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ITT, I'll tell you why I believe in UFO's and aliens
- Thread starter Insane Metal
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morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
To anybody who denies sex with elves: http://www.vbs.tv/watch/the-vice-guide-to-sex/icelandic-elf-sex/comments
That's all the proof you need.
That's all the proof you need.
evil solrac v3.0
Member
Darktails said:
I read that. sounds like absolute garbage. to me recordings like this are the most interesting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28brqWCSgGA
Razorback PT said:
Go fist pump to American Gladiator re-runs or something. I'm more than willing to have a conversation with you about your opinion on the matter; but not if you're going to ridicule a credible source and leave a sour taste in the mouth of others.
For the record - the only reason I'm as passionate about the disclosure project on GAF is because I think the Gamer's demographic is one that can truly change the world. We have some very intelligent people in the industry itself and a very smart community following it's every move. If there is even half of a percent of credible UFO stories; then that is the greatest discovery in human history. Ever. And humanity needs to reap its cultural (among numerous other) benefits from such a revelation.
JumpJeff84
Member
morningbus said:
Save it for the thread.
Has anyone ever given a good explanation as to why the government would cover up aliens?
Seems to me that they'd LOVE for that shit to go public. They'd be able to do things that would make the patriot act look anarchistic. We spend two thirds of a trillion bucks a year fighting dudes with AK47s and pipe bombs, imagine the budget they'd whip up for the War on Space.
Not to mention the complete impossibility of covering up something that big for so long, as well as the numerous other impossibilities of UFO claims.
Seems to me that they'd LOVE for that shit to go public. They'd be able to do things that would make the patriot act look anarchistic. We spend two thirds of a trillion bucks a year fighting dudes with AK47s and pipe bombs, imagine the budget they'd whip up for the War on Space.
Not to mention the complete impossibility of covering up something that big for so long, as well as the numerous other impossibilities of UFO claims.
Shanadeus said:
:lol Yeah, alright dude... throw up emoto-cons and laugh at things you haven't seen / read about / researched or explored.
:lol this is so much fun mannn. Lets make light of every situation without being presented the facts from every side.
pj said:
Those are a lot of good questions. All of which are legitimate and hold some weight in the realm of discussion. Have you ever seen the disclosure project? Remain as objective as you can and peep this 2 hr. documentary pulling together 400 top officials from NASA, astronauts, pilots, radiologists, civilians, american and international air forces and more...
http://disclosureproject.org
Razorback
Member
Kamal007 said:
Listen, I get where you're coming from. I was a believer for a short while. I got obsessive even. But there just isn't any proof. None.
You accept that there are charlatans out there wanting to take advantage of others, right?People that come up with shit like The Secret. John Edward types, L. Ron Hubbard, all the new age nonsense.
Fooling others is very profitable.
JumpJeff84
Member
Razorback PT said:
You saying The Secret is 'shit'? Whoah now....slow down. It actually works. They exaggerate it a bit, yeah, but it does work on a smaller scale. Have you actually read the book?
Kamal007 said:
These conspiracy theories are essentially unverifiable, based on witness testimony and silly conjectures. I bet that they will soon use Hawking's statement about aliens in another one of their silly videos
You go ahead and enjoy knowing the truth, it won't change a single thing in your life or affect the world one bit. If a tenth the bullshit this man has claimed is true, then he could win the Randi prize with his powers to " "remote view" locations and times (past and present), and develop "cosmic consciousness" and supernatural abilities such as precognition."
I'm laughing because it's nonsense :lol
Razorback PT said:
It's cool that you didn't take my american gladiators fist pumping joke seriously. And it's really cool that you responded in a gentlemanly manner... so I'm assuming you're open to dialogues of conversation. So hear me out.
You're saying you were obsessed with the belief that aliens exist and or are being covered up? That's where our stances differ. I stumbled upon the non-profit organization that is the disclosure project and took in all the opinions of the 400 odd people who have worked in high ranking positions with access to information that's generally withheld from the layman.
- I saw the documentary, thought it was interesting, moved on.
- Checked out James Fox' I know what I saw movie about the Arizona sighting (over 5 minutes by thousands of civilians including the then governor of Arizona)
- At this point there's far too much testimony from too many different sources which can't have known each other all describing similar things. Not vague lighting in the sky - but crafts with similar dimensions, physics, acceleration and deceleration respectively.
- The Vatican comes out recently and discloses that there might be extra-terrestrial life, Stephen Hawking comes out very recently after years of denial, and takes a mathematical probability stance about ET life.
Britain releases it's UFO documents after 15 years of persuasion (look up Nick Pope's interviews with the BBC on youtube), Brazil releases it's UFO documentation (highlighting several credible sightings / extra-terrestrial information), Mexican government captures crafts of unknown origins on infrared cameras (videos up on youtube) and urges the governments of the world to push forth and have a real investigation / open talk about this. Stephen
- I am by no means convinced that aliens are real (though I'd be a fool to deny the mathematical probability) - but there is definitely more to the story than you and i are being told... and I think that it's important that everyone be presented with both sides of the story - so that they can arrive at their own conclusions.
And nobody is profiting from this information. The Disclosure project is non-profit, SETI is a different body of people entirely.
JumpJeff84
Member
Kamal007 said:
Anything to draw attention away from the child-raping I guess.
Kamal007 said:
Before I devote 2 hours of my life to that, what is the nature of it?
I am not interested in any eye witness testimony, regardless of the person's status.
I am also not interested in theoretical discussion of the possibility of UFOs, because I believe it to be possible, I just don't believe the stories.
What I would like is physical evidence clear enough to rule out any man-made explanations.
Another thing that makes no sense about UFOs is why the fuck are they hovering around people's houses? They have the technology to travel trillions of miles, but they gotta get within a couple hundred feet of ground level to observe us?
As for dancing lights, again, why? If they are trying to communicate, why do it in such random time intervals, in such random locations, and in such random manners?
Nothing about any UFO story I've ever heard made sense from a "what are they trying to achieve?" perspective.
Shanadeus said:
Why are you so quick to categorize 400 high ranking witnesses who have held conferences outside Washington as conspiracy theorists?
What truth?! I'm urging everyone to check out material that sheds light on the other side of the story. The story that isn't and won't be covered on corporate media. I'm trying to figure out what the truth is for myself - that's why I think it's important to take in every source of information to stay informed. You obviously feel differently.
Wow - how dark, shallow and hollow your perception of life must be if your stance on something like this is so funneled and directed at only one spectrum.
What are you talking about? You read up on the website some out of context terms and have put yourself off from giving it an honest chance. Why can't you actually watch it and then formulate an opinion?
Oh I get it... you're assuming it's nonsense because you're all knowing on this rock spinning through endless space that we inhabit, right? :lol
I'm going to up the ante to 100% of UFO stories are bullshit. I believe in them due to the infinity of the universe but if they do know we're here why would they be all shady and refuse contact? If they're an intelligent life they've probably gone through the same growing pains our society is going through since we're still in the technological revolution. They would understand that our species isn't just completely fucked up and shouldn't be contacted because I would assume they'd have a similar experience. You'd think they'd make contact and help out.
pj said:
There are witness testimonies from high ranking officials. Some of which claim to have seen craft, document it and were sworn to secrecy by their commanding officials.
There is a lot of evidence presented by radiologists about crafts moving faster than anything us humans could have even conceived in the time periods they were in (or even now).
How can you make sense of anything or even begin to answer anything when people flat out deny it's existence?
We're on the same side, with the same questions and concerns. Check out the documentary and check out I know what I saw -
Here's a trailer on Fox's flick to get a grasp of the material covered:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Etw33HrvPU
Tenks said:
Yeah - make contact with a civilization of animals which can't learn to love one another, stop wars, exploitation of one another and the environment they inhibit... a civilization which learned to blow up the earth 100x over before learning how to keep themselves fed for one day.
Gee... I wonder why they don't wanna' be our friends.
/ total hypothetical, I have zero insight into alien rationale / train of thought
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
pj said:
I think this is sometimes explained along the lines of the aliens not believing we're yet "ready" to communicate openly with them. But I've always thought this to be a ridiculously geocentric point of view. Why would intergalactic aliens care so much about one race on one stinking planet? If we're on the verge of blowing ourselves up, who gives a shit, cosmically?
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
Kamal007 said:
If they didn't want to profit from the information, then why is it being sold on their website? I can't find links to the free google videos on their website, but I can find links to buy everything, including books written exclusively by Steven Greer, the organization's founder.
I'm not going to say that the organization is doing anything shady, but to say that no one is profiting from anything is a little naive. The way these organizations usually work is that the organization buys thousands of copies of the author's book, which, for the author doesn't matter as it is a sale and they directly profit from it regardless.
I mean, Sarah Palin did the exact same thing with her books. This isn't uncommon.
Razorback PT said:
Really good youtube video I always like to bring out when someone yells me to be "open minded":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI
Kamal007 said:
Testimonies don't interest me at all. I don't see how being a high ranking official has any bearing on their truthfulness. Outside of this context, most people associate higher rank, especially in government, with being a bigger liar.
But those questions go straight to the issue of its existence. If it doesn't make sense for aliens to do something, then they probably wouldn't do it. Therefore, if someone sees it happening, then it's probably not aliens.
From the trailer: "Interviewer: How would you describe the acceleration?"
"Interviewee: Probably.. the speed of light."
I have 0 interest in testimonials of ANY kind.
Joe Shlabotnik said:
Isn't it crazy just to think about? A civilization that hasn't been able to freely travel it's own solar system already may have visitors from another galaxy.
Until we look at all the facts presented and have an open discussion on an administrative level, we're left with nothing but interesting hypotheticals.
That's the only reason why I'm playing the fanboy role in defending this theory... this field is not full of lone nut, crack-pots who see a sighting in the woods one afternoon and never again... it's full of nations of people who all describe similar things that are out of this fucking world. Even if five percentile of their claims are true - we ought to at least explore it! And not blue-book esque exploration (which those scientists said >5% of the claims may be credible)
I thought it was obvious that UFO doesn't mean alien... In any way.
Various research has acknowledged that there are unaccountable things flying around or appearing to fly around in the sky. Albeit small, there are things that simply cannot be explained. Does that mean we're being visited by aliens? Of course not. To simply express interest in proving what those anomalies/objects might be shouldn't provoke wild ass conspiracy accusations.
Various research has acknowledged that there are unaccountable things flying around or appearing to fly around in the sky. Albeit small, there are things that simply cannot be explained. Does that mean we're being visited by aliens? Of course not. To simply express interest in proving what those anomalies/objects might be shouldn't provoke wild ass conspiracy accusations.
Dude Abides
Banned
Kamal007 said:
Radiologists?
JumpJeff84
Member
Dude Abides said:
More importantly, what do the chiroprators think?
For like the millionth time, the Phoenix lights were flares. We know this for a fact. Also, is the Mexican UFO captured on infrared that one that was proven to be oil rigs in the distance? It really doesn't sound like you pursue this research beyond learning what you want to hear.
pj said:
And I'd agree whole-heartedly if these individuals described different things, with countless inaccuracies to their testimonials ... but without knowing one another - they all describe the same thing.
You cannot decipher rationale for something that may or may not be light-years ahead culturally, intellectually and advanced in any other way. Your dimension of rationality is a product of your individual intelligence, culture and your environment. Our collective consciousness also plays a role in our individual rationale.
So if ET's do indeed exist and we are being visited by them... I think it would be safe to assume they are far more technologically advanced than us... making their civilization older. it's very difficult for me to articulate at present, but I hope I did my point justice.
it makes little to no sense in trying to entertain the questions of why with our scientific method before acknowledging the more prevalent question of the truth behind all this.
That's an isolated incident, and I agree... whomever replied with that response probably tunes into Glen Beck. But - how can you deny countless sightings / testimonials from people who do not know one another - all saying the same thing? That seems like flat out denial on your end.
Dude Abides
Banned
Kamal007 said:
What?
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
It's not full of lone nut crackpots but perfectly competent, sane people can have irrational streaks, or simply be mistaken. There's no such thing as a "credible" witness on alien spacecraft because the only truly credible witness would be an actual alien.Kamal007 said:
You mentioned Buzz Aldrin before. What makes Buzz Aldrin any kind of expert on extraterrestrial spacecraft? At first blush there seems to be an obvious answer, but honestly, why would an astronaut's testimony be any more compelling than anyone else's? Why would an astronaut--someone who surely has a deeply romantic view of outer space, in fact--be an especially reliable witness?
And so it goes for air traffic controllers, retired military, etc.
Dude Abides said:
What we perceive as rationality is more cultural than you might think. You're rational based on the product of your environment. There is such a thing as a collective consciousness that everyone buys into (irrespective of how much they deny it) and models themselves according to.
Take for example two individuals from different time periods... one from our modern, 21st century information age and one from the ancient Aztec Age. Present both parties with in a situation of life or death with cannibalism being the sole means of survival and one individual's rationale may be at odds, while the other's may see zero problems with devouring another human being.
Point being - if aliens exist, and actually are visiting us - they're certainly more advanced. So their reasons / how they present themselves may not fit into our current model of rationale...
A very, very crude example, I know... but I hope it conveys my point
Trailblaster
Banned
Yeah know...
it's always seemed to me that due to the distances between Stars and galaxies being so vast, It would be easier for a advanced alien inteligence to vist a neighboring universe then a neighboring star system.
It just seems to me that it would take less energy to travel a short distance in the 7th dimension then then astronomical distances between stars, in the 3rd dimension
it's always seemed to me that due to the distances between Stars and galaxies being so vast, It would be easier for a advanced alien inteligence to vist a neighboring universe then a neighboring star system.
It just seems to me that it would take less energy to travel a short distance in the 7th dimension then then astronomical distances between stars, in the 3rd dimension
Death Dealer
Member
I once had a highly compartmented security clearance. At the time, I hadn't thought about the subject of UFOs. Our ship had an instruction called JANAP-146. As part of my qualifications, I had to be familiar with the material in this book. One of the chapters covers what is known as a CIRVIS MERINT message. It's for reporting critical intelligence, things like enemy submarines, aircraft, missile sightings, and UFOs.
The book spelled out a stiff penalty for disclosing these reports. It was an abberation. It goes without saying, classified material is not to be discussed outside of cleared people with a need to know. That's the only instance I can recall, where a general military instruction specifically outlined jail time and hefty fines for leaking information.
What I later learned is this instruction was pushed by the Air Force back in the 1950s to stifle civilian airline captains from reporting UFOs to the media.
The book spelled out a stiff penalty for disclosing these reports. It was an abberation. It goes without saying, classified material is not to be discussed outside of cleared people with a need to know. That's the only instance I can recall, where a general military instruction specifically outlined jail time and hefty fines for leaking information.
What I later learned is this instruction was pushed by the Air Force back in the 1950s to stifle civilian airline captains from reporting UFOs to the media.
Joe Shlabotnik said:
No doubt. But when countless individuals who have occupied high positions in our society report seeing similar things that they all describe as other wordly - why shouldn't it at least spark an honest and thorough investigation? Especially when most of them say they were sworn to secrecy by their government?
Have you seen the disclosure project? If you haven't, would you watch it - just so we can continue this dialogue? I'm genuinely intrigued by your train of thought and am curious to hear what you would have to say. You have nothing to lose.
KHarvey16 said:
But there is documentation, video footage and other sources of evidence sighted, too. http://disclosureproject.org
What have you to lose to honestly listen to the information presented?
Dude Abides
Banned
Kamal007 said:
It conveys it but does not establish it. You are talking about cultural relativism and moral "truths," not rationality and empiricism. The issue is whether whether an empirical fact, or several related ones, are true or not. That has nothing to do with cultural differences or views on morality. While people from different cultures may disagree as to whether cannibalism is permissible to save oneself from starvation, they will generally not disagree as to whether water flows downhill.
Death Dealer said:
That is frightening in its own right. I've read something similar for NASA , AFA and FAA employees. I sincerely hope you aren't making fun of me :lol
Trailblaster said:
Have you read up on Michio Kaku's string theory? He hypothesizes (and has now made an equation which the large hadron collider will test) about how the universe isn't made up of atoms and molecules but instead of string which can be bent and manipulated once we understand the properties of dark matter.
edit
Dude Abides said:
Right - but they will disagree about whether the sun spins around the earth or the earth around the sun. A civilization which holds the former as truth cannot begin to understand the reasons / purposes of why an advanced advanced civilization operates in the ways it does.
So who's more crazy? The people who think odd shapes/forms in the sky are unexplainable or the people who claim they know for a fact that they're not?
I believe myself, that if the known data collected from various countries is accurate at all, and that around 5% of reported incidents (in France last year for example) are unexplainable, that there should be some effort put into finding an explanation. It could be an ancient alien anime addict hell bent on our destruction or it could be light reflecting off of a radioactive balloon that got loose during a nuclear physicists 50th birthday party.
Either way, what the fuck is wrong with asking for an explanation?
I believe myself, that if the known data collected from various countries is accurate at all, and that around 5% of reported incidents (in France last year for example) are unexplainable, that there should be some effort put into finding an explanation. It could be an ancient alien anime addict hell bent on our destruction or it could be light reflecting off of a radioactive balloon that got loose during a nuclear physicists 50th birthday party.
Either way, what the fuck is wrong with asking for an explanation?
Razorback
Member
Kamal007 said:
I didn't believe anything, but I certainly entertained the thought that all of it could very well be true, and I was heavily leaning more towards it being true than not.
At one point it just started getting silly. Have you heard of project Serpo?
You ask me why I deny some of the credible stuff due to the batshit insane stuff. Because its all connected. Its the same people telling us these things.
If there really are alien spacecraft out there, I don't believe anyone who tells me they know what they are.
The government might be hiding secret aircrafts. That's as far as the conspiracy goes for me. They probably even use the alien stories to their advantage.
Joe Shlabotnik
Banned
Kamal007 said:
I've listened to about a half hour so far and I'm just hearing people describe bizarre blips they saw on their radar, basically. But I will try to watch the whole thing, and I am unfairly not giving it undivided attention right now.
But if they are so advanced and their motives this inscrutable, then they're basically gods to us. And at that point what are we really discussing?
But if you allow, as the host of that video does, that we could be in possession of alien technology applicable to solving all of our Earth problems, well that really narrows the scope of their methods and motives to conveniently geocentric purposes. Which means questions like, "Why aren't they hanging out over Times Square for a day or two?" are relevant again.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
belvedere said:
Because a lot of these people aren't asking for the unexplained to be examined, they're asking for things already explained to be seen as Government conspiracy and for the truth to be finally revealed.
These people are the birthers of Ufology and the less time spent pandering to their inane bullshit the better.
Death Dealer
Member
Kamal007 said:
I agree with Kaku, in that many university professors don't know as much about physics as they think they do. Many defense insiders have alluded to the idea that classified black project technology is multiple decades ahead of what is known in mainstream science. Read Aerospace journalist Nick Cook's book on hunt for zero point energy, and Dr. Paul LaViolette book on the secrets of anti-gravity propulsion.
Gaborn said:
There is plenty of reliable evidence. Whether it's enough to constitute "proof" is another matter. IMO it's beyond reasonable doubt. There are certainly no alien cadavers on display at the Smithsonian, and official culture and academia ridicules the belief, but it's not such an outlandish idea as it may appear at first glance.
We don't have HD photos of an alien, but we do have definitive proof of a long history of technological objects operating in the Earth's atmosphere, beyond anything possible with our known aerodynamics, and the US military considers the issue highly classified. If aliens are visiting, you don't have a need to know.
There is a plethora of high ranking officials trying to open the lid on this subject. If you look into it, senior military officers in just about every developed nation on this planet have acknowledged UFOs and ET visitation to this planet is a reality.
In 1974 France's Minister of Defense, M. Robert Galley, gave an interview with French National Radio, testifying that UFOs are real, the military had lots of data on them, and if the public was aware of everything, they would be disturbed.
Read the COMETA report. The former head of the French equivalent of Nasa, Andre Lebeau, takes the ET hypothesis seriously. Top ranking govt officials in Brazil, Belgium, France, and Russia among other nations have gone on the record affirming the situation.
I've never seen a flying saucer or alien ship or had an abduction experience, but if you look at some of the documents released under the FOIA, there is some explosive stuff, CIA Chadwell memo etc
The CIA was sued for its UFO files. It got to keep most of them classified, based on a national security neccessity. Isn't that interesting, considering official Air Force PR states UFOs pose no threat to natl security ? To this day, the CIA denies any further interest in UFOs, citing the closure of Project Blue Book.
At the dawn of the FOIA age, they released some files, and referenced other material in possession that was classified by NSA. OADR - It took the NSA's permission to downgrade it. The NSA was sued, they denied they had anything on UFOs and won the right to be exempt from future FOIA attempts. Google Project Moon Dust and Blue Fly. As the declassified Air Force documents show, it was a program for the field recovery and exploitation of foreign space debris and UFOs.
One of the most revealing insights gained by UFO document researchers, was a memo written by a General Bolender. It says UFO reports affecting National Security don't go through Project Blue Book channels, they go through military channels. In other words, as J. Allen Hynek suspected, it was a dog and pony show for the public.
Ben Rich and Kelly Johnson both thought some UFOs have an extra-solar system origin. Anyone doubting the seriousness of the subject should begin by reading the book UFOs and the National Security State by Richard Dolan.
Don't accept the govt propaganda at face value. Do your own research with primary sources. How many times have we been told a UFO that could outperform the jets scrambled to intercept it, was just a weather balloon or the planet Venus ? :lol
belvedere said:
Thank you. My sentiments exactly.
Razorback PT said:
I'm sorry - but aren't you arguing semantics at this point?
Is that about the officers posted on that ET planet or something? Where the Scottish hacker got access to those officers etc.? I've heard of it... and I don't know what to make of it.
All I know is that we're spinning on a rock, through what we perceive as nothingness in a dimension so grand that we can only see a fraction of its spectrum. And our way of life is completely contradictory to living harmoniously with this place... and it all makes no sense to me.
Who are these people, my friend?
I'm conflicted. On one hand you seem to have your mind made up and it seems futile to try and convince you otherwise. On the other hand, you seem to be a victim of over-exposure and blurring the lines between rationality with healthy skepticism and lunacy in conspiracy.
It seems the situation has left a sour taste in your mouth. I just hope you don't tune out completely.
Halycon said:
God forbid you add something constructive to the discussion instead of throwing around tired rhetoric / stereotype.
Death Dealer
Member
You're an ignorant troll.Halycon said:
You can't dispute a word of what I wrote.
I've said this before, but I do want intelligent alien life to visit earth and for everyone to know about it. I want to turn on a TV one day/get on the internet and there's solid, tangible, irrefutable evidence EVERYWHERE. I want photo ops between an alien ambassador and every politician on earth. I want to SEE intelligent extra terrestrial life. But there's no solid evidence we will see it in our life times. Incidentally, I feel similarly about big foot, the loch ness monster, and essentially any and every conspiracy theory'ed fantastical creature out there.
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