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Arma dev: pirates/legal buyer is 100÷x(y+z)/3

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
lol, almost just like I expected

http://www.vg247.com/2011/11/17/arma-dev-notes-piracy-to-buyer-ratio-of-100-to-3/


“Our statistics from multiplayer show that for every three legitimate buyers playing their game in multiplayer, there are 100 (failed) attempts to play with a pirated version,” Bohemia CEO Marek Španěl told PC Gamer.

“This indicates that piracy is an extremely widespread problem on PC, and it’s also really worrying for us as a mid-sized, independent, PC-oriented developer. We do not have any such data for single-player, but I’m afraid there the ratio of pirates to legitimate gamers is undoubtedly much worse,” he added.

“It’s very difficult. Companies and teams invest a lot into game development, and with such widespread piracy, it’s extremely tough to get the investment back.”

Bohemia has gained an element of notoriety for its use of a DRM system called DEGARDE (formerly known as FADE), which introduces bugs to pirated copies of the game.

“The motto is: Pirated games are not worth playing, original games do not degrade. Some of the symptoms are funny, usually annoying,” Španěl explained.

“In the Arma series, players with pirated copies have lower accuracy with automatic weapons in both single player and multiplayer, and occasionally turn into a bird with the words ‘Good birds do not fly away from this game, you have only yourself to blame’” While we know we will never stop piracy, we use this as a way to make our stand that piracy is not right, that it has a serious negative impact on PC games developers.”

Španěl described DEGRADE as a “supplement” to more common DRM systems like always-on and online registrations, which are often required by publishers before they’ll sign off on a PC game.

B-b-but if Bohemia Interactive didn't make shoddy console ports people wouldn't pi... Oh wait.
 

Glix

Member
Um.

there are 100 (failed) attempts to play with a pirated version

It is very carefully worded to make sure they are not saying that this is 100 different people. Its probably more like 3 people legitimately playing and 5 people trying over and over to get their pirated copies to work.

I'm tired of these companies only being transparent when it helps them, and then expecting us to swallow all of their BS.

Piracy is a risk. Asses risks before you make business decisions.

Also note that they don't give any info on if the game was profitable (in fact they say that it is difficult to turn a profit, but are very careful and made sure they didn't say that they didn't make a profit). Spare me your woe is me bullshit and either give me all the facts or shut the fuck up.
 

CSX

Member
i wonder what the ratio will be like if they were able to know how many people dont attempt to connect multiplayer on a pirated copy
 

Rapstah

Member
As someone who bought the game, at launch at least it was the weirdest, most obscure multiplayer registration system ever so I don't doubt that illegitimate buyers keep trying because they think something else is broken.
 

Truth101

Banned
Glix said:
Um.



It is very carefully worded to make sure they are not saying that this is 100 different people. Its probably more like 3 people legitimately playing and 5 people trying over and over to get their pirated copies to work.

I'm tired of these companies only being transparent when it helps them, and then expecting us to swallow all of their BS.

Piracy is a risk. Asses risks before you make business decisions.

Also note that they don't give any info on if the game was profitable (in fact they say that it is difficult to turn a profit, but are very careful and made sure they didn't say that they didn't make a profit). Spare me your woe is me bullshit and either give me all the facts or shut the fuck up.

Yeah I was going to say that also, but I wasn't sure with how it was worded.
 

rCIZZLE

Member
I like companies that have at least a little fun with cheaters/pirates even though it's wrecking their hard work.
 
Glix said:
Um.



It is very carefully worded to make sure they are not saying that this is 100 different people. Its probably more like 3 people legitimately playing and 5 people trying over and over to get their pirated copies to work.

Okay? That still adds up to a huge fucking number of pirates.
 

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Truth101 said:
Yeah I was going to say that also, but I wasn't sure with how it was worded.
Subversus reached to a conclusion for you so you should thank him for his efforts in the title and mocking of an attitude that is pretty much nonexistent around here which ends up making it look like he's merely distorting legitimate points people bring up elsewhere with a single catch all phrase that had next to no thought put into it.

HP_Wuvcraft said:
Okay? That still adds up to a huge fucking number of pirates.
Okay? And the point of this is what? That if people weren't pirates Bohemia would be making more money? Cos if not (and it's a not until someone can prove otherwise) it's pointless information to begin with. Or at least not information that should under any circumstances get anyone upset enough to start swearing, but whatever.
 

Qatar

Member
rCIZZLE said:
I like companies that have at least a little fun with cheaters/pirates even though it's wrecking their hard work.
417361_700b.jpg
 

Aaron

Member
Do people who bought their game but never played it offset that value? Because you can put me in that column.
 

jax (old)

Banned
I like how people are using the wording to say "there's not that much piracy". yeah right.

its the same x people logging in.
 

Salacious Crumb

Junior Member
Jax said:
I like how people are using the wording to say "there's not that much piracy". yeah right.

its the same x people logging in.

There's piracy, but it's not 100 pirates for every 3 legit customers. Thread title is dumb
 
subversus said:
for every three legitimate buyers playing their game in multiplayer, there are 100 (failed) attempts to play with a pirated version,” Bohemia CEO Marek Španěl told PC Gamer.
c92401cfca671d37c3ba06db8c6a7b5f.gif
 
Rimfya said:
But are they pirating it because of DRM?

Because that'd be totally okay then.
DRM still doesn't make it okay to pirate. Sure, it really fucking sucks, but you can just not buy the game, or wait til they remove it.
 

Cels

Member
Stabby McSter said:
DRM still doesn't make it okay to pirate. Sure, it really fucking sucks, but you can just not buy the game, or wait til they remove it.

i think the person you quoted was mocking people who "reason" that way
 

Glix

Member
HP_Wuvcraft said:
Okay? That still adds up to a huge fucking number of pirates.


3/5 is the EXPECTED # of pirates or thereabouts. If that wasn't okay, the game should never have been green lighted in the first place.

3/100 is an inflated number in order to get attention and pity and sympathy. It is insulting to anyone who actually understands the PC gaming market, and destroys their credibility making it impossible for me to believe any of their points are anything other than spin.

Its the same bullshit as - The MTA is losing X$'s a year to turnstyle jumpers so we can't balance the budget. NO You CANT stop it all, so you have to accept a certain amount of it and then make your projections based on that.

I mean, if a company made a PC game and said "Well, we will make a profit, but ONLY if no one pirates it" they are fucking kidding themselves and are doing a disservice to their customers and shareholders.

Hell. My company should stop buying UPS's and then every time that the network goes down we should send out a press release about how its the electric company's fault.
 

Takuan

Member
Disappointing, but not at all surprising. In a genre dominated by Call of Duty, however, I highly doubt even 10% of those pirates would have bought the game anyway.

I also believe the numbers are purposely misleading.

VG247 also deserves blame for the sensational and quite possibly incorrect headline.
 
Glix said:
3/5 is the EXPECTED # of pirates or thereabouts. If that wasn't okay, the game should never have been green lighted in the first place.

3/100 is an inflated number in order to get attention and pity and sympathy. It is insulting to anyone who actually understands the PC gaming market, and destroys their credibility making it impossible for me to believe any of their points are anything other than spin.

You are making up numbers is no different from the devs of the game citng numbers like this.
 

King_Moc

Banned
You are making up numbers is no different from the devs of the game citng numbers like this.

Our statistics from multiplayer show that for every three legitimate buyers playing their game in multiplayer, there are 100 (failed) attempts to play with a pirated version,”

Not quite. Multiple attempts from the same person, or not, at least they didn't pull their numbers straight out of their ass...
 
"every three legitimate buyers playing their game in multiplayer, there are 100 (failed) attempts to play with a pirated version"


100 failed attempts or 100 illegitimate buyers?


If it's just attempts then it really doesn't mean anything, they could be all from the same frustrated pirate for all we know.
 

gabbo

Member
Isn't Bohemia's main source of income licensing out their engine/selves for actual military sim production used by various governments/armies?

Not that I am in any way condoning pirating their games (love Arma2 personally), but this is still more BS written to try and prove some piracy/drm point.
100 attempts to play online |= 100 distinct pirate copies
 
Metalmurphy said:
"every three legitimate buyers playing their game in multiplayer, there are 100 (failed) attempts to play with a pirated version"


100 failed attempts or 100 illegitimate buyers?


If it's just attempts then it really doesn't mean anything, they could be all from the same frustrated pirate for all we know.

You really think one or two pirates are trying 100 times to connect to online? The number is inflated no doubt, but ppl really are down playing it a bit much.
 

Glix

Member
BattleMonkey said:
You are making up numbers is no different from the devs of the game citng numbers like this.

Its different in that I'm just a GAF poster ballparking to make a point.

These guys are developers putting out press releases with misleading information. So yeah, there is a bit of a difference.
 

Onemic

Member
Metalmurphy said:
"every three legitimate buyers playing their game in multiplayer, there are 100 (failed) attempts to play with a pirated version"


100 failed attempts or 100 illegitimate buyers?


If it's just attempts then it really doesn't mean anything, they could be all from the same frustrated pirate for all we know.

it's just attempts. OP title is hyperbole, and the article itself is attention seeking
 
Glix said:
Its different in that I'm just a GAF poster ballparking to make a point.

These guys are developers putting out press releases with misleading information. So yeah, there is a bit of a difference.

You are still talking like your stating facts. This is also not a press release.
 

JWong

Banned
Stabby McSter said:
DRM still doesn't make it okay to pirate. Sure, it really fucking sucks, but you can just not buy the game, or wait til they remove it.
Is it okay to buy the game and then pirate a non-DRM copy?
 

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Btw, since it's "failed" attempts then their DRM works, pirates have a gimped copy, can't play online/co-op/whatever, etc. So where's the problem? If those 100 people really wanted the game, and the features they attempted to try and failed, they would buy it past that point. Let's see if their sales increase 100fold before ARMA3 is out!

...I'd like to see stats about actual pirates that bypassed security and play regularly on cracked servers or whatever else. Too bad nobody could possibly provide such.
 

King_Moc

Banned
Is it okay to buy the game and then pirate a non-DRM copy?

Technically no, though i prefer to go with what i think is morally right. as long as you aren't torrenting it and helping someone else get an illegal copy, i'd basically be ok with it. The law probably wouldn't be though.
 

DGRE

Banned
Why should it have to be an assessed risk?

Why do they have to be happy or content about the current state of PC gaming and piracy?

They created something,made it available for sale, and people are stealing it. It's something devs can be rightfully angry about.
 

DGRE

Banned
Alextended said:
Btw, since it's "failed" attempts then their DRM works, pirates have a gimped copy, can't play online/co-op/whatever, etc. So where's the problem?
Is this a joke post?

"I ONLY STOLE 2 APPLES OUT OF A BAG WITH FIVE APPLES IN IT!!1! MY BAG WAS GIMPED SO IT'S OKAY!!1!"
 

Alexios

Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
DGRE said:
Is this a joke post?

"I ONLY STOLE 2 APPLES OUT OF A BAG WITH FIVE APPLES IN IT!!1! MY BAG WAS GIMPED SO IT'S OKAY!!1!"
No, it's not a joke post, but your selective quoting and delibarate attempt to ignore the point made sure makes yours look like one. 2 out of 5 apples huh?

Also I haven't even played the game to know exactly what it blocks, I was just guessing. For all I know it's tied to single player features too. I was just going by the pirates desire to use the features it does block. Maybe you can enlighten me on that issue, if you can do that without getting so emotionally involved, since you seem so in the know. Though that's just my curiosity speaking, it doesn't change the point I made.
 

Scapegoat

Member
Let's try turn that negative nancy frown upsidedown...

So for every 3 legit customers there are 100 failed attempts... so we could say that, at most, for each legit customer there could be up to 33 other potential customers who were interested enough to download and crack your game and take it online!

For each customer, there could be up too 33 other people who they should try and convince to buy the game by adding new features/content etc. I'd rather be in that situation than have a game that seemingly no one is interested in (low sales, low pirate numbers).
 

M3d10n

Member
I wouldn't be surprised even if they're really 100 different people. However, I would love to see a breakdown of countries based on the IP addresses. How many of those people are actually within Bohemia's "sales range"?

crazy monkey said:
OMG wtf haha what game was that. Awesome message.
Look at the rest of the image, it's not a game.
 
MTMBStudios said:
B-b-but isn't Bohemia doing pretty alright? I really don't know. I thought ARMA1/2 is pretty popular, as popular as that kind of game is going to get.

In their own words:

ARMA 2 definitely is a success in terms of sales. It seems that despite the world economical crisis, Bohemia Interactive can again stand on it’s own feet for a while and focus on game development without having to worry about satisfying a bottom line or meeting financial targets, in this day and age that’s pretty rare, but one could say it reaffirms our ambitious development philosophy as not being completely cuckoo!
 
Ughh, here we go another thread filled with people that try to justify why piracy isn't that bad or that the situation was deserved.

And he says "failed attempts" to reiterate their online protection works. Its the same as 100 different players, per 3 real players.

That's why pirates are so filled with bs, "I only pirate DRM big corp games! Fuck the police!" and yet small games get hardcore pirated just as much. "Games are too expensive thats why I pirate!" yet 1 dollar iPhone games are pirated at an insane rate as well... just say you are self righteous and feel entitled to everything.
 
BattleMonkey said:
You really think one or two pirates are trying 100 times to connect to online? The number is inflated no doubt, but ppl really are down playing it a bit much.

I can easily see 1 doing 20+ attempts.

"Y don't this work!"
 
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