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[mnz]

Companies can't revoke the keys because they are already redeemed when the chargeback comes through. The hacker/scammer who uses the stolen credit card gets paid by g2a, g2a takes a cut from the buyer of the key, and the chargeback comes back to the developer who gets nothing and gave away a copy of the key for free.

G2a is a good idea in that you should be able to sell keys or extra keys, but they facilitate a lot of fraud and bad business as well.

Disabling of redeemed keys happens on Steam.

 

[The Boat]

Haha, wow.

I'd missed that TinyBuid have the face of G2A, PewDiePie as DLC in SpeedRunners.

"Buy our product because PewDiePie endorses it"

"Ignore PewDiePie's endorsement of G2A they are baddies"

Having their cake and eating it.

Despite his close ties to G2A, they are still granting PDP monetization permission for their games. Why are they not taking any steps to distance themselves from him?

This is flat out hypocrisy in my view.

It's almost like they made that DLC before this happened!
Why would they distance themselves (at least so soon after this transpired) from the biggest Youtuber or Twitcher or whatever the fuck he is because of a second degree connection to G2A?

 

[Corronchilejano]

This is nice video that explains some of the G2A stuff

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBakPg6x63Q&feature=youtu.be&a

Damning. A company literally taking advantage of game developers.

 

[shintoki]

Companies can't revoke the keys because they are already redeemed when the chargeback comes through. The hacker/scammer who uses the stolen credit card gets paid by g2a, g2a takes a cut from the buyer of the key, and the chargeback comes back to the developer who gets nothing and gave away a copy of the key for free.

G2a is a good idea in that you should be able to sell keys or extra keys, but they facilitate a lot of fraud and bad business as well.

Ideally,

People who purchase the keys will do chargebacks on G2A and the Devs will remove the keys from Steam.

So the ones who get left holding their dick are G2A. They get hit with chargebacks and the keys are deactivated.

 

[spindoctor]

I still can't understand why they are unable to disable keys that were charged back. This is what they say in their blog update

A lot of people have been asking about revoking keys. It seems like an easy no brainer solution – simply disable the keys that leaked or are being sold illegally. The problem with this is a bit more complex than you might think.

You have some keys which are legit from bundles, others from a bunch of fraudent credit cards, and random keys scavenged from giveaways. These would be from at least 3 different batches. How do we track which one to disable? Now imagine when we have hundreds of these batches.

Large corporations tackle this by having a ton of people working on tracking smaller batches, but we want to stay small & nimble. This means automating as much as possible. And even if we were to spend a ton of time on micromanaging this, it wouldn’t solve the overall problem. Awareness of the general issue is what makes an impact.

You disable the ones that were bought with fraudulent credit cards. That's the one where you are being wronged in the situation. If someone decides to sell a legitimate bundle key or a key they won in a giveaway, it's unfortunate, but it's not even close to being fraud. If bundle/giveaway keys being resold is causing financial harm to your company then you need to stop doing giveaways and bundles. In every case the supply of keys is controlled by you.

And it's laughable that they want G2A to enforce a minimum price on their games being sold.

 

[LordRaptor]

And it's laughable that they want G2A to enforce a minimum price on their games being sold.

If they're the only people capable of generating keys, and keys are being sold at a lower price than they themselves can generate them, outside of wacky brewsters millions style hijinks where someone is trying to lose as much money as possible as fast as possible, its a pretty reasonable assumption to make that those "cheaper than it costs to produce" keys are in fact the product of fraud.

 

[LewieP]

It's almost like they made that DLC before this happened!
Why would they distance themselves (at least so soon after this transpired) from the biggest Youtuber or Twitcher or whatever the fuck he is because of a second degree connection to G2A?

He is the face of G2A. He is one of the highest profile people driving custom towards G2A.

 

[Micael]

Damning. A company literally taking advantage of game developers.

I wouldn't take that video at face value, it is basing itself on quite a lot of information that is either unproven or straight up wrong.

If they're the only people capable of generating keys, and keys are being sold at a lower price than they themselves can generate them, outside of wacky brewsters millions style hijinks where someone is trying to lose as much money as possible as fast as possible, its a pretty reasonable assumption to make that those "cheaper than it costs to produce" keys are in fact the product of fraud.

It would be yes, however they aren't being sold at "cheaper than it costs to produce", because as been pointed out in this topic, the game has been bundled 5 times already, and has had many discounts, and has been sold in other regions at reduced prices and so on, the average price is well above the minimum price the game has been at.

 

[The Boat]

He is the face of G2A. He is one of the highest profile people driving custom towards G2A.

Yet, he has nothing to with this. Considering they have some sort of relationship with him, that they worked on the DLC and that he's influential, I see no reason for them to run and cut ties with him in a hurry.

 

[KingV]

If they're the only people capable of generating keys, and keys are being sold at a lower price than they themselves can generate them, outside of wacky brewsters millions style hijinks where someone is trying to lose as much money as possible as fast as possible, its a pretty reasonable assumption to make that those "cheaper than it costs to produce" keys are in fact the product of fraud.

If steam didn't let Devs generate keys for literally $0, you might be onto something

 

[Durante]

If they're the only people capable of generating keys, and keys are being sold at a lower price than they themselves can generate them, outside of wacky brewsters millions style hijinks where someone is trying to lose as much money as possible as fast as possible, its a pretty reasonable assumption to make that those "cheaper than it costs to produce" keys are in fact the product of fraud.

Except if they sold their game as part of <$5 bundle tiers before. Which they did, multiple times (as well as giveaways).

 

[LordRaptor]

the game has been bundled 5 times already

Except if they sold their game as part of <$5 bundle tiers before. Which they did, multiple times (as well as giveaways).

Yeah, this is where it gets trickier, particularly as the "statute of limitations" for chargebacks can be so far past the point at which people would reasonably assume a customer was satisfied with the purchase being non-fraudulent.

If steam didn't let Devs generate keys for literally $0, you might be onto something

the cost to a producer to generate those keys is irrelevant; if they set a price, that is the minimum price that product is sold for.

This is different to things like regional price discrimination, or things like larger publishers having regional product managers who have targets to hit and can bulk sell keys cheaper than the publisher fixed price in order to meet regional sales targets, both of which can be manipulated by resellers as 'grey market' sales.

 

[Jacksinthe]

The problem is that sale prices aren't meant to last. I don't know how you would draw the line between buying a bunch of keys for cheap to gift to friends later and buying a bunch of keys to resell at near full price. I do think that something needs to change on that front though.

It's not 1 sale price. It's the frequency of sales.

Also, you can easily identify "a bunch of keys" for "friends" or "resale".

How often do "friends" spend thousands of dollars on thousands of keys in one go? Most people don't buy games for everyone on their Facebook friends list.

Also, country of IP origin is also a tell.

Not difficult to flag and limit sales of keys per IP from suspicious locations.

Unless you just don't give a fuck how your site is abused alongside developers like G2A.

 

[KingV]

the cost to a producer to generate those keys is irrelevant; if they set a price, that is the minimum price that product is sold for.

In your earlier post you're talking about detecting fraud by looking for keys that cost less than it costs to generate them.

I assume you mean less than it costs to purchase them?

You can see what you're talking about at work with Devs that don't devalue their own game by selling it in bundles for less than $1. Ark, is 19 euros on G2A right now, because it hasn't been devalued by the developer by selling keys in a non-monthly humble bundle.

 

[DieAntwoord]

I don't use key sites but I see why they're popular. If developers both AAA and Indie Alike stopped charging retail prices for a key and data (which cost nearly nothing to host) than maybe sites like G2A could be beaten at their own game. There's no reason for a AAA game to cost 60 dollars on release considering there's no console manufacturers involved, no disc to be pressed, no retail establishments to contract with, no real employees to pay for selling your product and you truly expect to drop 60 bucks on release for a PC title?

I don't buy anything on PC unless it drops to under 20 bucks (which it does, constantly, many times cheaper.) because there's no reason for them to cost so much because publishers and developers receive MUCH higher cuts than if they we're retail. A PC developer will get the same profit at selling their game at 20 dollars (assuming they get 70% trough digital sales) because a 60 dollar game will net them 12 dollars profit after all is said and done once Best Buy/Gamestop/etc and Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo get their share. On the PC there isn't ANY of that.

It's usually steam (who pays out 80%!), gamersgate, GreenManGaming, etc and the developer. Digital PC games are a scam and many people who buy keys know this. That is why they're so popular. So until these developers stop trying to put wool over the eyes of that particular market expect the Gray Market to stay around. And I can't help but on paper support it. Because the state of digital gaming and pricing is a sham and they know it.

 

[omnislayer]

He is the face of G2A. He is one of the highest profile people driving custom towards G2A.

I had no idea he was affiliate with them. Now I know to avoid him now. Thanks.

 

[WordAssassin]

I bought my first key from CDKeys recently. Attempted to pay through Skrill at first because that was the default. That payment was flagged and declined by my credit card company. So I switched to PayPal payment, which worked.

A couple of days later I had 2 fraudulent charges on my card, both to match.com (of all places), in various amounts. I had to call my card company and go through the entire fraud process.

Maybe it's a complete coincidence, but I've never had fraud charges and none of my charge activity has been out of the ordinary except for that one purchase. Personally I won't be buying from CDKeys again. I'll just wait for a regular price drop through an actual retailer, like Steam, Best Buy, or Amazon.

That sounds like an issue with Skrill. Never ever use them, just a quick google sounds like so many people have these types of problems. Doesn't default to them on my end, which makes that extra weird.

Personally, I've spent £528.55 with them in the last 12 months and nothing untoward has happened with me.

Same as any online store really, they get their games from distributors and sell on the keys essentially.

I've got no stake in CDKeys so I wasn't trying to convince you of using them, it was more that if Skrill is ever an option, never use it!

Fuuuck!!!

I just had a very similar issue. I tried to buy something off CDK using my PayPal but it wouldn't go through. So I thought, ok, that happened sometimes, I'll just use my card. So that Skrill thing popped up with a Verified by Visa or whatever box. Paid for it that way, immediately got a fraud alert on my credit card. I figured that since it was an out of the country site that was why, cleared the charge, and used another card. Same thing, immediately rejected the card. Unable to see this as something shady, merely annoying dealing with an out of country merchant, I OK'd the charge and then paid again and this time it went through.

Just checked my bank account and it's fine... but now I'm gonna be super paranoid. I wonder if I should call the bank and let them know so they can keep an extra eye on it? Maybe I'll just have them send me new cards anyway. I'll give it till Monday, nothing's gonna be able to be done over the weekend anyway and my bank's fraud system is really good so hopefully if something happens it won't take long to sort out. Ugh all for $10 Halo Collection and $2 Alan Wake. I hope nothing happens ):

Not gonna use Skrill ever again, even if nothing happens to me. Thankful as fuck I checked this thread.

 

[CrashPrime]

Every time I see a developer complaining about key resellers and fraud, I never see any action to deactivate chargebacks.

Do it.

 

[inner-G]

I never see any action to deactivate chargebacks.

Do it.

.

They absolutely should

 

[KojiKnight]

Ideally,

People who purchase the keys will do chargebacks on G2A and the Devs will remove the keys from Steam.

So the ones who get left holding their dick are G2A. They get hit with chargebacks and the keys are deactivated.

Except G2A also offers 'insurance', in other words they get some extra money and that covers them on that as well.

 

[Hasney]

Fuuuck!!!

I just had a very similar issue. I tried to buy something off CDK using my PayPal but it wouldn't go through. So I thought, ok, that happened sometimes, I'll just use my card. So that Skrill thing popped up with a Verified by Visa or whatever box. Paid for it that way, immediately got a fraud alert on my credit card. I figured that since it was an out of the country site that was why, cleared the charge, and used another card. Same thing, immediately rejected the card. Unable to see this as something shady, merely annoying dealing with an out of country merchant, I OK'd the charge and then paid again and this time it went through.

Just checked my bank account and it's fine... but now I'm gonna be super paranoid. I wonder if I should call the bank and let them know so they can keep an extra eye on it? Maybe I'll just have them send me new cards anyway. I'll give it till Monday, nothing's gonna be able to be done over the weekend anyway and my bank's fraud system is really good so hopefully if something happens it won't take long to sort out. Ugh all for $10 Halo Collection and $2 Alan Wake. I hope nothing happens ):

Not gonna use Skrill ever again, even if nothing happens to me. Thankful as fuck I checked this thread.

Hey, those are some good, cheap games! It was worth it!

Odds are that you won't be affected, but if you want to be safe, just ask for a new card from your bank.

 

[Froli]

Lirik and Jackfags said they won't be renewing their contract with G2A. I hope Pewdie follows suit.