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oni-link · Aug 18, 2015

Will contain spoilers for the first 14 hours of the game

I played the first Kingdom Hearts (Via the first HD collection) early in 2014, and I ended up really enjoying it, the combat system was fun, the worlds were nostalgic and well implemented, and the game looked absolutely gorgeous

I tried Chain of Memories, but after the first game found the combat system awkward and didn't have much motivation to play it after the 35 hours it took me to beat the first game, so more or less dropped it after an hour

Jump forward to a few weeks ago and I picked up the 2nd HD collection and jumped into the 2nd game. Well it looks amazing, but wow does it start off poorly. The pacing is atrocious, it's 5 hours of playing as someone else, with no explanation to why. There are cutscenes every few minutes, often giving you control back only for you to walk forward 5 paces just to trigger another cutscene. Then you finally get to Sora and still almost nothing is explained.

I know CoM takes place between 1 and 2, but really it seems like so much happens that is vitally important, and I'm 14 hours in and still almost nothing has been explained. I feel for the poor kids that picked this up after loving the first game and being totally and utterly confused. The first 5 or 6 hours also feature very little from anything Disney other than the flashbacks of the first game, with only Vivi from Final Fantasy making an appearance.

Once you get to Sora it reverts back to the formula of the first game, and as you get fewer cut scenes and more action, the game improves after the poorly paced start

I didn't hate the start, but it will be a chore to ever replay. People often criticise Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword for having long and slow intros, but this is definitely worse.

The last two sections I've played were by far my most and least favourite. The black and white world where Donald, Goofy and Sora have 1940s Disney designs was amazing. From the smoke effects to the sound effects, they were all so well done, as were the enemies. It really felt like you were playing an old Disney short

Then followed the Pirates of the Caribbean level, which was just so out of place and jarring. Seeing realistic characters mixed with cartoons was just bizarre, I'd have preferred they kept it to all Disney cartoons and had a more coherent art style like in the first game. Plus the voice acting for everyone in this area of the game is terrible. The guy voicing Jack Sparrow must give one of the worst voice acting performances in a video game ever

I was also disappointed to see the Gummi ship sections return, though they are better than they were in the first game, but hopefully this is something that is dropped from the third game. Both games look great on PS3, but the Gummi sections look more like something you'd see on an N64

So far I'm enjoying it though, the combat is fun and satisfying, and so is messing with all your skills as you level up. That said so far I think I liked the first game more

I don't know much about Birth By Sleep, which is also on the HD collection, so I may try that after I beat KH2, since it's apparently not like CoM

Please tag any spoilers as I'm only 14 hours in as of this post



Sithlord77 · Aug 18, 2015

I'm actually at the same point as you. I've had it since December and play it on and off. It's ok it's just not as good as it once was. The gameplay is very dated now.

Story is boring and I hate the menu system it's confusing and obtuse.

Onaco · Aug 18, 2015

oni-link said:
I tried Chain of Memories, but after the first game found the combat system awkward and didn't have much motivation to play it after the 35 hours it took me to beat the first game, so more or less dropped it after an hour

Jump forward to a few weeks ago and I picked up the 2nd HD collection and jumped into the 2nd game. Well it looks amazing, but wow does it start off poorly. The pacing is atrocious, it's 5 hours of playing as someone else, with no explanation to why.



Sigh...
Every game is important to the plot, you should play or watch them all to understand this convoluted plot. You skipped one of the most critical games.

mapachealocado · Aug 18, 2015

You should at least watch the 358/2 Days movie that came with 1.5 so you have a better understanding of who Roxas is. Birth by Sleep is great and nothing like CoM (which I agree is not nearly as fun as KH1) so you'll definitely enjoy it. Still, if you want to understand the story, you really need to play all of them.

Napalm_Frank · Aug 18, 2015

oni-link said:
Plus the voice acting for everyone in this area of the game is terrible. The guy voicing Jack Sparrow must give one of the worst voice acting performances in a video game ever

You have no right to single that one out when the game features Mena Suvari's holocaust of a performance as Aeris.

RadioJoNES64 · Aug 18, 2015

I think Kingdom Hearts II is a rather dull experience unless you do a critical mode play through, It's a lot more fun and it's more engaging due to reaction commands being no where near as powerful.

R10Neymarfan · Aug 18, 2015

It's better to play chain of memories before you started kh2. Also I disagree watch or play 358/2 days after you finish his KH2 prologue more impactful

Roldan · Aug 18, 2015

Eh, liked it, but I felt that while the first game harmoniously works (most of) the Disney worlds with its own plot, the second game didn't manage to do the same.

Many worlds are filler, and when you finally get to a cutscene where the (unnecessary convoluted) plot is being developed, you don't remember half of it due to the pacing. Also, things like

ANSEM WASN'T ANSEM THE REAL ANSEM WAS A GOOD GUY

and

Sora/Riku/Kairi reunion

made me facepalm.

After watching 358/2, I was really looking forward to see where the plot was going, but I finished KH2 disappointed.

It's a shame, though. The game is gorgeous and its mechanics are really fun.

(KH fans, don't hate me pls.)

..... · Aug 18, 2015

So you skip a game in the series and wonder why you don't understand the story? What even is this.

Napalm_Frank · Aug 18, 2015

mapachealocado said:
You should at least watch the 358/2 Days movie that came with 1.5 so you have a better understanding of who Roxas is. Birth by Sleep is great and nothing like CoM (which I agree is not nearly as fun as KH1) so you'll definitely enjoy it. Still, if you want to understand the story, you really need to play all of them.

Not doing CoM before KH2 is nothing compared to what I imagine going from KH1 to Days is.

oni-link · Aug 18, 2015

Onaco said:
Sigh...
Every game is important to the plot, you should play or watch them all to understand this convoluted plot. You skipped one of the most critical games.

I looked up the plot so I wasn't lost, and I was aware that 2 didn't directly follow on from 1

That said I don't really want to play 100s of hours of games I'm not that interested in just to understand the story, the wiki was enough to put me on track, and I liked 1, and I'm enjoying 2, but CoM didn't really click with me

It's somewhat bad planning to put so much important plot into a side game, even more so when it was originally on the GBA

Napalm_Frank said:
You have no right to single that one out when the game features Mena Suvari's holocaust of a performance as Aeris.

Haha yeah but she's much less prominent, so far i've had a handful of lines from her, whereas Jack Sparrow is a main character (and party member) for an entire chapter

TheLegendaryDarkKnight said:
So you skip a game in the series and wonder why you don't understand the story? What even is this.

I skipped a side game that played completely differently to the main games and featured mostly reused assets, a game that was a remake of a GBA game. If it was that important they should have called CoM KH2 and KH2 should be KH3, it's confusing because of the naming conventions more than anything, how many other films/games have a "2" that doesn't follow on from "1"

Banana Aeon · Aug 18, 2015

One day, when I get the time, I'm going to create a RTTP of the combat in KH2: Final Mix. It is honestly one of the greatest combat systems I have ever played in my life.

The story is going to be confusing if you skip a title obviously. And you are supposed to be confused by the intro. Think back to how you were supposed to feel during MGS2.

Kinsei · Aug 18, 2015

I'll give you a tip while trying to avoid spoilers as you're reaching a certain part of the game. When it asks you to go back to a certain world make sure you do every other world first. You'll know what I'm talking about when it happens.

QuiteWhittle · Aug 18, 2015

oni-link said:
Jump forward to a few weeks ago and I picked up the 2nd HD collection and jumped into the 2nd game. Well it looks amazing, but wow does it start off poorly. The pacing is atrocious, it's 5 hours of playing as someone else, with no explanation to why. There are cutscenes every few minutes, often giving you control back only for you to walk forward 5 paces just to trigger another cutscene. Then you finally get to Sora and still almost nothing is explained.

I know CoM takes place between 1 and 2, but really it seems like so much happens that is vitally important, and I'm 14 hours in and still almost nothing has been explained. I feel for the poor kids that picked this up after loving the first game and being totally and utterly confused. The first 5 or 6 hours also feature very little from anything Disney other than the flashbacks of the first game, with only Vivi from Final Fantasy making an appearance.


I feel for the people who will inevitably play KH3 without touching the decade or so of handheld "side-stories" in between 2 and 3.

Dad · Aug 18, 2015

TheLegendaryDarkKnight said:
So you skip a game in the series and wonder why you don't understand the story? What even is this.

I'm still putting blame on the devs for shoving so many key plot points into a card based GBA spinoff game of all things.

Falk · Aug 18, 2015

This is kinda belated advice, but if you're dead set on not playing CoM (as in, you're never ever going to play it) you might as well have watched an abridged story/cutscene version of it. There's a bunch on YouTube.

Napalm_Frank · Aug 18, 2015

Dad said:
I'm still putting blame on the devs for shoving so many key plot points into a card based GBA spinoff game of all things.

To be fair portable gaming was big back then and Square wanted desperately to get into the market after the lil falling out with N64. It definately wasn't some crazy idea back then to do a canon game on a gameboy where the card system made total sense. The remake is way more awkward entry point to CoM despite technically being an improvement.

Now, the complete abandoning of home consoles after 2 is another thing entirely.

Arcana Wiz · Aug 18, 2015

QuiteWhittle said:
I feel for the people who will inevitably play KH3 without touching the decade or so of handheld "side-stories" in between 2 and 3.

This. It seems that KH

DD will be the Chain of Memories of KH3... Many people will think it isnt important, but it will continue it's story.

And they have hinted that Birth by Sleep trio will return, right? Expect a lot of people asking themselves why there is 3 random people with keyblades appearing out of nowhere....

Syril · Aug 18, 2015

Banana Aeon said:
One day, when I get the time, I'm going to create a RTTP of the combat in KH2: Final Mix. It is honestly one of the greatest combat systems I have ever played in my life.

Someday I'll play the 2.5 version on the new critical mode they made for it and see what this incredible overhaul to the combat system is. I can only assume that there was some major overhaul because the original KH2 on its hardest difficulty was one of the mashiest games I ever played.

Diggeh · Aug 18, 2015

You shouldn't really skip any of the games, but you can always read the hilarious classic KH series summary to catch up.

Dad · Aug 18, 2015

Napalm_Frank said:
To be fair portable gaming was big back then and Square wanted desperately to get into the market after the lil falling out with N64. It definately wasn't some crazy idea back then to do a canon game on a gameboy where the card system made total sense. The remake is way more awkward entry point to CoM despite technically being an improvement.

Now, the complete abandoning of home consoles after 2 is another thing entirely.

I still think it's silly that CoM introduced so many major plot points that dictated the entire convoluted mess of a story going forwards and managed to make almost everything from the first game irrelevant. I didn't even really understand what was going on in KH2 until years after I played it.

Blood Diamonds · Aug 18, 2015

Arcana Wiz said:
This. It seems that KHDD will be the Chain of Memories of KH3... Many people will think it isnt important, but it will continue it's story.

And they have hinted that Birth by Sleep trio will return, right? Expect a lot of people asking themselves why there is 3 random people with keyblades appearing out of nowhere....

Kingdom Hearts Unchained takes that spot. So many people are going to skip it because "mobile lol!!!" Chi has a crazy story that leads right into KH3

Mauricio_Magus · Aug 18, 2015

Kingdom Hearts 2: Final Mix in Critical Mode difficulty is one of the best game I have ever played, it's so damn good.

Anyways, play them in order if you want to understand the story at all. I didn't understand KH2 at all back in the day and actually understanding what's going on in KH2 makes it pretty great.

Syril said:
Someday I'll play the 2.5 version on the new critical mode they made for it and see what this incredible overhaul to the combat system is. I can only assume that there was some major overhaul because the original KH2 on its hardest difficulty was one of the mashiest games I ever played.

Vanillia KH2 sucked, but FM is just great, you'll see when you play it again.

Reset · Aug 18, 2015

Well you're at fault for being lost since you only played one third of KH1.5. If you couldn't be bothered to play/watch Re:CoM and 300 days you should have read up a summary.

Foffy · Aug 18, 2015

Napalm_Frank said:
To be fair portable gaming was big back then and Square wanted desperately to get into the market after the lil falling out with N64. It definately wasn't some crazy idea back then to do a canon game on a gameboy where the card system made total sense. The remake is way more awkward entry point to CoM despite technically being an improvement.

Now, the complete abandoning of home consoles after 2 is another thing entirely.

Is that not due to the fact that the main Kingdom Hearts team has essentially been stuck with FFXV since Kingdom Hearts II? It would explain why every game since then has either been done by other teams (S-E Osaka) or even outsourced (h.a.n.d., Success).

That's probably one of the reasons they've made so many spin-offs, but for a franchise such as this, the spin-offs are literally mainline entries. For something associated with Disney, that barrier to entry is kind of fucking hilarious to see. They at least solved it with the HD collections as that has six of the eight titles presently available, but up until then it was a fucking mess.

Watch people be totally lost when they reference a smartphone game and a 3DS title for KH III.

Ralemont · Aug 18, 2015

KH2 Gummi Ship is one of the best minigames I've ever played. It fixes everything KH1 Gummi did wrong.

rhandino · Aug 18, 2015

I can't wait for all those people that are going to play Kingdom Hearts III and skip Dream Drop Distance because they think is only a side-game...

Kind of a shame you skipped Chain of Memories OP, for me is one of the best game in the series (It helps that It was the first Kingdom Hearts game I played) and I loved to death the Card Based Combat system but then again, is not for everyone so I also understand that =/

Napalm_Frank · Aug 18, 2015

Ralemont said:
KH2 Gummi Ship is one of the best minigames I've ever played. It fixes everything KH1 Gummi did wrong.

Gummi stuff in KH2 is soooo goood.

Too bad the Donut ruins much of the cool stuff they had going for ;-;

oni-link · Aug 18, 2015

BkzUzi said:
Well you're at fault for being lost since you only played one third of KH1.5. If you couldn't be bothered to play/watch Re:CoM and 300 days you should have read up a summary.

Well I did read a summary before I started 2 because I was aware that the story is a mess and I didn't want to be lost, maybe I didn't make that clear in the OP, I was commenting on how it doesn't explain much, which would be confusing to someone playing 1 then 2

Its the fault of the developers, not the players, for being confused, as the number 2 follows on from the number 1. They should have named the games differently to avoid confusion

Either CoM should have been called KH2, or KH2 should have been called something else, and even if that was the case, it's still odd to throw a vitally important chapter of your games story on a handheld in the form of a card game

That would be like if Sony released a puzzle game sequel to Bloodborne on 3DS with tons of plot and story points and new characters and then put out Bloodborne 2 on PS4 where you were just expected to have played the weird side game to understand anything

StoneFox · Aug 18, 2015

I was a kid that went from 1 directly to 2. It was confusing at first, but after a while the storyline becomes more and more explained, most of the important details from CoM are in the first FMV of KH2 and can be followed along if you watch it closely. After finally watching 358/2, I actually really enjoy the Roxas segment from KH2, except for the day where they try to find the "seven wonders" or whatever, that part is such filler that could have been done in a cutscene.

Dream Drop Distance is very important to the plot going into 3, and it's not in any of the HD collections being a 3DS game and all. They are going to have spend at least fifteen minutes of 3 going over stuff from DDD...

KeyChainDude · Aug 18, 2015

Yeah it will be kinda hard for you to follow the story, but don't worry, the game will still be amazing. Also BBS FM is one of the best entries in the series (the second best in my opinion), so don't worry about it being like CoM either.

That said, I'm really proud of managing to have played every single game in the series. I did crazy things to be able to enjoy the entire story, including buying a 3DS to play DDD alone and experiencing 200h of the DS games on an emulator, but I don't expect casual fans to go through the same hassle just to understand KH3 lol

Inuhanyou · Aug 18, 2015

I didn't originally appreciate COM or RECOM, similar to yourself i turned it off after an hour when i got it so hyped for PS2.

But since, i've had a change of heart. I've played through RECOM in its entirety, and although a majority of the worlds are just the same worlds in KH1, i really like what they tried to do by changing up the battle system a bit to make it fresh. The card battle system is not mashing X like the other games, and although people who want that don't really like it, i think it gives a lot more variety of attack and strategy.

Also yes, COM basically explains everything in between 1 and 2(i liked both riku and sora's stories in RECOM more than any of the other stories in KH), so you'd probably need to experience that to even understand points of 2(also a lot of people dont bother to read the ansem reports, which have tons of info as well)

As for the tutorial of KH2, yeah its annoying, but you'd never really care about Roxas otherwise, if you didn't spend all that time getting to know him and his friends and the town they inhabit

Syril · Aug 18, 2015

Mauricio_Magus said:
Vanillia KH2 sucked, but FM is just great, you'll see when you play it again.

What sort of stuff did they change in it? My main issue with the fighting in original KH2 was that with Sora's new dashing attacks and faster combos, you didn't really have to care about positioning or timing, and the normal enemies were never dangerous enough to make you want to not be incredibly careless.

Galang · Aug 18, 2015

Banana Aeon said:
One day, when I get the time, I'm going to create a RTTP of the combat in KH2: Final Mix. It is honestly one of the greatest combat systems I have ever played in my life.

I personally disliked KH2's combat compared to the first. Does the final mix version make a large difference? I plan to play it eventually, but just curious. I found it very tedious and button mashy

Silent_Ocarina · Aug 18, 2015

I really like the Kingdom Hearts series, but I seriously don't know exactly why. I recently replayed Kingdom Hearts I and II. This is mostly true for I, but every time I made it to a new world, I found myself thinking, "Aww man, I hate this world. I hate Tarzan (Atlantica, Monstro, etc)." Eventually I realized that I kinda didn't really like any world. I wondered why I even kept playing. I liked II a lot more. The combat is really fun to me. It doesn't seem incredibly deep to me, but I'm sure there are finer points that I don't understand. I do like some aspects of the story as well. There's so much I don't like, though, like how every mini game is just garbage, but I just keep coming back for more.

On the subject of voice acting, though, I'm not even that sensitive to bad voice acting, but Aeris is just awful.

cmChimera · Aug 18, 2015

Industry has really changed how we take sequels I see. You now are required to own three consoles play at least 3 games to understand the story of [insert game title here] 2.

EekumBokum · Aug 18, 2015

Mgs3 takes place before 1 and 2, so its not like this is the only series that does not follow the convention of having its sequels continue right after its previous numbered entry.

Anyways, I highly recommend at least reading through summaries for the games you are thinking of skipping. The plot elements are really critical in all of them pretty much.

Napalm_Frank · Aug 18, 2015

It's kinda funny how Peace Walker-MGSV is almost exactly the same situation as CoM and KH2. Ton of people skipping the portable game that laid down a lot of the story used in the ''true sequel''.

With Roxas intro being the Ground Zeroes? :O

Anura · Aug 18, 2015

Silent_Ocarina said:
I really like the Kingdom Hearts series, but I seriously don't know exactly why. I recently replayed Kingdom Hearts I and II. This is mostly true for I, but every time I made it to a new world, I found myself thinking, "Aww man, I hate this world. I hate Tarzan (Atlantica, Monstro, etc)." Eventually I realized that I kinda didn't really like any world. I wondered why I even kept playing. I liked II a lot more. The combat is really fun to me. It doesn't seem incredibly deep to me, but I'm sure there are finer points that I don't understand. I do like some aspects of the story as well. There's so much I don't like, though, like how every mini game is just garbage, but I just keep coming back for more.

On the subject of voice acting, though, I'm not even that sensitive to bad voice acting, but Aeris is just awful.

I had that issue with one. The Disney worlds sucked HARD. Every. Single. One. But, hallow bastion is still one of the best in the series and the end of world is also legit good. The combat basics being X mashing with the occasional cure and aero, it's just not a good combat system.

IMO 2fm improved these two things a lot but the story turned super junky. If three has the combat balance of two and the Disney integration of one it will be perfect.

oni-link · Aug 18, 2015

EekumBokum said:
Mgs3 takes place before 1 and 2, so its not like this is the only series that does not follow the convention of having its sequels continue right after its previous numbered entry.

Anyways, I highly recommend at least reading through summaries for the games you are thinking of skipping. The plot elements are really critical in all of them pretty much.

Yeah, but if you play MGS1, then 2, then 3, you will understand what is going on

If MGS5 makes no sense unless you've played Peace Walker, then yeah that will be similar, but if MGS5 finds a way to catch you up on what happened in Peace Walker then it won't be an issue

KH2 does kind of catch you up a little, but it's not that clear, I could just about follow it based on reading the wiki for CoM and having played all KH1

MulderYuffie · Aug 18, 2015

I hope you like playing KH3 when it comes out and missing out on almost everything from the last 10 years this series has had. Anyways CoM is very important and not a "spin-off" nor is it a side story like Days or Coded. It is by all means a direct sequel and follows directly after KH1. You should really give BBS a try to think of it as KH0 because that is what it basically is and Dream Drop Distance is what you might consider the "CoM" between KH2 and KH3 even though it plays vastly different to CoM and more along the lines of the numbered titles and BBS.

Foffy · Aug 18, 2015

Napalm_Frank said:
It's kinda funny how Peace Walker-MGSV is almost exactly the same situation as CoM and KH2. Ton of people skipping the portable game that laid down a lot of the story used in the ''true sequel''.

With Roxas intro being the Ground Zeroes? :O

Peace Walker was, at one point, literally called Metal Gear Solid 5: Peace Walker in promotional materials.

Kingdom Hearts is one of those franchises where spin-offs are just as important as mainline entries. And as is the case for franchises that pull that shit, it's horseshit, and even Metal Gear doesn't pull it nearly as badly.

Kinsei · Aug 18, 2015

rhandino said:
I can't wait for all those people that are going to play Kingdom Hearts III and skip Dream Drop Distance because they think is only a side-game...

Kind of a shame you skipped Chain of Memories OP, for me is one of the best game in the series (It helps that It was the first Kingdom Hearts game I played) and I loved to death the Card Based Combat system but then again, is not for everyone so I also understand that =/

Birth by Sleep, Days (You know that character is going to show up), and Unchained X too.

The KH3 OT will certainly be something.

BasilZero · Aug 18, 2015

I just finished KH2 Final Mix HD yesterday on PS3.

Before that in the last 1-2 months I finished KH1 Final Mix HD, Re:COM HD, and 358/2 days movie.

Started on BBS today and will watch Re:Coded and play KH3D (which I already have) afterwards.

I already played KH1, Chain of Memories/Re:Chain of memories, KH2, BBS, 358/2 days and Re:Coded a few times in the past few years.

Cant wait for KH3

!

WhateverItTakes · Aug 18, 2015

Kinsei said:
Birth by Sleep, Days (You know that character is going to show up), and Unchained X too.

The KH3 OT will certainly be something.

... Christ. The first post will just be explaining all the convoluted bullshit.

..... · Aug 18, 2015

Dad said:
I'm still putting blame on the devs for shoving so many key plot points into a card based GBA spinoff game of all things.

The game was remade for PS2 , which was also included in the HD collection. Whilst the card system might not be to everyones taste the story is worth playing it for.

Foffy · Aug 19, 2015

TheLegendaryDarkKnight said:
The game was remade for PS2 , which was also included in the HD collection. Whilst the card system might not be to everyones taste the story is worth playing it for.

The remake, while localized, was not given a worldwide release until the HD remaster. Europe basically never got the remake until 1.5 was released. The original PS2 release for NA also happened in 2008, long after people moved on to seventh-generation platforms.

These HD re-releases are really a blessing in disguise, if you think about it. For a franchise that originally demanded at least six platforms (PS2, GBA, DS, 3DS, PSP, PS4/XONE) now demands just three (PS3, 3DS, PS4/XONE). Probably one of the few times an HD remastering didn't just seem like cashing in on an IP craze.

silva1991 · Aug 19, 2015

Maybe KH2 has worst plot than KH1, but the combat is easily much better and satisfying in KH2(on critical)

also KH2 has much better bosses in my opinion. they are just so much fun to fight

Fj0823 · Aug 19, 2015

"I skipped an entire game, why is the plot not making sense in the sequel?"

Man, KH3 meltdowns are going to be amazing...

Buntabox · Aug 19, 2015

You really can't afford to skip anything. Played through most of it this summer, as well (Only played KH1 on it's original release. Missed 2). You really need to at least watch the cutscenes. Reading a wiki probably isn't much help. They introduce a lot of characters in CoM and a lot of info. And 358/2 makes the KH2 prologue comprehensible (which I agree is still not very well paced).

I did a 3hr cutscene watch of CoM and watched all of 358/2 (which is insane how existential that game is. People just eating ice cream and talking about their feelings). It's about 6hrs of your time total. But it's absolutely necessary.

I'm in the final stretch of KH2 and I just needed a break. Going to come back to it and BBS after the fall.

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