boy grown up and the two set of eyes appearing in the darkness, great way to end it.

Seeing Trico get mangled by the other versions of him and later the humans attacking him was brutal to watch, definitely hit an emotional level in me. Hopefully he didn't have to suffer his last days.

Great game but SOTC is still my favorite of the 3 Team Ico games although I would rank TLG above ICO.
 

Jedi2016

Member
Did the game ever explain why Trico was so freaked out by the glass eyes?
This was simple enough, I thought... the animals were simply conditioned (probably through negative reinforcement) to avoid them. I imagine they were built when the city was still inhabited, to keep the animals away from the regular people that lived there, limiting their access only to the White Tower.

Another question I thought of last night is: Why does Trico react the way he does to the soldiers? They're clearly on the same "side" prior to his accident, yet he responds instantly, and with extreme violence, any time he sees one. Much more violently than he responds to any other human figure.
 
Another question I thought of last night is: Why does Trico react the way he does to the soldiers? They're clearly on the same "side" prior to his accident, yet he responds instantly, and with extreme violence, any time he sees one. Much more violently than he responds to any other human figure.

I think when they have the helmets on, the Trico's are able to be controlled by the master of the valley (that's why when Trico and the nemesis both have their helmets broken they become more docile). And I'm guessing Trico doesn't like being controlled by the Master and his minions and made to capture humans and do his bidding. And when the armies see that Trico is acting of his own accord o ostensibly try to escape they attack him.
 

Shoeless

Member
Just finished the game. A magnificent experience. I can't remember the last time a game has made me feel such sense of wonder, desperation, triumph, and sadness as this has.

I feel so fractured though :( As a dog lover this was often a brutal experience and the end was just horrific. It's not a sad ending but it's not a happy ending either. Why couldn't the boy go find trico after they all recover? Maybe he did.

All I want to do now is hug my dog close.

I could have been much worse. I was really worried we were going to get an Old Yeller ending, which would have broken me in half.
 

Kaizu

Member
Another question I thought of last night is: Why does Trico react the way he does to the soldiers? They're clearly on the same "side" prior to his accident, yet he responds instantly, and with extreme violence, any time he sees one. Much more violently than he responds to any other human figure.

All conjectures on my part here but it's probably the summation of being locked onto a chain by them and their insistence in throwing his friend into a door.
 

B-Genius

Unconfirmed Member
I played it in one sitting - only interrupted by sleep - with a friend. He was just as blown away as I was! In the end we agreed that the controls work in favour of what the game tries to convey. The boy is struggling and you feel it.

As far as I'm concerned you can put the game on a pedestal - TLG is a grand adventure that's totally unique in terms of scale and ambition. Some people have different preferences when it comes to game mechanics. Not everyone will get it... It really hurts with this one, though ha ha.

This will sound strange but I think the drastically different perceptions of the game kinda tell me a little something about the person playing it. Hell, Last Guardian really made think about life and humanity itself.

Ueda, you crazy genius!
Thanks. I'll put it on a small pedestal, then :)

Still trying to process the story and my emotional reactions to the implications throughout (some of which are just downright dark), but in terms of gameplay and general game feel, I'm firmly in the camp that believes the experience benefits from its approach. I don't think anyone else really attempts this kind of game (the way it presents itself to the player, and the way the protagonist controls), and it wouldn't be the same if done another (more orthodox) way.

You definitely need to meet the game half way on a lot of fronts, including camera/character control, but if you can make the adjustments to your mindset and take your time with inputs, etc. then it not only becomes manageable, but also much more enjoyable. People can be very stubborn when it comes to this, and I dislike the notion that it's clunky or pretentious just because it's different. Like people are trying to find fault and be a critic for the sake of it, rather than trying to take it all in.

... Not sure who I'm preaching to here ^^;
Just getting some more stuff off my chest, as this game absolutely deserves praise and was absolutely worth the wait.
 

Shock32

Member
Wow I just finished this game and am still processing everything, I really never thought I'd feel genuine emotions like this from a video game. The ending was such a rollercoaster ride it topped off an amazing adventure. That fight on the tower was so gut wrenching I just wanted it to be over, but I had no idea what to do. It took me a good 10 minutes to figure it out and the whole time you just hear the anguished screams. I really dont even know if I want to play the game again because of that and the village scene. I'm glad they had the post credits scene, it ended happily with the family. Knowing trico was happy and the boy was happy was icing on the cake.

I love the whole last scene and the trophy name for beating the game "though we are far apart". That means they are far apart but will always be connected from their journey. The grown up boy starting in his village and seeing trico where you first met, man that was all done so good. Nobody will understand but them, their kind will never get along but they couldn't have done it without each other. And seeing the trico that was in the tower that you battled was really great too. I couldnt have asked for a better game/ending, nine years was nothing for that masterpiece.

OK im done now :)
 
Ending seriously had me crushed. Boy I haven't shed tears like that since valiant hearts. I jab on r1 as soon as he said he had to send Trico away. I didn't want to see him get hurt anymore and it's crazy how I knew instantly that I was to press that button. Honestly would have been far too depressed had it not been for the post credit scene. What an impactful experience. Alex Navarro basically explained it best, Trico is the first character in a game I found my self audibly talking to through my TV. What a Rollercoaster of emotions lol.
 

black070

Member
I finished this game in two sittings, it would have been one but I got seriously frustrated near the end and had to take a break.

This is the first Ueda game I've completed - I only went as far as upto the first save in ICO and defeating the first boss in Shadow of the Colussus (not for the lack of will, just didn't have the time), and boy what a marvellous experience. I oddly connected with Trico pretty hard, so the ending absolutely crushed me. Easily a Game of the Year contender for me after all is said and done.
 

Markitron

Is currently staging a hunger strike outside Gearbox HQ while trying to hate them to death
This has probably already been discussed at length, but were there any solid connections to Ico or SotC?

Also The Valley is one of the best gaming environments ever, easily the best since Rapture.
 

Dimmle

Member
When I realized I could call for Trico to leave in the ending village scene, I was wracked. Goddamn, only a video game could achieve this. That's what Ueda's games are: testaments to the medium.
 

Toth

Member
My first post after lurking for some time.
Just finished the game today.It was an incredible journey with a very satisfying ending.Easily my Goty, even though the controls aren't tight at all.

I did as well. It's not my GOTY (FFXV baby) but it's still an incredible journey and very emotional. I wish the controls were better though as they proved to be very frustrating at time.


I want my own Trico now!
 

Gbraga

Member
I still can't stop thinking about this game. I very much believe I should give it more time before I go for a second playthrough, but it just won't leave my mind.

Easily my Game of the Year and would very likely enter a top 10 of all time.

I'll share some of my thoughts on why, especially from a gameplay perspective.

As crazy as it may sound, I still insist that Ueda is underrated as a game designer, even by his fanbase. All everyone talks about is "the feels", and the ones who don't like his games, on the other hand, say that the poor gameplay stopped them from feeling this connection. It's a fine opinion to have, but for whatever reason a lot of fans just embraced that as well, and they say that his games have poor gameplay, but are amazing for other reasons. Maybe they do feel that way, but I'm inclined to believe they're just not giving the gameplay enough credit.

Shadow of the Colossus speedruns aren't a thing because of the feels, they're a thing because to this date no other game achieved what that game did when it comes to input-driven giant boss battles. They're usually qtefest "spectacles", that try to sell you on how epic everything looks, without making it actually feel epic. It looks very intense and life threatening, but in reality all you do is wait and press the button the game tells you. The only high budget game that even listened to what Team ICO had to say on the matter was Dragon's Dogma, almost 7 years later, and 4 years passed since Dragon's Dogma released and no other AAA game tried. We just had Final Fantasy XV using giant bosses as a cool looking setpiece where you don't do much but watch the action on screen.

The Last Guardian is a bit of a special case, because it's not just people not giving it enough credit for what it achieves with its gameplay, the whole game is generally underrated, which was a quite a shock. I was expecting the game to be really good, but never reach the highs of Shadow of the Colossus to me, but I was sure it would be a critical darling, 10s everywhere. I was completely wrong on both accounts.

As development tools and graphics advanced, more and more games want to break out of this combat-focused gameplay loop, and consumers reflect this desire. Everyone wants more variety, more calm moments that make the experience more like an adventure, instead of a bloodthirsty psychopath increasing their body count between each story cutscene. Character development and interaction during gameplay became much more prevalent in the AAA space, and is now absolutely expected.

The problem is that the gameplay design didn't quite follow these technical advancements and desires to tell different stories, at least in the AAA scene. When I think of character interaction during downtime from combat in a AAA game, I think forced slow walking. The interaction isn't nearly as meaningful as it is in the combat parts of the games, and it ends up creating this disconnect between the player and the adventure. This is even more obvious during setpieces that try to emulate the pacing of an adventure movie. Everyone acts as if they're facing great danger, but the player isn't put in great danger. If all I'm doing is holding forward while the characters say "wooah, that was close!", it becomes nothing more than a "hold forward to play cutscene", and an unskippable one at that.

The Last Guardian's contribution to the debate, in my opinion, is that you shouldn't have to choose between meaningful interaction and a focus on the adventure. And what an adventure!

Although the title-creature and the world are clearly fantastical in nature, in order for the experience to work, achieving a certain level of verisimilitude is fundamental. It needs to be believable. When you strip the game of all its layers to get to the core, you'll find Trico. So in a way, it's not an exaggeration to say that the game IS Trico. All of the game's systems, mechanics, puzzles, even down to the architecture of the places we explore, everything is built around the creature. And not just in the obvious videogamey way of "it's a big creature, we need big levels", there are at times incredibly small places you need to go through, but the main issue at hand is precisely "how are we gonna fit Trico in here?". Most of the problems and solutions revolve around Trico. The player, on the other hand, is just a boy, with a name briefly mentioned but not subtitled, trying to understand this world and this animal as much as the players themselves.

And it's through that boy that we must learn to interact with Trico, so that we, together (and I can't stress enough how much of a collaborative process it is), can overcome the obstacles on our journey, trying to find our way out and back home. And that's where the believability is so important. Real animals in pretty much any other game don't feel nearly as real as here, and that's because of the fact that they're nothing more than gameplay tools, even if wearing the costume of a living being. This isn't a bad thing by itself, don't get me wrong, but since they made the decision of creating Trico as a living, conscious being, it's fundamental that the player can buy the idea that this is an animal with its own will, and for that, it needs to behave convincingly.

Whether or not the game is successful on that attempt is obviously subjective and one of the main reasons why it's such a divisive game (way more than I thought it would be, as I don't think their previous games are divisive, at least not around here), but I personally think they absolutely nailed it. Beyond the points that were already discussed to exhaustion of Trico having its own routine and interests, I'd also like to, once again, talk a little about the collaborative process that this game's progression is. Precisely because it's a believable creature with its own thoughts, instead of yet another tool for the player to handle, the "control" we have over Trico is much more of a "suggestion" than actual direct control. Dealing with this concept is without a doubt the biggest cause of frustration when it comes to the game's controls. But as someone who is really into speedrunning and sees a lot of value in consistency, I was happy to find out that it didn't really feel like Trico answering to you was up to RNG, at all. It's not just giving him a command and rolling a dice, spamming it until it works. As long as you keep in mind that you're suggesting something to a living being, rather than giving commands to a robot, the interaction works fluidly and consistently. People mentioned "this is how animals behave" to defend it, and while they're not wrong, it gave me a very different idea of how it was. I wish my pet was nearly as obedient as Trico is.

When we meet our companion for the first time, it's very weak, far from its former glory, but it's still a majestic creature, and in many moments, all that's left for us is to contemplate its actions in awe, and not uncommon are the moments where our role is merely to take care of it, while it solves the current problem by itself. I've also seen this being criticized a lot, in a "the puzzle solves itself" way, but once again I firmly believe this is a result of the premise itself not resonating with the person. It's true that in some moments you'll climb on Trico and it'll move to the next area without your input, but as I mentioned before, it's not a tool at your command. It's a real animal in that world, legendary and feared as the man-eating beast, but in this particular case, it's also your friend. And this bond that is built throughout the game gives you a role to play during those sequences that is equally input-driven, albeit optional. While Trico clumsly moves to the next area, you can take the time to treat its wounds, for example. Giving it some attention and cleaning it up. These segments are also typically short, and nothing but platforming that the boy can't perform anyway, so even if the player isn't interested in doing that, or doesn't have any wound to treat, you're not having any actual puzzle solving removed from you.

This intelligence and curiosity that Trico shows also makes it an active part during the moments where you action is what will determinate progress, which makes for the majority of the game. Most of these situations ask the player to work with the animal, be it to solve puzzles or fight enemies, figuring out how Trico will fit in a certain environment, using its stature and movement to your advantage, even though from its perspective, all it wanted was not to be alone. There are a few situations where it does nothing but wait for you to solve the puzzle and fetch it some food, but those actually serve as a welcome break of pace, giving you some rare alone time that just makes the threats even more threatening, given the boy by himself isn't equipped to deal with them.

But going back to what I was talking about in the beginning, the gameplay aspect that really made it shine among all of the games that try to focus on character relationship was, surprisingly, the action scenes and setpieces. When you add non-combat focused controls, that lack involved battle mechanics for you to deal with the action, the checkpoints, that are very generous, but don't give you an on-screen indication of when you're safe to fail, and the overall massive scale of the connected map the game takes place in, it all ends up giving a lot more tension and giving a big impact to these combat moments and action-filled setpieces. There's some genuine fear of failing, both for the mechanical reasons just mentioned, and just wanting to preserve the well being of your friend, using gameplay conventions and the feels to make these scenes so remarkable.

They abandoned the general combat conventions of gaming, but not the adrenaline that comes with action, and that was a brilliant decision. The answer to the much discussed question of "how to make a personal AAA game about character development and the feel of an adventure, without boring the player with the lack of action?" is what sounds, in retrospect, completely obvious: Not letting go of the action and the adrenaline rush that comes with it. The Last Guardian without a doubt offers some of the most intense action sequences of this generation, while always keeping that feel of an adventure movie that so many games lose when they try to imitate the aesthetic of an adventure movie but without taking player input into consideration. It's not exciting when the platforms crumble under Nathan Drake because you've seen it a million times and you know he'll grab the platform automatically. It looks dangerous, but it doesn't feel dangerous.

In The Last Guardian it does, not only because you're not equipped to deal with the threats you're facing, but also because you know it won't become a QTE fest, or super heavily scripted segment, for the game to pretend that you could handle it. The basic mechanics are all you have to work with. And also, as mentioned, the fear for the well being of your companion. Every time Trico is in danger, I was in a rush that is not unlike the one I feel from getting to the last bits of health of an incredible boss in Soulsborne. I didn't want Trico to get hurt, and what if my actions could have some impact in how badly Trico could get hurt? I didn't think they would, but what if? Even in segments that I took some time to help it and it was very clear that the game wouldn't punish me for taking my time, I still didn't want to let Trico suffer any more. Many different stories made me cry and care about characters, but only gaming, and only when done in such a unique way, can make me desperate to just make it stop.

Whew. What a ride this game was. Some closing unrelated thoughts:

This game's presentation is superb. It's in my opinion the best looking game of this generation, without a doubt. The soundtrack this time is much more conventional than what you'd expect from Ueda, but it's still very much applied in a similar way, with similar sensibilities. I never felt like it was trying to impose itself and guide my feelings, it merely accentuated what I was already feeling, it didn't steal from the simplicity of the narrative. Veritcality is a constant theme throughout the campaign. At any moment you find yourself outdoors, you can look up to see where you're going and how closer you are to your final destination, and look down to see how far you've come, and you can really appreciate how intense the situations you've been through were, by seeing what remained of some of the previous locations. It's just a shame that this jawdropping scale comes at such a high performance price. While it wasn't enough to make me think of the game as anything less than a masterpiece, it definitely did negatively impact some moments. You just get to an outdoor area after struggling in an oppressive environment for so long, and instead of having a cathartic experience, the first thing you think is "this game runs like shit in open areas".

Artistically, this game is everything you could expect from the names behind genDESIGN. The typical "ruins of a once great place" atmosphere is back, the architecture and its decay help to tell a story of that world and the man-eating eagles, one that is highly up to the player's imagination, much like someone waking up in that place would have no idea of what the hell happened there. But it's just consistent and cohesive enough to feel real, and to feel like wondering about it isn't a waste of time, that whatever conclusion you may reach, is probably somewhat close to the truth.

The main story this time around was told in a much more straight forward way, to my surprise, with even the inclusion of a voice over (that didn't work that well a lot of the time, I must say), and several cutscenes that tell a clear story. The mystery is still there, and there's obviously a lot left for your imagination, but the story of the main characters is told in a very direct way, which I felt was the right decision, to have this "middle of the road" storytelling for this game. I wouldn't want Shadow of the Colossus to be any different, for example, but I don't think vague storytelling can do justice to the kind of relationship that is built between the boy and Trico, so it was a great decision for this particular tale.

It's a game that will most likely move you to tears if you're invested in it and on board with the premise. Not for some melodrama, but for the deep emotional connection created, that makes you actually care about these characters, and gives weight to every decisive moment in the narrative. By the time the credits roll, the prevalent sentiment is satisfaction, for living this incredible adventure to the end.

I've cried before in games, but tears of joy because of Trico's reaction when it found out I was alive? I don't think I ever had any experience like it. At the end, when you give it the command to fly away, I was a mess. And not because I was already building up to it, the moment I knew what to do, and pressed that button, it hit me really hard.

It's a miracle this game was completed and released, but I'm very thankful for it. The industry is better for having games like this.
 
edit:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reTN0FzYuXE

They fade away after a few seconds so you have to hit the button combo again to get them to show. That is why they fade in and out.

edit2: Correction on this. Just played through the end again. You ONLY need to press O to get the horns to light up. R1 does absolutely nothing. So in effect you are 'using the shield' rather than using the action command.

Saw this posted by genDESIGN and immediately thought of the easter egg at the ending:

ybLeyhz.png


Ueda san you absolute genius!

Ohmygod, I never realized about Trico's horns lighting up. Gonna have to reply the ending - I actually felt a little lump in my throat watching the video. Holy shit. Wow, when I didn't think I could possibly adore this game enough already-!
 

B-Genius

Unconfirmed Member
GBraga said:
Better than the majority of reviews for the majority of games out there. Very well said on all fronts. The fact that you're able to identify the flaws without letting them hamper your experience is the sign of an intelligent, respectful player. Wish more people could take the time to form (let alone articulate) their thoughts as well as this!
 

Gbraga

Member
Better than the majority of reviews for the majority of games out there. Very well said on all fronts. The fact that you're able to identify the flaws without letting them hamper your experience is the sign of an intelligent, respectful player. Wish more people could take the time to form (let alone articulate) their thoughts as well as this!

Wow, thank you so much for the kind words, as well as taking the time to read through all of that! It ended up a bit longer than I expected.

And I swear, one of the reasons I decided to write my thoughts was seeing your posts here. You're one of the users I always really enjoy reading posts and discussing games with, so I feel like senpai noticed me! :D
 

B-Genius

Unconfirmed Member
Wow, thank you so much for the kind words, as well as taking the time to read through all of that! It ended up a bit longer than I expected.

And I swear, one of the reasons I decided to write my thoughts was seeing your posts here. You're one of the users I always really enjoy reading posts and discussing games with, so I feel like senpai noticed me! :D
Haha, don't know what I've said to earn that sort of praise, but thanks! It means a lot. Always happy to chat about TLG or otherwise.

Happy 2017 everyone!
 

Asd202

Member
Just finished the game. The ending sequence was brutal and that ending I was crying through it all I'm just a little sad that the boy and trico never met again. What a magnificent game. Thank you Ueda.
 
I just completed the game. Fuck me, that last hour was probably the most emotionally stressful and invested I've ever been playing a video game. When the other griffins started tearing Trico apart I genuinely struggled to press on. So suffice to say, I'm grateful for the (semi) happy ending.

Is it safe to assume that Trico interpreted the shield's signal as an invitation to visit the protagonist at his village? That's what I like to think the epilogue is establishing, but maybe I'm being a tad too optimistic. It's just hard to deal with the heartbreak of seeing the boy send Trico away without even getting a chance to say goodbye.

Edit - Hah, didn't even see the comment above mine until after I posted this. The mimicry was purely unintentional!
 

Dimmle

Member
I took so long to find the shield and realize what I had to do during that horrific climax that I felt a strange urge to reload from the last checkpoint and replay the sequence quickly so that my "canon" story would not force Trico to experience so much suffering.

That's probably the weirdest convergence of emotional investment and player logic I've ever encountered in a game. In the end I decided I could only endure his mauling once.
 

meanspartan

Member
Completed it last night and I loved it. As a dog lover the end was really difficult to watch

Its a real shame about the awful frame rate and some really bad, not-fun puzzles. Otherwise the game is a masterpiece

Yes, a couple puzzles are totally arbitrary and not logical at all, when I hit one of those I just looked up a guide, fuck it not wasting time. And two that involved tossing barrels to higher surfaces were extremely frustrating, just kept bouncing off.

They should patch those, quick.
 

EGM1966

Member
I had the impression that the White Tower predates the rest of the city that's inside the valley, from the way the other buildings seem built around it, and the sort of haphazard bridges connecting to it.

Granted, the Master of the Valley didn't seem particularly intelligent or "thinking", and I don't discount that it was a construct of some kind, but I don't think the people that built the city are the ones that made it.

As for who/what the "last guardian" is? It's as good a guess as any, given that both the boy and Trico are not the last of their kind.
I don't this so TBH. From the environmental evidence the impression I got was the whole place was once a functioning entity under control of some leader. The portal doors and antennae chambers are in the outer buildings too and the design is consistent.

I believe the real "master" is in the tomb oh encounter early only. It's clearly a coffin in shape of (interestingly large) human. Given the key to controlling everything has been interned with this figure this seems safe assumption.

Over time the outer buildings have crumbled into disrespair although some elements remain functional here and there.

The central building is clearly still "powered" with remaining artefacts of the intered figure. I suspect the master of the valley encountered is merely a mechanism created by the interred figure. Whether it's simply gathering chosen boys to power itself or try and reanimate the interest figure isn't clear but I reckon a bit of both from previous Team ICO titles.

I note even the central tower is starting to fail though, with cracks starting to set in (one allowing you to get the mirror key in the first place).

Myself I figure the idea is the whole thing is destined to fail over time but it's asking a long time due to the child gathering Trico's.

You of course speed up the process entirely. I note at the end the final shots seem to show the magic/power implying outer coating of the central building peeling away with destruction of the controlling AI (for want of a better term).

So I think the whole place was of a piece originally with the central tower as the "home" of the magician/wizard who ruled it before dieing and being intered at the base of the tower. The central tower thus lasted the longest over time while the outer buildings crumbled.

I don't see the (obviously failing over time too) automata guards building the outer buildings nor having a reason too: and clearly no one else inhabits the place.

So I figure it all had to exist at essentially the same time.

Whether the horn/power/shadow figure motifs are just that or indicators of a stronger link to ICO and SOTC isn't clear although the design of the world is consistent with those two.

If I had to guess from the clues TLG comes after ICO. The main reason is boys are clearly sometimes born with something inside them that causes the Trico to chose them but don't manifest horns anymore indicating a weakening of effect over time.

So roughly speaking the order would be:

SOTC: power of Dormin is finally scattered across forbidden lands at end of game. First child with horns obtaining some of his essence is "born" via reincarnation of Wander.

ICO: sorceress seeks to become reborn by gathering children containing essence of Dormin while preparing her own daughter as the vessel she'll occupy. Long enough has passed from SOTC that the forbidden lands are now inhabited with villages. The search is slow though at the sorceress waits patiently even as her castle falls into disrepair as she waits to gain enough power and for Yorda to be ready to host her consciousness

TLG: enough time has passed children no longer exhibit external signs of containing power but it can be sensed by Trico. A powerful wizard constructs a domain in "the nest" and creates automata to serve him. He creates a controlling entity to collect children containing usable essence of Dormin that will maintain his domain after his death (and possibly try to reserect him once enough power is gathered). Long time passes and the power wanes and you are taken and by chance Trico preparing you for absorption is struck by lightning...
 
This is probably an idiotic question but... what is the title of the game referring to exactly? Seems to me like it's very open to interpretation. Who or what is the last guardian?
 

Dimmle

Member
Yes, a couple puzzles are totally arbitrary and not logical at all, when I hit one of those I just looked up a guide, fuck it not wasting time. And two that involved tossing barrels to higher surfaces were extremely frustrating, just kept bouncing off.

They should patch those, quick.
I agree that those barrel challenges could be irritating but I'm not sure how a patch would alleviate anyone's frustration with them.
 
This is probably an idiotic question but... what is the title of the game referring to exactly? Seems to me like it's very open to interpretation. Who or what is the last guardian?

Doesn't seem to be a firm consensus on this, here or otherwise. Seems most people think it's the master of the valley. To me though, it could actually be the boy - the shield exists for some purpose, and I wonder whether or not given we know the master has enslaved the race of Tricos, that the boy is "saving" them.
 

Gbraga

Member
I wish we got the original title in the west >_>

It's much more unique and powerful. Reminds me so much of Ghibli films.

That part at the end when Trico puts the boy inside his mouth and flies away is the perfect title card moment. Gives the title so much weight. It was the first thing I thought when it happened.
 

Markitron

Is currently staging a hunger strike outside Gearbox HQ while trying to hate them to death
This is probably an idiotic question but... what is the title of the game referring to exactly? Seems to me like it's very open to interpretation. Who or what is the last guardian?

It is very open to interpretation, IMO it's referring to Trico. At one point these animals were probably benign and friendly before falling under the control of the master. Perhaps they were referred to as Guardians?

Since Trico broke free of this control he reverted to type and protected the boy, making him the last guardian during the events of the game. I think the end was meant to imply that the species will prosper again.

I haven't given it too much thought but that's the impression the game left me with.
 

Dabi

Member
In my mind, after the boy (now man) activated the shield for the first time in decades, Trico and his kid realizes what's up, flys back to the village and the two catch up on all the years missed.

You can't tell me otherwise
 
Doesn't seem to be a firm consensus on this, here or otherwise. Seems most people think it's the master of the valley. To me though, it could actually be the boy - the shield exists for some purpose, and I wonder whether or not given we know the master has enslaved the race of Tricos, that the boy is "saving" them.

It is very open to interpretation, IMO it's referring to Trico. At one point these animals were probably benign and friendly before falling under the control of the master. Perhaps they were referred to as Guardians?

Since Trico broke free of this control he reverted to type and protected the boy, making him the last guardian during the events of the game. I think the end was meant to imply that the species will prosper again.

I haven't given it too much thought but that's the impression the game left me with.

Thanks guys. I thought perhaps I missed some glaring plot strand that made the title of the game super obvious, but apparently not. Yeah, looking back on the game, the name of The Last Guardian does strike me as a curious one. Ueda's previous games had straightforward titles, as does the Japanese counterpart for TLG, yet here we are with something seemingly abstract in comparison.

In my mind, after the boy (now man) activated the shield for the first time in decades, Trico and his kid realizes what's up, flys back to the village and the two catch up on all the years missed.

You can't tell me otherwise

That's honestly how I interpreted it as well, but it does feel like I'm being too wishful. Who knows. I bet moments after the scene cut to 'The End', Trico gets up and starts making his/her way out of the nest, and we're all just being denied certain knowledge of a super happy reunion because Ueda is a troll.
 
Just finished the game.
Wow, another timeless classic.
What an incredible experience and piece of art. It was 100% worth the waiting.
Played on the PS4 Pro / 1080p TV.
Framerate was perfect 30fps, 98% of the time.
Definitely going for the platinum trophy now.
 

B-Genius

Unconfirmed Member
IGM1966 said:
That's a nice interpretation and timeline theory. It's quite reasonable to assume connections (not just thematic links) between the three games, and piecing them all together is gonna be a lot of fun. Makes me want to replay them all!

It is very open to interpretation, IMO it's referring to Trico. At one point these animals were probably benign and friendly before falling under the control of the master. Perhaps they were referred to as Guardians?

Since Trico broke free of this control he reverted to type and protected the boy, making him the last guardian during the events of the game. I think the end was meant to imply that the species will prosper again.

I haven't given it too much thought but that's the impression the game left me with.

It could even be the term given to the beasts while they're subservient beings in masks. They essentially protect the Master's tower and prolong its life force, so they are technically Gurdians. Trico could be the last because he (and the boy) kind of chucks a wrench in the works.

That's honestly how I interpreted it as well, but it does feel like I'm being too wishful. Who knows. I bet moments after the scene cut to 'The End', Trico gets up and starts making his/her way out of the nest, and we're all just being denied certain knowledge of a super happy reunion because Ueda is a troll.
For me, they wouldn't even need to fly back to the village. It's just enough to know that Trico recognises the "call" and maintains a link with the man. The fact that the creatures are free and the village will never be attacked is icing on the cake.
 

big fake

Member
I didn't know in 2016 I would say these words "The Last Guardian is the best game of the year and has lived up to expectations". If I was to say this to myself 5 years ago I would laugh myself to death.

This game, Ueda's vision, has showed me that games have so much potential still untapped. There are a lot of games that have systems and gameplay mechanics but few who do what TLG does so well in its simple yet excellent execution of a boy taking care of a bird dog creature. Ueda is seriously a mastermind, his games are so well lived in and not once has there been a director and his vision to be compromised for anything.

He believed in it, and he made it better than we could imagine. Its also another nail in the coffin in trusting reviewers. I don't see how this could get its super low scores that it did. I understand some of the control/camera issues but how could people not feel what it had to offer?

Regardless, TLG delivered and Ueda proves he is still a god damn legend.
 
Just finished ;_;

This game is just fascinating from a design standpoint. So much is done with so little. The boy, the beast, and a mirror.

I've been sitting here for a good hour just reminiscing on the journey i just went through.

What a masterpiece. this is Ueda's best game yet.

In my mind, after the boy (now man) activated the shield for the first time in decades, Trico and his kid realizes what's up, flys back to the village and the two catch up on all the years missed.

You can't tell me otherwise

i thought that is what it's implying.

After all that time, I like to think Trico's tail grew back and the reactivation of the mirror surely made trico wake up/feel something.
 
I just finished it. Wow doesn't even come close to describing the feelings I had after playing it. I thought that when Trico's tail came off, it was dead and my heart sank. The barrel reveal was fucked up. I haven't felt this depressed since Life Is a Strange. Then the post credit scenes came on and I immediately got a lump in my throat when I read the final "though we are far apart" trophy.

Even though I had some major issues with the frustrating camera, that doesn't taint this experience for me. It might not be the greatest game I've ever played, but it left an impression on me that I will never forget. Truly one of the most heartfelt games ever.
 

A-V-B

Member
Just finished ;_;

This game is just fascinating from a design standpoint. So much is done with so little. The boy, the beast, and a mirror.

I've been sitting here for a good hour just reminiscing on the journey i just went through.

What a masterpiece. this is Ueda's best game yet.



i thought that is what it's implying.

i'm sure Trico's tail grew back and the reactivation of the mirror surely made trico wake up.

Considering it's been left in the dirt for so long... Trico hasn't felt this in ages.
 
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