• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

Running PC games at 30Hz

Disclaimer: While I don't think this can damage your monitor/TV, I'm not an expert on this. If I have anything wrong please don't take it as undue arrogance and, for the love of god, don't hesitate to correct me :P

Because Watch_Dogs is upon us and many of the people interested in the PC version of the game won't be able to hold 60 FPS (with high-end settings), I feel it's appropriate to have a thread dedicated to getting games to run properly at 30 FPS.

If you've ever played a PC game that's been limited 30 fps, you've likely noticed that it isn't as fluid as console games at 30 fps. The FPS counter always reads 30, but something is amiss. It seems as though the screen continually stutters whenever you pan the camera around. The reason for this is the discrepancy between your monitor's refresh rate and the game's refresh rate. When your monitor's refresh rate is 60Hz and your game is running at 60 FPS, everything is fine. One frame is spit out every time your monitor refreshes. This is true for any refresh rate and FPS combination where both numbers are the same. The problem with trying to limit your games to something that isn't your monitor's refresh rate is that, while your FPS is locked to a specified number (eg 30), the discrepancy still exists. Your monitor is still refreshing at xxHz while your game is only rendering a fraction of that. Locking your framerate to half (or quarter) of your refresh rate helps to lessen the effect, but the issue is still present nonetheless. The only way to have a smooth gaming experience is to have your graphics card render a frame every time your monitor refreshes. Nvidia's G-Sync and AMD's FreeSync are aiming to rectify this issue by dynamically adjusting your monitor's refresh rate to match whatever FPS your graphics card can manage to output but, as of May 2014, they aren't ready.

So, with that in mind, let's talk about running your monitor at 30Hz.

Firstly, you (probably) need to create a custom resolution in order for your monitor to be able to output 30Hz properly. If you're an Nvidia user, you can get by using the Nvidia Control Panel. I'm an AMD user, so I only have the following guide from Nvidia's website to work with, but hopefully someone in the GeForce camp can help if this method is no longer valid.

http://www.nvidia.ca/object/custom_resolutions.html

Just set your desired resolution and change the refresh rate to 30.

As far as I know AMD doesn't have a driver option to create custom resolutions. As such, you have to do it yourself by either editing your registry or using a third party program. I'm not going to get into registry editing, but there are a few guides on the internet/YouTube that I have successfully used before. For this case, though, I used Custom Resolution Utility to allow my monitor to run 1920x1080 @ 30Hz.

http://www.monitortests.com/forum/Thread-Custom-Resolution-Utility-CRU

Click the first blue link to download the program, follow the guide and you should be fine.

Once you have your resolution set up, you're ready to get your games running at 30Hz.

The way to accomplish this varies from game to game. Some games have the option to change your refresh rate right in the options menu, others require an .ini or .cfg tweak, and a few just don't seem to work afaik. Changing the refresh rate inside of a game's options menu is pretty straight forward, so I won't bother explaining that. Finding the refresh rate line using an options file is a little trickier, and it varies from game to game, but if the option exists it's usually in a logical place (eg under the "display" section). The most obvious trick is to simply search for "refresh" within the file. Certain games use different terms for refresh rate, but it's usually easy enough to find if you make an effort. If you can't find a way to get a particular game to run at 30Hz, try changing your desktop resolution to 30Hz and then opening the game.

I know that there are many people who prefer responsiveness over everything else when it comes to how a game runs. If you're one of those people, this thread is probably useless. If you want the most immediate response possible, disabling Vsync and lowering settings is always the best way to go. Running your monitor at half/quarter of its usual refresh rate means that the amount of input lag will inevitably increase. While some games, like Watch_Dogs or Assassin's Creed, don't suffer too much from the increased latency, there are others which are severely hindered by the lack of precision. FPS games, for example, usually require the most precise inputs possible and, as a result, don't fare too well with lower frequencies. Especially if you're playing with a keyboard and mouse. If you can't hit 60 FPS and you're not bothered by the increase in latency, though, then running games at 30Hz should improve your gaming experience.

I hope this helps a few people because I know it makes a difference to me but, as I said, I'm not an expert. If anyone has any input or suggestions I would love to hear them.
 
I gave it a go a couple of days to experiment on my TV, a Panasonic Plasma. Tried 30Hz refresh and 24Hz. Didn't have to use custom resolutions, when using a DVI to HDMI cable, 24, 30, 50, 60Hz were all available to be selected.

I think 24Hz is on the border of being bad where it felt almost slideshowy, I believe it's 20% slower than 30Hz.

30Hz was fine especially since it was locked so I didn't experience any stuttering.

Just be sure to force VSync in your driver settings. I've got an AMD card so it's an option in the catalyst control centre.
 
Granted I've never tried this... but... you didn't really provide a mechanism to back up this claim. 30fps games on console are still outputting 60hz, no?
You have a point.

I have no idea why consoles look smoother at 30 fps, but I do know that PC games locked to 30 fps running at 60Hz do not look as good.
 
You have a point.

I have no idea why consoles look smoother at 30 fps, but I do know that PC games locked to 30 fps running at 60Hz do not look as good.

Could it be motion blur? I know consoles use that a lot to cover up fps problems, but a lot of PC games give that option nowadays too
 
Granted I've never tried this... but... you didn't really provide a mechanism to back up this claim. 30fps games on console are still outputting 60hz, no?
He's completely right. It's a frame pacing issue. I'm putting something together soon that will hopefully clear some things up.
 
on the couple of occasions that i felt like locking frames to 30, i just went into the Nvidia control panel ...and then chose ...

Manage 3D Settings
Program Settings tab
Browsed to find the game and its .exe file
then under its Vsync option i would choose 'Adaptive (half refresh rate)'.

clicked to apply and then everything seemed alright. the 30fps limit would only apply to that one particular game ...so i thought that was a pretty good way to go about it. really no hassle involved, other than having to put up with 30fps.
 
Granted I've never tried this... but... you didn't really provide a mechanism to back up this claim. 30fps games on console are still outputting 60hz, no?

Modern tvs have adjustable refresh rates. For example, my Samsung is to 60hz when I'm on the XMB of the PS3, and if I boot a 30fps it'll switch to 30hz.
 
You have a point.

I have no idea why consoles look smoother at 30 fps, but I do know that PC games locked to 30 fps running at 60Hz do not look as good.

I see it too. Dark souls locked at 30 looks jumpy on my monitor while the ps3 version doesn't. Even games that dip below 30 seem smother.
 
Could it be motion blur? I know consoles use that a lot to cover up fps problems, but a lot of PC games give that option nowadays too

i think it is motion blur.

i remember locking Crysis 3 to 30fps (graphics were basically cranked all the way up as high as they could go) ...the game had an in game option to increase motion blur. i turned that all the way up and the game looked smoother than when it was lower.
 
He's completely right. It's a frame pacing issue. I'm putting something together soon that will hopefully clear some things up.

I remember reading something about multi-gpus having frame pacing issues. But with a single GPU, shouldn't that be resolved by Vsyncing to 30Hz?
 
I remember reading something about multi-gpus having frame pacing issues. But with a single GPU, shouldn't that be resolved by Vsyncing to 30Hz?
You would think, but no...at least not always. Sometimes it works but in a lot of cases you wind up with frame delivery inconsistencies. It can be quite ugly and produces results much worse than a proper 30 fps.
 
You have a point.

I have no idea why consoles look smoother at 30 fps, but I do know that PC games locked to 30 fps running at 60Hz do not look as good.
Probably the TV doing some post processing. Monitors tend to show a more raw image. There is no point in running your monitor at 30Hz
 
Then it's the games themselves doing the blurring.
If that were the case then there would be no difference between the game at 30Hz and 60Hz on my monitor, but that isn't the case.

Without fail the game running at 30 FPS & 30Hz looks better than the game running at 30 FPS & 60Hz.
 
Modern tvs have adjustable refresh rates. For example, my Samsung is to 60hz when I'm on the XMB of the PS3, and if I boot a 30fps it'll switch to 30hz.
Pics of your TV reporting these refresh rates? I mean, maybe I could see a game that prefers 1080i when you have them all checked, which is kinda 30fps. But as a general case I'm not convinced, the HD output standards are well defined and most people at this point are going to have their consoles outputting only 1080p (60hz) I would think.
 
If that were the case then there would be no difference between the game at 30Hz and 60Hz on my monitor, but that isn't the case.

Without fail the game running at 30 FPS & 30Hz looks better than the game running at 30 FPS & 60Hz.
Then I'd reckon there is something going on with your setup. I do not have this issue. I have only tested between 120Hz and 60Hz though.
 
I don't think it has anything to do with my setup.
Well you are pretty much the only person I know who's recommending playing at 30Hz. Theoretically your suggestion makes no sense since at 30fps@60Hz will just show every frame twice with no stuttering. Practically in my experience with 60fps@60Hz definitely does not show an improvement in stuttering either compared to 60fps@120Hz. 120Hz however does do wonders to reduce screen tearing.
 
won't be able to hold 60 FPS (with high-end settings)

I think this logic is broken. Given that framerate, although not a setting, is the highest priority specification out of any of them, capping your framerate at half that of your monitor's native refresh rate would make the overall settings very low, would it not? I can't image why anyone would ever want to make that trade off, especially on PC where you are using 1:1 controls where every frame really does matter, your image quality will improve, but shit will look ugly as hell because of the relative chopiness, it's smarter to reduce IQ imo.
 
I think this logic is broken. Given that framerate, although not a setting, is the highest priority specification out of any of them, capping your framerate at half that of your monitor's native refresh rate would make the overall settings very low, would it not? I can't image why anyone would ever want to make that trade off, especially on PC where you are using 1:1 controls where every frame really does matter, your image quality will improve, but shit will look ugly as hell because of the relative chopiness, it's smarter to reduce IQ imo.
Yeah, well, that's just like your opinion, man.

As I said, this isn't for everybody. There are people (like myself) who don't have a problem with 30 fps. If that is the case, and you want the best possible IQ, this is a better solution than simply capping your framerate.
 
Well you are pretty much the only person I know who's recommending playing at 30Hz. Theoretically your suggestion makes no sense since at 30fps@60Hz will just show every frame twice with no stuttering.

This would be true if PC monitors would be running at 60Hz. They're not, usually it's something around 59.8 Hz (Retroarch can give you the exact values). Which results in terrible judder when trying to run 30fps content.
 
This would be true if PC monitors would be running at 60Hz. They're not, usually it's something around 59.8 Hz (Retroarch can give you the exact values). Which results in terrible judder when trying to run 30fps content.
By that logic if you can force 30Hz why can't you force 60Hz?
 
Disclaimer: While I don't think this can damage your monitor/TV, I'm not an expert on this. If I have anything wrong please don't take it as undue arrogance and, for the love of god, don't hesitate to correct me :P[/I


It's always good to have this disclaimer, but there shouldn't be any issues.

I've overclocked my monitor to run at 4K resolutions and ~90Hz through drivers, separately since both require a lot of bandwidth. Theoretically there can technically run into issues, but I have never heard of any actual reports.
 
I've been running custom resolutions at 30hz for a while now using CRU and not had any issues (it's the only way I can get 3840x2160 and higher not to be out of range). It's not a pleasant experience mind.
 
I don't see the difference between running the monitor itself at a different refresh rate, assuming that the game's frame rate is exactly divisible by your refresh rate. For example, my monitor is 60Hz. Running a game at 30fps means each frame of the game displays for two frames of the monitor's refresh period. The end result is the same.

With the exception of active-shutter 3D displays, LCD panels will only change the pixels when they're told to. My monitor isn't having to re-draw that frame that doesn't change from one cycle to the next, it merely holds it. The problem comes when the frame time decides to change, and then I might want that faster refresh rate to be able to display that frame quicker than it would if it were somehow locked to 30Hz. It could also be a problem if you have a display that doesn't have a refresh rate that syncs perfectly with the game's framerate. Those odd models with refresh rates like 75Hz and such.

As for why 30fps looks better on console, I think it's simply a matter of viewing distance. You're much closer to your PC monitor, and it takes up a larger viewing angle. Therefore, the "gap" from one frame to the next is physically much larger within your field of view, and thus more noticeable.
 
You have a point.

I have no idea why consoles look smoother at 30 fps, but I do know that PC games locked to 30 fps running at 60Hz do not look as good.

Maybe it's the slow panning of a controller vs fast panning with a mouse. Panning the camera quickly at 30 fps with a mouse often doesn't feel good.

So if you plugged in a controller, and set your montior to 30Hz you should get the same experience as console
 
Try RadeonPro's "Always On (Double VSync)" option with "Lock frame rate to monitor's refresh rate" ticked. And Triple Buffering if you want it (but you shouldn't need it since 30FPS is your target).

I've tried this with Watch_Doge and it runs about as smoothly as 30FPS is going to run (lol).
 
I don't see the difference between running the monitor itself at a different refresh rate, assuming that the game's frame rate is exactly divisible by your refresh rate. For example, my monitor is 60Hz. Running a game at 30fps means each frame of the game displays for two frames of the monitor's refresh period. The end result is the same.

With the exception of active-shutter 3D displays, LCD panels will only change the pixels when they're told to. My monitor isn't having to re-draw that frame that doesn't change from one cycle to the next, it merely holds it. The problem comes when the frame time decides to change, and then I might want that faster refresh rate to be able to display that frame quicker than it would if it were somehow locked to 30Hz. It could also be a problem if you have a display that doesn't have a refresh rate that syncs perfectly with the game's framerate. Those odd models with refresh rates like 75Hz and such.

As for why 30fps looks better on console, I think it's simply a matter of viewing distance. You're much closer to your PC monitor, and it takes up a larger viewing angle. Therefore, the "gap" from one frame to the next is physically much larger within your field of view, and thus more noticeable.

Maybe it's the slow panning of a controller vs fast panning with a mouse. Panning the camera quickly at 30 fps with a mouse often doesn't feel good.
I play with a controller on PC and I play console games on my monitor.

If I play at 60Hz the game looks choppy. If I play at 30Hz the game looks smooth.
 
Pics of your TV reporting these refresh rates? I mean, maybe I could see a game that prefers 1080i when you have them all checked, which is kinda 30fps. But as a general case I'm not convinced, the HD output standards are well defined and most people at this point are going to have their consoles outputting only 1080p (60hz) I would think.

Mmm, it's not happening anymore. I cleary remember that it used to switch from 60 to 30hz, for what that's worth.

Now that I think about it, it stopped doing it after I played the Killzone 2 demo, I remember looking into it without being able to "fix" it, but since it wasn't really a problem I didn't stress it.

I still changes to 24hz when I'm watching a movie though, thankfully.
 
Try RadeonPro's "Always On (Double VSync)" option with "Lock frame rate to monitor's refresh rate" ticked. And Triple Buffering if you want it (but you shouldn't need it since 30FPS is your target).

I've tried this with Watch_Doge and it runs about as smoothly as 30FPS is going to run (lol).
I used to use double V-Sync. It's still choppy. That's why I made the thread :P

If you set your monitor to run at 30Hz, the game has the same fluidity as the console version.
 
My display (LG 34UM95) supports 60Hz, 50Hz and 30Hz in the monitor properties, so this would be no problem. Then again, I have 3 Titans, so I think I'll run Watch Dogs at 60Hz :)
 
You have a point.

I have no idea why consoles look smoother at 30 fps, but I do know that PC games locked to 30 fps running at 60Hz do not look as good.

I would assume it's because you're using a mouse. 30fps is totally fine with a controller, but with a high fidelity input device like a mouse it can appear choppy.
 
OP, have you tried limiting the framerate to 30 FPS with MSI Afterburner (i.e. Riva Tuner Statistics Server), without changing the refresh rate of your monitor? I don't have much experience running games in 30FPS, but sometimes games on PC also produce noticeble stuttering even when running at 60 FPS. Using Afterburner to limit the framerate and D3Doverrider for VSync usually fixes all of that.
 
Yeah that is what I meant. I have 30Hz Interlaced, 50Hz, 59Hz and 60Hz which I have had for a while. I did not select interlaced in CRU.
I had that as well.

I'm assuming CRU looks like this when you open it?
8glpMJC.jpg
 
OP, have you tried limiting the framerate to 30 FPS with MSI Afterburner (i.e. Riva Tuner Statistics Server), without changing the refresh rate of your monitor? I don't have much experience running games in 30FPS, but sometimes games on PC also produce noticeble stuttering even when running at 60 FPS. Using Afterburner to limit the framerate and D3Doverrider for VSync usually fixes all of that.
Yeah, I used to use that as well.

Again, doesn't produce the desired effect.
 
Top Bottom