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Halo 4 Designer Calls Out Kojima on Sex (Pot to Kettle: "You are blue!")
- Thread starter Nibel
- Start date
Yes, but why not stick with the Halo 1-3 design? Yeah, it changed from game to game, but the core look was the same, and wasn't very sexual at all, it was just like a doll or mannequin, which seems to me suits the AI representation a lot more than Halo 4's did.
kerotan_eater
Banned
I think the fact that it is just japanese culture so we shouldn't care is not an accurate assessment, it doesn't invalidate the fact that it is still questionable.
Majukun
Member
kojima (or anyone else) doesn't need justification for his designs
people are just pointing out that someone should not "look at the speck of sawdust in his brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in his own "
kerotan_eater
Banned
lol ... seriously?
FlashbladeGAF
Member
no one is buying MGSV for Quiet's bikini outfit either.
I get not liking the design though, but it's not like this is anything new for both genders in a Kojima game.
It's not like every straight guy liked playing as a naked tortured Raiden.
Kojima gonna Kojima
it's just now we can hear about the process through twitter instead of discovering it out ourselves in the game
Bluekaveli
Member
Who is he to talk to Kojigod like that?
Practical.
At least Cortana is a computer AI thingy, and what does a computer thingy need clothes for?
People are missing the point though, or just not bothered by it and would rather take sides.
Because they are doing exactly what Kojima is doing, but they are not being honest about the applications.
Cortana's design became significantly sexier so they can appeal to the younger male demographic. Same reason they adjusted the gameplay to be more in line with Call of Duty.
I'm sorry, but WTF is wrong with you?
Evil Beaver
Member
Spider from Mars
tap that thorax
I agree with him. The attire of Quite doesn't make sense for the environment she moves in, currently. You could speculate that she can change her skin pigmentation (based on the trailer) to achieve an octocamo effect, which would explain the clothing.
The problem I have with the recent "Japanese pre-release game sexism outrage of the month" is that the audience can never truly engage in the conversation because the context of the criticized material is unknown. Do it after the game is released.
The problem I have with the recent "Japanese pre-release game sexism outrage of the month" is that the audience can never truly engage in the conversation because the context of the criticized material is unknown. Do it after the game is released.
tirkaroKujo
Member
Yes, I can. Because honestly? The first one is kinda worse. Imagine if it was a STRONG FEMALE CHARACTER being stripped naked complete with a ton of accidental censorship gags, then you had to roam around with her bare ass sticking out at all times while she covers up her modesty and can just outright not attack anyone due to being too embarrassed to show her junk.
And even then, it's not like Raiden's skintight bodysuit is very respectable in the first place. You can say male nudity=played for laughs, but keep in mind Raiden was designed with a female audience in mind.
neoism
Member
Again, I don't think the problem is that she's wearing a bikini. Nothing wrong with a sexy character in a vacuum...
I think the problem is that Kojima made the designer sex her up more, he intentionally went out of his way to say 'Her design is not going to be about her character, but about how many pervs buy her statue'. It's indicative of a problem within not only video games, but other media as well.
What? That's why Kojima sexed her up more. His intentions are clear.
I think the problem is that Kojima made the designer sex her up more, he intentionally went out of his way to say 'Her design is not going to be about her character, but about how many pervs buy her statue'. It's indicative of a problem within not only video games, but other media as well.
What? That's why Kojima sexed her up more. His intentions are clear.
lol you funny.
But yeah all that we've seen so far with Quiet just seems gross. Really curious what Ellis's response would be to Cortana though. Obviously he had nothing to do with her design, but hmmmmm...
EDIT: Ultimately don't care if someone is being hypocritical if their point is still valid. Especially if it's being dismissed because of the hypocrisy. Which is what seems to happen in every thread. Waving the hands. Nothing to see here. Look over there! They are doing it too!
We will see how this game turns out. If the sexy is more than just attractive women. Modern men in combat will at times wear very little as well.
RedNumberFive
Banned
I wonder if this behavior began pre or post "video game tropes vs women"? It seems that suddenly we have a bunch of GAFfers that need to go out of their way to share how concerned they are. Frankly, I play video games as a way to relax and escape, and a woman wearing Victoria's Secret to the battlefield doesn't bother me. In fact, I'll just come out and say I enjoy it. There is room enough in the gaming industry for all sorts of titles, and if I want to engage in a male power fantasy I'm not going to have the guy who makes one of the most dude-bro titles out there make me feel guilty about it.
You're acting like these characters have actual input on this. Cortana "chose" to be naked, because the developers chose to have her choose to be naked. The other AI "chose" to have clothes because the developers chose to have him choose to have clothes.
Whatever you think of the actual character designs, don't shift the blame and/or credit onto the characters when the characters are just creations.
Not specifically, but this is as close as we will get.
lol @ the description change. A bit too late for that, Dave.
Yes, yes and yes.
But you don't see any developers outraged at Bioware's obvious attempts.
CambriaRising
Member
You laugh, but that dude is the only one who gets the girl in the end.
Speaking of well realized female soldiers in MGS.
Have you seen some of Shinkawa's Sniper Wolf concept art? There is one of her just just sitting there naked. Shinkawa doesn't need Kojima's direction to make a character sexualised.
Nightengale
Member
It's fair to think it's questionable or that some don't like it, but that's par-for-course for every aspect and themes used in storytelling for any game.
Honestly, I just think it's stupid because it's not like this is anything new to Kojima. Kojima's been doing this sort of shit for the past 15 years.
Speedy Blue Dude
Banned
The Halo 3 design was just as sexual as the Halo 4 design. The art style just changed, and among the many changes to Master Chief, the Covenant, the Forerunners, the UNSC Soilders, the ships, Cortana was changed to a more realistic style (like everything else in Halo 4). I don't see the problem. Cortana's design in Halo 4 was a natural evolution from her design in Halo 3.
I don't see how any of this matters, David didn't design Cortana, he didn't create her, and Cortana is literally one of the best female characters in gaming. Smart, Independent, and Confident, and a vital part of the series, just as important as Master Chief. Hell I'd argue that Cortana does more in the series THAN Chief.
A guy who works for a company that produced a game with an extremely over-sexualized character in it complained about MGS V having an over-sexualized character in it. He also bemoaned it as "what's wrong with the gaming industry".
Evil Beaver
Member
I honestly believe that Kojima doesn't give a single flying fuck. Excuse my language.
PaulExcellent
Member
I actually like both designs quite a bit.
(Cortana just looked better on 3 to me. Is that weird?)
Both are rather sexualised, though.
(Cortana just looked better on 3 to me. Is that weird?)
Both are rather sexualised, though.
FlashbladeGAF
Member
and I think that was only in regards to his looks
Raiden as a whole was designed to be the player
Can you point to where this was stated, or are you just projecting?
You have to remember that Halo is a Universe and so there is more than just the games that are canon. The Spartan program was created to combat groups who went against the republic and not the Covenant.
SeventhSon
Member
Isn't Quiet the name of the character he criticized?
except for not following precedents in things like the MP is what got a lot of people pissed at 343, so precedent can be good. Bungies cortona changed a bit from halo to halo too. Its not like her breasts weren't out in the open in the other models.
I stand to my point. You guys wouldn't give it that much attention, if some random person tweeted this/made this statement. It would get some replies and people would probably discuss it, but it wouldn't reach ~1200 posts.
I know his statement, was a little bit off, but come one guys, you are making such a drama about it...
Well, that much is obvious, but that they're pretending otherwise is annoying. At least Kojima is up front with it.
OverHeat
« generous god »
Eva is still showing off her boobs
Old Eva! What was your point?
I never understand this type of logic. When films, such as the likes of Sucker Punch, are made do they set the film industry back 10 years? Does it prohibit in anyway the making of more serious films? Do films such as Saving Private Ryan get lambasted for being in the same medium as Scott Pilgrim vs The World?
I think the obvious answer to these questions is a resounding, "No". So why do we act so differently when it regards to video games? The eccentric character design in MGS5 has no baring on anything else other than itself. It doesn't somehow have a net negative on the video game industry as a whole. The video game industry isn't some monolith entity which dictates the creation of only certain types of games. Kojima clearly wanted this character designed a specific way, and if it displeases you that's perfectly fine. There are other games out there that probably suit your tastes.
That's a bit of a cop-out isn't it?
Same could be said about Quiet.
She's a female soldier who just happens to prefer to go to battle in a thong, a bra, pantyhose and army boots, nothing more.
In the end, yes, Kojima Productions is 100% responsible for her look, but so it 343 for Cortana's.
Not that any of it phases me at all as I like the designs and don't have a problem with them in the least.
Just don't like how one of the persons on one team can shit on another teams work when they are just a "guilty" of what they are accusing others of doing.
And as a couple of other people have pointed out, it's becoming a thing nowadays for western industry people, be that developers or "journalists" to point out certain things about Japanese developers or design choices and belittle them or talk about them like they are the lowest of the low.
Bit of a disgusting trend in it's own right.
The hypocrisy of the whole thing rubs me the wrong way as well.
Callibretto
Member
So wait until mgs5 is out and I have a feeling we're going to get lengthy codec conversation about Quiet's lack of clothing.
The part where Kojima said it?
"The initial target is to make u want to do cosplay or its figurine to sell well."
Callibretto
Member
He want to cosplay as Quiet? I don't think Kojima is ready for that.
Isn't Quiet the name of the character he criticized?
And it isn't very sexy, given she's now an old woman. I think there's a difference between "showing off because that's just her design" and "showing off because she's written that way", too. Eva in MGS 3 has breast implants and is showing them off specifically to get into Snake's head. Cortana is naked because....she is.
Some are really insecure about liking video games.