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Pejo · Mar 21, 2017

Welp, I just decided to pimp out my Effie based on comments above. I really like that skill layout.

Gave her Brave Lance+ from Abel, Pivot from a spare 4* Eirika I had, and Threaten Def 3 from a spare 5* Peri. Now I only need about 4 million skill points.

So My main team is now shaping up to be Effie, Ninian, Lechesis and a rotating spot for reds I guess, Lucina, Eldigan, or Lilna. It's a little blue heavy, but they're both solid, versatile units that can potentially cause problems even for colors they're weak to. I really don't like any of the Axe users thus far in the game.

Puruzi · Mar 21, 2017

Male Robin really isn't shit. He was great before but now other blue mages just outclass him

Man-is-Obsolete · Mar 21, 2017

Cerium said:
And yet there are a billion posts about MRobin every time I mention that Vantage is good on Takumi.

Clearly, people don't get it.

ggx2ac, Shun, and I are all running Nino teams. The meta is trending in that direction. That makes MRobin an especially poor investment at this point in time.

Why not both? Just because Hector is countered by countless reds doesn't mean he shouldn't be played in arena. Maybe not on defense, maybe. The thing is no one is ever going to play you directly. They will play a bot controlled version of your team, and they will bait your Nino out with their counter to him. Takumi is stil viable despite getting smacked on by Robin, and Robin is still viable despite getting deleted by Nino and Nino is still playable despite getting baited by a decent res / decent speed green or red.

This goes back to what I was saying when inheritance first dropped when everyone was worried this would cause a great imbalance in Arena. Inheritance greatly benefits the side that is controlled by the player, no matter if you are F2P or a whale.

Wichu · Mar 21, 2017

lt519 said:
So I went with Triangle Adept 2 because I didn't want to eat feathers or Roy and then added Blue Tomebreaker from (f)Robin. Just gave it a test drive in the Arena. He's officially a tank mage. 0 damage taken from archers and shrugs off swords/Tiki as if getting tickled by a feather. Survived a blue mage volley he normally would have lost against from Linde. Not sure he can withstand a Tharja since I haven't seen one and I'm on a good streak so I don't want to experiment

If you separate Tharja from her team, Robin tanks her too. She wrecks you if she gets enough buffs (Rauðrblade is insane), but without them it's not so bad.

And if you have +Atk, you can one-shot her on the counter (though you need Triangle Adept 3). If she has a Res buff, you need a corresponding Atk buff. If you can one-shot her, then you can win even against a buffed Tharja, as she needs to double you to get the KO.

Draxal · Mar 21, 2017

On color breakers are going to be pretty common imho.

My Julia is rocking green tomebreaker and it lets her one v one Nino with ease.

Firemind · Mar 21, 2017

Yeah Takumi really doesn't have the bulk to take advantage of Vantage much. I think you'd rather have Quick Riposte.

SYNTAX182 · Mar 21, 2017

PK Gaming said:
That doesn't change anything, especially in Robin/whoever has the Raven tome's case. The Takumi A.I always place itself near its teammates, so deleting him with Olwen potentially places her at risk at being attacked.

That's why anyone who can lure Takumi away from his teammates is valuable.

Edit: But yes, killing him enemy phase is more preferable due to vantage.

Yeah you leave her open if you attack with her last. But if you initiate with Olwen first, you can drag back with Nino, use a dancer for another turn and use Olwen reposition to get her and whoever else out of danger. That's why I'm thinking swap or reposition on Lucina instead of Rally speed. Hmm..

Man-is-Obsolete · Mar 21, 2017

Puruzi said:
Male Robin really isn't shit. He was great before but now other blue mages just outclass him

Sure in terms of firepower Reinhardt and Linde have him beat. But so long as people keep putting Klein and Takumi and this arena season Jaffar on their defense teams Robin is a great addition to any offensive teams.

SYNTAX182 · Mar 21, 2017

Draxal said:
On color breakers are going to be pretty common imho.

My Julia is rocking green tomebreaker and it lets her one v one Nino with ease.

Yes, I was thinking of this too.

Akuun · Mar 21, 2017

I'm usually happy if I have characters who are good against two colors. Making them immune to the color they're supposed to be weak to isn't the point. Every character having a counter is the whole point of the game.

Yes, Robin hard counters some units but gets hard countered by others. That doesn't make him shit. Same goes for Hector, Nino, Lucina, and all the other strong units in the game.

lt519 · Mar 21, 2017

Wichu said:
If you separate Tharja from her team, Robin tanks her too. She wrecks you if she gets enough buffs (Rauðrblade is insane), but without them it's not so bad.

And if you have +Atk, you can one-shot her on the counter (though you need Triangle Adept 3). If she has a Res buff, you need a corresponding Atk buff. If you can one-shot her, then you can win even against a buffed Tharja, as she needs to double you to get the KO.

Hmm thanks for the info, I'm thinking about giving my Jaffar a Rally support move once he gets enough SP. I might go for Rally Attack then.

dreamlongdead · Mar 21, 2017

Cerium said:
And yet there are a billion posts about MRobin every time I mention that Vantage is good on Takumi.

Clearly, people don't get it.

ggx2ac, Shun, and I are all running Nino teams. The meta is trending in that direction. That makes MRobin an especially poor investment at this point in time.

Based on what evidence? You'll rarely see Nino centered teams at the high levels. Those teams will give you low point Defensive wins, but it's really about Lords and Knights.

You'll only be seeing one caster on these types of teams.

Hector and Effie are basically free wins for me, but you'll never see me call them trash units. For people who still commonly encounter Takumi, Robin (M) is amazing. There really isn't a Red or White unit who can touch him if he's specced appropriately.

Mupod · Mar 21, 2017

maybe when I get out of the stat hell I'm in that puts two Takumis on every team (this literally happened to me today) I can think about not having Robin. Right now playing without a hard counter for Takumi is a nightmare. I'm gonna have Nino up and running soon so I don't see why I can't just have both. Robin has been slapping shit for me for so long I have the SP to set him up with some buffs too.

Cerium · Mar 21, 2017

dreamlongdead said:
Based on what evidence? Those teams will give you low point Defensive wins, but it's really about Lords and Knights.

You'll only be seeing one caster on these types of teams.

ggx2ac is ranked in the 100s as we speak. Shun also does extremely well. I'm not throwing out random ass names, these are the best players we have in this thread.

And you only need one caster: Nino.

Man-is-Obsolete said:
Why not both? Just because Hector is countered by countless reds doesn't mean he shouldn't be played in arena. Maybe not on defense, maybe. The thing is no one is ever going to play you directly. They will play a bot controlled version of your team, and they will bait your Nino out with their counter to him. Takumi is stil viable despite getting smacked on by Robin, and Robin is still viable despite getting deleted by Nino and Nino is still playable despite getting baited by a decent res / decent speed green or red.

This goes back to what I was saying when inheritance first dropped when everyone was worried this would cause a great imbalance in Arena. Inheritance greatly benefits the side that is controlled by the player, no matter if you are F2P or a whale.

The thing is that the counters to Nino are not common. Tharja and Sanaki are the big ones, but how often do you see those in Arena? On the other hand both MRobins and Ninos abound. Every character has a counter, but the metagame is what determines which heroes are generally more effective.

It's true that inheritance favors offense teams. But, going back to the original point of conversation, Vantage Takumi is absolutely one of the best units you can put on defense because a lot of players are straight up not prepared for "Surprise Vantage" on him. My defense results have significantly improved since I gave him that skill.

redcrayon · Mar 21, 2017

I look at it that I've certainly seen the variety in team composition increase over time as more characters have been released and people experiment with different setups, and that has to be a good thing.

commish · Mar 21, 2017

I think blue heavy in this meta is okay, given the relatively fewer good green options.

SYNTAX182 · Mar 21, 2017

I think the diversity is good, don't wanna roll up on every arena season steamrolling and not have anything else to do the rest of the way. My score is starting to average around 4300 now, which I'm okay with. Haven't gotten a defense this season though, might have to work on that.

Draxal · Mar 21, 2017

commish said:
I think blue heavy in this meta is okay, given the relatively fewer good green options.

Green has very solid options, it's just that they were completely wrecked by red which has so many options.

dreamlongdead · Mar 21, 2017

Mupod said:
maybe when I get out of the stat hell I'm in that puts two Takumis on every team (this literally happened to me today) I can think about not having Robin. Right now playing without a hard counter for Takumi is a nightmare. I'm gonna have Nino up and running soon so I don't see why I can't just have both. Robin has been slapping shit for me for so long I have the SP to set him up with some buffs too.

You should consider upgrading Sharena or one of your dragons to 5*. Hector and Effie would be the best choices, but those two are super hard to get. I've never even seen 4* Effie.

I would also suggest putting Fury 3 on one your units, though I personally haven't done it yet.

It's so much better when Takumi fights are no longer common. Skill inheritance does give you tools to counter him, though.

commish · Mar 21, 2017

Draxal said:
Green has very solid options, it's just that they were completely wrecked by red which has so many options.

But we can agree that they have fewer "good" options than the other colors right? I mean, I run 2 greens in my team, so I'm not anti-green

lt519 · Mar 21, 2017

Mupod said:
maybe when I get out of the stat hell I'm in that puts two Takumis on every team (this literally happened to me today) I can think about not having Robin. Right now playing without a hard counter for Takumi is a nightmare. I'm gonna have Nino up and running soon so I don't see why I can't just have both. Robin has been slapping shit for me for so long I have the SP to set him up with some buffs too.

I'm running Robin and Nino. It's a great combo that can handle anything out there (as long as you properly manage a Tharja encounter). Insert random Red Lord and you don't even need a fourth unit. I've been scoring in the 4200's easily with level 30 4*s in the last 4 weeks. I'm deciding between Roy and Eirika for my Red as those are my only options and then my 4th I've been toying with Jaffar and Kagero, Jaffar currently for the bonus.

People forget about Robin being a good hard counter for Kagero too. Even with the bonus damage to infantry units he can tank a Kagero. Offensively you can do a lot of things with a tanky Robin that you can't do with a lot of the other mages.

Defense on the other hand, people mine as well not even have Robin on their teams. I just bait one shot them with Nino.

Draxal · Mar 21, 2017

commish said:
But we can agree that they have fewer "good" options than the other colors right? I mean, I run 2 greens in my team, so I'm not anti-green

I think the best way to say it is much harder to obtain. Nino wasn't pullable as a five star until recently, and Julia was the only good on focus banner in the first month.

Blue definitely has more options but the best green has is incredibly solid.

dreamlongdead · Mar 21, 2017

I would really interested to know who is providing the buffs to Nino. Seems like that team has Hone Speed users and Ralliers. Since I'm facing low movement and Melee heavy teams, that type of setup is kind of hard to visualize.

I'm running two Sword units, and one of them would just OHKO her if she gets in range.

Cerium · Mar 21, 2017

dreamlongdead said:
I would really interested to know who is providing the buffs to Nino. Seems like that team has Hone Speed users and Ralliers. Since I'm facing low movement and Melee heavy teams, that type of setup is kind of hard to visualize.

I'm running two Swordies, and one of them would just OHKO her if she gets in range.

Eirika is the prototypical Nino companion.

I'm running Eirika with Sieglinde (+3 Atk), Hone Speed (+4 Spd), and Rally Resistance (+4 Res).

Then I throw in Ninian with Dance and Fortify Defense (+3 Def).

Total of 17 bonus damage on Nino from buffs alone. 66 attack not counting color advantages, and a buffed Nino with the right nature (+Spd) will double just about anything. Add dancing on top of that and it's just stupid. I was worried about Lucina on paper but in my Arena run last night I confirmed that a buffed Nino will ORKO Lucina just like anything else.

Draxal · Mar 21, 2017

Cerium said:
Eirika is the prototypical Nino companion.

I'm running Eirika with Sieglinde (+3 Atk), Hone Speed (+4 Spd), and Rally Resistance (+4 Res).

Then I throw in Ninian with Dance and Fortify Defense (+3 Def).

Total of 17 bonus damage on Nino from buffs alone. 66 attack not counting color advantages, and a buffed Nino with the right nature (+Spd) will double just about anything. Add dancing on top of that and it's just stupid. I was worried about Lucina on paper but in my Arena run last night I confirmed that a buffed Nino will ORKO Lucina just like anything else.

She shouldn't orko a good Lucina unless you had darting blow, you shouldn't be able to outspeeds by her 5.

Sushen · Mar 21, 2017

I want to give more utility to Olivia beyond being a dancing machine. I'm thinking some buffing skills to help out. What would be good choices? I see her A and B passive available. Along with special.

Cerium · Mar 21, 2017

Draxal said:
She shouldn't orko a good Lucina unless you had darting blow, you shouldn't be able to outspeeds by her 5.

Lucina with neutral nature has 36 speed. My Nino (+Spd/-Res) has 39 speed unbuffed, and Eirika gives her 4 more for 43 speed. She doubles Lucina easily.

I'm also going to give her Fury when I get some more feathers. I could give her Darting Blow, but she's already so fast that I don't think it's even necessary.

Draxal · Mar 21, 2017

Cerium said:
Lucina with neutral nature has 36 speed. My Nino (+Spd/-Res) has 39 speed unbuffed, and Eirika gives her 4 more for 43 speed. She doubles Lucina easily.

I'm also going to give her Fury when I get some more feathers. I could give her Darting Blow, but she's already so fast that I don't think it's even necessary.

I said a good Lucina.

SYNTAX182 · Mar 21, 2017

Sushen said:
I want to give more utility to Olivia beyond being a dancing machine. I'm thinking some buffing skills to help out. What would be good choices? I see her A and B passive available. Along with special.

I would put HP+4 and drag back from donnel for a/b slot, then give her a Ruby Sword to combat green units. For special, you can go glacies since she has good resist for higher damage or holy vestments/aegis to tank a bit. This should give her some cheap utilities to learn. Don't go for skills that need high sp. Hard to get sp for dancers.

Cerium · Mar 21, 2017

Draxal said:
I said a good Lucina.

With Fury even a "good" Lucina will fall.

And anyway I can always use Dance if I really need a second volley.

ggx2ac · Mar 21, 2017

Cerium said:
ggx2ac is ranked in the 100s as we speak. Shun also does extremely well. I'm not throwing out random ass names, these are the best players we have in this thread.

And you only need one caster: Nino.

But I wasn't using Nino this time because of Ninian being the bonus hero. I switched out Nino with Minerva.

Edit: I've dropped to rank 248 now.

Technoweirdo · Mar 21, 2017

Draxal said:
On color breakers are going to be pretty common imho.

My Julia is rocking green tomebreaker and it lets her one v one Nino with ease.

Curious, what happens when two units break each other? Do we get a Wary Fighter situation where nobody can double? Brash Assault + Quick Riposte where both parties double each other? Or do we roll back to whoever has the higher Speed?

Cerium · Mar 21, 2017

ggx2ac said:
But I wasn't using Nino this time because of Ninian being the bonus hero. I switched out Nino with Minerva.

Edit: I've dropped to rank 248 now.

My point is that you know what you're doing and so does Shun and I like to think that I have a clue as well.

ggx2ac · Mar 21, 2017

Cerium said:
The thing is that the counters to Nino are not common. Tharja and Sanaki are the big ones, but how often do you see those in Arena? On the other hand both MRobins and Ninos abound. Every character has a counter, but the metagame is what determines which heroes are generally more effective.

You'll see level 50 Tharja units plenty of times, they can be difficult to beat because they are pretty fast and have decent health. I think this was before I got to use Inherit Skill to get Triangle Adept so maybe that will make a difference.

Edit: If I had a high level Olwen, it would also make a big difference.

Scum · Mar 21, 2017

Akuun said:
If you already have a Tharja, then give her and Eirika a spin to see if you like the playstyle first. Might as well try it out before spending those feathers on Nino.

Thanks. Will do.

Shun · Mar 21, 2017

I don't use Nino, but I know she's good.

The only mage I would run is Rinda because of her stats and role.

I haven't run a single ranged unit since the first two weeks.

I've been running an entire Melee team for a while now.

Ryoma+1/Tiki/Sharon/Anna netted me a 4,625 Arena score with an average enemy level of 660. Last night I was in the top 30s but earlier today I dropped all the way down to 140s.

I personally think the 3 characters in the OP are the 3 best characters in their respective colors at the moment offensively.

Ryoma is straight up the best red in the game, edging Lucina only because he is more versatile. Rinda is Rinda, Nino needs help but there really isn't that much competition.

Calvary teams have a higher ceiling, but they require a lot of luck and spending and aren't as versatile, that's why I'm not sold on Reinhart or Cecilia even though I know they are both really good characters. I also think Leon is good and has a high ceiling, but only with a cavalry team with the new changes.

Cerium · Mar 21, 2017

ggx2ac said:
You'll see level 50 Tharja units plenty of times, they can be difficult to beat because they are pretty fast and have decent health. I think this was before I got to use Inherit Skill to get Triangle Adept so maybe that will make a difference.

Triangle Adept on Corrin?

I've considered putting it on Ninian to make her a harder counter against Nino threats, but that would mean sacrificing my 5* Cordelia and I don't really want to do that if I can help it. Of course, you are playing in the level 50 bracket while I'm playing with the 40s.

Shun said:
I don't use Nino, but I know she's good.

The only mage I would run is Rinda because of her stats and role.

I haven't run a single ranged unit since the first two weeks.

I've been running an entire Melee team for a while now.

Ryoma+1/Tiki/Sharon/Anna netted me a 4,625 Arena score with an average enemy level of 660. Last night I was in the top 30s but earlier today I dropped all the way down to 140s.

I personally think the 3 characters in the OP are the 3 best characters in their respective colors at the moment offensively.

Ryoma is straight up the best red in the game, edging Lucina only because he is more versatile. Rinda is Rinda, Nino needs help but there really isn't that much competition.

My bad I got confused with Nono and from your OP.

Draxal · Mar 21, 2017

Tbh I think Lucina is better then Ryoma for one reason only.

There are very few plus ten Ryomas around, there are some plus ten Lucinas around.

Other then that Raijinto > Falchion.

I'm also on the Tharja is really fucking good bandwagon, but green isn't a threat.

commish · Mar 21, 2017

I think SI hurts Lucina a bit in that one of her biggest draws before was being anti-dragon. But now, with SI, you can build in some defense to that in your dragons. Distant counter will always be amazing simply because some of the maps make getting within striking distance of a ranged unit quite difficult, at least not without great risk.

Draxal said:
Tbh I think Lucina is better then Ryoma for one reason only.

There are very few plus ten Ryomas around, there are some plus ten Lucinas around.

Other then that Raijinto > Falchion.

I'm also on the Tharja is really fucking good bandwagon, but green isn't a threat.

I really considered using Tharja as my next promotion, but settled on Nowi. As you say, I see less green.

ggx2ac · Mar 21, 2017

Cerium said:
Triangle Adept on Corrin?

I've considered putting it on Ninian to make her a harder counter against Nino threats, but that would mean sacrificing my 5* Cordelia and I don't really want to do that if I can help it. Of course, you are playing in the level 50 bracket while I'm playing with the 40s.

That and if I gave my Female Corrin Lightning Breath to counter ranged attacks would help too.

Although I don't know if it's worth it compared to Dark Breath.

Cerium · Mar 21, 2017

ggx2ac said:
That and if I gave my Female Corrin Lightning Breath to counter ranged attacks would help too.

Although I don't know if it's worth it compared to Dark Breath.

If my Adult Tiki was 5* I'd transfer Lightning Breath+ in a heartbeat. I don't get much use out of Light Breath.

lt519 · Mar 21, 2017

Lol Lyn does zero damage to Robin with TA. Just had a perfect arena run ruined by a dumb move. I let Roy tank a Lucina instead of Robin and Roy got doubled. Ended with 4388 on one death that cost me 70 points. Gonna try an Eirika run now. From what I understand she's got a higher arena score than Roy. I need to beef her up though. Should get me above 4500 on a perfect run.

OceanBlue · Mar 21, 2017

I'm pretty sad I can't get a higher arena score this cycle. Only bonus unit I have is Jaffar and his BST is so bad lol.

Shun · Mar 21, 2017

ggx2ac said:
That and if I gave my Female Corrin Lightning Breath to counter ranged attacks would help too.

Although I don't know if it's worth it compared to Dark Breath.

Cerium said:
If my Adult Tiki was 5* I'd transfer Lightning Breath+ in a heartbeat. I don't get much use out of Light Breath.

Dark Breath+ is by far the best dragon weapon. If you don't mind the lower attack damage and want distant counter, then get the other. Dark Breath+ is the best option for team because of its effect. A -Attack/Speed debuff within two spaces all in one is amazing because most of the dragons are tanks. The sole exception being Kamui who is going to be your fast hyper offense dragon, and Ninian your dancer. Both are fast dragons and benefit from Dark Breath+ very well for the rest of the team.

If you really need distant counter, then it's pretty great. But by that time you're likely dead from Nino/Yuria/Rinda.

The reason Ryoma works well with distant counter and Raijinto is because it's a 16 attack weapon and he is physical and usually take a hit and deal a lot of damage back to ranged characters who usually have lower defenses. The dragons don't have that same luxury until a skill like hone/spur dragons is out.

lt519 · Mar 21, 2017

OceanBlue said:
I'm pretty sad I can't get a higher arena score this cycle. Only bonus unit I have is Jaffar and his BST is so bad lol.

I hope they remove all that, not sure what is going in the April update, but having to pick specific units to max your score is a bad system. Like why make some not viable for score chasing. Especially when I haven't been pulling any that'd give me much better than what I have right now.

lt519 · Mar 21, 2017

Wow just bodied a Nino with Jaffar, accidentally left him in range and he took Nino out with a double counter with 5 HP to spare, thankfully it wasn't a buffed Nino.

Hmm one death run with Eirika only got me 4363. Was a bit more smooth of a run though with the buffs provided by Eirika.

If I give her +5 HP will that add to my score? She synergized with Nino, Robin, and Jaffar much better. Don't have anyone other 5* to improve my score besides Hinoka+2.

J-Tier · Mar 21, 2017

Draxal said:
On color breakers are going to be pretty common imho.

My Julia is rocking green tomebreaker and it lets her one v one Nino with ease.

I'm wondering if I should do this for my Julia too. I have a Henry to merge, but I've been hesitant because it's so specific.

Man-is-Obsolete · Mar 21, 2017

If I wanted to put dark breath+ onto Ninian she would have to learn both weapons or just dark breath+?

ggx2ac · Mar 21, 2017

I'm thinking of removing Eirika's Drag Back, it feels like I've rarely had any situations now where I needed to use it.

So my options are:

Fury/Triangle Adept + Renewal/Desperation/Vantage

J-Tier · Mar 21, 2017

Man-is-Obsolete said:
If I wanted to put dark breath+ onto Ninian she would have to learn both weapons or just dark breath+?

EDIT: Redacted.

She may be able to learn the + version without the preceding abilities--I don't see the "Req" on it.

EDIT2: Nevermind, it requires the preceding abilities.

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