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Curious case of Rockstar vs. PC

D

dex3108

Member
So GTA V on Steam is at 8.5M owners if we add to that at least 1/3 of that number for copies sold outside Steam (it is probably way more) we get something between 11M and 12M sold copies on PC alone (I am confident to say that it is probably around 13M-14M). And that makes almost 20% (to be precise 17%) of all sold copies (last number was over 80M). Game was released on 5 platforms so if we divide that sales number on 5 equal parts that makes it relatively equal to console sales.

And yet Rockstar is still refusing to do RDR2 on PC (at least for now). Are delaying PC release (if that is their tactic) really make difference? Will majority of PC players really switch to consoles to play one game? What other reason could be?

P.S. I hope that my math is good :D Sorry if I made mistake.
 
R

_Rob_

Member
91Vk7eMeNYL._SX522_.jpg
 
G

GhostTrick

Banned
civilstrife said:
They know they'll make the money eventually and that a good portion of PC players will buy it on consoles first.
Click to expand...



That remains to be seen.
People keep saying "Double Dippers work. Look at GTAV PC". When in fact, it just show that if GTAV happened earlier on PC, sales on that platform would be higher.
 
T

texhnolyze

Banned
Well, that seems to be their tactic and GTA V shows that it works.

I believe they need to port RDR1 first before releasing the sequel on PC.

So I guess PC gamers will be playing RDR1 while everyone else is playing 2 in 2018.
 
Rellik

Rellik

Member
texhnolyze said:
Well, that seems to be their tactic and GTA V shows that it works.

I believe they need to port RDR1 first before releasing the sequel on PC.

So I guess PC gamers will be playing RDR1 while everyone else is playing 2 in 2018.
Click to expand...

I doubt it.

They'll take their time with the PC version of RDR2 and make it so much better than the console version so people like me then buy it again so I can replay with better graphics and 60fps.
 
T

texhnolyze

Banned
Rellik said:
I doubt it.

They'll take their time with the PC version of RDR2 and make it so much better than the console version so people like me then buy it again so I can replay with better graphics and 60fps.
Click to expand...

And that's exactly what they might do. Take their time with the PC version and release it in 2019.
 
O

osnameless

Member
dex3108 said:
f we add to that at least 1/3 of that number for copies sold outside Steam (it is probably way more) we get something between 11M and 12M sold copies on PC alone
Click to expand...

What sales outside Steam? Doesn't every copy need to be authenticated through Steam, and it is counted as a Steam sale?

Also, I am all for more Rockstar games on PC, but I kinda get why Rockstar is hesitant with that. GTA V worked because they spent more than an extra year optimizing it, and to this day GTA Online is a hassle with all the hackers and stuff.

I don't think your calculations are entirely accurate too. GTA V is a game that basically every console player gets when he buys a new console, so I think the game sold way too more on PS4 and Xbox One, and to assume that the sales are equal between the two generations is kinda hard to believe.
 
Deathknell

Deathknell

Member
dex3108 said:
And yet Rockstar is still refusing to do RDR2 on PC (at least for now). Are delaying PC release (if that is their tactic) really make difference? Will majority of PC players really switch to consoles to play one game? What other reason could be?
Click to expand...

RDR2 is obviously coming to pc in 6+ months but yeah, they are some real greedy motherfuckers, that's the reason.
 
martino

martino

Member
i 'm confident rate of double/triple dippings on this game is one the highest you can find.
on this basis i can't see them not delaying probable pc version (ps5 version)
here we go gt5 like or more numbers
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
Well, if RDR2 gets delayed until Fall (I'd give this a 50% chance), and the PS5 comes out in 2019 (I'd also give this a 50% chance), then it would make more sense to just put the PS5 version on PC a year later.
 
Z

Zushin

Member
osnameless said:
What sales outside Steam? Doesn't every copy need to be authenticated through Steam, and it is counted as a Steam sale?

Also, I am all for more Rockstar games on PC, but I kinda get why Rockstar is hesitant with that. GTA V worked because they spent more than an extra year optimizing it, and to this day GTA Online is a hassle with all the hackers and stuff.

I don't think your calculations are entirely accurate too. GTA V is a game that basically every console player gets when he buys a new console, so I think the game sold way too more on PS4 and Xbox One, and to assume that the sales are equal between the two generations is kinda hard to believe.
Click to expand...

No, Rockstar has their own login service. My copy is run through Rockstar Social Club because that's where the cheapest copy available to me at the time activated. Not linked through Steam at all.
 
Rellik

Rellik

Member
Zushin said:
No, Rockstar has their own login service. My copy is run through Rockstar Social Club because that's where the cheapest copy available to me at the time activated. Not linked through Steam at all.
Click to expand...

Not sure about GTA V but I got a physical copy of Max Payne 3 (Yes, those still exist) that also went through Rockstar Social Club and not Steam.
 
D

dex3108

Member
Nirolak said:
Well, if RDR2 gets delayed until Fall (I'd give this a 50% chance), and the PS5 comes out in 2019 (I'd also give this a 50% chance), then it would make more sense to just put the PS5 version on PC a year later.
Click to expand...

Nah they Take2 won't do it because they have other games to release during holiday season.
 
Sentenza

Sentenza

Member
I seriously doubt "double dippers" is a relevant business strategy as this forum loves to claim.
It's probably another one of these "GAF bias against reality", where users think what's common here happens on a large scale.

I'd be incline to think the percentage of people who own more systems AND buy the same game twice must be very, very small and that they are statistically irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Also, empiric evidence seems to suggest that late ports (on any platform) tend to sell way less than concurrent releases. Then again this is Rockstar we are talking about, so I'm not sure the rule applies to them as well.
 
U

UrbanRats

Member
Nirolak said:
Well, if RDR2 gets delayed until Fall (I'd give this a 50% chance), and the PS5 comes out in 2019 (I'd also give this a 50% chance), then it would make more sense to just put the PS5 version on PC a year later.
Click to expand...

OnlyTheDeadCanKnowPeaceFromThisEvil.meme
 
M

Martinski43

Member
Well in the case of GTA V i tripple dipped. Got it first for PS3 and then later for PS4 and then for PC when that version came out. Yep i'm a sucker.
 
Rellik

Rellik

Member
Martinski43 said:
Well in the case of GTA V i tripple dipped. Got it first for PS3 and then later for PS4 and then for PC when that version came out. Yep i'm a sucker.
Click to expand...

Same and I have no shame because each one was a large improvement over the previous.

red731 said:
I double dipped from PS3 to PS4 and will prolly buy again on PC for 60fps shenenigans and just leisure Michal Bayism.
Click to expand...

You'll enjoy it all over again. 60fps makes a big difference in GTA V.
 
G

Gen X

Trust no one. Eat steaks.
GhostTrick said:
That remains to be seen.
People keep saying "Double Dippers work. Look at GTAV PC". When in fact, it just show that if GTAV happened earlier on PC, sales on that platform would be higher.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but imagine if there was no announcement of the PC version, PC gamers buy it on their console of choice, then 6-12 months later Rockstar announce RDR2 with free RDR for pre orders. Boom.

/drops mic
 
R

red731

Member
I double dipped from PS3 to PS4 and will prolly buy again on PC for 60fps shenenigans and just leisure Michal Bayism.
 
ISee

ISee

Member
I certainly learned my lessen with GTA 5. I bought the PS3 version, then the PS4 upgrade and finally on PC.
I waited for ff15 on PC (okay, I bought the game on PSN during the 12€ price error and played it for 5-6 hours) and I plan to wait for the RDR2 PC version.
 
T

TheSecondSpitter

Member
Sentenza said:
I seriously doubt "double dippers" is a relevant business strategy as this forum loves to claim.
It's probably another one of these "GAF bias against reality", where users think what's common here happens on a large scale.

I'd be incline to think the percentage of people who own more systems AND buy the same game twice must be very, very small and that they are statistically irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Also, empiric evidence seems to suggest that late ports (on any platform) tend to sell way less than concurrent releases. Then again this is Rockstar we are talking about, so I'm not sure the rule applies to them as well.
Click to expand...
Citation please
 
S

Soulblighter31

Banned
Sentenza said:
I seriously doubt "double dippers" is a relevant business strategy as this forum loves to claim.
It's probably another one of these "GAF bias against reality", where users think what's common here happens on a large scale.

I'd be incline to think the percentage of people who own more systems AND buy the same game twice must be very, very small and that they are statistically irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
Click to expand...


yeah, thats one of the more bizzare and absurd things on this forum, among many many others. According to posts here, PC gamers means they have a computer and a console of choice. They do not, in the actual real world.
 
Sailent

Sailent

Banned
I've seen people talking about "double dipping" on Destiny 2. That means buying it on consoles first and then PC.

So yeah... RDR2 might be delayed on PC because of people like this. To maximize sales.
 
kraspkibble

kraspkibble

Permabanned.
i don't see any other reason for delaying the PC version other than tempting people to double dip. i'm not having a go at people for doing it because i did it myself. triple dipped GTA V (ps3/ps4/pc) and now just double dipped Destiny 2 (PS4/PC).

i doubt someone who owns just a PC is going to go out and buy a console just to play RDR2. some people will but most people won't spend that amount of money for 1 game. a lot of people already do own both a console + PC though like myself. I'll be buying RDR2 for PS4 because I don't want to wait for the PC version.

I'd like to think I won't double dip but probably will although I won't be paying full price. I'll wait until it goes on sale even if it means waiting a few years. lowest i've seen GTA V for on Steam was £20 and the game came out on PC over 2 years ago.
 
S

Sad Affleck

Member
I don't think the delay in PC versions has anything to do with double dipping. The percentage of people who double dip in the grand scheme of things isn't that big to warrant a release strategy focused on them. I believe that Rockstar has a specific development cycle and they see no reason to change it. They develop for consoles first, then once the console versions ship they start work on the PC version.
 
AHA-Lambda

AHA-Lambda

Member
I seriously doubt "double dippers" is a relevant business strategy as this forum loves to claim.
It's probably another one of these "GAF bias against reality", where users think what's common here happens on a large scale.
Click to expand...

This. I highly doubt the average person double dips for PC versions.
 
R

Randall365

Member
I think it's a business decision. Release on consoles and deal with any issues arising - then spend resources developing the PC version, release and then deal with problems.

They could take on more staff and produce all 3 versions at the same time, but then again what's the point - they will still make a killing.

I recall when Arkham Knight had a multi platform launch - the PC version was withdrawn wasn't it? If you haven't got the resources, then it's best to play safe.

Personally I don't think RDR2 will be released on PC at all. Their refusal to release RDR1 was completely inexplicable, but they sure had a reason.
 
H

Hesh

Member
Console-makers pay them lots, and lots, and lots of money to market their games on their respective consoles. As such, they'll prioritize console releases first and foremost and then spend the house money on a PC port when they feel like it.
 
O

osnameless

Member
Randall365 said:
I think it's a business decision. Release on consoles and deal with any issues arising - then spend resources developing the PC version, release and then deal with problems.

They could take on more staff and produce all 3 versions at the same time, but then again what's the point - they will still make a killing.

I recall when Arkham Knight had a multi platform launch - the PC version was withdrawn wasn't it? If you haven't got the resources, then it's best to play safe.

Personally I don't think RDR2 will be released on PC at all. Their refusal to release RDR1 was completely inexplicable, but they sure had a reason.
Click to expand...

I agree...

For some time, more and more developers are taking this approach, instead of making a cheap outsourced PC port, and I actually don't mind it at all. Getting a more polished, less-buggy version of a game at the expense of getting it day one sounds like a good deal to me.

WB did it starting with MK9 for most of its big games. MK9, MKXL, Injustice, Batman Arkham Knight... (Maybe MK9 doesn't count, as the PC release came a few years late)

Also, Ubisoft followed this method for some time, most of their AAA titles were released on PC two weeks after their console release.

It is hard to think that Rockstar wanted people to double-dip, seeing that they delayed the PC release multiple times, and it was actually up in the air for sometime if I remember correctly.

I believe Rockstar sees that opting for focusing entirely on consoles is more beneficial than devoting some of its resources for a PC version that would hurt the game's name if it was a poor release, so dismissing the PC release altogether makes sense to them.
 
D

Demicore

Member
I've always thought delaying pc releases was a tactic aimed at limiting the effects of piracy, as a great number of people tend to want to play games around the launch date.
 
D

dex3108

Member
Demicore said:
I've always thought delaying pc releases was a tactic aimed at limiting the effects of piracy, as a great number of people tend to want to play games around the launch date.
Click to expand...

That maybe was case before, but these days almost every multiplatform game is announced for PC and released same day as other version or close to that release. Rockstar still refuses to even announce PC version with other versions.
 
B

Budi

Member
I'm a double dipper, bought the game on launch for PS3. But didn't pay full price for it on PC, got it from sale for 30 bucks I think. Regret that though, I never finished the game on PS3 and I've only played the PC version for 4 hours. =/

Double dipping isn't something that I usually do though. Ofcourse I don't have current gen consoles either, but if I had I wouldn't probably do it.
 
S

Solaire of Astora

Death by black JPN
GhostTrick said:
That remains to be seen.
People keep saying "Double Dippers work. Look at GTAV PC". When in fact, it just show that if GTAV happened earlier on PC, sales on that platform would be higher.
Click to expand...

And sales overall would be lower... Hence, double dippers work. Unless you're going to argue that people would buy it for a console and pc if they released at the same time.

.
 
S

soqquatto

Member
Sailent said:
I've seen people talking about "double dipping" on Destiny 2. That means buying it on consoles first and then PC.

So yeah... RDR2 might be delayed on PC because of people like this. To maximize sales.
Click to expand...

I'd like to see numbers on people "double dipping", I'm not so sure it's so widespread. you'll do much more money with microtransactions rather than intentionally delaying a version to promote buying your product twice
 
Phoenix RISING

Phoenix RISING

Banned
throwawayname said:
I bought GTA V 3 times!
Click to expand...

You are part of the problem.

Going to buy another copy to ensure that GTA V appears on next month's NPD?

GTA has been traditionally ported over to PC. Such a precedent has not been set for Red Dead Redemption. I don't think there's any guarantee that RDR2 would come to PC.
 
Q

Qassim

Member
Carlius said:
ya... no way theres even 500k sales through the rockstar store. all revenue comes from steam.
Click to expand...

The only way to get the Steam version of the game was to buy it directly through Steam, which was often the most expensive option. All physical and other digital copies of the game were handled directly by Rockstar Social Club. This isn't like other games where you could buy Steam keys for the game from elsewhere.

At launch if you looked around on any kind of social site (forums/twitter/facebook/reddit/etc), there were huge amounts of people who didn't have the Steam version. I'd say it's a fairly safe assumption that there was a lot more than 500,000 copies of the game sold outside of Steam.

Games like The Witcher 3 initially sold more outside of Steam, ,it has almost definitely sold way more on Steam since, but people underestimate how much people are willing to give up Steam if it means getting it for cheaper (or with other perks).
 
E

elyetis

Member
Probably the result of
1/ good old fear of piracy
2/ double dipping
3/ not changing their workflow

People don't like changes, so they probably justify 3 with 1 & 2 even in the face of most publisher transitioning to simultaneous console & PC release.

Carlius said:
ya... no way theres even 500k sales through the rockstar store. all revenue comes from steam.
Click to expand...
It's one of the few games I don't have a steam version of, and I know it's true for my friends too, I can't remember it but my guess is you could get it at a lower price at release from the rockstar store which would explain it. So I wouldn't underestimate the game sales outside of steam.
 
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