• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Pelosi declines to endorse Sen. Bernie Sanders' single-payer healthcare bill

Status
Not open for further replies.
F

Fenderputty

Banned
Makonero said:
When will democrats learn: we don't want fucking incremental change!
Click to expand...

When will these berniecrats learn. The legislative process don't give a fuck

Plinko said:
Good for her. Don't underestimate her--she's brilliant.

Single-payer is a huge payroll tax increase that looks awful to most citizens. Start small: fix the ACA, bring in public option, then years down the road move to single-payer.

Jumping instantly to single-payer is a horrible idea and I'm not surprised Bernie is doing it. It could potentially destroy any positive movement in this area.
Click to expand...

This. Go for the public option
 
D

DUFFMCWALIN

Member
Deuce Deuce said:
By what measures? The recent CBO scores of the various Republican healthcare proposals stated that the ACA markets are stable.

The biggest threat atm is from the current administration's shenanigans.
Click to expand...

That's exactly the issue. The fact that the executive branch can withhold payments that can seriously harm the markets show one of the many faults in the ACA (and of the executive branch too). I would rather see a full effort movement on moving to single payer now instead of 30 years when the Dems aren't afraid of their shadows anymore.

edit: Yes yes incremental change is most likely the outcome as long as we all don't die.
 
Schattenjäger

Schattenjäger

Gabriel Knight
Plinko said:
Good for her. Don't underestimate her--she's brilliant.

Single-payer is a huge payroll tax increase that looks awful to most citizens. Start small: fix the ACA, bring in public option, then years down the road move to single-payer.

Jumping instantly to single-payer is a horrible idea and I'm not surprised Bernie is doing it. It could potentially destroy any positive movement in this area.
Click to expand...
Big Bang approach will never work in this country

The roots of the current system are too strong

Incremental change is the only way forward, Obama was smart enough to see that
 
S

Septimus Prime

Member
KSweeley said:
Isn't Universal Health Care the same as single-payer?: https://www.democrats.org/party-platform#universal-health
Click to expand...
They aren't the same, but they work in tandem. Universal Healthcare is what you posted: every citizen is automatically enrolled and covered, so everyone has it—it's universal.

Single-payer is the practice of having only a single entity (the government) doing the underwriting and coverage. The government would also negotiate drug and care prices with tons of leverage, as the sole provider, and together with universal healthcare, it will be able to drive down healthcare costs by amortizing risk over the entire population.

The public option is basically the government acting as an insurer. So you would have a choice of coverage between current, private providers, plus the option to choose public coverage.
 
K

KSweeley

Member
legacyzero said:
The bill is being introduced tomorrow
Click to expand...

Ready Or Not, Here Comes Bernie Sanders And His Single-Payer Plan
Pay attention to the proposal. Pay more attention to what he says about it.

Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) plans to unveil a new version of his “Medicare-for-all” proposal on Wednesday. But the actual substance of the plan may matter less than what he says about it ― and the role he envisions that proposal playing in future debates over how to reform the U.S. health care system.

Why ‘Berniecare’ Is Getting Traction After All These Years

Certainly Sanders has earned the right to talk about Medicare-for-all. He’s among a small group of public officials who have been pushing the idea literally for decades, no matter what the political climate. And if he hadn’t made the concept such a prominent part of his 2016 presidential campaign, nobody but a handful of relatively low-profile progressives would be talking about it now.

Instead, Democratic senators are lining up to co-sponsor his bill, including four (Cory Booker of New Jersey, Kirsten Gillibrand of New York, Kamala Harris of California and Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts) who are potential Democratic presidential candidates for 2020. An even more unexpected endorsement of the concept, if not the Sanders proposal specifically, came last week from Max Baucus, the relatively conservative former Democratic senator from Montana who was a key architect of the Affordable Care Act.
Click to expand...
 
M

massoluk

Banned
DUFFMCWALIN said:
That's exactly the issue. The fact that the executive branch can withhold payments that can seriously harm the markets show one of the many faults in the ACA (and of the executive branch too). I would rather see a full effort movement on moving to single payer now instead of 30 years when the Dems aren't afraid of their shadows anymore.
Click to expand...
Oh. I think you will get to single-payer, I think pushing it right now with doofus with no concept of political machinations and GOP Congress bending over to cut any tax run into real risk of losing ACA on top of not having single-payer
 
G

GillianSeed79

Member
This Democratic party leaderships' support of big, bold policy ideas like this one shows how much they really care about working people and just goes to show how adept they are about firing up their base and instilling passion
In Democratic party supporters to go out and vote in elections for Democratic candidates.

Real talk though - Everybody knows single payer is never going to pass unless Democrats somehow take back the house, senate and White House, which is not happening any time soon. It just sucks that actually supporting a policy your supporters support is a liability and winning office means means having to whore yourself out to centrists and moderates.
 
K

kirblar

Member
GillianSeed79 said:
This Democratic party leaderships' support of big, bold policy ideas like this one shows how much they really care about working people and just goes to show how adept they are about firing up their base and instilling passion
In Democratic party supporters to go out and vote in elections for Democratic candidates.

Real talk though - Everybody knows single payer is never going to pass unless Democrats somehow take back the house, senate and White House, which is not happening any time soon. It just sucks that actually supporting a policy your supporters support is a liability and winning office means means having to whore yourself out to centrists and moderates.
Click to expand...
You're almost there but not quite. If Dems take the House, Senate and White House, Single Payer will still not pass because it does not have near-unanimous support across the party.

(The public option, assuming the fillibuster's killed, WOULD pass in a landslide.)
 
F

Fenderputty

Banned
GillianSeed79 said:
This Democratic party leaderships' support of big, bold policy ideas like this one shows how much they really care about working people and just goes to show how adept they are about firing up their base and instilling passion
In Democratic party supporters to go out and vote in elections for Democratic candidates.

Real talk though - Everybody knows single payer is never going to pass unless Democrats somehow take back the house, senate and White House, which is not happening any time soon. It just sucks that actually supporting a policy your supporters support is a liability and winning office means means having to whore yourself out to centrists and moderates.
Click to expand...

Centrists and moderates are the party. You're just upset they make up enough of a number that the Dems don't whore to you. Boo fucking hoo
 
B

Burt

Member
He's said outright that he knows the bill has literally zero chance of passing and he's only putting it forth to start a discussion. I don't think that having a foolproof budget-feasible proposal is something that's relevant to his aims.
 
M

Mortemis

Banned
kirblar said:
You're almost there but not quite. If Dems take the House, Senate and White House, Single Payer will still not pass because it does not have near-unanimous support across the party.

(The public option, assuming the fillibuster's killed, WOULD pass in a landslide.)
Click to expand...

Why would you assume that?
 
D

DraconisNav

Banned
dehydratedbabies said:
The AMA is imploding.
Click to expand...

The American Medical Association is doing just fine, thank you.

The ACA is struggling due to critical under-funding in key areas and lack of competitive enforcement in others. Both could be fixed by adults in the executive and legislative branch.

Unfortunately they're in short supply.
 
M

Mr.Mike

Member
KSweeley said:
Isn't Universal Health Care the same as single-payer?: https://www.democrats.org/party-platform#universal-health
Click to expand...

Late, but dammit I went through the trouble of finding this.

No. Universal coverage refers to a system where all residents have health coverage. Setting up a single-payer plan, where the federal government pays for all residents' health care, is one path to get to universal coverage — but not the only one.

Some universal-coverage countries have lots of different payers. Japan and Germany, for example, require citizens to enroll in one of dozens of competing health insurance plans (Japan has 3,500 insurance plans; Germany has a more modest 300). These are typically called "multi-payer" health care systems.

There are lots of similarities between single-payer and multi-payer countries like Germany and Japan. All of them, for example, have the government set medical prices at a standard rate. But they're still different paths to getting a country's population insured.
Click to expand...
 
M

Makonero

Member
Beartruck said:
Trump was elected because republicans didn't want incremental change, they wanted big sweeping gestures.

Look how well that's working out...
Click to expand...
They have every branch of government and all the control they want?

Just because they can't agree on anything now that they have power doesn't mean they don't have all the power.
 
K

kirblar

Member
Sanders will introduce universal health care, backed by 15 Democrats (WAPO)

As he described his legislation, Sanders focused on its simplicity, suggesting that Americans would be happy to pay higher taxes if it meant the end of wrangling with health-care companies. The size of the tax increase, he said, would be determined in a separate bill.
Click to expand...
As of Tuesday night, just one senator from a swing state had done so. Sen. Tammy Baldwin (D-Wis.), who as a member of the House had backed Rep. John Conyers Jr. (D-Mich.)'s Medicare for All bill, wrote a Tuesday op-ed for the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel to confirm that she was on board. The Republican Party of Wisconsin, which has struggled to find a first-tier challenger for Baldwin next year, was quick with a statement: ”Senator Tammy Baldwin Embraces Radical $32 Trillion Health Care Takeover."

The $32 trillion figure was based on the Urban Institute's analysis of Sander's 2016 campaign plan. The new bill was different — and so was the confidence Democrats had as they embraced it.
Click to expand...
Mortemis said:
Why would you assume that?
Click to expand...
Because it's all but killed right now and Obama/Reid not nuking it in '09 turned out to be a massive error.
 
S

Slayven

Member
Burt said:
He's said outright that he knows the bill has literally zero chance of passing and he's only putting it forth to start a discussion. I don't think that having a foolproof budget-feasible proposal is something that's relevant to his aims.
Click to expand...

First question is always going to be "Who pays what"
 
M

Mortemis

Banned
kirblar said:
Because it's all but killed right now and Obama/Reid not nuking it in '09 turned out to be a massive error.
Click to expand...

I haven't heard anything about this, last time I checked Trump was the one crying about nuking it and republicans were against the idea.

I guess I haven't been paying too much attention to the tax reform drama, if they're nuking it then they must be desperate to get that through.
 
K

KSweeley

Member
Where Dems stand on Sanders's single-payer bill

Supports Bernie's Bill:

Tammy Baldwin (Wis.)
Richard Blumenthal (Conn.)
Cory Booker (N.J.)
Al Franken (Minn.)
Kirsten Gillibrand (N.Y.)
Kamala Harris (Calif)
Mazie Hirono (Hawaii)
Jeff Merkley (Ore.)
Tom Udall (N.M.)
Elizabeth Warren (Mass.)

Undecided:

Tom Carper (Del.)
Bob Casey Jr. (Pa.)
Joe Manchin (W.Va.)
Charles Schumer (N.Y.)
Chris Van Hollen (Md.)

Not Endorsing:

Tim Kaine (Va.)
Claire McCaskill (Mo.)
Debbie Stabenow (Mich.)
Jon Tester (Mont.)
Click to expand...
 
R

royalan

Member
Plinko said:
Good for her. Don't underestimate her--she's brilliant.

Single-payer is a huge payroll tax increase that looks awful to most citizens. Start small: fix the ACA, bring in public option, then years down the road move to single-payer.

Jumping instantly to single-payer is a horrible idea and I'm not surprised Bernie is doing it. It could potentially destroy any positive movement in this area.
Click to expand...

I also don't expect it to be a very comprehensive bill in the text. But hey, we'll see tomorrow.
 
K

KHarvey16

Member
I can see this making a lot of sense in a world where the president is hungry for deals with the opposition that bring him praise. Killing single payer now, which was never feasible in the near term, to help secure a public option deal would be excellent.
 
L

luckygodzilla

Member
kirblar said:
WaPo has an article up tonight w/ knowledge of what's in it. He punted on the "how do we pay for it" part. Again.
Click to expand...
Because of course he did.

With all three branches of the federal government being firmly red, it's hard not to see why Pelosi is more pre-occupied with protecting what we have rather than introducing new pie in the sky legislation.
 
K

kirblar

Member
legacyzero said:
Ugh this kind of shit is what got the California bill shelved
Click to expand...
Actually doing the math got the Vermont bill shelved!

(California also may not legally be able to raise the funds because of the way the proposition system has shackled their ability to properly fund the government.)
BackLogJoe said:
Are you serious? There are states with no options.
Click to expand...
Not true, they found replacement vendors in the counties w/ pullouts. All are covered in 2018.

This, of course, would not be a problem w/ a public option.
 
F

Fenderputty

Banned
Unknown Soldier said:
Yeah, because killing the filibuster for Cabinet appointments sure worked out so great for them
Click to expand...

There's numerous articles and studies that have Been done about this. The legislative filibuster has benefitted the GOP more than Dems.

Mortemis said:
I haven't heard anything about this, last time I checked Trump was the one crying about nuking it and republicans were against the idea.

I guess I haven't been paying too much attention to the tax reform drama, if they're nuking it then they must be desperate to get that through.
Click to expand...

I'm assuming he meant they fucked with reconciliation enough that it was almost a like for like filibuster blow up.
 
E

Effect

Member
Plinko said:
Except Bernie already said they will look at the amount of tax increase later. Stupid move.
Click to expand...

This is the problem with Sanders as well. He never wants to look at the details of how things are going to work. He always does this! This is the bs he was pulling in the primary. This bill is grandstanding and a stupid attempt at a purity test. Its going to fail. It was always going to fail and why draw attention away from whatever the republicans are still trying to do with the ACA? They have not stopped trying to repeal it. There is suppose to be another attempt this week and even though Hatch says there isn't support for it moves are still being made. This stunt by Sanders makes no damn sense here. It accomplishes nothing positive here. It gives possible media cover to that other repeal attempt!

He should be using his position for calling about what trumps cabinet is doing. Bring attention to trump's people undermining the ACA by not advertising the sign up period for it, using the budget for that to run ads against the damn program and law itself. Where is Bernie on this? What about what trump is doing with national lands? etc? Where is Sanders on a lot of the shit that is in danger and could use a spotlight? No he wants to use his spotlight on a fucking stunt.
 
W

Widdle Puppy

Banned
Why not attach her name to it to at least to further the discussion or at the very least come out and say she is in support of single payer but as of now she is focused on something else ?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Bobby Kotick, former CEO of Activision, Interested in Buying Tik-Tok
2 3
143
7K
Gameplay Gods Bless replied
Kamala Harris to Co-Sponsor Single Payer Healthcare
2 3 4 5
214
23K
Ponn replied
Kamala Harris co sponsors Bernie Sanders medicare for all bill
6
2K
Orbis Tabula replied
Vox: Bernie Sanders outlines his single payer bill
4 5 6 7 8
390
36K
kirblar replied
Sen. Booker Cosponsors Sen. Sanders' Medicare for All
2
70
8K
Azuran replied
Top Bottom