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A Three Year Struggle: Advance Wars

N

NipplesAndToes23

Member
advancewars.png


So, I started Advance Wars back in the spring of 2012. It's the second game I played on an emulator and the first game I played that's exclusive to the system. It is also my very first strategy game so this is very much an experience for me. My first attempt at this game I was a little overwhelmed about the amount of stuff that involves the gameplay when I went into the tutorials, but that didn't put me off. After getting through the long ass field training and got my traction into the campaign I was finally able to see the true meat of the game. This is a fucking hard game. The first few missions ranged from easy to somewhere in the middle, but once you get to the center of the game, shit gets real.

I don't remember which map or mission it was, but I initially gave up on the game back then at a mission that involved fog, naval, and air forces. I tried many times to beat it, but I never could. I tried again the summer of the following year to find out that the save file was gone on the computer I last played it on. It took me a while, but I did decide to start another file, but I got frustrated early on, probably because I didn't bother to do the field training again and quit once again.

Finally this year, I decided to start this one last time. I went back and did a couple of the field training segments this time, which helped, but since I didn't do all of them made it a little harder on me. I forgot that cruisers can't attack other vessels except for submarines and that they can hit dirigibles. I still hit a couple of walls though. I cheated a little bit and watched someone's let's play on a map to get a S rank and watched help to beat the Enigma map with Sami, but fortunately or unfortunately Sturm reacted differently to me vs that Youtuber's vid so I had to come up with my own strategy after the third move and it felt great when I finally managed to beat him by bombing him to death. That's the good thing with this game. When you're presented a challenge it gives it to you and when you finally conquer it, it feels great.

Now, I am at the final battle of the game or what I really, really hope is the final battle. I have access to three armies with three different CO's with their own powers, but I still feel like I'm at a disadvantage. I really need some help here. Sturm is one bad motherfucker. He already starts out with an air fleet, several anti-air guns, MD Tanks, regular tanks, and an airport. The only advantage I have in terms of fleet are anti-air missiles, rockets, and Artillery units. It seems like no matter what strategy I use he manages to fuck me over. Meteor Strike is a cheap ass power and I can't predict how he uses it because each time he uses it he picks a different army or spot to target. I've been trying to beat this for about four days now and I don't want to cheat and watch someone else's vid, because I already said that it looks like he acts randomly according to the usage of his power and I feel like I wouldn't have earned it, but general advice I'll take.


When I do finally beat this game I'm not sure if I'll ever play it again, because it gets too frustrating and maps can take forever to finish when it involves bases.
 
B

butalala

Member
I think one way to deal with Sturm's power is to trick his AI by having a 3 x 3 square of infantry somewhere out of the way. It should target that instead of your useful units. I could be talking nonsense though, I haven't played this game since 2002.

You're absolutely right about the triumphant feeling about beating challenging strategy game levels. I've been getting the same feels from Fire Emblem lately. You should try those games out too, they're an interesting take on the AW formula.
 
N

not sure

Neo Member
Sturm's Meteor targets the location it can do the most damage value wise. The best thing to do against him is to split up your higher value units, and lump your cheaper units together, the turn before he will have a full CO bar, since he seems to always cast it the turn he gets it.
 
W

wicko

Member
You might be in a rough spot depending on who you have for the last mission.. I think I ended up with the hardest combination. Can't remember who I had exactly, but Sami was definitely one of them (on Advance Campaign no less).

I think he will target bigger groups of units like mentioned above, so if you can, toss some cheap units in a 3x3 area and hope for the best. I don't remember the exact unit composition since advance campaign version is different, but prioritize any bombers if possible. I don't think he uses very many artillery units but his direct combat units are tougher than normal.
 
V

Vagabundo

Member
I need to buy this on the Wii U VC. I played a lot of Advance Wars 2 - I think - on the DS. It could be hard as fuck sometimes.
 
N

NipplesAndToes23

Member
wicko said:
You might be in a rough spot depending on who you have for the last mission.. I think I ended up with the hardest combination. Can't remember who I had exactly, but Sami was definitely one of them (on Advance Campaign no less).

I think he will target bigger groups of units like mentioned above, so if you can, toss some cheap units in a 3x3 area and hope for the best. I don't remember the exact unit composition since advance campaign version is different, but prioritize any bombers if possible. I don't think he uses very many artillery units but his direct combat units are tougher than normal.
Click to expand...

Oh good, this is definitely the last mission?

I didn't know the three CO's could be different. I have Grit, Andy, and Sami. I feel like Eagle would make things a lot easier. What do you all mean by 3x3 area? 3 squares by 3 squares?
 
F

fredrancour

Member
I remember being told as a kid (In a magazine) that baiting the meteor strikes was possible by clumping an APC and some other crap in one spot, that Sturm had a thing for crushing APCs. I've never made it to the last mission of the first game to try it out though.


I can't remember if I beat AW2 either. I know I beat both DS games though.

I miss this series so much. Good luck with the last level.
 
B

butalala

Member
I think it's the last mission. There might be some kind of bonus post-game stuff, but if I remember right, the credits roll after you finish the game.

3 x 3 square means 9 grid places, three long by three tall, like this:

XXX
XXX
XXX
 
W

wicko

Member
Blasian Persuasion said:
Oh good, this is definitely the last mission?

I didn't know the three CO's could be different. I have Grit, Andy, and Sami. I feel like Eagle would make things a lot easier. What do you all mean by 3x3 area? 3 squares by 3 squares?
Click to expand...

Yeah, 3 squares by 3 squares. Sami choice is rough and Grit is kind of painful too, not much will stand toe to toe with Sturm's units in your selection there. I think you always get Andy center though. Eagle would definitely be helpful. I think the CO selection is based on who you use for certain missions. If Andy is getting overrun, it might help to send some units from your left CO (Hopefully it is Grit) behind Andy's base, to back him up. Sturm usually focuses more heavily on the center so Andy could probably use the help. Be careful not to group the units too much while sending help to Andy otherwise they'll be targeted by the meteor.

I think you gain access to the Advance Campaign for completing this. If you thought the regular campaign was hard, well I've got news for you.. I haven't actually been able to beat the final mission because of my CO composition. I think I was trying to unlock specific COs and it left me in this situation.. I don't think I could handle starting over so I may just look for a guide if I still can't do it.

butalala said:
Colm Meaney avatar convention in here.
Click to expand...

Haha, sure is.
 
N

not sure

Neo Member
Sturm isn't the last mission in AW1. There is a secret level afterwards where Andy duels Eagle. I forget how you unlock it though.
 
A

AzureTranquility95

Banned
Heh, I went through a similar struggle when I got AW1 in 2010. Didn't beat it until 2014.

I just sucked it up and used a walkthrough until I was confident in using my own strategies. Worked like a charm.
 
K

kittens

Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, the game is hard as nails. I almost always give up on the last mission of AW games, lol.
 
W

wicko

Member
Blasian Persuasion said:
He didn't take the bait.
Click to expand...

That bastard..

Well, all I can suggest is have Sami build infantry and ranged units since her ranged stats aren't reduced like direct combat, and the same for Grit. Bring Grit's units behind Andy's to protect them and shell the shit out units in combat with Andy. I think initially your goal with Andy will be to just survive as long as you can while the ranged units take care of the damage. Infantry will be shredded by those AA tanks, but you could experiment with buying cheap units just to create a barrier until Grit units arrive.

Sami's infantry could cross the mountain to help with Andy's defense. I think it will buy you some time, anyway.

This might help: http://awrevival.netfirms.com/ac/gas/gas.htm

It's for the advance campaign, so it might be overkill to follow this directly. However it might give you some helpful hints.
 
K

Koren

Member
It has been a while... (but that makes me want to play the original game again ^_^ )


If I remember correctly, the meteor indeed aim for maximum damage (in value). You can definitively manipulate it, although it'll always be costly. Try to space valuable units as much as possible when meteor is coming, and make a cluster of lesser units that'll serve as bait.

But if I'm not mistaken, you can do a 13-units cluster like this:

__X__
_XXX_
XXXXX
_XXX_
__X__


Air superiority is really useful in this map IIRC. Blocking the bridges a must. Sitting over enemy airports / factories can help, too.


There's also several bugs in AW AI that you can exploit. For example, the AI has a REALLY high priority against APC, even empty ones (it's completely stupid at times). Try it, it's efficient. You can even protect air units by using an APC as decoy (if a single enemy unit can attack the APC, it'll most probably do this, ignoring all other far more valuable units).


About CO power, there's a thing you should do: pay attention to how your opponent CO Power fills. Stop attacking by ending your turn just before it's full, and launch a big attack the next turn (using your own CO Power on this turn if possible). The CO Power activate when you've deal a fixed amount of damage to the enemy, but when the jauge is full, the damages aren't added anymore. You should also try to do as much damage as possible when your enemy CO is active, since it won't count towards CO filling.

By doing this, you can greatly reduce the number of CO Power you'll face. And better, the CO Power will activate when the enemy army is at its lowest. It's really handy.


There's also an interesting trick that works in all games: money is a key part of the game. At first, you'll probably want to produce many cheap units, but by doing so, you can't buy more expensive and powerful units later. Except that... try to produce units in pairs at least, and have one slightly damaged (e.g. 9HP). Buy joining them, you'll technically loose the 9HP unit (and keep the 10HP one), but *get back 90% of the price of the unit*.

It can make the difference and allow you to buy an Md Tank or a bomber, and getting them 1 turn earlier can be the difference between life and death.

It's also useful since the game play "rock paper scissors" with delay: produce something, the computer will produce the counter-measure. But if you can get back half of your spent money and produce something else, the computer will have produced counter-measure that are far less useful... and he's not able to get the money back.

wicko said:
You might be in a rough spot depending on who you have for the last mission.. I think I ended up with the hardest combination. Can't remember who I had exactly, but Sami was definitely one of them (on Advance Campaign no less).
Click to expand...
I could be wrong, but Sami can be awfully strong in most (all?) advance war games, and I'm pretty sure that it was no different in this mission. The fact that a 10HP infantry can capture in two turn even if it lose 7HP between both turns is really handy. Granted, you need good APC handling if you don't want to lose too much time, but still...

(and I think I've finished the advance campaing with all COs and many different compositions, I don't think there's one that make the mission impossible)
 
W

wicko

Member
Koren said:
I could be wrong, but Sami can be awfully strong in most (all?) advance war games, and I'm pretty sure that it was no different in this mission. The fact that a 10HP infantry can capture in two turn even if it lose 7HP between both turns is really handy. Granted, you need good APC handling if you don't want to lose too much time, but still...

(and I think I've finished the advance campaing with all COs and many different compositions, I don't think there's one that make the mission impossible)
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say impossible, but probably the most difficult to use. The problem with Sami in that mission in AC is that it's difficult to get her units into the enemy base due to all the bombers and heavy tanks. Even if you do get past them, they aren't helping Andy out and he'll get wiped out. I also had Grit with me, so I'd basically lose every direct combat fight thanks to Sturm's bonuses. You also have to go through mountains to reach Sturm's base, because the ground route is bottlenecked and full of units.

I didn't know about that APC trick, I might employ that just to buy time.
 
V

Virdix

Member
Its been so long since I played the first Advanced Wars, i dont remeber if i ever beat the last level or not. I do remember playing against my brother as a kid during long car rides. What a game.
 
Dr. Buni

Dr. Buni

Member
This game is hard as hell. I think I am still on Mission 8 or something and I started playing it years ago.

Years ago.

It is even harder for me because I like playing with Sami :c
 
K

Koren

Member
wicko said:
I wouldn't say impossible, but probably the most difficult to use. The problem with Sami in that mission in AC is that it's difficult to get her units into the enemy base due to all the bombers and heavy tanks. Even if you do get past them, they aren't helping Andy out and he'll get wiped out.
Click to expand...
You can more easily send mechs through the mountains, though, both to help Andy and attach sturm. The main issue is probably the bombers, Grit's A-Air missile launchers are probably useful for cover with their improved range if he's available.

Besides, since Sami don't need much money later if you just want to use her capture power, you can let Andy get some properties in her area...

wicko said:
I didn't know about that APC trick, I might employ that just to buy time.
Click to expand...
It's patched in the other games, but in AW1, it... feels like cheating, really. It's insanely useful in advance campaign, even if it's a cheap tactic.

Reila said:
This game is hard as hell. I think I am still on Mission 8 or something and I started playing it years ago.
Click to expand...
With training, the game is more and more easy. That's good news, because the advance campaign (think hard mode) is indeed challenging. It's closely linked to the details of the games, though, I can't play the last Advance Wars nearly as well, since they changed many things in units and especially in CO Power mechanics (and as a consequence, I don't like it nearly as much: yes, CO Powers are really efficient in the first three Advance Wars games, and who trigger it best win the battle, but that prevent the battles from being tedious).

Reila said:
It is even harder for me because I like playing with Sami :c
Click to expand...
If you're playing with Sami, you have to use very specific tactics. Use the capture bonus and the motion bonus to quickly get a money advantage over the enemy, especially by controlling more of the contested properties than with other COs (remember, the properties you have to capture in the early game are usually the ones in the middle of the field, not the closest ones or in the opposite side of the enemy).

Then simply produce a LOT of infantry/mechs. Yes, their attack is lower, but the opponent can't attack all of them each turn, and you can yourself attack enemies units several times.

The usual best way to win is suprise capture of the enemy HQ, though. It's not as efficient in the first GBA game as it is in the subsequent ones (Victory March is insanely effective with 1-turn capture and larger range), but still really efficient. I wouldn't like to play Sami against an human (put an anti-infantry unit on the HQ and you're set) but the computer makes a lot of errors against Sami because she works differently from other COs.
 
S

Shuggananas

Banned
Hard as fuck game but so satisfying.
The last mission is a marathon. Don't give up, and you should do fine. Don't rush either. Just tank that shit up, and win in the long term. Sami + grit ain't great tho

You need to play 2 and dual strike afterwards. Wonderful games. I don't remember 2 very well though.
 
O

OrbitalBeard

Member
I finished AW last year for the first time and the final mission is probably the most challenging single level in any game I have ever played.

I believe my successful playthrough of this one stage took me close to two hours to complete and that was after dozens of futile attempts and many, MANY hours of frustration. Like a poster above said, it is definitely a marathon and you have to make and sacrifice an insane amount of units in order to prevail.

I remember the point I realized I was probably going to FINALLY complete the mission and it still took me another 45 minutes to do so lol

Overall though, AW1 is amazing! I really hope Nintendo puts AW2 on the Wii U eShop at some point this year.
 
Dr. Buni

Dr. Buni

Member
Koren said:
With training, the game is more and more easy. That's good news, because the advance campaign (think hard mode) is indeed challenging. It's closely linked to the details of the games, though, I can't play the last Advance Wars nearly as well, since they changed many things in units and especially in CO Power mechanics (and as a consequence, I don't like it nearly as much: yes, CO Powers are really efficient in the first three Advance Wars games, and who trigger it best win the battle, but that prevent the battles from being tedious).


If you're playing with Sami, you have to use very specific tactics. Use the capture bonus and the motion bonus to quickly get a money advantage over the enemy, especially by controlling more of the contested properties than with other COs (remember, the properties you have to capture in the early game are usually the ones in the middle of the field, not the closest ones or in the opposite side of the enemy).

Then simply produce a LOT of infantry/mechs. Yes, their attack is lower, but the opponent can't attack all of them each turn, and you can yourself attack enemies units several times.

The usual best way to win is suprise capture of the enemy HQ, though. It's not as efficient in the first GBA game as it is in the subsequent ones (Victory March is insanely effective with 1-turn capture and larger range), but still really efficient. I wouldn't like to play Sami against an human (put an anti-infantry unit on the HQ and you're set) but the computer makes a lot of errors against Sami because she works differently from other COs.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the tips, I will give the mission another try later. The mission I am stuck is the "Mighty Kanbei!" one, I think.
 
S

Spinosaurus

Member
Grit/Andy/Sami is the combination I got and it's probably the worst for the final mission. Beating it was so satisfying.

FUCK AW2's final mission tho. Still never beat it.
 
wondermega

wondermega

Member
Man what year did this come out, like 2001? I casually picked it up and couldn't stop until I won. Checked out AW2 maybe 3 yrs ago and got maybe a bit more than halfway thru before throwing my arms up in frustration. Such a perfectly designed game though, I'll probably just bite the bullet & start over.
Obligatory wish for a 3DS version..
 
K

Koren

Member
Reila said:
Thanks for the tips, I will give the mission another try later. The mission I am stuck is the "Mighty Kanbei!" one, I think.
Click to expand...
If that's the one with two bridges, since the enemy hasn't any factories, you just need to let him die against your defenses... Block the bridges, but don't go to the other side as long as the enemy is still strong. The south bridge can most of the time even be defended by mechs in the town. The eastern one is usually defended by the Md (but don't try to attack with it)

Your first priority is its long-range units, since when they're destroyed, your units will be attacked by only one enemy unit at a time. Retreat if one of your units is in a range of a strong long-range enemy unit. You can use the APC trick as a long-range decoy if needed.

Once the long-range units are destroyed, it's a wait game. Use your own long-range to destroy the enemy units. But DON'T reduce them to 0, especially the units in front of your unit blocking the bridge.


You probably won't be able to use many Sami tricks there, though (except maybe by luring all the units on the eastern bridges, quickly killing southern units, sniding an APC with a mech there, and doing an HQ rush from south, but I'd say it would be more difficult than "normal" method.

But Sami mechs can probably hold the southern bridge pretty well from the town.
 
K

Koren

Member
wondermega said:
Man what year did this come out, like 2001?
Click to expand...
Indeed, there were rumors of retiring/not releasing the game following the 9-11 (that made me import the game at this time because I was already fond of the old SNES game).

wondermega said:
Obligatory wish for a 3DS version..
Click to expand...
I'm ambivalent about this... I love AW, AW2 and Dual Strike, but I don't like Dawn of Sorrow nearly as much. I'd rather have a remake of the GBA games, with a war room including all COs and an online sharing system for maps (or better, scenarios).
 
Doczu

Doczu

Member
Koren said:
I'm ambivalent about this... I love AW, AW2 and Dual Strike, but I don't like Dawn of Sorrow nearly as much. I'd rather have a remake of the GBA games, with a war room including all COs and an online sharing system for maps (or better, scenarios).
Click to expand...

Days of Ruin (not Dawn of Sorrow :p ) was great in balancing the game after the clusterfuck (although in a fun way) that Dual Strike was. The tag attack mechanic was highly overpowered and almost always resulted in a retaliation tag attack by the CPU (due to the insane amount of damage that could be dealt). Too much reliance on CO powers, almost no tactics were needed to win (just brute force your way through the game).

The best thing of Dual Strike was implementing the fog of war for the CPU. No more cheating and bombing everything with artilery...
 
Dr. Buni

Dr. Buni

Member
I'd rather not have a new Advance Wars. Int Systems already ruined Fire Emblem with Awakening, so I'd rather not have to deal with a new Advance Wars having waifu crap shoved into it.
Koren said:
If that's the one with two bridges, since the enemy hasn't any factories, you just need to let him die against your defenses... Block the bridges, but don't go to the other side as long as the enemy is still strong. The south bridge can most of the time even be defended by mechs in the town. The eastern one is usually defended by the Md (but don't try to attack with it)

Your first priority is its long-range units, since when they're destroyed, your units will be attacked by only one enemy unit at a time. Retreat if one of your units is in a range of a strong long-range enemy unit. You can use the APC trick as a long-range decoy if needed.

Once the long-range units are destroyed, it's a wait game. Use your own long-range to destroy the enemy units. But DON'T reduce them to 0, especially the units in front of your unit blocking the bridge.


You probably won't be able to use many Sami tricks there, though (except maybe by luring all the units on the eastern bridges, quickly killing southern units, sniding an APC with a mech there, and doing an HQ rush from south, but I'd say it would be more difficult than "normal" method.

But Sami mechs can probably hold the southern bridge pretty well from the town.
Click to expand...
That is the one. I try to block the two bridges so the enemy's unit can't get inside my HQ, but it seems like I can't make units quickly enough, the enemy always defeat the ones I have before I get enough new ones. As I said, I will give it another try later today, hopefully I will beat this damn mission finally!
 
D

Dougald

Member
Great thanks OP, now I'm reliving the terror of that last mission

I managed to beat it back in 2002 but hell if I can tell you how. I'm pretty sure it just boiled down to being in school with lots of free time, I'd probably never manage it again today
 
B

bj00rn_

Banned
..This is the one game that I will remember the most from my relatively brief (couple of years) moment with handheld gaming.. Pretty much the only game I miss from that time. I still have my handhelds, but can't be bothered anymore.. but..hmm..emulation..perhaps..
 
P

pete_clarf

Member
Koren said:
Indeed, there were rumors of retiring/not releasing the game following the 9-11 (that made me import the game at this time because I was already fond of the old SNES game).
Click to expand...

The release day was September 11th. I had two jobs at the time. One in telemarketing, one at Gamestop. I had to work at telemarketing that morning and Gamestop that night. I had Advance Wars reserved at work, so was excited to pick it up during work and play it that night.

Well, everything happened while I was at job #1. They let us go home. For some reason, I still wanted to get Advance Wars but, shortly thereafter, they closed the mall. For some reason, I still wanted to get Advance Wars. Toys 'R Us stayed open that day, so I got it there.
I did not play it that day.
 
A

Adam Prime

hates soccer, is Mexican
Dougald said:
Great thanks OP, now I'm reliving the terror of that last mission

I managed to beat it back in 2002 but hell if I can tell you how. I'm pretty sure it just boiled down to being in school with lots of free time, I'd probably never manage it again today
Click to expand...

Would it be easier to beat it today on WiiU with save states?
 
A

AzureTranquility95

Banned
Reila said:
This game is hard as hell. I think I am still on Mission 8 or something and I started playing it years ago.

Years ago.

It is even harder for me because I like playing with Sami :c
Click to expand...

As far as AW1 goes, Sami tends to be hard mode, Max is easy mode, and Andy is normal mode. This isn't always true, just usually.
 
S

Shuggananas

Banned
AzureTranquility95 said:
As far as AW1 goes, Sami tends to be hard mode, Max is easy mode, and Andy is normal mode. This isn't always true, just usually.
Click to expand...

Yeah, indirect units are a bit too weak for casuals imo, they should have made them able to fire after moving but for only half damage, they would have been more attractive this way
 
A

Adam Prime

hates soccer, is Mexican
Doczu said:
Well you can still save the game every turn. There is no real need for a save state in this title.
Click to expand...

Oh, I didn't know if you could load back. I thought it was more of a "suspend state" where after you save they kick you back to the title.
 
F

FutureZombie

Banned
I don't want to completely derail the thread, but how exactly is it okay to play this game on an emulator when you don't own the game? In what way is that not piracy?
 
P

PSqueak

Banned
Spinosaurus said:
Grit/Andy/Sami is the combination I got and it's probably the worst for the final mission. Beating it was so satisfying.

FUCK AW2's final mission tho. Still never beat it.
Click to expand...

What? That mission is way easier than the one in AW, just have a heavy hitter in the middle (Max or Kanbei) whose only mission is survive, Eagle in either side, and whoeveer you want for the last guy (i always go Grit) and you'll do fine.

As soon as the side guys sneak into the sides of the base you'll turn the tides in the middle.
 
C

cakely

Member
Loved this game but I beat it too long ago to offer any real help. I do remember you could "bait" the meteor strike with a pile of units in a very predictable fashion but I don't remember the exact details.

I ended up getting an "S" ranking on every single mission in both the normal and "advance" campaign.
 
R

REDSLATE

Member
Played a bit of Days of Ruin years ago. Got stuck on a rather difficult mission and never completed it. Solid game though: Good Campaign, fun multiplayer (net, local, or hotswap), and a map editor. I also liked its darker tone.

If you like portable strategy games, try Warhammer 40k: Squad Command. It's quite a challenge and a great 40k entry.
 
S

stalker

Member
I beat the game with some help from guides here and there. Not following any guide completely but getting some hints.

Then I started Advanced campaign and soon understood that normal campaign is almost kind of an extended tutorial. One day I will try to do the advanced campaign, that is really difficult.
 
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