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Ubisoft On Scaling Pyramids, City Design, RPG focus, engine changes in AC:Origins

C

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
-The way they changed the game engine in general is that it's less driven by animation. Which has resulted in big improvements to responsiveness, how easily the game switches between different types of gameplay, and the environment of the game.
A comparison....the map of AC:Syndicate is less than 10% of the size of AC:Origins map...

-Unlike past AC games the climbing system now allows for almost any surface to be climbable. Including rock faces and mountains.

- A big focus was put on mounts to make exploration more enjoyable. Chariots are drivable, the players will be able to drift with them and they're very useful in open areas. Players will be able to sideswipe a horse and knock the driver off with the side of the chariot.

-There will be a few major cities in the game, Alexandria being one of them.
Alexandria will be a modernized and engineered city. The player will feel that kind of "organization" in the city while the older cities will feel more organic and chaotic

-Climbing the pyramids will not be a quick task. It will take time and effort and there will also be a navigation puzzle that the player will have to go through to actually reach the top.

-There will be no inventory limit in the game. You can hold two bows and two melee weapons at any given time, specific example mentioned that he's seen players switch between swords with two different attributes. Inventory is thankfully easy to sort.

-There is no weapon durability but you will have to find higher level loot with higher rarities. Specifically there are 160 unique weapons in the game all with varying attributes like poison or fire damage.


Source 1, Source 2
 
Aces&Eights

Aces&Eights

Member
Optimistic about returning to Creedland. My only hold out is the combat. I hope it is a lot tighter than what was shown. I am giving them the benefit of the doubt since it was alpha footage, no?

Baldwin_the_First said:
I thought I would too, but the combat seems worse than any AC I've played so far. Regretting buying it on sale last week on PSN.
Click to expand...

I passed on Syndicate but this is not helping my hopefulness lol
 
Aces&Eights

Aces&Eights

Member
Crossing Eden said:
Fixed.


They talk a lot about the combat system in the first link.
Click to expand...


Yeah, I saw that. But tbh, proof is in the pudding. It is really hard to "describe" how the actual flow and feel of combat is going to be. I am hopeful that they are changing it up as described but the end product remains to be seen
 
N

NullPointer

Member
Good to hear that monuments like the Great Pyramid include navigation puzzles and its not a simple matter of pushing forward to reach the top.

Still not sold on the leveled enemies and gear. Is there any difference in behavior between a level 5 guard and a level 20 guard? Or is it just more health, more damage?

Anything visual to set them apart besides the number over their heads? Or will you require the HUD element that puts those numbers over their heads at all times?
 
Roni

Roni

Gold Member
I, for one, am really glad they went with a combat approach closer to what For Honor gave us. Feels like it was a big inspiration...

I welcome it... Haven't played Rogue, Unity and Syndicate - might go straight for this one.
 
C

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
NullPointer said:
Good to hear that monuments like the Great Pyramid include navigation puzzles and its not a simple matter of pushing forward to reach the top.

Still not sold on the leveled enemies and gear. Is there any difference in behavior between a level 5 guard and a level 20 guard? Or is it just more health, more damage?

Anything visual to set them apart besides the number over their heads? Or will you require the HUD element that puts those numbers over their heads at all times?
Click to expand...
To the bolded yes, higher level enemies have better AI and are capable of more tactics than lower level ones.
 
A

Aztechnology

Member
I hope they have difficulties in this one. Watching the gameplay was disappointing. Literally running in plain sight with weapons climbing inside the vision range of an enemy without them even so much as looking. Aside from that, it's looking like a big step forward.
 
G

GeoGonzo

Member
Crossing Eden said:
-The way they changed the game engine in general is that it's less driven by animation. Which has resulted in big improvements to responsiveness, how easily the game switches between different types of gameplay, and the environment of the game.
Click to expand...

Honestly kind of worried about this. We shall see how it end up... but I worry it will "feel" better at the cost of looking worse, and that's an important part of AC games for me.
 
Muffdraul

Muffdraul

Member
Impeccable said:
Playing through Syndicate now to get hyped for Origins. Having fun.
Click to expand...

Syndicate is probably the most "fun" AC in the franchise so far. Not necessarily in terms of game play (which I did personally find very fun,) I mean as in the characters, the atmosphere of the world, etc. IMO no doubt it's the #2 best AC behind AC2.
 
S

sjay1994

Member
I am happy the pyramids are going to be navigation puzzles.

Some of my best memories from AC2 was figuring out how to climb a tower.
 
M

More_Badass

Member
Gentleman Jack said:
I can't imagine a less compelling metric for a game than how huge the map size is.
Click to expand...
If you're doing a world like this and want relatively decent-sized cites and the juxtaposition with smaller towns, and want cities to feel like special places compared to the wilderness, then size and how big the world is matters

Compare Skyrim's cities and how they're spaced and how tight the map is versus Witcher's Novigrad and how grand it feels after traveling across the map, through the small towns and villages, and fields and forests

Size matters. Considering one of the big appeals of AC is the historical tourism, the bigger the better, since they lets them space out the world and more accurately represent the area
 
C

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
GeoGonzo said:
Honestly kind of worried about this. We shall see how it end up... but I worry it will "feel" better at the cost of looking worse, and that's an important part of AC games for me.
Click to expand...
Animation fidelity and gameplay feel are constantly at odds with each other unfortunately. AC has always struck a good balance especially with the movement. Contrary to what r//gaming believes, the devs have confirmed that the animation is still a WIP. So I expect some pretty substantial improvements in that regard given the past history of this series when it come to improving from alpha builds:
IEG71nG.gif

h4CY9kg.gif
Click to expand...
sSkgiiV.gif

Lqzfj3u.gif
Click to expand...
 
J

JigglesBunny

Banned
Having been a fan of the series since the very beginning and only disliking three entries (ACIII, Black Flag and Syndicate and if you want to be thorough, the awful movie), this is so unappealing. I don't want AC to be an RPG-lite and it looks like they're aiming for quanity over quality.

I definitely hope it turns out well and I'll look for reviews before spending any money trying to find out, it just doesn't look like the right step for the series.
 
A

Alexious

Member
Crossing Eden said:
-The way they changed the game engine in general is that it's less driven by animation. Which has resulted in big improvements to responsiveness, how easily the game switches between different types of gameplay, and the environment of the game.
A comparison....the map of AC:Syndicate is less than 10% of the size of AC:Origins map...

-Unlike past AC games the climbing system now allows for almost any surface to be climbable. Including rock faces and mountains.

- A big focus was put on mounts to make exploration more enjoyable. Chariots are drivable, the players will be able to drift with them and they're very useful in open areas. Players will be able to sideswipe a horse and knock the driver off with the side of the chariot.

-There will be a few major cities in the game, Alexandria being one of them.
Alexandria will be a modernized and engineered city. The player will feel that kind of "organization" in the city while the older cities will feel more organic and chaotic

-Climbing the pyramids will not be a quick task. It will take time and effort and there will also be a navigation puzzle that the player will have to go through to actually reach the top.

-There will be no inventory limit in the game. You can hold two bows and two melee weapons at any given time, specific example mentioned that he's seen players switch between swords with two different attributes. Inventory is thankfully easy to sort.

-There is no weapon durability but you will have to find higher level loot with higher rarities. Specifically there are 160 unique weapons in the game all with varying attributes like poison or fire damage.


Source 1, Source 2
Click to expand...

Is there a source for that map size comparison?
 
H

heringer

Member
Crossing Eden said:
The way they changed the game engine in general is that it's less driven by animation. Which has resulted in big improvements to responsiveness,
Click to expand...

THANK YOU!

My biggest beef with Unity and Syndicate is how sluggish they feel, even at 60 fps. Older games are much snappier.
 
F

Frozenprince

Banned
The animation still needs some serious love, I hope that's a BIG focus during crunch. But sounds fun so far, hopefully it'll be relatively low jank
 
J

Jonnax

Member
oh no a giant map.
Once I've started working I've lost the ability to just get lost in a world and so it often becomes tedious traversing a giant map.
Syndicate was the perfect size imho, it was possible to get a grasp of how the city was laid out.

I think with Origins it'll be a bit too big to identify where you are except for giant landmarks like the Pyramids.
 
F

Frozenprince

Banned
More_Badass said:
If you're doing a world like this and want relatively decent-sized cites and the juxtaposition with smaller towns, and want cities to feel like special places compared to the wilderness, then size and how big the world is matters

Compare Skyrim's cities and how they're spaced and how tight the map is versus Witcher's Novigrad and how grand it feels after traveling across the map, through the small towns and villages, and fields and forests

Size matters. Considering one of the big appeals of AC is the historical tourism, the bigger the better, since they lets them space out the world and more accurately represent the area
Click to expand...

But you also have to balance the density, my worry is there will be a lot of "dead area" in the vastness of the map that you'll need to navigate around and regret having to do so to get to places or find the only unique place in that "section" of the map.

It's important in design to make sure everything has a place and that you're never caught in too much emptiness. Emptiness is fine, but you need to scale it against everything else.
 
S

Servbot24

Banned
Despite not demoing very impressively I think it sounds pretty cool. I may be tempted to get it, and frankly I think this has been a bad series, including 2.
 
SenjutsuSage

SenjutsuSage

Banned
Aces&Eights said:
Optimistic about returning to Creedland. My only hold out is the combat. I hope it is a lot tighter than what was shown. I am giving them the benefit of the doubt since it was alpha footage, no?



I passed on Syndicate but this is not helping my hopefulness lol
Click to expand...

Any combat concerns are purely down to players simply not being very good at the game, or just plain being sloppy button mashers. Enemies aren't waiting turns to attack, so any attempt to go on a flurry of attacks against one particular enemy while ignoring the other characters, will get you rocked.
 
N

nelsonroyale

Member
cautiously interested in this. It seems the game is huge.

JigglesBunny said:
Having been a fan of the series since the very beginning and only disliking three entries (ACIII, Black Flag and Syndicate and if you want to be thorough, the awful movie), this is so unappealing. I don't want AC to be an RPG-lite and it looks like they're aiming for quanity over quality.

I definitely hope it turns out well and I'll look for reviews before spending any money trying to find out, it just doesn't look like the right step for the series.
Click to expand...

The serious has pretty much always been about quantity, but now they are adding a bit more depth. I think that is a good thing.
 
C

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Alexious said:
Is there a source for that map size comparison?
Click to expand...
Pretty sure it was said in an interview or video. They've said it's about if not larger than the entire AC4 map. Which was already a metric fuck ton larger than Paris or London. (Ofc the scale of the cities were much larger with the 1:1 monuments and such).

Frozenprince said:
But you also have to balance the density, my worry is there will be a lot of "dead area" in the vastness of the map that you'll need to navigate around and regret having to do so to get to places or find the only unique place in that "section" of the map.

It's important in design to make sure everything has a place and that you're never caught in too much emptiness. Emptiness is fine, but you need to scale it against everything else.
Click to expand...
I think my favorite part about exploring in The Witcher 3 is that it has a lot of dead area but the atmosphere just comes together so well that I don't mind it and it emphasizes just well done the small villages and settlements are as well as how far ahead Novigrad is as a full fledged city.
 
G

Gugus

Neo Member
I have to say this : this game looks like it has a large capacity for fun, these new bases are welcomed developpement.
But, this is the Witcher 3 with a hood. At least it is what is shown now.

I am one bloody AC fan, but they kind of erased the initial Assassin fantasy and its core (again, with what they have released).
No system shown for social stealth is like the latest kick in the initial pillars for that fantasy. ACS already shown that traversal was not fun anymore, althought trying to tell the players that "Assassins had the advantage with height".
ACU had this "badass" fantasy vibe (crowds, animations, parkour choices) but couldn't have a scenario that was hooking us to the time-period.

Here, Origins runs everything on its map and RPG combat buffs for now. Parkour is not really interesting in the way that it doesnt give an advantage to the player, and stealth now just seem not even fun to use.
Althought I prefer a hooded man with a wrist-blade to Geralt, tbh.
 
S

Soul of the Beast

Member
How about the combat?
Is it still just mashing attack and block to win?
I'd rather the game being quite challenging than making combat super easy and pretends I'm the best player ever.

What's the point of stealth if killing enemies with a sword is much easier?
 
R

RedSwirl

Junior Member
That first thing seems like a big change. One of my biggest problems with AC before was that I never felt quite as in control of my character as I did in other similar games.

Overall it seems like Ubisoft is just grabbing a bunch of good ideas from other games to make its own "ur" open-world action game. We'll see how that works. It certainly worked for Breath of the Wild. That however is because BOTW found something good to center itself around -- exploration and mystery. AC needs to find something in a similar way, ideally stealth. That was the original dream of AC1 -- to create an open-world stealth game based on maneuverability.
 
C

cackhyena

Member
RedSwirl said:
That first thing seems like a big change. One of my biggest problems with AC before was that I never felt quite as in control of my character as I did in other similar games.

Overall it seems like Ubisoft is just grabbing a bunch of good ideas from other games to make its own "ur" open-world action game. We'll see how that works. It certainly worked for Breath of the Wild. That however is because BOTW found something good to center itself around -- exploration and mystery. AC needs to find something in a similar way, ideally stealth. That was the original dream of AC1 -- to create an open-world stealth game based on maneuverability.
Click to expand...
That's why 1 still holds a higher place than most of the rest for me. What it's become is something I never envisioned. A jack of all trades. At least with this one, discarding animation priority, and basically making it an RPG, I can treat it like Egyptian Witcher. I'm under no illusions that stealth is only a piece of the pie. Unfortunate as that is.
 
C

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Gugus said:
I have to say this : this game looks like it has a large capacity for fun, these new bases are welcomed developpement.
But, this is the Witcher 3 with a hood. At least it is what is shown now.
Click to expand...
It has very clear Witcher 3 influences, but it is doing a lot of stuff that isn't present in TW3 and is inspired by FC and the other AC games.

I am one bloody AC fan, but they kind of erased the initial Assassin fantasy and its core (again, with what they have released).
No system shown for social stealth is like the latest kick in the initial pillars for that fantasy. ACS already shown that traversal was not fun anymore, althought trying to tell the players that "Assassins had the advantage with height".
ACU had this "badass" fantasy vibe (crowds, animations, parkour choices) but couldn't have a scenario that was hooking us to the time-period.
Click to expand...
I agree social stealth being gone completely in this entry is very surprising. But like a lot of their changes makes sense considering the guy is a grown man with a defined fighting style and such.

Here, Origins runs everything on its map and RPG combat buffs for now. Parkour is not really interesting in the way that it doesnt give an advantage to the player, and stealth now just seem not even fun to use.
Althought I prefer a hooded man with a wrist-blade to Geralt, tbh.
Click to expand...
I disagree on that completely actually, you still have a massive advantage over enemies when it comes to maneuverability:
cQzK2KN.gif

gp6cai6.gif
Click to expand...

I also disagree that stealth won't be fun to use as ironically despite the focus on action RPG elements there are now more nuances to the stealth than ever before even with the lack of social stealth, it's one of the dedicated play styles you can choose to take part in.
 
V

veloxStrix

Banned
I think we've always known that Ubisoft always does excellent "world building", I just wish they would do more world building. Game looks much more fun than the last few installments though.
 
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