Halycon said:
Don't get me wrong I'm good friends with a number of reasonable, politically moderate Muslims - but god damn the Islamists on this board can freak me out sometimes.
(So can the fundamentalist Christians, but those are a dying breed, thank goodness)
:lol :lol :lol I am fairly moderate, but lean a bit on the conservative side Muslim wise if you get to meet me in real life... But no where I would say I am a perfect, only God is perfect. Anyway that's a different subject all together.
Atrus said:
So... I'll go ahead and ask. Do you want the Taliban's application of Sharia law on your household or community?
Ok Shari'a law is only applied to areas where the area through voting allows this to happen.
speculawyer said:
Nor do the people unless they vote for it.
What the hell does that mean? There are US troops in the neighboring country, so let's cut off some heads?
Seriously, you are not making much sense. Just law arises from the will of the people through voting. Sharia law imposed by violence is not the will of the people. If the people vote for it then fine. But unless that happens it is just brutal violence-enforced theocratic bullshit from a bunch of fundamentalist nutjobs.
(And if the people vote for it, it is still superstitious nonsense from fundamentalist nutjobs but at least it was voted on.
)
Dude, the Pakistani parliament voted on this and then the President signed the bill to allow shari'a in that area... So nothing is being forced onto the people by the nutjobs as the western media makes seem so. Also the area had shari'a law implemented there for until the late 60s or 70s, I don't exactly remember perfectly man... So let them have it.
As for wanting Shari'a, Iran has their Shari'a and so does Saudi Arabia... You see the huge difference in the Shari'a... Each region has their own interruptation of it... I am not there so I don't know what the shari'a is like... But from the pictures and videos that I am seeing people there were distributing sweets and there were parties going around when the bill was passed.... So interrupt the shari'a they have there is not as constricting as any Saudi's version...
The US time after time has wanted to break the Pakistan into smaller countries through proxies, its being debated on Pakistani news channels that my parents and I watch here in the US... Search for Balcohistan or Pushutonistan etc... Plus the whole mess with MQM/Altaf Hussan/Musharaf/Zardari...
speculawyer said:
Sadly, I think he does.
Hey Zapage, I'm curious . . . do think if a member of your family left Islam then that family member should be killed? (As is the view of many Islamists.)
My 2nd cousin twice separated married a white dude and bunch of my father cousin's and relatives have married outside the Muslim faith... If you want my personal opinion then I'll have to say no... As for religious context here's the answer:
* In spite of the alleged command of Allah to kill all non-believers, millions of non-Muslims continue to live beside their Muslim brothers in the predominantly Muslim countries.
* In the United States of America as well as in other Western countries, Muslims are quite successfully convincing the non-Muslimsinstead of trying to kill themthat Islam is more tolerant than Judaism and at any rate the Christian coalition. Of course, one may cite instances of Muslims killing non-Muslims, but at the same time, Christians, too, have been killing non-Christians! Does anyone need a command from God to go and kill?
* The Muslim preachers allowed in the US prisons are more successful than their Christian counterparts in getting converts. Maybe that is one of the reasons for spreading this absurd story! The second-largest religion in the world after Christianity, Islam, is also the fastest-growing religion. In the United States, for example, nearly 80 percent of the more than 1,200 mosques have been built in the past 12 years. Some scholars see an emerging Islamic renaissance as Islam takes root in many traditionally Christian communities. Islam has drawn converts from all walks of life, most notably African-Americans
(From a CNN report of April 14, 1997).
* Not even one with the brains of a gnat would believe that a Muslim imam engaged in inviting non-Muslims to Islam would undermine his cause by making an open declaration that the Muslim mission in life is to kill all non-Muslims. Or else he must be insane or hopelessly dim-witted.
* And lastly, if Allah had commanded Muslims to kill all non-Muslims, the Prophet and his companions would not have left alive any non-Muslim tribes in Arabia, when they had got complete authority over them. Speaking of the Christian missionary claim that Islam was spread at the point of the sword, one may ask: Was it because of the fear of the sword that hundreds of thousands of the most warlike Arabs of the time literally followed the Prophet in everything he commanded?
And what is more, isnt it ridiculous to say that any belief system, not only Islamic, can be pushed down the throat of a human being at the point of the sword? Cant you see that Islam has withstood the vicissitudes of fourteen centuries and is still outstripping all other faiths at an astonishing rate? Can a religion that preaches the killing of all outside its confines capture the minds and hearts of millions throughout history? Sorry, the Rick Mathes story does not stand to reason.
Source:
http://www.readingislam.com/servlet...sh-AAbout_Islam/AskAboutIslamE/AskAboutIslamE
Atrus said:
If he did I don't think he'd be on the internet pandering, unless he's a member of the Global Islamic Media Front. A real Taliban would be foaming at the mouth over just about everything, uttering threats every other sentence, and probably already a part of their Jihad against the degenerate Western Imperialist Crusaders and their Jewish-Christian lies.
I'm just interested to see if what isn't good for a clearly religious guy like Zapages is somehow magically good for the people in Pakistan and Afghanistan.
:lol... That just made me laugh out loud man. I am not a part of any organization at all... I am just your normal Muslim Pakistani guy who is sick and tired of hearing and seeing his leaders and western world looking down on Islam because of actions of few a misguided Muslims aka what happened in 9/11...
Personally, I just fear what Islam has become aka wahabismitic nature and how culture has become so much ingrained into Islam that it is destroying its beautiful nature of it... Actually I am not sure that you might be interested in hearing this, God is energy or a thing so massive and magnificant that we humans can't even imagine...
Technically political Islam is like a social democracy with the Caliph being able to be removed through votes and voted in... Throughout the history after first four Caliphs, which brought the schism in Islam and afterward made the Caliphate and the Sultanate a more of dynastical/monarchical form. Why do I say we need a Caliph its because like Christians that have their Pope, we Muslims need to have Caliph...
All I do this research is on my side as a hobby as a Muslim.... All I tell my fellow Muslim brothers and sisters when I meet them is that as there is hadith(I think) that says that only way to reach God is through knowledge... So learn and learn. This is what we Muslims have forgotten about and are fighting about things that are not important to us...
Clearly to us Muslims living there or here the Western system is not working because all it produces is more corrupt leaders... So going back to Islam in the political sense would end the corruption of the courts with their lawyers... Although it might not work 100% of the time, but it will become corrected over time, which the past 60+ years of pseudo-democracy has not been able to do with a few dictators in between...
PS: Guys check this great article out:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/3a7d0dfc-24b7-11de-8bb2-00144feabdc0.html