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[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Third parties have no reason to bail on the X1. In fact, they actually have more reason to support it. I'll give you two main reasons why.


1) Unlike the WiiU, the X1 does not have a relatively strong first party. Microsoft is easily the weakest of the big three on that front. The best microsoft exclusives, bar halo, have always come from third party sources.

2) Xbox owners buy a fuckton of games. The Xbox one still has the highest attach ratio of the big three.

While we may see the slow death of third party exclusives on the X1, its still going offer a huge opportunity for 3rd parties to make money. That alone guarantees it not suffering anything near the same fate as the WiiU.

 

[SwiftDeath]

Huh. Not exactly a gap the XB1 should be too concerned about, but I suppose it is a little worrying that this was during the Titanfall release.

I'm sure the price cut to $450 on the titanfall bundles is not out of concern...

 

[Special C]

Activision may have already started to bail though. But that's not the point. Third party support or no, there's no reason to buy an X1 over a PS4, whereas the Wii U has Nintendo games. X1 is worse off than Wii U outside the States, and domestic may not sustain it either. Right now it seems that it won't be able to overtake Wii U before the holiday season, and that's discounting the Wii U actually has a better lineup.
Sure come the end of the generation it will have done better. But not by much.

I can certainly agree that the PS4 is a more powerful machine, but Xbox One has plenty of great exclusives on the way. Also, some people may just prefer the controller, OS (which IMO is much better than the PS4s after the recent wave of updates), or the XBOX Live ecosystem.

Saying there is NO reason to buy an Xbox One over the PS4 is just a silly thing to say, even the majority of people may prefer the PS4.

 

[quetz67]

That is impossible, there would be a console for one in seven people! Maybe if the population was in the 10s of billions and most of the countries in the world were not poor.

Maybe they were expecting that late in it's life at a mass market price point it would become an inevitable companion to every TV in the world?

It is a mystery to me how such a huge company could misread the market so completely.

 

[spekkeh]

I can certainly agree that the PS4 is a more powerful machine, but Xbox One has plenty of great exclusives on the way. Also, some people may just prefer the controller, OS (which IMO is much better than the PS4s after the recent wave of updates), or the XBOX Live ecosystem.

Saying there is NO reason to buy an Xbox One over the PS4 is just a silly thing to say, even the majority of people may prefer the PS4.

Hmm I was never a fan of Halo, but I guess it could bring a portion of 360 gamers back. Other than that there's Quantum Break, and...?

 

[fedexpeon]

Huh. Not exactly a gap the XB1 should be too concerned about, but I suppose it is a little worrying that this was during the Titanfall release.

Price cut+free game bundle didn't help the X1 as well.
But another factor is that the PS4 is still supply constrained.
It seems that Sony can only produce 1M per month, and 1/3 of their shipment is going to the US.
If you can't win one month in your own home/stronghold with the most hyped game, bundles, retail price cuts, and your competitor has no rapidly supply on stock, how can you win the next month or the following month?
It will always be full of L in your column, while your competitor will always have W in every countries.
The gap will widen, and the network effect will destroy your product even with a 399 price point since it is still an inferior spec console, and no one wants to play on a "dead" console with a weaker spec.
299-350 price point might be needed imo.

 

[Eusis]

Why do people keep forgetting that xbox is the next wii U outside the US and UK? I'm pretty sure if ps4 was selling terrible in the states and being beaten by xbox in Europe, it would be called the next wii u. But somehow the xbox is fine because it is doing well only in one or two places.

An important factor to keep in mind is the hardware too. Wii U is roughly in the same area as the PS3/360, an audience well established and well addressed, so accounting for a third/fourth pillar as it were (depending on if they were already including PC) may not be worth it at this stage of the game. XB1 will have at least some carryover 360 owners and some odd PS3 owners who jumped to the other side because... I dunno, maybe they buy consoles based on which is most expensive. At any rate more of the base transfers, the power level is roughly identical, so it's not a big deal to throw PS4 games onto XB1 so long as sales aren't outright catastrophic. Which I expect to be an actual issue for Japanese games but not any others.

 

[Mory Dunz]

Activision may have already started to bail though. But that's not the point. Third party support or no, there's no reason to buy an X1 over a PS4, whereas the Wii U has Nintendo games. X1 is worse off than Wii U outside the States, and domestic may not sustain it either. Right now it seems that it won't be able to overtake Wii U before the holiday season, and that's discounting the Wii U actually has a better lineup.
Sure come the end of the generation it will have done better. But not by much.

Why do people keep doing this....

 

[GamerJM]

I really can't see the Xbox One struggling on a Wii U-level. Microsoft will be very aggressive with trying to stay competitive with the PS4 this gen. Ultimately they probably won't "win" and they'll probably lag behind by a considerable amount, but I think it's foolish to assume that the Xbox One won't stay relevant. I think that it still has a large potential userbase. I used to doubt brand loyalty, but I think with this generation it's going to be a more significant factor due to the importance of online infrastructure; I'm sure Xbox Live is a system seller to people, be it because they've already invested in the platform or they have friends who they want to play with who have. Additionally Microsoft seems to be pretty successful at marketing Xbox platforms to children and families. Again it's not going to be a PS4-level success but I would bet money on it being much more successful than the Wii U.

....I honestly feel disgusted for having written this since I really don't care for the Xbox One as a platform at all personally and I feel like a bit like a "console warrior" for having written it, but I just don't agree with the notion that it'll end up tanking in sales as time goes on. I just don't see it happening.

 

[FrunkQ]

Microsoft desperation kicking in via Amazon... Just got this offer from Amazon...

ON TOP of the £350 Titanfall bundle...

Simply add an Xbox One console to your basket and get an Xbox Live 12 Month Gold Membership or a selected game, including Kinect Sports Rivals or Call of Duty: Ghosts, for just £30.

You can also get an additional Xbox One Wireless Controller for £20 to expand the gaming fun even further with your new Xbox One bundle.


So £400 nets you:
- XB1
- 2 controllers
- Titalfall
- 12 months gold or another game

An excellent deal and a good chunk "cheaper" in real terms than the PS4. But there is the vague whiff of channel overstock and desperation creeping in now!

But as someone who cancelled the preorder last July I am almost tempted I must say.

 

[Aquamarine]

Activision may have already started to bail though. But that's not the point. Third party support or no, there's no reason to buy an X1 over a PS4, whereas the Wii U has Nintendo games. X1 is worse off than Wii U outside the States, and domestic may not sustain it either. Right now it seems that it won't be able to overtake Wii U before the holiday season, and that's discounting the Wii U actually has a better lineup.
Sure come the end of the generation it will have done better. But not by much.

UK:

Hardware units:

Wii U, 2012-2013 LTD - 150K units at the beginning of December

Xbox One, 2013 - 364K units



Spain (software units):

Wii U, 2012 - 52,000 units

Xbox One, 2013 - 60,000 units


France (hardware units):

Wii U, 2012 - 120K units

Xbox One, 2013 - 126K units


These are all data that run contradictory to the "Xbox One is doing worse off than Wii U" narrative.

 

[Andvary]

Sales be damned. I still plan on buying a Wii U after I get my Xbone. It's actually starting to look pretty unique standing beside the third party twins.

 

[Mory Dunz]

UK:

Hm, even though this is only software, is the Wii U doing better than the Vita in the UK then? (by the sole strength of December it seems). The UK is one of the Wii U's worst territories, I think, so I wonder if it applies to the rest of Europe.

Not that it matters, but I've seen people been mention Vita's Europe performance along with its JP one, and I had doubts...I just like facts.

Hooray for facts. Both systems can occupy obscurity together.

 

[spekkeh]

UK:

Hardware units:

Wii U, 2012-2013 LTD - 150K units

Xbox One, 2013 - 170K units



Spain (software units):

Wii U, 2012 - 52,000 units

Xbox One, 2013 - 60,000 units


France (hardware units):

Wii U, 2012 - 120K units

Xbox One, 2013 - 126K units


These are all data that run contradictory to the "Xbox One is doing worse off than Wii U" narrative.

Ah fair enough, my experience is probably colored by living in a tier 2 country.

 

[MercuryLS]

Some posters are taking crazy pills if you think xb1 is going to completely tank and lose major 3rd party support.

 

[Unknown One]

Unlike the Wii-U, the Xbone is strong enough to get ports. It's Nintendo's own damn fault that they are getting hardly any. Especially with their weak hardware.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Hardware units:

Wii U, 2012-2013 LTD - 150K units

Xbox One, 2013 - 170K units

Technically, XBO was 364K for 2013. But we didn't get a Wii U year end LTD update afaik for more accurate comparison. At any rate, the overall point still stands; the idea that the XBO is doing worse than the Wii U is quite absurd.

It probably won't pass the Wii U in Nintendo's Q1/Microsoft's Q4 shipments; but I imagine it will do so by Jul-Sept quarter end.

The US market performance, trailing the PS4 quite closesly, is in itself largely enough to justify third party development. Furthermore, the XBO installed base is buying more software at retail per system. So I've no idea where these weird ideas about XBO losing support are coming from.

 

[theprodigy]

Speaking of European sales, can someone compile a list of LTDs by country for all the consoles?

edit: particularly for the Wii U, I'm really curious how this breaks down (I know France is 300k)

 

[~~Hasan~~]

.



While we may see the slow death of third party exclusives on the X1, .

Not gonna happen. MS focus on third party exclusive games is what they are best at. look at the exclusive games we got from third party studios in around 6 months. Ryse. DR3, Titan Fall and i am not sure if i am missing something else.

i expect nothing less than 2 or 3 third party exclusives this E3 from MS as well " Sunset overdrive is included"

its what MS lives on. they believe securing a potential big third party exclusive is what bring gamers to their console. and in a way to me at least, is right. because i bought Xbox one for Titan Fall mainly couple of days ago " i want other games but still"

Unlike the Wii-U, the Xbone is strong enough to get ports. It's Nintendo's own damn fault that they are getting hardly any. Especially with their weak hardware.

i don't think weak hardware has anything to do with this. WIIU can get an enhanced port of PS360 games or even equel ports. i honestly do not know why nintendo WIIU isn't selling well. but i believe its the price that what killed it. peopel didn't want to buy 350$ system that has the same graphics of a 200$ console called xbox with less games. it was a stupid idea. in fact, Sony raised the price of PS3 in japan by like 20$ or something when the new ps3 slim slim or whatever it's called arrived.

Nintendo saw this, like the usual old mentality stubborn idiots people, they didn't reduce the price of the system. sales kept going very low and 3rd party developers gave up on nintendo.

and i believe Xbox one will follow the same fate if they didn't reduce the price. however. MS is already doing so with 50$ less and titanfall free of charge. so they are at least smart enough to know there is a problem and trying to fix it.

this is why its good to chage the managment from time to time to fresh new people. and not sticking as a CEO for 15 god damn years

 

[shinra-bansho]

Not gonna happen. MS focus on third party exclusive games is what they are best at. look at the exclusive games we got from third party studios in around 6 months. Ryse. DR3, Titan Fall and i am not sure if i am missing something else.

Two of those aren't third party, they're internally published. The third is available on PC as well, and the franchise is likely going multiplatform. Sunset Overdrive also isn't a third party exclusive.

I'm not really sure where this idea that Microsoft's focus is on having a myriad of third party exclusives is derived. This last generation, where they gained an equal footing, essentially saw the death of the days of third party exclusives - that was what essentially allowed the Xbox to gain an equal footing. Exclusive content deals perhaps, but then both companies engage in co-marketing.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

This is the NPD thread. XB1 is selling more games than the PS4 yet its doomed to a Wii U like future.

 

[quetz67]

This is the NPD thread. XB1 is selling more games than the PS4 yet its doomed to a Wii U like future.

Not sure, I expect Nintendo not to abandon the Wii U, not so sure about MS and XB1.

 

[gtj1092]

Is xb1 actually selling more games or does it have just a higher attach ratio. Isn't the difference less than a half a game. Just curious because I remember Wii had a lower attach ratio but was actually selling more overall software. I know with the UK xone has a higher attach rate but ps4 leads in overall software sales.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

Activision may have already started to bail though. But that's not the point. Third party support or no, there's no reason to buy an X1 over a PS4, whereas the Wii U has Nintendo games. X1 is worse off than Wii U outside the States, and domestic may not sustain it either. Right now it seems that it won't be able to overtake Wii U before the holiday season, and that's discounting the Wii U actually has a better lineup.
Sure come the end of the generation it will have done better. But not by much.

Please tell me you honestly don't believe this.

edit: just saw Aqua's post, lol.

 

[PanicFreak]

Technically, XBO was 364K for 2013. But we didn't get a Wii U year end LTD update afaik for more accurate comparison. At any rate, the overall point still stands; the idea that the XBO is doing worse than the Wii U is quite absurd.

It probably won't pass the Wii U in Nintendo's Q1/Microsoft's Q4 shipments; but I imagine it will do so by Jul-Sept quarter end.

The US market performance, trailing the PS4 quite closesly, is in itself largely enough to justify third party development. Furthermore, the XBO installed base is buying more software at retail per system. So I've no idea where these weird ideas about XBO losing support are coming from.

Spider-Man

 

[Tsundere]

Is xb1 actually selling more games or does it have just a higher attach ratio. Isn't the difference less than a half a game. Just curious because I remember Wii had a lower attach ratio but was actually selling more overall software. I know with the UK xone has a higher attach rate but ps4 leads in overall software sales.

It's just a higher attach rate, which can be explained by less consoles thus less potential double owners.

 

[prag16]

Hmm I was never a fan of Halo, but I guess it could bring a portion of 360 gamers back. Other than that there's Quantum Break, and...?

And Quantum Break probably has a strong chance of showing up on PC at some point.

 

[StreetDisciple]

I have to applaud Sony for turning what was seemingly a colossal disaster (PS3) around and having such great success at the end of its life into the PS4 era. MS is doing well but still have a steep hill to climb . This E3 is going to be do or die for them. I am really interested in the insomniac game that's coming out but that's all I see so far.

 

[andromeduck]

so right now newegg is pushing the XB1 at $450 with included Forza and Titanfall

 

[CadetMahoney]

X1 is worse off than Wii U outside the States, and domestic may not sustain it either.

If only.

 

[allan-bh]

Is xb1 actually selling more games or does it have just a higher attach ratio. Isn't the difference less than a half a game. Just curious because I remember Wii had a lower attach ratio but was actually selling more overall software. I know with the UK xone has a higher attach rate but ps4 leads in overall software sales.

In US Xbox One LTD retail software sales are more than 10% higher than on PS4.

 

[DieH@rd]

Was this some bad late aprils fools joke btw.?

http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/24/xbo...on-lifetime-sales-100-million-xbox-360-units/

No, MS was really deluded that TV/entertaiment integration will push Xbone into every home. They were fully in that mode after May tent presentation before Sony smacked them down at E3 few weeks later.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

In US Xbox One LTD retail software sales are more than 10% higher than on PS4.

Probably offset by DD sales, but the "Xbox One/TitanFall is a failure" thing needs to die. Aqua said in the other thread that the Xbox One, for being a failure, is still selling better than most other gaming systems we look back on and call a success, outside of the PS4 and DSL, and TF is doing about as well as GoW on a smaller userbase.

 

[airmangataosenai]

Why do people keep forgetting that xbox is the next wii U outside the US and UK? I'm pretty sure if ps4 was selling terrible in the states and being beaten by xbox in Europe, it would be called the next wii u. But somehow the xbox is fine because it is doing well only in one or two places.

Yeah, this isn't true. One was always going to lose to the PS4 outside of those two countries anyway just as the 360 did to the PS3.

 

[theprodigy]

off topic: where's the latest PAL charts

 

[KillerMan91]

off topic: where's the latest PAL charts

It's Easter Monday so UK charts are probably delayed by a day.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

Probably offset by DD sales, but the "Xbox One/TitanFall is a failure" thing needs to die. Aqua said in the other thread that the Xbox One, for being a failure, is still selling better than most other gaming systems we look back on and call a success, outside of the PS4 and DSL, and TF is doing about as well as GoW on a smaller userbase.

Do MS not sell DD games?

 

[gtj1092]

In US Xbox One LTD retail software sales are more than 10% higher than on PS4.

Thanks just found the numbers and did the math.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

Do MS not sell DD games?

Of course, but I can definitely see PS4 DD numbers being higher. Not that it matters. I'm just glad they're competitive.

 

[Soulscribe]

It's cool to see both consoles selling at a healthy pace.

 

[Jinfash]

Two of those aren't third party, they're internally published. The third is available on PC as well, and the franchise is likely going multiplatform. Sunset Overdrive also isn't a third party exclusive.

Sunset Overdrive is not an exclusive?

 

[Tsundere]

Two of those aren't third party, they're internally published. The third is available on PC as well, and the franchise is likely going multiplatform. Sunset Overdrive also isn't a third party exclusive.

I'm not really sure where this idea that Microsoft's focus is on having a myriad of third party exclusives is derived. This last generation, where they gained an equal footing, essentially saw the death of the days of third party exclusives - that was what essentially allowed the Xbox to gain an equal footing. Exclusive content deals perhaps, but then both companies engage in co-marketing.

Ummm, I believe you missed the point about the whole third-party thing. They are internally published sure, but these aren't first party developed games; they are completely reliant on third party developers for them. Heck, they're practically completely reliant on third party developers for almost all of their sales so far. Outside of Forza the first party (developed) portfolio is practically barren.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

Of course, but I can definitely see PS4 DD numbers being higher. Not that it matters. I'm just glad they're competitive.

I can't why would they be higher?

 

[N.Domixis]

I can't why would they be higher?

Has more downloadable games? I think the free ps+ games is the reason the attach rate is not as high.

 

[allan-bh]

Sunset Overdrive is not an exclusive?

Microsoft is the publisher.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

To those that don't get it.

One will have at least 50 million users by year six (I expect 80% of them to come from NA) and WiiU will be lucky to hit 15 million units in that same timespan worldwide.

Under no scenario will One lose support and the only region One is outright nonexistent in is Japan (where they haven't launched). WiiU meanwhile is bombing in Nintendo's largest market. Like legit outright bombing. Not like One. One is being outsold yes, and that has to be shaking execs up at MS, but any comparison to WiiU is out and out flawed.

We haven't seen a system like WiiU since the Sega Saturn.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

Has more downloadable games? I think the free ps+ games is the reason the attach rate is not as high.

I think it's the PS+ as well. I seriously doubt there are more DD sales. Downloads, probably.

 

[Dragon]

I think it's the PS+ as well. I seriously doubt there are more DD sales. Downloads, probably.

Uh I don't. There are many many more downloadable titles on PS4.

 

[Salex_]

I think it's the PS+ as well. I seriously doubt there are more DD sales. Downloads, probably.

Why do you refuse to believe the PS4 most likely has higher digital download sales? There's more games on PSN than XBL, there have been many Amazon Digital PSN sales, and promotions like spend $60 and get 10 back from Sony.

 

[ethomaz]

I can take the guys that says the Xbone is selling more game in US when we don't know how much F2P games and digital are making the retail sales be lower for both consoles.

Warframe reached 1.7 million subscriptions in March for example...

And I almost forget the "free" games on PS+.