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coopolon · Jul 18, 2013

I don't know about this game. I've only played the first ~5-10 hours of SJ and Nocturne, but this game seems so much ridiculously harder than either of those two games early hours. I just fought the Lvl 3 Naruko spoilers

robed man who summons the two snake like things at the beginning

. It took me a few attacks to find they were weak to agi, so I end up wiping on the first one - fine. But at my level I can only get one demon who has agi - Pele. And she hasn't leveled up up enough to whisper it to me yet. But grinding isn't necessary in SMT games right? So I try again, hitting with everything I've got and healing as best I can but I just don't know what I can do when they can KO one fully healed party member/attack with lunge. I have a few revival beads but I can't keep pace. Edit: Oh, and I'm not weak to any of their attacks. They only get turns when they score criticals - which is somewhat frequently.

Eventually on the fourth or fifth try I beat them, but not because I changed any strategy, I just got lucky with them missing enough.

So what was I doing wrong?

I'm thinking I should drop it to easy, but that just seems like surrendering!

Laughing Banana · Jul 18, 2013

yami4ct said:
I distribute my stats more or less randomly (I know, I know. Bad move.), but I definitely bias them more or less toward phys. Same way I built my SMT III guy and he kicked ass. So, Team Phys all the way!

Thoraxes said:
I'm going teamPHYS too.

It's kinda my thing for these games.

Added you two to team awesome

Dresden
Laughing Banana
Lin Siniang
hosannainexcelsis
Soulhouf
yami4ct
Thoraxes

7 members of TeamPHYS in GAF's SMT IV. Not bad!

Blusby · Jul 18, 2013

I'm on Team PHYS as well, it'll pay off eventually, I know it will.

Ourobolus · Jul 18, 2013

So far Pixie was the biggest pain in the ass to recruit so far. Man she's a sociopath.

Alucrid · Jul 18, 2013

phys? magic? nah it's all about that luck.

Ourobolus said:
So far Pixie was the biggest pain in the ass to recruit so far. Man she's a sociopath.

really? i was all, "hey babe here's a life stone" now come ride wit me. and she was all "yeah!"

Rhodan · Jul 18, 2013

Ourobolus said:
So far Pixie was the biggest pain in the ass to recruit so far. Man she's a sociopath.

Yeh but some her dialog is awesome, Leanan Sidhe is too when you encounter her a little later;
(Im paraphrasing)
"Do you think I'm beautiful?"
"Its what's on the inside that counts"
"Oh, then let me rip out your entrails and see"

Ourobolus · Jul 18, 2013

Alucrid said:
phys? magic? nah it's all about that luck.

really? i was all, "hey babe here's a life stone" now come ride wit me. and she was all "yeah!"

She kept pulling the same shit Chagrin was pulling for the other guys. I actually got Chagrin pretty easily though.

Garland7G · Jul 18, 2013

after I finally recruited pixie, the next few times I encountered her, I spanked the grp she was with and she actually surrendered and offered to join me. but since I already had her in my stock she called a random demon and they joined my team. the 1st time it was some dwarf and then the next time it happened some other random demon joined me lol.

GeekyDad · Jul 18, 2013

pa22word said:
I went into this game really excited for it, wildly anticipating the sequel to nocturne, and upon playing it was greeted by a GO in my third-ish battle without even getting the chance to have a turn due to shit I couldn't control, and I immediately shut it off. I really, really fucking despise the persona style "attack whats on screen to start an encounter" bullshit, but it's only worsened here due to the wonky camera and weird control layout (why in the hell is attack mapped on Y? who in the hell has their hands laying there by default?). When I get ran through in a single turn (at full health) due to press turn deciding it was my turn to have shit roll down hill uncontrollably almost entirely due to getting attacked by an enemy that popped up from offscreen that I couldn't swing the wonky camera around to hit and then fumble with the control layout to hit attack, that's just bad design. I had no chance of actually surviving that encounter no matter what I did (remember, I was at full health), and that's terrible design. I am probably going to shelve it for a bit until I can get myself in the proper mood to deal with some of this game's horseshit.

Fair criticisms, though none of it has bothered me as much as it sounds like it bothers you. It is weird having the attack button mapped to X (not Y). At first, my initial reaction was to always press A. And the enemy avatars on the dungeon maps would be easier to negotiate were they exactly like Persona 3/4 in that you could stealth your way around, but these mobs aggro instantly and quickly. That being said, I feel more of a sense of urgency and dread due to the way enemy aggro is designed, and I like that. I like feeling a true sense of danger when entering a dungeon. With the Persona games, you don't really feel that (unless she says, "I sense Death").

One thing I would recommend, though, is tinkering with the different camera angles (by pressing sideways on the D-pad). I found an angle that worked better for me, allowing me to better judge the distance of mobs as they run up on me.

Forkball · Jul 18, 2013

My hero has Zan+1 and I have no idea how I got the +1. Any help?

GeekyDad · Jul 18, 2013

Forkball said:
My hero has Zan+1 and I have no idea how I got the +1. Any help?

Anytime a demon whispers to you upon leveling up, if they have a skill you already have too, you automatically get +1 added to its power.

ForteanMan · Jul 18, 2013

Back at work instead of fighting my way through Tokyo. This does not please me. I guess that's what bathroom breaks are for.

Freyjadour · Jul 18, 2013

Minotaur

is so god damned tuned around a MAG based MC. Reorganized everything I had to have two high MAG Bufu nukes and a sturdy healer with Media and Bufu. Everything else was a crap shoot with full Sukukaja and Sukunda not seeming to do much of anything.

Ourobolus · Jul 18, 2013

Is

Minotaur

the first roadblock? I beat

Issachar

in the forest and he was pretty easy (level 10 btw).

ForteanMan · Jul 18, 2013

Ourobolus said:
Is

Minotaur

the first roadblock? I beat

Issachar

in the forest and he was pretty easy (level 10 btw).

He certainly was for me. I think it took me about 6 or 7 tries, even knowing what strategy to use against him, to finally beat him.

Sseklebeast · Jul 18, 2013

Laughing Banana said:
Added you two to team awesome

Dresden
Laughing Banana
Lin Siniang
hosannainexcelsis
Soulhouf
yami4ct
Thoraxes

7 members of TeamPHYS in GAF's SMT IV. Not bad!

I am on TeamPHYS as well! It started off mostly random but have been concentrating on STR,DEX and AGI.

Deleted member 20415 · Jul 18, 2013

Jucksalbe said:
Died in the second battle of the game....I feel bad.

I'm dying left and right and I've played a shit ton of SMT games... just a lot to get used to. Not a fan of the "Use play coins to revive stuff as well."

But I'm just getting warmed up... liking the game so far.

Forkball · Jul 18, 2013

So what's so special about special fusions?

Also I played the forest part and

killed Issachar. WHERE'S THE NEUTRAL OPTION HUH? Just curious, what happens if you spare him?

hardcastlemccormick · Jul 18, 2013

Forkball said:
So what's so special about special fusions?

Also I played the forest part and

killed Issachar. WHERE'S THE NEUTRAL OPTION HUH? Just curious, what happens if you spare him?

Just dialogue, apparently.

daveo42 · Jul 18, 2013

This game definitely does zero hand holding early game and does a good job in rewarding those who are constantly prepared for any situation, more so than any other RPG I've played.

I think the only thing I really want are more app points per level. So many apps I have to buy.

eznark · Jul 18, 2013

I'm on the third training quest in SMT IV and have died three times. That's normal, right?

Samyy · Jul 18, 2013

eznark said:
I'm on the third training quest in SMT IV and have died three times. That's normal, right?

I died more, your doing good!

Forkball · Jul 18, 2013

eznark said:
I'm on the third training quest in SMT IV and have died three times. That's normal, right?

Honestly the first part has been the hardest part of the game for me thus far. Now I'm back in that area after 5ish hours and stomping those gryphons.

daveo42 · Jul 18, 2013

eznark said:
I'm on the third training quest in SMT IV and have died three times. That's normal, right?

It appears to be normal. I've died several times. My friend, however, says he's only died once and just finished up the first 3 side quests after the initial training missions. Not sure if I should be amazed by this or ashamed at my own lack of gaming prowess.

eznark · Jul 18, 2013

Is there a way to get out of the dungeon while doing these starting quests? My demons are all dead so I assume I will get wiped if I get into any more fights.

PlanetSmasher · Jul 18, 2013

Running into a roadblock against

Medusa

. I can get her to the final critical HP point but she always wipes my entire party by using her special attack three times in a row once that last bit of dialogue plays.

Maybe I just need to just hire a third demon with Zan and just brute force my way through the fight like I did with

Minotaur

.

hardcastlemccormick · Jul 18, 2013

eznark said:
Is there a way to get out of the dungeon while doing these starting quests? My demons are all dead so I assume I will get wiped if I get into any more fights.

Go back up to the exit and then you can go to your Barracks to sleep, which is the Pokemon Center in this game.

duckroll · Jul 18, 2013

eznark said:
Is there a way to get out of the dungeon while doing these starting quests? My demons are all dead so I assume I will get wiped if I get into any more fights.

Why not shitcan the dead demons and just recruit more on the fly?

eznark · Jul 18, 2013

duckroll said:
Why not shitcan the dead demons and just recruit more on the fly?

Good idea!

This is the first SMT game (outside of the SRPG on DS) that I've played. I don't have the nuances down yet.

chickdigger802 · Jul 18, 2013

First numbered smt game. Love the presentation. Feels oddly like I'm playing yugioh lol.

Will my dudes always be so squishy? I failed a recruiting thing and then the monster decided to 1 hit kill my guy.

Is there any general tips on the recruiting system?

Is it random?

What skill points matter in smt games? Been doing a 3 mag 1 agi 1 luck build atm.

leonemesis · Jul 18, 2013

I beat the game back on Sunday, I've been playing the japanese version for most of June.

Damn, the game is awesome, took me about 90 hours to finish (it will be less if you go Chaos or Law). I ended up at the Neutral route, despite leaning towards Chaos route, but I'm glad I did, this route felt so rewarding. And it was no walk in the park either, but I was well prepared (I have played a lot of SMT/DDS/Persona/DeSu/DS), so I didn't have any trouble getting past end-game bosses.

I did struggle a bit with

Beelzebub

because he uses some dirty tactics.

Megidolaon THREE times in a row, how's that?

Bit of advice to newcomers is, when you hit lvl 15-20 you can get some demons with null attributes, so it's a good idea to keep a demon with, let's say, null wind, if your protagonist or other demon is weak to that type of attack. This way, if the enemy uses a hit all spell, like mazan, you don't lose any turns, (the enemy does).

CSX · Jul 18, 2013

chickdigger802 said:
First numbered smt game. Love the presentation. Feels oddly like I'm playing yugioh lol.

Will my dudes always be so squishy? I failed a recruiting thing and then the monster decided to 1 hit kill my guy.

Is there any general tips on the recruiting system?

Is it random?

What skill points matter in smt games? Been doing a 3 mag 1 agi 1 luck build atm.

Best to have a focused build for MC. So keep on doing that for leveling up. And yes recruiting can be random. In fact they can ask a question where EVERY answer pisses them off Lol.

Forkball · Jul 18, 2013

Finally got enough lifestones to get the free DLC armor like 7 hours into the game. And I still don't have the pants. Demons love to just rip you off when it comes to life stones.

chickdigger802 · Jul 18, 2013

So this is one of the games i should have my 3ds around on my backpack? Heard the playcoins could be handy for something.

ForteanMan · Jul 18, 2013

chickdigger802 said:
So this is one of the games i should have my 3ds around on my backpack? Heard the playcoins could be handy for something.

You can use them to pay off Charon to revive you rather than having to pay him Macca. This preempts the "Game Over" screen and brings you immediately back into the gameplay.

NeonZ · Jul 18, 2013

chickdigger802 said:
Is there any general tips on the recruiting system?

Is it random?

I haven't played enough this game to know for sure, but, in most previous games, it was generally kind of random, but not completely random. Generally, there are some answers that specific demon types will prefer, but there's always a chance that even the preferred answer will fail.

hardcastlemccormick · Jul 18, 2013

I only talked to Charon for the difficulty settings, now I just soft reset. The only reason I see to pay him is if you forgot to save.

My current issue with fusions is that pretty much everything you can make is either amazing (two or three times your level) or pointless. I'm trying to build a party for

--Medusa--

here and everything in the fusion search feels like an unchanged sideways shift, not an upgrade. Maybe it's time to let a few demons go.

EDIT: The Demon stock increase apps are cheap. Yessssssss

JetBlackPanda · Jul 18, 2013

Is every copy still a launch edition out there or no?

Edit: USA

chickdigger802 · Jul 18, 2013

A bit curious about this game's economy. Gear for protag seems expensive. is burning macca for recruitment ok?

Also what does the 'cheat' option do in dialogue with demons?

How does recruitment even work? Is it you fill up a hidden happy meter with correct dialogue choices before they join ya?

SteeloDMZ · Jul 18, 2013

chickdigger802 said:
First numbered smt game. Love the presentation. Feels oddly like I'm playing yugioh lol.

Will my dudes always be so squishy? I failed a recruiting thing and then the monster decided to 1 hit kill my guy.

Is there any general tips on the recruiting system?

Is it random?

What skill points matter in smt games? Been doing a 3 mag 1 agi 1 luck build atm.

After a while you start seeing patterns during the negotiations, so they aren't entirely random.

AtomskEater · Jul 18, 2013

chickdigger802 said:
A bit curious about this game's economy. Gear for protag seems expensive. is burning macca for recruitment ok?

Also what does the 'cheat' option do in dialogue with demons?

How does recruitment even work? Is it you fill up a hidden happy meter with correct dialogue choices before they join ya?

As far as I can tell, if you don't want to give up money/items that the demon asks for and don't want to tell them no/"I don't have it" outright, "cheat" just tries to trick them or something. Maybe some demons types will respond positively to it. I haven't seen anything special happen when I use it.

Ourobolus · Jul 18, 2013

chickdigger802 said:
Also what does the 'cheat' option do in dialogue with demons?

Cheat basically rolls a die to fake out the demon. So if a demon wants like 300 macca and you don't want to pay it, you can choose "Cheat" for a chance to not pay it. However, if you fail, the demon attacks you.

perorist · Jul 18, 2013

JetBlackPanda said:
Is every copy still a launch edition out there or no?

Edit: USA

I'm guessing there won't be regular editions until the second shipment of the game. It's only been officially out for 3 days so if you find a store that has them, it's still going to be the first print edition.

JetBlackPanda · Jul 18, 2013

perorist said:
I'm guessing there won't be regular editions until the second shipment of the game. It's only been officially out for 3 days so if you find a store that has them, it's still going to be the first print edition.

thank you.

jasonng · Jul 18, 2013

Restarted a new game because I went for a jack of all trades build the first time. Now I'm focusing on dex/agi/luck. Working out for me so far but I'm still in the beginnings of the game.

thefil · Jul 18, 2013

My Amazon order for this has been "shipping soon" for 4 days... I was hoping to play it on vacation next week.

Jinfash · Jul 18, 2013

I'm assuming the more demons I have in my party the less xp I earn after battles as it's an even split, correct?

Also, I've just hit level 10 and I'm unsure how to spend my app points. So far I've spent them on +1 MC skill slot, +1 demon skill slot, and 6 demon party slots. The latter which I regret, I shouldn't have spent that many. So what's the consensus on most worthwhile upgrades this early in the game?

The_Darkest_Red · Jul 18, 2013

I like that they made the recruiting system kind of obscure and random. That way you don't have a situation where everyone is just looking up the "correct" choices to pick for every demon or whatever. It still sucks when you piss them off and they unleash fury on you, though!

Ourobolus · Jul 18, 2013

Jinfash said:
I'm assuming the more demons I have in my party the less xp I earn after battles as it's an even split, correct?

Also, I've just hit level 10 and I'm unsure how to spend my app points. So far I've spent them on +1 MC skill slot, +1 demon skill slot, and 6 demon party slots. The latter which I regret, I shouldn't have spent that many. So what's the consensus on most worthwhile upgrades this early in the game?

For me it's been MC skill slots and Demon skill slots. I spent some on Fundraiser, but so far that hasn't been THAT great. I may get the MP-walk skill though.

GeekyDad · Jul 18, 2013

Ourobolus said:
Cheat basically rolls a die to fake out the demon. So if a demon wants like 300 macca and you don't want to pay it, you can choose "Cheat" for a chance to not pay it. However, if you fail, the demon attacks you.

You know, if they actually put a rolling-die animation next to the conversation bubble during demon negotiations, I think more folks would get it.

In any case, someone elsewhere mentioned considering the personality/type of demon when doing conversations as a guide rule for how best to answer. You're still going to "roll a die," but at least your odds are likely better.

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