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entremet · Dec 6, 2012

We've talked about Intermittent Fasting, referred to IF, in both Fitness and Weight loss threads, but I thought about creating unique thread about this new dieting hotness as mega threads can be hard to follow.

What is Intermittent Fasting?

Fasting has been around for thousands of years, originally for religious practice. However, of late it has been proposed by many health bloggers, starting with Martin Berkham of LeanGains, who brought it to the to the forefront in the internet fitness community.

Martin Berkham

Here's his primer:
http://www.leangains.com/2010/04/leangains-guide.html

He basically does carb cycling--higher carb on training days--resistance training--and lower carb on off days. He recommends a 16 hour fasting window, where you only drink water or take BCAAs for fasted workouts. So 16 hours off, followed by an 8 hour feeding window.

Realistically, that can look like this: Start eating from 12 noon to 8pm. And the fasting window begins at 8pm, throughout the night and workout fasted with BCAAs in the morning.

That's one example. You can play around with the fasting window to meet your schedule.

Brad Pillon

http://www.eatstopeat.com/newindex....lYH4Bw&usg=AFQjCNHiW3tkQCr58X1O-gcITnvh88cjIQ

Brad advocates 24 fasts, around 1 to 2 a week.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=da2pc3vMkSc

And here's Dr. John Beradi's n=1 experiment with IF.

http://www.precisionnutrition.com/intermittent-fasting

I did IF for a while got at my leanest ever. I never felt hungry and it was nice not to have to think about scheduled meals. But I just wanted to provide some resources as this comes up a lot in both thread and has been a topic of controversy in the fitness community.

HiResDes · Dec 6, 2012

One of my friends who happens to have a doctorate and is currently working at a research department within the local university informed that he's doing a new study on fasting and it's possible positive correlation with extending life expectancy. Apparently, the average life expectancy of U.S. citizens went up significantly during the Great Depression and Lee thinks it might be due to involuntary intermittent fasting. I believe he mentioned that fasting young aids in the regeneration of cells later in life.

Everdred · Dec 6, 2012

My fiancee is doing the Bullet Proof Intermittent Fasting

She's on day 8 now and has lost 9 lbs.

Fasting has also been proven to help prevent cancers and seizures.

CountAntonius · Dec 6, 2012

I started with the Warriors fast but it wasn't for me so I moved onto eat stop eat which is Brads. Been doing it a month now. Those days are kind of a pain but not too bad.

andycapps · Dec 6, 2012

I do intermittent fasting as described in the OP. I've slacked off some with it getting a little colder but I still hold to it pretty well. The timeframes are really only a big deal for a few days and after that you get used to it.

zethren · Dec 6, 2012

From what I understand, from speaking with friends on this subject, fasting allows for your body to work on whats already going on inside of it rather than constantly expend energy on digestion of food and allocation of nutrition. Your body can attend to getting rid of existing toxins and such.

I watch what I eat, and nowadays I eat far less than I used to, but I'm not sure if I could fast for more than a day personally. Though I understand the benefits of short fasting periods.

Krowley · Dec 6, 2012

I'm on a low-carb diet but I also mix this in. I used it very successfully to overcome a plateau, and afterward it became my default way of eating. I'm not 100% strict about it anymore, but my eating pattern tends to work out this way most of the time.

The biggest trouble I have with this is avoiding grabbing a piece of cheese or something after my stopping time when I go to the fridge to refill my drink. So I sometimes cheat in the sense that I'll get a few meager calories during the fast, but usually not a meal.

andycapps · Dec 6, 2012

zethren said:
From what I understand, from speaking with friends on this subject, fasting allows for your body to work on whats already going on inside of it rather than constantly expend energy on digestion of food and allocation of nutrition. Your body can attend to getting rid of existing toxins and such.

I watch what I eat, and nowadays I eat far less than I used to, but I'm not sure if I could fast for more than a day personally. Though I understand the benefits of short fasting periods.

This is just fasting for 16 hours at a time for males, 14 for women.

opticalmace · Dec 6, 2012

Not to poop up the thread but I read that as fisting, not fasting...

ezrarh · Dec 6, 2012

I did a little IF over the summer, lost a good amount of bodyfat this way. Although I did more of a 10 hour eating period instead, was too hard to get all the food I needed in 8 hours because of my schedule. This was when I took a break from lifting seriously and did muay thai instead. Now that I'm back to lifting 3 to 4 times a week, I'll see if I can do it while actually slowly gaining strength and a little weight.

Deleted member 17706 · Dec 6, 2012

I almost never eat breakfast anymore, so I'm kind of in the leangains camp by default. I don't do any of that carb cycling stuff, though. Not a whole lot of "working out," either.

I usually eat my first meal of the day around 12pm, dinner at 7-9pm and then do the same thing the next day.

rvy · Dec 6, 2012

I've done it, it's cool. First day is hella hard. More people should try it out.

Malvolio · Dec 6, 2012

I added IF once a week about a year ago and I feel like it totally made a huge difference. My weight loss improved and I think it was a huge boost mentally. It felt like a full body reset once a week and even though I've lost about all the weight that I need to I plan on keeping it part of my lifestyle from now on.

Host Samurai · Dec 6, 2012

I also believe in fasted cardio. You will shed lots of fat. I have been doing it for years and have 10% bf

X-Frame · Dec 6, 2012

Anyone know of or have purchased Jason Ferruggia's "Renegade Diet"?

It's a variation of LeanGains but more focus on healthy foods and overall health, and eating carbs post workout and only at night. To break the fast just pro/fat/veggies and lighter meals not to spike insulin too much.

SmackDaddy · Dec 6, 2012

Intermittent fisting has made me a better person, and also made me want to get skinnier so more people would want to fist me.

But this is super interesting! Has anyone done this themselves? I feel like it would screw up social things like going out to eat and to bars... Hmmm..

Coldsnap · Dec 6, 2012

I do carbbackloading which takes some stuff from IF

CountAntonius · Dec 6, 2012

SmackDaddy said:
Intermittent fisting has made me a better person, and also made me want to get skinnier so more people would want to fist me.

But this is super interesting! Has anyone done this themselves? I feel like it would screw up social things like going out to eat and to bars... Hmmm..

Yeah eating out is rough. I don't eat after 6 pm anymore, but if I know I have something planned I'll start my food intake a little later to keep the window going. Also this is why people like eat stop best. The only thing you're supposed to change is two 24 hour fasts that are very flexible.

Celegus · Dec 6, 2012

I can't go 4 hours without eating, that sounds horrifying.

Emily Chu · Dec 6, 2012

personally I'm doing the Jared Leto 21 days fast since 3 days ago

I feel amazing, ultimate survival more activated

more focused and less depressed then I've been in years and years

dunno if unhealthy or not

but I'll stick to it

RM8 · Dec 6, 2012

SmackDaddy said:
I feel like it would screw up social things like going out to eat and to bars... Hmmm..

Nope, just compensate later in the week. That's actually a great thing about IF.

I can't give you numbers, but as a skinny guy with high-ish body fat % I've been doing IF (with some low-cal fruit because my stomach gets incredibly acidic if I don't eat anything... blows) for a couple of weeks and the results have been showing real quick. I really mean real quick. Need to get my body fat measured soon.

brandonh83 · Dec 6, 2012

Sounds interesting and honestly not too hard as I sometimes unintentionally go through those same steps without even thinking about it, for whatever reason. Think I'll try it out.

Dereck · Dec 6, 2012

zethren said:
From what I understand, from speaking with friends on this subject, fasting allows for your body to work on whats already going on inside of it rather than constantly expend energy on digestion of food and allocation of nutrition. Your body can attend to getting rid of existing toxins and such.

Wow, this really true?

andycapps · Dec 6, 2012

brandonh83 said:
Sounds interesting and honestly not too hard as I sometimes unintentionally go through those same steps without even thinking about it, for whatever reason. Think I'll try it out.

Just so you know, there's more to it than just the timeframe of eating. You've got to calculate your macros (what you should be eating) and then stick to eating those in certain percentages of your meals. If you're going to do it, get ready to do a lot of reading. It's not super hard to do, it's just something that I think you'll do better at if you understand the science behind it.

There's a really good Reddit thread on it here. This should really be added to the OP as it includes everything you need to know what to do. Leangains is Martin Berkhan's thing and he's pretty much just been posting about it for years on his blog. He's writing a book, and with any luck, it'll be out sometime before we all die.

Leangains is a variation of Intermittent Fasting and is what a lot of people are talking about when they talk about Intermittent Fasting.

Zoe · Dec 6, 2012

Basically been doing IF my whole life by not eating breakfast and not snacking. Can't say it's helped me any.

TheCrow · Dec 6, 2012

andycapps said:
Just so you know, there's more to it than just the timeframe of eating. You've got to calculate your macros (what you should be eating) and then stick to eating those in certain percentages of your meals.

There's a really good Reddit thread on it here. This should really be added to the OP as it includes everything you need to know what to do. Leangains is Martin Berkhan's thing and he's pretty much just been posting about it for years on his blog. He's writing a book, and with any luck, it'll be out sometime before we all die.

But you don't have to mess with macros to do IF. Leangains is just a IF with carb cycling.

andycapps · Dec 6, 2012

Zoe said:
Basically been doing IF my whole life by not eating breakfast and not snacking. Can't say it's helped me any.

That's not really IF.

TheCrow said:
But you don't have to mess with macros to do IF. Leangains is just a IF with carb cycling.

True. I should have clarified that macros come into play if you're doing LG.

Esch · Dec 6, 2012

HiResDes said:
One of my friend's who happens to have a doctorate and is currently working at a research department within the local university informed that he's doing a new study on fasting and it's possible positive correlation with extending expectancy. Apparently, the average life expectancy of U.S. citizens went up significantly during the Great Depression and Lee thinks it might be due to involuntary intermittent fasting. I believe he mentioned that fasting young aids in the regeneration of cells later in life.

There is also readily googleable research on fasting and neuroprotective benefits as well. Worth a search or two.

Two answer the topic I love IF and ever since I started it ive seen no reason to stop.

Haxxor · Dec 6, 2012

Dance Inferno · Dec 6, 2012

Is this is a good way to cut? I'm on a bulking phase right now so I'm basically eating as much as I can (I'm a hardgainer so I basically try to stuff myself), but I'm trying to plan out how and when I'm going to start cutting. My brother is doing intermittent fasting right now and he seems to be getting good results.

SamVimes · Dec 6, 2012

zethren said:
From what I understand, from speaking with friends on this subject, fasting allows for your body to work on whats already going on inside of it rather than constantly expend energy on digestion of food and allocation of nutrition. Your body can attend to getting rid of existing toxins and such.

Is there any science on this?

TheCrow · Dec 6, 2012

ilnadmy said:
Is this is a good way to cut? I'm on a bulking phase right now so I'm basically eating as much as I can (I'm a hardgainer so I basically try to stuff myself), but I'm trying to plan out how and when I'm going to start cutting. My brother is doing intermittent fasting right now and he seems to be getting good results.

I like it more for cutting since it left me feeling full even on a low calorie diet since I ate one or two big meals. I'm bulking right now and still do Leangains but it can get hard fitting in the calories in a 6 hour window.

andycapps said:
True. I should have clarified that macros come into play if you're doing LG.

I've made the same mistake too.

despire · Dec 6, 2012

entrement said:
Fasting has been around for thousands of years, originally for religious practice.

Gotta nitpick

If we go really far you could say humans have always practiced intermittent fasting and our bodies are expecting it.

99.9% of your history we've had no way of knowing where and when our next meal will be and we've been forced to fast while waiting for that next mammoth to kill.

So intermittent fasting has been always there. Before it was involuntary and later with certain religions it was more of a voluntary practice. But yes it has been around for thousands of years. Only during the last hundred years or so we've stopped doing it. Humans didn't even eat breakfast until the mid-1800's.

Anyway this thread is a good idea.

SamVimes said:
Is there any science on this?

Don't know about toxins and such. As far as I'm concerned there is no such things and if there are our livers will take care of them anyway. Sounds like his friends have understood something a bit wrong.

BUT:

Brad Pilon said:
In dozens of published peer reviewed scientific studies, short-term intermittent
fasting has been found to have the following health benefits:
• Decreased body fat & body weight
• Maintenance of skeletal muscle mass
• Decreased blood glucose levels
• Decreased insulin levels & increased insulin sensitivity
• Increased lipolysis & fat oxidation
• Increased Uncoupling Protein 3 mRNA
• Increased norepinephrine & epinephrine levels
• Increased Glucagon levels
• Increased growth hormone levels.

yonder · Dec 6, 2012

I did Leangains for a few months, but didn't really notice much of a difference since I ended up eating the same amount of food as I usually did. It was pretty easy, though, and it was nice to able to skip breakfast and sleep longer instead. Maybe I should give it another shot...

SamVimes · Dec 6, 2012

despire said:
Don't know about toxins and such though. As far as I'm concerned there is no such things and if there are our livers will take care of them anyway. Sounds like his friends have understood something a bit wrong.

Yeah i wanted mostly to know that, every time i hear the word toxin my bullcrap detector goes off.

andycapps · Dec 6, 2012

SamVimes said:
Yeah i wanted mostly to know that, every time i hear the word toxin my bullcrap detector goes off.

I hear you, and I think that's a lot of pseudoscience combined with word of mouth. LG or IF isn't going to suddenly make you a super human, but if you follow it, you can see some great results in your body. It's a pretty proven thing, it just goes against a lot of broscience out there like how you need to eat 6 meals a day to stoke the body's metabolism and a lot of horseshit like that. The crazy thing about IF and LG is that there's tons of science behind it if someone wants to sit down and read everything, compared to all the stuff out there that people assume is true but there's nothing to back it up.

HomerSimpson-Man · Dec 6, 2012

opticalmace said:
Not to poop up the thread but I read that as fisting, not fasting...

There's nothing quite like an 8 hour feeding period followed by 16 hours of fisting. It does wonders to the body.

RM8 · Dec 6, 2012

I personally didn't care for the magical health benefits. It just lets you cut your calories hardcore while eating stuff you love (in moderation, of course, but the thing is that you still can). Plus it works, it's really great.

despire · Dec 6, 2012

SamVimes said:
Yeah i wanted mostly to know that, every time i hear the word toxin my bullcrap detector goes off.

Same here. But I've never heard any of the advocates of IF/LG mention toxins in any way. First time I've heard in this context is from that one dude in this thread.

I just think his friends have gotten it wrong somehow.

Etrian Oddity · Dec 6, 2012

Intermittent fasting does not work for everyone.

If you're like me, your immediate losses will quickly disappear and you will in fact gain weight back, because your body gets used to the fasted state and alters its metabolism.

Dance Inferno · Dec 6, 2012

TheCrow said:
I like it more for cutting since it left me feeling full even on a low calorie diet since I ate one or two big meals. I'm bulking right now and still do Leangains but it can get hard fitting in the calories in a 6 hour window.

That's what I'm thinking. I seriously doubt I would be able to gain any mass on IF since I find it very hard to gain mass period. However the last time I was on a cutting phase I couldn't break past 13% bodyfat because I just got super hungry all the time. I feel like with IF I would be able to feel full on a lower total number of calories.

Nostalgic Nightmare · Dec 6, 2012

Can I have black coffee during the fasting hours like water?

blackflag · Dec 6, 2012

A lot of people just do this for the convenience. I do it and I'm not sure I've noticed more fat loss over what I was doing before. It is just nice to know I don't gotta eat 6 times a day to keep my gains and it allows me to not worry about food in the morning or while at work. I usually eat between 5-11pm on non workout days and 7:30-11pm on workout days.

andycapps · Dec 6, 2012

Nostalgic Nightmare said:
Can I have black coffee during the fasting hours like water?

Not sure about on IF but on LG, yes. That would have been a dealbreaker for me.

phosphor112 · Dec 6, 2012

I would "fast" one time a week. 400 calories max.
Then I would alternate "Normal" and "reduced" (1200 cal) days.

I did it for over a month. I lost several pounds, and my blood pressure, triglyc and cholesterol, all dropped.

I eventually got week willed and broke... =/

despire · Dec 6, 2012

Nostalgic Nightmare said:
Can I have black coffee during the fasting hours like water?

You can but you also need to drink lots of water.

Etrian Oddity said:
Intermittent fasting does not work for everyone.

If you're like me, your immediate losses will quickly disappear and you will in fact gain weight back, because your body gets used to the fasted state and alters its metabolism.

Doesn't make sense. Are you sure you just didn't do it wrong or ate too much?

Beerman462 · Dec 6, 2012

This seems very doable. I have a couple questions though. Is the Berkham method everyday? The 9pm to noon fast and a 4pm work out would be perfect for me. Also are there any larger fasts to work into the plan?

red731 · Dec 6, 2012

Host Samurai said:
I also believe in fasted cardio. You will shed lots of fat. I have been doing it for years and have 10% bf

Fasted cardio?(link) Is it like interval training? I will google that right now...

I do fast in period of two months for 16 hours and then have a breakfast in the morning to let system know I started again.

ed: link added
ed: gonna try what Interfectum is doing

Interfectum · Dec 6, 2012

I do the 5/2 diet (I fast every tuesday and thursday) and it's been fucking amazing. Weight, blood work and overall health has improved a lot and I wasn't even that unhealthy to begin with.

Beer gut? Gone.
Borderline blood pressure? Gone.
Borderline blood sugar? Gone.

It seriously feels like some voodoo magic.

And I'll tell you what, the hardest part about fasting is the social part. A lot of people think its weird and don't understand it.

Soybean · Dec 6, 2012

I've read articles going either way about the benefits and downsides of IF, but regardless, it sure as hell makes cutting calories a lot easier. I love it.

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