DXB-KNIGHT
Member
But there was a thread where said they are supporting this game, so their is a form of support.
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Yu Suzuki: I expect individual backers to provide the majority of funds for Shenmue
- Thread starter ShogunDarius
- Start date
lol obviously the later.
thanks for the heads-up didn't now you get a copy when you help funding.
Chaos2Frozen
Member
And you think that support is unlimited funding or something? Please read before you comment anything.
justsomeguy
Member
Err.. Sony would be more entitled to game sale profits if they poured $20 million into the project compared to a backer who donates $60 who does get a return via getting the game itself.
the support is an unknown amount of logistics and possible marketing
the funding support is below the $2 million kickstarter amount
that's not a lot, in context to what this game needs
Opus Angelorum
Member
It will be using a modern engine no doubt, and as it's only targeting current generation hardware I imagine it will require a fairly decent PC.
I take your point though.
DidntKnowJack
Member
I think you missed something. The main thrust of this conversation is how Sony is not funding the game. Sure they'll assist in some marketing, but that's not going to get the game made. Not the entire game we'd all like to get, anyway.
edit: Or I should say they're not funding a substantial amount.
this has really become sort of a mess.
i don't know what yu suzuki expected, but there should be way better management of this project. the igavania project was fucking fantastic from how it involved the community to how updates were slowly revealed, and how stretch goals felt like they had weight. more than that, the question of sony's involvement was always there. the game was announced on their stage so obviously people were going to wonder. and if suzuki needed $8m-10m to make a game he thought he could have been proud of, then he could have come out and said so from the start. making a visual novel because eh, why not, is a kind of shit thing to do to the people who have supported you the most.
i don't know what yu suzuki expected, but there should be way better management of this project. the igavania project was fucking fantastic from how it involved the community to how updates were slowly revealed, and how stretch goals felt like they had weight. more than that, the question of sony's involvement was always there. the game was announced on their stage so obviously people were going to wonder. and if suzuki needed $8m-10m to make a game he thought he could have been proud of, then he could have come out and said so from the start. making a visual novel because eh, why not, is a kind of shit thing to do to the people who have supported you the most.
DXB-KNIGHT
Member
Forget the console wars and Shenmu for a moment and think that way
This is the 1st kickstarter that was pushed by a giant cooperation at e3 even by just exposure, and no one think that giant cooperation do things just for good will since there is no good will when it comes to money.
It's just natural that some projects at kickstarter are mad.
This is the 1st kickstarter that was pushed by a giant cooperation at e3 even by just exposure, and no one think that giant cooperation do things just for good will since there is no good will when it comes to money.
It's just natural that some projects at kickstarter are mad.
Sephiroth_VII
Member
Quick and dirty translation of the Andrew House bit:
The bolded bit is crucial, and I'm absolutely solid about the translation.AV Watch interview with Andrew House said:
Maintenance
Member
Poor Shenmue, caught in the console wars crossfire.
HighResTomato
Member
I don't think even $10m will be enough to make the game that everyone has been dreaming about, especially in 2 years.
It was Suzukis choice to make it a console exclusive he should demand more money from Sony.
It was Suzukis choice to make it a console exclusive he should demand more money from Sony.
DidntKnowJack
Member
Why do people keep saying this? I'm not saying its untrue, I'm just unsure where this is coming from specifically.
chromatic9
Member
Seems you're not understanding.
Of course various negations could be happening or not
To try and help you, perhaps look at Chris Roberts of Star Citizen fame , how that was handled early on.
This Shenmue thing could've been handled a lot better. Too many are in the dark and also many assumptions and cost of development based of wrong info of old games are going around.
One bad thing right now is how people think its mostly funded by Sony and even saying Sony should now refund the 2 million now they reached the goal. Press and fans alike think this
I have to post info on a Giant Bomb after show with Adam Boyes stating how large funding isn't possible. It's not possible with Microsoft either due to ip rights.
So please stop with the quotes and accept this can be handled in a much better way with a bit more info for the fans to act or not
As I've posted in a few other Shenmue threads this week, if you want to understand Sony's relationship with this game look at Grim Fandango Remastered, the game that Boyes announced at E3 last year. Like Shenmue 3, that was managed through SCEA's third party productions group under Boyes, it was self-published by the original dev under licence and it was PS4/PC with other platforms TBA. Sony's involvement is in providing publicity and making things happen, but definitely not publishing or financing the game apart from possibly a pub fund type arrangement (which is basically a loan against future revenue), not tens of millions of dollars as some seem to think!
It was a mistake not to be clear about this from the start. Fortunately there's plenty of time left to improve the Kickstarter.
It was a mistake not to be clear about this from the start. Fortunately there's plenty of time left to improve the Kickstarter.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
It's frustrating when it happens to something you've backed, but pretty much every single gaming kickstarter attracts hordes of these people eager to drum up controversy and talk about how the developer somehow is screwing over everyone that backs the project. It's quite annoying and always comes off as condescending, as if these concern trolls are saying they are just so much smarter than everyone who has pledged money.
Don't let them get to you, and don't worry, in the end they have absolutely no effect. Kickstarters naturally start out really strong, then fade off majorly before getting another rush right at the end.
Its getting misconstrued again. I dont think Yu is saying "10 million for my vision, for this to be open world" I think he's just saying "It will be a REALLY fucking open world if I hit $10m". Which I think is if all his stretch goal ideas are implemented. As it stands the villages and exploration will be there but its not going to be as expansive in side quests and all other things as it will be if it hit that goal.
Its not going to be an on rails QTE experience, no matter no how. Jesus.
i don't think much choice was involved in this.
as for those andrew house quotes, that's the first that's been heard about it being console exclusive and does not match up with the kickstarter, and what adam boyes/gio corsi/john drake have been saying so he may be mistaken
like i said, if xbox fans want shenmue, ask phil spencer for it. there's still time before the kickstarter ends to make an agreement.
Oh cool, then I'm also entitled to a percentage of sales for my backing of Bloodstained right? Same goes for people who backed Mighty No. 9? Yup, we need them receipts!
Kwansu Dudes
Member
In previous threads, some users were against this because of Sony's involvement and that the game wasn't coming to other consoles. They've seemed to have disappeared though.
So Sony gave Suzuki a very minor amount of cash and a place to sell Shenmue 3 at their conference? Is that what i'm hearing?
No wonder they are using Kickstarter. Well, its not as if a publisher is gonna want to touch this considering Sega's aversion
No wonder they are using Kickstarter. Well, its not as if a publisher is gonna want to touch this considering Sega's aversion
While that might be true, I don't think that it's a certainty. If the statement we have to go on is (paraphrasing) "I expect that contributions from individual backers will exceed contributions from publishers", then outside publishers kicking in <= $2m is only the case if he "expects" that the Kickstarter campaign will only provide the minimum $2m goal.
But by the time he made that statement, the Kickstarter itself was already well over $3m, and after the success of recent campaigns, I can't imagine that his expectations were any less than $4-5m.
Obviously that's not proof that he's secured more than $2m, and it's perfectly consistent with his outside investment coming to much less than that, but it's also consistent with a similar level of publisher backing to what Bloodstained received. The only thing we can really tell for certain is that he's not getting some massive AAA-style cash injection, and that the level of outside funding is almost certainly in the seven-figure range.
This is all so messy. By obfuscating how the game is actually being funded, they've cast a huge shadow over the actual announcement and have left people second guessing what the hell is really going on and what type of end product they can realistically expect.
I have no real stake in this - I never played 1 or 2 but backed the KS for $29 because, regardless of never having played the series, it's Shenmue fucking 3. But I'm feeling a bit sorry for the fans. It's a KS, no wait Sony are heavily involved, no wait we need to get to 10 million on KS to make the game I really want to make.
They've really damaged the perception of this KS by not being open and honest. I think they could have made a lot more if they had just come out and said we need 10 million.
Maybe behind the scenes things are crystal clear. I don't know. But publicly they've communicated things terribly.
I have no real stake in this - I never played 1 or 2 but backed the KS for $29 because, regardless of never having played the series, it's Shenmue fucking 3. But I'm feeling a bit sorry for the fans. It's a KS, no wait Sony are heavily involved, no wait we need to get to 10 million on KS to make the game I really want to make.
They've really damaged the perception of this KS by not being open and honest. I think they could have made a lot more if they had just come out and said we need 10 million.
Maybe behind the scenes things are crystal clear. I don't know. But publicly they've communicated things terribly.
DidntKnowJack
Member
What are you talking about? It was always PC and PS4, they even said that at the KS announcement.
Sony are bringing both Yin and Yang to this.
On the one hand, they're obviously doing what they can to make the PS4 version a reality, and the marketing support at the time of release will give the game a big chance of being a relative success. Using their E3 stage to announce the kickstarter definitely helped with the initial surge of backers.
On the other hand, they seem to have positioned themselves to get the maximum reflected glory from the project without putting their hands very deep in their pockets, and it's not at all clear whether the final total for the kickstarter will be any different, or even worse, than it might have been if it was announced elsewhere.
I don't think anybody really made a bad decision here, but in hindsight, keeping Sony at arms length until the Kickstarter had concluded seems it would have been the safest bet.
On the one hand, they're obviously doing what they can to make the PS4 version a reality, and the marketing support at the time of release will give the game a big chance of being a relative success. Using their E3 stage to announce the kickstarter definitely helped with the initial surge of backers.
On the other hand, they seem to have positioned themselves to get the maximum reflected glory from the project without putting their hands very deep in their pockets, and it's not at all clear whether the final total for the kickstarter will be any different, or even worse, than it might have been if it was announced elsewhere.
I don't think anybody really made a bad decision here, but in hindsight, keeping Sony at arms length until the Kickstarter had concluded seems it would have been the safest bet.
Black Republican
Member
Goddammit shenmue fans. The infighting is ssd
I just think it boils down to that
it probably doesnt I know, but what a mess if this ends up inferior because theres no one to blame but ourselves
Fair enough its not a game an individual wants or on a platform they can enjoy - but what do you get from poisoning the well? That goes double for the shitty games 'journalists' and their concern...
ps3ud0 8)
Shin
Banned
What are you guys talking about some projects being mad at KS?
I'm missing something...
We can whine, cry, bitch, moan all we want but the fact remains that no-one did a thing in the past 14 years to help bring this title back to life.
And now that it is it's not good either, if you want or have to blame someone then blame the people of your respected console(s) because they didn't do shit to realize this game.
We got some great announcements this E3, historical ones yet almost every thread has to be shat on.
I'm missing something...
We can whine, cry, bitch, moan all we want but the fact remains that no-one did a thing in the past 14 years to help bring this title back to life.
And now that it is it's not good either, if you want or have to blame someone then blame the people of your respected console(s) because they didn't do shit to realize this game.
We got some great announcements this E3, historical ones yet almost every thread has to be shat on.
This is how I feel. There are way too many idiots with a keyboard that act like they know more about what's going on then the people who have actually played the series and have followed the kickstarter closely. The Shenmue fans don't need your help. If you don't want to fund the game then don't.
Neff
Member
I'm not convinced. If Kickstarter contributions were so important, the goal wouldn't have been set so low.
I'm sure they want to get as much as they can to help with the budget, but I'm also fairly sure Sony will have chipped in a cool 10-20m of their own at the very least.
This whole thing has been fishy from the beginning. The only reason I pledged is out of respect for YS.
I'm sure they want to get as much as they can to help with the budget, but I'm also fairly sure Sony will have chipped in a cool 10-20m of their own at the very least.
This whole thing has been fishy from the beginning. The only reason I pledged is out of respect for YS.
UltraGunner
Banned
I think announcing it at e3 did harm it a lot. It gave the impression that Sony was financially backing this up.
Sephiroth_VII
Member
Andrew House is the CEO of SCEI. He's at the top, so his word should be taken as final, I would say. And I'm absolutely certain about that part of my translation, too.
I think that things at this point are work in progress and can change.
This is the current deal and situation but once the Kickstarter is over all the parts involved will have a meeting and make a final decision. They need to decide on the scope of the project.
They won't be able to make a full Shenmue experience just with Kickstarter money, the game will be more like a Telltale game series if they rely just on that.
At current rate Kickstarter could end at 5-6 millions. I don't see Sony not putting in an other 4-5 million given the interest and resonance the title has created also for themselves if Suzuki can make a much better game in that way. For them it's nothing, they finance a lot of things with a fraction of the interest generated interest here. Of course it still won't be the budget of a modern AAA game but that was obvious since the beginning.
This is the current deal and situation but once the Kickstarter is over all the parts involved will have a meeting and make a final decision. They need to decide on the scope of the project.
They won't be able to make a full Shenmue experience just with Kickstarter money, the game will be more like a Telltale game series if they rely just on that.
At current rate Kickstarter could end at 5-6 millions. I don't see Sony not putting in an other 4-5 million given the interest and resonance the title has created also for themselves if Suzuki can make a much better game in that way. For them it's nothing, they finance a lot of things with a fraction of the interest generated interest here. Of course it still won't be the budget of a modern AAA game but that was obvious since the beginning.
Where is that guy who said Sony would fund the majority of the project by themselves?
Oh here it is. :lol
Oh here it is. :lol
i was pulling my information from the famitsu article which apparently was written before the kickstarter went live. so to my knowledge it's still accurate that sony and other additional funding sources will be kicking in sub-$2 million.
Nightengale
Member
Sigh.
Assuming this doesn't get back on track, my suggestion (mainly aimed to Boyes if he's reading this) is that they set up Kickstarter Part 2 sometime next year for the remaining budget, with a far better campaign initiative ala Bloodstained.
Release some sort of vertical slice of the demo, maybe the first hour of the game or so. Or work a deal with SEGA to get a Shenmue I/II port out there, and use that as a platform to get additional KS funding.
Whatever, I'm just throwing ideas out here. Yu Suzuki will probably get enough money to make Shenmue 3-lite, once they sort out their tier-list, get this message out, etc, but we need to figure out all the options to make the 10 million funding a reality.
Guys, gals! Whoever else has any idea, marketing/business skills to craft a master plan, BY YOUR POWERS COMBINED!
Assuming this doesn't get back on track, my suggestion (mainly aimed to Boyes if he's reading this) is that they set up Kickstarter Part 2 sometime next year for the remaining budget, with a far better campaign initiative ala Bloodstained.
Release some sort of vertical slice of the demo, maybe the first hour of the game or so. Or work a deal with SEGA to get a Shenmue I/II port out there, and use that as a platform to get additional KS funding.
Whatever, I'm just throwing ideas out here. Yu Suzuki will probably get enough money to make Shenmue 3-lite, once they sort out their tier-list, get this message out, etc, but we need to figure out all the options to make the 10 million funding a reality.
Guys, gals! Whoever else has any idea, marketing/business skills to craft a master plan, BY YOUR POWERS COMBINED!
Or some people would have seen Shenmue as boring, tedious and overrated and not donated at all.
Unless people actually paid attention to Adam Boyes when he said that this was strictly Suzuki's thing when introducing it and they were mostly just giving him a stage to announce it.
I feel like Sony's involvement is just going to mostly be along the lines of marketing the game, sending out free dev kits, and helping with coding issues. So basically the standard stuff they've always been doing for indie studios.
HighResTomato
Member
It's such a weird thing to say.
Wanting fans to finance the MAJORITY of the cost. But a third party gets the game as a marketing/console exclusive.
I'm hoping this is not the case, because that would be truly scummy.
Wanting fans to finance the MAJORITY of the cost. But a third party gets the game as a marketing/console exclusive.
I'm hoping this is not the case, because that would be truly scummy.
it cost around $80m. but it also was in development for about 5-6 years, starting on the saturn and ending on the dreamcast.
from the kickstarter:
still sounds like an open door to me.
he may be at the top, but the kickstarter as well as corsi/boyes/drake all contradict that. in the case of corsi/boyes/drake, they are all closer to the matter and i would think would know the details more exactly/intimately
Ok, I need to be able to give more than 120$. If I eat only bread and bananas for a while, I can do it.
Honestly I was happy at first with 120$, but now I really want to give more. Not for any stretch goal, but for the core game to be as good as it can possibly be with Kickstarter funds.
Honestly I was happy at first with 120$, but now I really want to give more. Not for any stretch goal, but for the core game to be as good as it can possibly be with Kickstarter funds.
A 15 year late sequel to one of the most notorious financial failures in gaming history? I'd say there's a pretty compelling reason.
It was pretty obvious all along that the kickstarter will be it's main funding. It's not going to get a massive AAA budget. The original games wouldn't even need it if they were made today; and while at best you'd hope for some evolution over the originals if you want a truly ambitious project it'd probably be a pretty stupid idea to tie it to an old failed franchise and have it be a direct story continuation. It'll mostly be a fun little nostalgia romp.
Sephiroth_VII
Member
Why, exactly? It's not like fans providing the funding get nothing in return.