And the development costs SHOULD be cheaper. So even if there is less sales the income might be the same.
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Fortune: Nintendo started talking to 3rd parties at E3 about NX; reception positive
- Thread starter thefro
- Start date
And the development costs SHOULD be cheaper. So even if there is less sales the income might be the same.
Do these cartridges use batteries?
Exactly.
Now just for arguments sake (no lol Nintendo fans and their hopes and dreams please) Ubisoft for example could be very happy with porting over Assassin's Creed 2016 to NX if they gain two more platforms to sell it on. If the opportunity cost for making the game run on both platforms isn't that high, they could get more money out of it themselves. If that's the case I could see several third parties giving it a shot. It won't, but it would be nice.
Yeah, I don't necessarily disagree. I'm sure there are other factors we aren't considering, but it just feels they are effectively going from two systems to just one. I hope they go that route, but I'm a little skeptical right now. Us fans sometimes talk ourselves into cool ideas that never materialize. I remember feeling really burned after the Wii U Speculation Threads when a lot of the cool ideas we thought had to happen just never did.
If that's the case, then we're basically looking at an Nvidia Shield situation, but with Nintendo games. Honestly, that's not half bad. That still begs the question of third parties. If this is the kind of thing we're looking forward to, then AAA ports could be out of the question.
I definitely agree. That's one of the reasons why the NES, SNES, Genesis, Neo-Geo, etc. days were much fun.
Back before the N64/PS1/Saturn generation came, 3rd party publishers wanted to move to discs because they contained more space than cartridges & were much cheaper to manufacture than cartridges were, as games back then were getting larger than what carts could hold.
Today? Things could change & we could possibly see a return to cartridges on consoles for physical media in the future, as we're getting to the point where SDXC cards, etc. have caught up to Blu-Ray on space & speeds (& possibly on manufacturing costs as well), especially as Blu-Ray isn't exactly doing too hot within the world in sales & in everything else.
Nintendo could release hardware apple style if they want since they are going the ios route. So technically Sony and MS could always play catch up.
If I was Nintendo I'd upgrade hardware every two years or so, maybe even license it out to a Samsung or Alienware/ dell as well. The potential of an IOS like set up is huge if they do if right. After all like IOS, Nintendo or other party could put out powerful hardware but still allow previous versions to play the new games.
Nintendo could disrupt the industry if they play it right.
GameGuru59
Banned
My God. That's like PS3 level graphics... on a phone. The console should and must be more powerful, but that's not a bad base spec to shoot for.
nothing more needs to be said.
Hahahaha best comment!
I don't think AAA games would be able to scale down far enough but in essence that's the idea.
Well I think that Nintendo is effectively done with the AAA space and I think it's a good idea. I think the idea is to leverage the great support for Nintendo's handhelds in Japan and then try to scoop up as many Vita and mobile developers as possible.
I think there's a real opportunity for Nintendo to carve their own niche with a different, unique type of software. By making software available across their different form factors it also helps make games more globally viable(handheld in Japan, home console in West).
However, I wouldn't rule out the possibility of the home console being just powerful enough to receive some ports like COD. It would have to be a viable market first though.
EDIT:
Well yeah, I expect the console will be more powerful but I expect a floor close to that for the handheld. It's easier to work up than down too.
Especially for a handheld.
infiniteheteroskdasticity
Member
If it's not x86 there will be little to no 3rd party support. Sony started talking to the third parties 3 years before the ps4 launched. By this point all large 3rd party devs had ps4 devkits and some of the smaller indies started to get them too. Nintendo has left it too late if this e3 is really when they started talking about it.
Warm Machine
Member
They have been knocking out significant upgrades to those chips every year. They pretty well doubled graphics power from the last go around. By E3 2016 they should have something approaching an Xbox One that uses mobile level efficiencies. Put in really good low level access to the GPU with fast RAM and graphics power won't be much of an issue especially if mobile is the focus.
No, because like we told Warm Machine, Nintendo shot down the idea of that kind of hybrid from Day 1. They're making a separate console & handheld.
But why bother when you can go for an AMD chip set that's a decent bit above the PS4 by that time? This is more so if they go with ARM for both the console & handheld versions.
Unlike the PS3, Wii U has no signs of recovery. It doesn't have the 3rd party support that is needed to fill out the schedule.
Arkam
Member
Basically. They told us (by us I mean the company bigwigs) that it was very similar to the Xbox360 but with more power. They said it would be easy to port current games on ps3/360 with ease and have plenty of resources to enhance them. Then the corporate head office got the first dev kit and ran some benchmarks... It was pretty disappointing. But even then we held out hope that the iteration they got was the real deal. Then our kit arrived and confirmed that the wiiu was not the box we had expected.
We ultimately cancelled all our planned wiiu games due to this. We had not allocated the resources to completely rebuild our projects to span wiiu and 360/ps3. A couple of our studios did eventually do some late ports that turned out ok, but took too large of a resource to accomplish and sold poorly.
All that said I am a huge nintendo fan still (play tons of wiiu) and very hopeful of the NX. If Nintendo is being honest with third party and they like it, they might just woo them back.
I'm pretty certain this is in regards to allowing/developing their IPs for (EDIT) existing smart devices, not their own dedicated console and/or handheld. Even the bolded portion of the quote indicates this. Do you have a link for the quote?
Jorok Goldblade
Member
When have they done that? Wii U launched Holiday 2012, the x86 twins launched Holiday 2013.
I love a lot of the games I've played on my Wii U, but there's no way Nintendo can give that box a six year lifespan.
evilromero
Member
If Zelda U is a launch game on NX I'll be first in line. It would be like the Wii launch all over again. Come home to the most epic launch game imaginable and hopefully a racing game like Excite or Wave Race NX.
1. ARM is more prevalent than x86 and probably more relevant to the developers Nintendo would be targetting. It doesn't really matter much in modern development as I understand it anyway.
2. It's pretty much guaranteed that some publishers have known about it for a quite a while, especially Nintendo's close Japanese partners.
It hurts so much.
To be fair there was support from all of those developers in the very beginning. They DID bring Tekken, Ghost Recon Online, Arkham City, Darksiders 2, etc. It's just that the Wii U didn't sell well. You really can't blame these developers for that. But I guess obviously the point you're making is that positive reception means nearly nothing if the support isn't actually there at launch and throughout the console's life time.
Interceptor
Banned
Huh? Of course it´s for their smart devices. That´s what we are talking about. Different software for Nx and smart devices. One type of software for the NX family, one type of software for mobiles.
And yes: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/corporate/release/en/2015/150317/03.html
You said: 6. "Nintendo wants its mobile and home devices to be unified and play the same games/use the same services" which is not going to happen.. unless you were talking about handhelds and not mobile aka smartphones.
Ghost Recon Online never came. And the other's were late ports.
interesting
Sounds like what I remember reading on the situation. Nintendo sent out a spec sheet and presented a console that would be more powerful than what they delivered in dev kits. After everything was said and done it certainly lined up with what you were saying back during that pre-launch period.
Agreed. Not sure on the partnerships, but if a version console is ever going to exist on the market - a console that is upgraded every two years but functions much like the mobile phone market where most games are playable on all variations, with some only on the latest and greatest - it would be Nintendo. It takes someone extremely bold and in a position to take a big risk like that (aka, needing to change up the home console game) to pull it off. Nintendo has proven to be bold. They talk at length about the united iOS platform before. I am thinking they feel console generations are sometimes too long to keep up with tech, and they will use that next year to announce the NX and the planned "shorter" lifespans.
Warm Machine
Member
Stop taking what Nintendo says as gospel before they have yet to reveal what it is they are making. They are not going to tell you any kind of truth until their whole plan is made plainly public. This happens time and time again when things leak in this industry. We get denials all the way until reveal. The hybrid thing was a guess I made about 2 years ago when WiiU started flailing and the problems with their dev chain was made apparent. I'm sticking with it until NX is revealed.
Don't bet on two skus with wildly different specs. Their whole single path development plan only works if the hardware is much the same. There is little you can do in game development when you have PS4 quality assets running on another machine of disparate hardware. Even PS4 to Xbox One is taking a hit let alone a console to mobile proposition. This whole thing only works well if the weaker hardware game is straight ported up and you don't need stronger hardware to make that a reality when you control the ecosystem.
evilromero
Member
This really makes too much sense. That first six or so months was the best the Wii U ever saw from third parties and then it just hit a brick wall. If it was indeed so easy to port from 360/PS3 then we would've continued to see a steady stream of games.
The games are gonna be NFC chips on a card so the physical media people get what they want and retailers get a cut too. But all the nfc chip does is contain a download code for the game.
GhostTrick
Banned
If they double it by next year, they would be below Xbox One, by 30%. So 1tflops.
LizardKing
Member
I guess I meant that releasing halfway during a gem is a bad idea. The wii U didn't launch at the halfway point, but it did launch before the Ps4 and XBone were in consumer minds. They need to be considered as part of the same generation.
Thanks for the info. I remember the original rumors saying it was going to be identical to the X360, but then it never materialized. I also think I remember you from the Wii U Speculation threads saying how it was under powered and everyone ganged up on you for lying haha. Must feel nice to be vindicated eh?
ArchedThunder
Banned
The PS3 and Wii U situations aren't even really comparable, and on top of that the next system they are releasing is undoubtedly a handheld.
We are probably looking at the handheld in Holiday 2016, giving the 3DS a lifespan just 4-ish months short of 6 years and then the console will likely release one year after that in Holiday 2017 giving the Wii U a 5 year lifespan.
5 to 6 years is the average life of a Nintendo home console, and 6-ish years for the 3DS only puts it one year behind the DS and 2-ish years ahead of the GBA.
Fourth Storm
Member
I think even a dollar is too much when blu rays are pennies. Tbh, I don't know the exact costs, but I know for sure their margins are lower on carts/SD cards. If anything, they are struggling to maintain the value of their portable games and their cost of manufacturing needs to go down, not up.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
The Wii U may have been considered this without the power-draining tablet controller.
Except I didn't say two widely different specs, I'm talking about a shared architecture & shared parts, with the console having more powerful parts. And it's pretty safe to believe Nintendo's no-hybrid comments when everything shown since then was of a separate future console & handheld. But I guess you can believe whatever you want.
Green Yoshi
Member
AstroNut325
Member
This post needs to be bookmarked and referenced whenever someone thinks the hardware power of the Wii U had minimal or no effect on its failure.
And Nintendo pursuing a mobile friendly path means their third party relations will be limited to mobile developers.
GameGuru59
Banned
Don't forget also that SD cards can be scaled to the size of game they are holding. So they're not all going to cost the same. There's also the reduced size of packaging and the reduced complexity of the console (perhaps even less cushioning to protect moveable parts). Then there's the faster performance.
All of this is in line with Nintendo's ethos. Greater reliability, proven, faster, and damn near indestructible.
Thanks for the link. I see where I went wrong: my use of the term "mobile" in #6 was what caused the confusion. "Handheld" would have been a better choice.
I was stressing that Nintendo's NX platform should share the same library between its dedicated handheld and console devices, not smartphones from other manufacturers. I agree that the software developed for smartphones will have to be different for the reasons Iwata stated.
Basically, the point I was trying to get across is that NX should use ARM-based designs to provide multiple points of entry to the same ecosystem, one being a dedicated handheld (mobile) and the other being a (home) console. Partnering with DeNA to get their IPs on existing App Stores is just the gateway drug to NX:
Said smartphone titles would also be easy ports to the NX handheld device, allowing you to play everything Nintendo on one portable device.
StealthGoblin
Banned
Nintendo feel so far gone to me. While all of the networks have built up they've not kept up. It has got to a point where even if they released a console that is more powerful than the PS4 with a robust forward thinking network, I would still only play Zelda on the machine.
Not interested in emulating mobile software either.
Not interested in emulating mobile software either.
Nintendo should buy Hudson off Konami and use 128GB HuCards for NX.
While I'm sure most of Nintendo's games will work on both versions of the NX, there's a few things to consider.
- Game Freak, who will refuse to make a mainline Pokémon work on the console
- Third party games (if any) that devs can't be bothered to scale down for the handheld
- First party games that are just too big for the handheld (take new installments of Zelda & Xenoblade for example)
I don't remember people ganging up on Arkam since he did post for everyone to brace themselves (albeit no one knew just how much to brace for). I do remember people ganging up on people like USC (myself included to an extent) due to him predicting a situation that was just high pie in the sky levels of pessimistic and doubling down on it only for us to get a collective slap in the face when the Wii U's actual specifications became public.
I still want to know what led to the internal lowering of Wii U's ability. Were they unable to get the power necessary for the design of the system they went with? [Seems like a given at this point.]
Never forget AMD/ATi HD4830 with 2GBs of GDDR5 or comparable ram!
Arkam
Member
Lol well being right based on facts directly from Nintendo was always comforting
You work in this industry long enough and you learn to laugh it all off.
Hardware power is Low on the totem pole of the Wii u's problems, both pre and post launch. As with most console launches (except for maybe the current HD twins) the tools were in a piss poor state and they didn't even properly expose 2 of the 3 CPU cores according to some developers.
ROI, demographics, sales - these are why nobody's bothering to adapt their work to the box.
No, third parties didn't have dev kits for the ps4 in 2010. They didn't even have spec sheets until 2011 (and even then, they weren't final. 2gb of gddr5 says hi, for example).
It's kind of misleading though, since most of the backgrounds are actually static.
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