Obama's FDA? =p
And it could be solved if the government was in charge of buying it, and distribute it at cost - wouldn't it? Heck, wouldn't that be the best solution for the wellbeing of the American public?
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Scorpion Antivenom: Greatest Healthcare System in the World: $40,000. Mexico: $100
- Thread starter CharlieDigital
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Obama's FDA? =p
And it could be solved if the government was in charge of buying it, and distribute it at cost - wouldn't it? Heck, wouldn't that be the best solution for the wellbeing of the American public?
CharlieDigital
Banned
Because you didn't read the article?
See, the markup to $3750 at distribution is completely reasonable to me -- I write enterprise software for the life sciences space (for several years now, working with companies like Pfizer, Roche, Genetech, Novo Nordisk, Bayer, etc.) and have a decent understanding of the business and costs (after all, our software products are designed to help reduce these costs to bring compounds to market). I can fathom those costs from the manufacturer and distributor. I could even fathom the hospital charging $5000 per dose to cover shipping, storage, administration, and other fees. But $40,000 is just fucking insanity.
Meus Renaissance
Member
But why? This cant simply be a case of profiteering
Funky Papa
FUNK-Y-PPA-4
Scorpion stings are pretty rare. Apparently they get 300-400 cases like this per year. There isn't a lot of money in this.
CharlieDigital
Banned
Jarmel Co: Scorpion Breeder, Anti-Venom Distributor
Bulbo Urethral Baggins
Banned
Had to throw that in there.
Who decides the cost? How many times do you need to hear about a $25,000 hammer or a $5,000 toilet seat to realize that when companies deal with government directly, costs tend to increase.
robertsan21
Member
Americans who do not want to let everyone have healthcare is according to me really fucking selfish and are the cause of why this world is so fucked up.
we need to start helping others out, be better at taking care of our planet and stop being so fucking greedy. aaaah I am bailing out on this thread as it just pisses me off so much that we still have so backwards thinking people.
we need to start helping others out, be better at taking care of our planet and stop being so fucking greedy. aaaah I am bailing out on this thread as it just pisses me off so much that we still have so backwards thinking people.
That's just too cheap for them. Genuine dinosaur eggs is where it's at.
CharlieDigital
Banned
LMAO. Did you READ the fucking article?
The woman had private healthcare insurance via Humana.
You really think this is the only area where medical supplies are marked up this high?
So among all governments of the developed world, ours is uniquely unable to efficiently run a healthcare system? You're saying that government fraud and waste in a hypothetical United States UHC system would be an order of magnitude worse than it is in Mexico?
soul creator
Member
time for her to sell some meth
CharlieDigital
Banned
There isn't even a point in address his point seriously because as the article details, the woman had private health insurance via Humana; it's not a case of the government regulating the market, it's a case of the government not regulating the market.
Technosteve
Banned
at this point would it be cheaper to tell them to fuck off and just pay the lawyers fraction of that price.
TheNatural
My Member!
Once I went for an eye exam. Optometrist was like "well you have a lash here in your eye growing inwards let me get that out for you." I didn't think anything of it, I was already on the chin thing and I think he even had an intern or something to do it. It took literally like 20 seconds.
I get a bill for "epilation" or some other similar fancy term for "we plucked an eyelash out" and it was like 80 fucking dollars! I called and bitched them out and all they had to say was "well its the same price anywhere." Didn't pay it, don't give a fuck.
The problem is, any doctor or hospital anywhere can charge whatever they want for fucking ANYTHING with no checks and balances. The bullshit about "well its a premium for people not paying their bill" is bullshit. It's like going to a Best Buy or Gamestop or something, buying a game, and then seeing on your credit card they charged you $180 for it because their profits were down that week due to slow sales.
It's not individuals jobs to make up your costs for running your business shitty.
Bulbo Urethral Baggins
Banned
I was replying to the suggestion that the government buy the antivenom from the company directly and distribute it at cost to those in need.
Freezie KO
Banned
This is ridiculous. We need universal healthcare already.
But the FDA is also bullshit. As are prescription requirements for that matter. If I want to buy a drug that's been working for ten years in Europe but held up by the FDA, I should be allowed to. And if I've been taking a medicine for ten years, I really shouldn't still need to pay for a doctor's visit to get a prescription every three months.
But the FDA is also bullshit. As are prescription requirements for that matter. If I want to buy a drug that's been working for ten years in Europe but held up by the FDA, I should be allowed to. And if I've been taking a medicine for ten years, I really shouldn't still need to pay for a doctor's visit to get a prescription every three months.
CharlieDigital
Banned
You seriously do not understand the issue here.
The wholesale price by the manufacturer and distributor is $3750.
The hospital, a private enterprise, charges $40,000.
One of these price points is reasonable. One of these is not.
How is this a failure due to regulations? If anything, it calls for more regulation to control these ridiculous practices.
Buba Big Guns
Banned
My friend was telling me a few days ago how his dad's heart transplant would have cost $1.3 million in the US....
I understand your perspective but in fairness - you do pay for it. It's paid via taxation. In the USA we can't do that. We have a gigantic military and espionage machine that we have to pay for. I mean how can we afford to develop all of those drones and weapons to blow people up half a world away if we're frittering away all of our tax dollars on silly things like health care?
TheNatural
My Member!
But don't worry though. You're totally allowed to buy vials of sugar pills and distilled water for $10-$30 a pop under the guise of the name Homeopathy.
Gotta love the FDA. A handful of jacked out bodybuilders pass away because they used one supplement with 50 others and they take that one off the market but hey, feel free to waste your money on voodoo.
Why they do what they do is anyone's guess. It a;; depends on which special interest group is funneling them more money than anything actual safety proven.
Just terrible.
Healtcare is almost free* where I live. You pay a one time fee for each hospital visit and procedure, the equivalent to $22, or a maximum of $163 for 1 year with unlimited procedures. The maximum amount you pay for medicine, $327 for 1 year.
I removed my gallbladder 10 years ago and last year I hade surgery on my leg (anterior cruciate ligament). All this for mere $49, including prescription painkiller.
I wonder how much I would have to pay if I lived in the US?
*~31% income tax
Healtcare is almost free* where I live. You pay a one time fee for each hospital visit and procedure, the equivalent to $22, or a maximum of $163 for 1 year with unlimited procedures. The maximum amount you pay for medicine, $327 for 1 year.
I removed my gallbladder 10 years ago and last year I hade surgery on my leg (anterior cruciate ligament). All this for mere $49, including prescription painkiller.
I wonder how much I would have to pay if I lived in the US?
*~31% income tax
Fuck it, I'd pay that. You probably have subsidized higher education and good public transportation as well.
TheNatural
My Member!
Where do you live.
EdgecrusherLSU
Neo Member
I agree. This kills me. Especially when they say that they bill without expecting patients to pay the full amount.
So either I do the right thing and dutifully pay an outrageous amount which will force me to sacrifice other things in my life.
Or I join thousands of other people in debt for a lifetime with a vague number that may or may not have to be paid off or may be settled for significantly less later on.
I'd simply point to the many other countries that seem to have absolutely no problem with inflated health care costs, and are government run or heavily regulated by government (ie, Japan). I'd also point out that by nature, health care as a commodity is different than any other because many times, you're -forced- to conduct business with a group because of the situation (usually, an emergency) - thus, they have much more leeway in setting costs, and can more easily abuse said system than some non-essential private service like... dog grooming. I doubt you need to groom your dog so badly that you'd just go to the nearest dog groomer, you could shop around pretty easily that way.
I'd say if anything deserves to be treated as an essential service that should be run by the government ala firefighting/police, it would be health care.
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
This should be less about the overall health care in US and more about the corrupt practices of this one hospital
And obamacare would do nothing to prevent this from happening - the lady had insurance and this hospital was out of her network -
The hospital should have to answer for this type of corruption
And obamacare would do nothing to prevent this from happening - the lady had insurance and this hospital was out of her network -
The hospital should have to answer for this type of corruption
Messypandas
Member
I'll take another 1000 years please
Bulbo Urethral Baggins
Banned
I understand that, but we are talking about two different issues now.
I'm trying to ask the question as to how a "fair" price gets decided for sole-source drugs if they are being bought exclusively by the U.S. government?
Do you think the government should control all drug design and development?
This January I had a 3-hour visit to the ER due to food poisoning, they only did a couple of blood tests and a CT scan and then I got discharged telling me I was fine, they did not treat any of my symptoms and I had to vomit it all out the next day, a few weeks later a lovely 10,000 dollar bill came home from the hospital, plus another 1,000 from the labs and the scan, so I'm not a stranger to these situations, seriously, fuck healthcare in this country
Messypandas
Member
I picked up some ball cream the other day and was surprised when the vendor told me the cost of the cream is £75 to the NHS when of course I only pay £7.50 everytime. They then said if I go to my local gum clinic I get it for free (kisses the NHS)
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the physicians aren't the ones setting the prices.
Want to know some funny stuff? YOU CAN BUY THIS IN ANY (almost) Pharmacy, drugstore/whatever you call it for $863.00 PESOS (That's $65.42 USD) aprox.
Also, you can get a discount if you buy it in bulk http://www.la-boticaria.com/alacramyn-suero-antialacran.html
Also, you can get a discount if you buy it in bulk http://www.la-boticaria.com/alacramyn-suero-antialacran.html
Take the cost of development, add in a reasonable markup to give investors a return, and you're done.
I doubt the Mexican producers and USA shipping workers are seeing much of that extra $82900.
Personally? Yeah - but specifically control - not necessarily fund. I think that sinking millions into RD for the sole purpose of making billions is counter productive - even if you're more likely to get more people working in drug design/development. It leads to situations like these, it leads to the most effective drugs being the most expensive drugs (at least for a few years) and it simply adds to the corruption.
I think a system where the government regulates drug research development, or at least drug sales, would be ideal.
Jibbajabbawockky
Member
Great. Then don't go complaining or running to a lawyer when you end up having some adverse effect from your medication that you got from some other country or end up having some interaction or adverse effect when you get your med without a new Rx.
Phoenician_Viking
Banned
This is ridiculous. I really hope that Obama wins the election and majority in congress so he can make some radical changes.
Hell yeah. Paying no money FTW. Yeah, i know taxes blah blah.
Hell yeah. Paying no money FTW. Yeah, i know taxes blah blah.
Bulbo Urethral Baggins
Banned
Wouldn't it make sense just to get rid of all scorpions?
Freezie KO
Banned
That's an easy deal to make, considering I order all my medication illegally from overseas anyway and haven't had a problem for 6 years running.
The US healthcare system is dumb on every level. The FDA should just have an advisory stamp on drugs, not the ability for a full legal ban on the substance. I can't sue someone if I drink poison, so what I chose to put in my body should be my issue.
Perspicacity
Banned
I'm fairly certain they also live in the badlands area of Alberta along the Red Deer river. But I contrast that with my parents who live in Arizona and seasonally need to get their home "scorpion-proofed" and feel a whole lot safer.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
It hasn't dropped below 70 fahrenheit in the last month and a half where I live, and most days are 80+. Currently 74 temperature, 81 with humidex. *shrugs* Time to sit my deck and drink some bagged milk.
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