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The Evil Within on Akumu is one of THE most unsatisfying experiences I've had :(

A

AgentOtaku

Member
FYI: Posted from phone, sorry for poopy grammer

Basically have been trying to do an Akumu run and got up to Ch.6 - middle part/castle area - and I think I'm just done...

It's the fucking antithesis of fun in almost every way (it's supposed to be challenging... but challenging CAN be fun, dammit). I've played a decent amount of games over the past 28 years or so and can't remember encountering a game's mode that goes so out of its way to basically piss you the fuck off and punish you because it's supposed oh so hardcore. This isn't in a satisfying Souls-esque, get better and feel that gratification, kind of challenge. This is basically find a way to navigate the game's mechanics that fall apart almost completely on higher than normal difficulty (which is balanced exquisitely I might add). A mode where you're at such a disadvantage that pure skill/mastery of said mechanics doesn't matter but instead focusing on exploits, cheap tactics, luck, and insane amounts of trial and error. Don't get me even started about your partner AI or how the game's collision detection is utter nonsense.
I ADORE The Evil Within SO DAMN MUCH, but have to force myself to stop playing this mode as it's actually making me resent the game as a whole. It's.just.so.broken.And before people ask, yes I've looked up youtube tactics, read FAQs, etc., but in the end, there's just this unfair consistent element of chance that, as I said before, makes you feel like shit no matter how well you play...

I really need to stop giving a shit about trophies....
 
graffix13

graffix13

Member
AgentOtaku said:
I really need to stop giving a shit about trophies....
Click to expand...

I know. I have the same problem.

I didn't even attempt Akumu mode because I knew it wouldn't be fun and I'd just end up sour. Was the platinum worth all the headache? I decided not. I've done that with other games and in the end it's just not worth it.

I just move on to another game and get immersed in that. The pain of not achieving the plat goes away after a few days, as you're now involved in a new game.

I was frustrated enough on TEW Normal mode.
 
A

Auctopus

Member
Sounds like Dragon Age Inquisition's 'Nightmare' mode. Just artificial difficulty piled on top of a partially broken combat system (aggro didn't work properly).
 
-MD-

-MD-

Member
I liked it but it was a 1 time thing for me just to do it, Nightmare is the best mode in the game.

4sNKHZh.png
Click to expand...
 
stn

stn

Member
I'm dreading doing it. Eventually I'll go for all the achievements.

@-MD-

Only 53 deaths in akumu? That's amazing. What's your secret?
 
R

RoboPlato

I'd be in the dick
I usually don't even attempt difficulties like that. They're rarely properly designed and more of just a test of endurance than skill.
 
M

Mupod

Member
I mean, I loved Vanquish, but God Hard wasn't fun either. The best part of the game was boosting around doing crazy stuff but God Hard turns it into a frustrating, plodding experience.
 
Neff

Neff

Member
AKUMU 悪夢 is a total afterthought in TEW, almost none of the game is designed around it. It's just there for bragging rights, should you consider it worth bragging that you endured a lengthy and barely interactive ordeal of sheer dogged persistence and blind luck. Even Nightmare difficulty feels kind of sloppy to me, but AKUMU 悪夢 is Nightmare times ten.

The game is truly, truly brilliant, but I'd advise anyone looking to preserve their self-respect, sanity and valued time to leave AKUMU 悪夢 alone.
 
M

Mubbed

Member
You should be well accustomed to Nightmare mode before attempting Akumu. Planning your build in advance makes it fairly manageable.
 
A

AgentOtaku

Member
CherryIcee said:
Those damn bear traps.
Click to expand...

I was actually grateful for them. The mines tho... you basically cant use them because the window to disarm them is ball-bustingly small... they end up not being worth the frustration, especially if you havent hit a checkpoint in awhile
 
L

LakeEarth

Member
Yeah, screw trophies if you aren't having fun. I have 4 plats, and they're four games where I was having so much fun that I didn't want to stop playing them.
 
A

AgentOtaku

Member
Mupod said:
I mean, I loved Vanquish, but God Hard wasn't fun either. The best part of the game was boosting around doing crazy stuff but God Hard turns it into a frustrating, plodding experience.
Click to expand...

Wolfenstein also makes having fun with the run n gun mechanics not really possible on higher difficulties either I noticed. You just go down to quick...
 
A

AgentOtaku

Member
Neff said:
AKUMU 悪夢 is a total afterthought in TEW, almost none of the game is designed around it. It's just there for bragging rights, should you consider it worth bragging that you endured a lengthy and barely interactive ordeal of sheer dogged persistence and blind luck. Even Nightmare difficulty feels kind of sloppy to me, but AKUMU 悪夢 is Nightmare times ten.

The game is truly, truly brilliant, but I'd advise anyone looking to preserve their self-respect, sanity and valued time to leave AKUMU 悪夢 alone.
Click to expand...

Nailed it sir
 
C

CherryIcee

Member
AgentOtaku said:
I was actually grateful for them. The mines tho... you basically cant use them because the window to disarm them is ball-bustingly small... they end up not being worth the frustration, especially if you havent hit a checkpoint in awhile
Click to expand...

Yeah. I never messed with them unless it was at the start of a checkpoint. The hardest parts of the mode for me were the house siege and the 2nd Laura fight (those damn bear traps again).
 
X

XxSlasherMcGirkxX

Member
The worst part about Akumu mode is the cheap checkpoints. They could save a checkpoint right in the middle of an enemy throwing a weapon at you. So as soon as the game is done loading you have to dodge instantly or you get one hit killed. Chp 6 was bullshit but the rest of the game is manageable if you have the determination. No balance whatesoever.
 
T

The_Darkest_Red

Member
AgentOtaku said:
I really need to stop giving a shit about trophies....
Click to expand...
This is the important part. Focus on this.

TEW is a great game but look what this experience has done to you. Was it worth it? You could have been playing another game and actually enjoying yourself. Let it go, AgentOtaku, it will be worth it. Trust me, I platinumed Killzone 2!
 
-MD-

-MD-

Member
Play Nightmare mode instead if you haven't yet, OP.

It will rekindle your love of the game.
 
N

nel e nel

Member
AgentOtaku said:
Wolfenstein also makes having fun with the run n gun mechanics not really possible on higher difficulties either I noticed. You just go down to quick...
Click to expand...

Good think you only need to replay the last chapter on the hardest difficulty to unlock that trophy.
 
T

themidnightsun156

Member
stn said:
I'm dreading doing it. Eventually I'll go for all the achievements.
Click to expand...

then why do it? are achievement hunters masochists? is it for a sense of accomplishment from doing something so difficult? or are you trying to get as much as you can out of the game for the money you spent?
 
F

Fisty

Member
Akumu is not bad at all, but i got to where you did before something else came out and i put it aside. Its just one-hit death, as long as you can play safe and slow, youre fine. When you get to one of the trouble spots, you just keep trying until you get that perfect run.

Also, Mikami games have ALWAYS been about finding exploits, cheap tricks, and cheesing the AI. Its part of why his games are so well loved. Weapon swapping for upgrades and boost rolling in Vanquish. Upgrading capacity for ammo refill, i-frames during animations, ladder camping in RE4. Gem exploits and such in Shadows of the Damned. TEW is just the first of his games with a trophy that practically requires you to learn all the game's weaknesses (except RE HD maybe)
 
J

jett

D-Member
TEW is an intensely unbalanced game, these people cheaped out on testing. Normal difficulty was frustrating enough for me.
 
AdaWong

AdaWong

Junior Member
Don't blame your Trophy Hunting hobby. Blame the game.

Trophy hunting is the best thing ever. The feeling of getting a hard that isn't based on luck >

*bling!*
 
A

AgentOtaku

Member
The_Darkest_Red said:
This is the important part. Focus on this.

TEW is a great game but look what this experience has done to you. Was it worth it? You could have been playing another game and actually enjoying yourself. Let it go, AgentOtaku, it will be worth it. Trust me, I platinumed Killzone 2!
Click to expand...

My man :)
 
C

ClayKavalier

Banned
themidnightsun156 said:
then why do it? are achievement hunters masochists? is it for a sense of accomplishment from doing something so difficult? or are you trying to get as much as you can out of the game for the money you spent?
Click to expand...
As someone who occasionally goes out of my way to platinum games (think I did Infamous: SS, Shadow of Mordor, and FarCry 4 last year), it's just satisfying to know that you've fully experienced a game. For me it's not quite about getting my money's worth, it's knowing that I've seen everything there is to see in a game I like. Seeing the 100% in my games list is satisfying too.

Although sometimes those things don't hold true. In FarCry you don't have to come close to getting 100% completion to get the platinum, and since the expansion came out I think I only have 85% trophy completion.

Okami is a good example of a satisfying platinum, there's a lot of obscure side quests you have to complete to earn trophies, stuff like revisit an early location at the end of the game to fight a hidden boss. If you love the game it's satisfying to know you've fully completed it.
 
R

Ralemont

not me
ClayKavalier said:
As someone who occasionally goes out of my way to platinum games (think I did Infamous: SS, Shadow of Mordor, and FarCry 4 last year), it's just satisfying to know that you've fully experienced a game. For me it's not quite about getting my money's worth, it's knowing that I've seen everything there is to see in a game I like. Seeing the 100% in my games list is satisfying too.
Click to expand...

Thing is, the concept of what fully experiencing a game entails has changed with the introduction of trophies. In JRPGs, for example, 100%ing a game would be doing all the sidequests, getting ultimate weapons, beating all the optional bosses, and getting the max level. Now with trophies a bunch of extra shit has been introduced and my personal opinion is that it has been to the detriment of the "feeling of getting 100%." Now getting a Platinum feels more like relief than satisfaction.
 
F

Fushichou187

Member
TheMoon said:
My Dead Space 1 trophies are still sitting at 91% because I had not desire to play on Professional to get the last gold. Thankfully I rid myself of this disease eventually.
Click to expand...

lol get a grip.

themidnightsun156 said:
then why do it? are achievement hunters masochists? is it for a sense of accomplishment from doing something so difficult? or are you trying to get as much as you can out of the game for the money you spent?
Click to expand...

I think both of those things are perfectly valid reasons for pursuing an achievement or trophy, particularly difficulty based ones.

Anyways, never played TEW so I can't comment on how to approach it but it sounds like OP is just burned out from it, so maybe they should put it aside and play something else, or perhaps come back to it later? I see other posters comparing their experiences with things like Dead Space (DS2s Hard Core mode ain't for the easily frustrated) and Vanquish. In both cases I think pursuing the higher difficulty forced me to simply master the tools the game gives me; I find satisfaction in that. A lot of people here don't and that's totally fine. If Akumu mode is giving you literal nightmares, you might just want to put it down for now.
 
F

Fushichou187

Member
AgentOtaku said:
Not nightmares... sadness tho because it's so poorly fucking balanced
Click to expand...

I hear ya. Again, never touched TEW so I can't comment on Akumu's balancing, but it's well-worn territory for games that have multiple difficulty levels to simply decrease the damage you do while making enemies hit harder; if resource management is involved then you can be sure that you'll find less of everything. Some games I personally think can do this well (TLoU's Grounded difficulty) but most feel like developers took the easy way out.
 
C

CybernatonEvolution

Member
AgentOtaku said:
FYI: Posted from phone, sorry for poopy grammer

Basically have been trying to do an Akumu run and got up to Ch.6 - middle part/castle area - and I think I'm just done...

It's the fucking antithesis of fun in almost every way (it's supposed to be challenging... but challenging CAN be fun, dammit). I've played a decent amount of games over the past 28 years or so and can't remember encountering a game's mode that goes so out of its way to basically piss you the fuck off and punish you because it's supposed oh so hardcore. This isn't in a satisfying Souls-esque, get better and feel that gratification, kind of challenge. This is basically find a way to navigate the game's mechanics that fall apart almost completely on higher than normal difficulty (which is balanced exquisitely I might add). A mode where you're at such a disadvantage that pure skill/mastery of said mechanics doesn't matter but instead focusing on exploits, cheap tactics, luck, and insane amounts of trial and error. Don't get me even started about your partner AI or how the game's collision detection is utter nonsense.
I ADORE The Evil Within SO DAMN MUCH, but have to force myself to stop playing this mode as it's actually making me resent the game as a whole. It's.just.so.broken.And before people ask, yes I've looked up youtube tactics, read FAQs, etc., but in the end, there's just this unfair consistent element of chance that, as I said before, makes you feel like shit no matter how well you play...

I really need to stop giving a shit about trophies....
Click to expand...



Welcome to (unofficial) challenge runs where you have to find specific, pixel-perfect paths, A.I loops, animation canceling and other game mechanics exploits, and hope for good RNG. This also applies to some games that have silly difficulty modes and challenges.

Speaking of souls games, they have a lot of possibilities regarding challenge runs, and MGS also has official shitty runs; things like big boss emblems and the associated unofficial challenge runs (MGS3 tuxedo run big boss emblem, ghost runs...etc).


Some players like exploiting every aspect of the game and doing specific stuff; it is somewhat fun. I personally don't like the extreme side of that where things boil down to doing very systematic steps and simply "path finding", and just doing shit without relying on skill, reactions and creativity. I like to do balanced challenge runs that exploit the A.I, game mechanics, and require skill (not just consistency and timing).


Fushichou187 said:
I hear ya. Again, never touched TEW so I can't comment on Akumu's balancing, but it's well-worn territory for games that have multiple difficulty levels to simply decrease the damage you do while making enemies hit harder; if resource management is involved then you can be sure that you'll find less of everything. Some games I personally think can do this well (TLoU's Grounded difficulty) but most feel like developers took the easy way out.
Click to expand...


TEW has stealth and traps around. I think you can cheese a lot of enemies with it without having to rely on most of your resources. I am already thinking of doing no-leveling up challenge runs in TEW (if possible); it is early to judge though since I am still midway in CH3, so we will see.


Edit: Someone already did Akumu+No upgrade
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=334163037&insideModal=1

Should I finish my backlog, grind Warframe, play new releases or do challenge runs in summer? Damn video games.
 
F

Fury451

Banned
I didn't even try it. Once I read what the mode was, I declared it impossible.

There's so many one-hit-kill situations and enemies in this game, that it would basically be nothing but pure frustration and never fun. I can't even fathom how you would do it without basically being lucky on a consistent basis.
 
A

AgentOtaku

Member
CybernatonEvolution said:
Some players like exploiting every aspect of the game and doing specific stuff; it is somewhat fun. I personally don't like the extreme side of that where things boil down to doing very systematic steps and simply "path finding", and just doing shit without relying on skill, reactions and creativity. I like to do balanced challenge runs that exploit the A.I, game mechanics, and require skill (not just consistency and timing).
Click to expand...


Ditto

This is why Halo games on Heroic are fantastic AND fun
 
C

ClayKavalier

Banned
Ralemont said:
Thing is, the concept of what fully experiencing a game entails has changed with the introduction of trophies. In JRPGs, for example, 100%ing a game would be doing all the sidequests, getting ultimate weapons, beating all the optional bosses, and getting the max level. Now with trophies a bunch of extra shit has been introduced and my personal opinion is that it has been to the detriment of the "feeling of getting 100%." Now getting a Platinum feels more like relief than satisfaction.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's why it's rare I'll go out of my way to platinum a game. I only do it if I really like the game or if there's only a few simple things to do after I beat it, which was the case with Shadow of Mordor. It wouldn't even cross my mind to fight my way through something like Akumu for the sake of a trophy.

I can't remember exactly what the difficulties are in Evil Within, there's basically Normal, Hard, even harder mode where enemies move faster, and then akumu which is Hard with one-hit kills, right?
 
-MD-

-MD-

Member
Fury451 said:
I didn't even try it. Once I read what the mode was, I declared it impossible.

There's so many one-hit-kill situations and enemies in this game, that it would basically be nothing but pure frustration and never fun. I can't even fathom how you would do it without basically being lucky on a consistent basis.
Click to expand...

It's really not all that hard save for 2 specific sections, you run faster than everything in the game.

ClayKavalier said:
I can't remember exactly what the difficulties are in Evil Within, there's basically Normal, Hard, even harder mode where enemies move faster, and then akumu which is Hard with one-hit kills, right?
Click to expand...

There's Casual (easy) > Survival (normal) > Nightmare (hard) > Akumu (hard+)

Nightmare is essentially Akumu but without the one-hit kills, it's the most balanced and fun mode imo.
 
C

ClayKavalier

Banned
-MD- said:
There's Casual (easy) > Survival (normal) > Nightmare (hard) > Akumu (hard+)

Nightmare is essentially Akumu but without the one-hit kills, it's the most balanced and fun mode imo.
Click to expand...

Do enemies move faster in Nightmare? I could have sworn there's a mode where enemies move 25% faster or something like that.
 
D

Death Metalist

Member
Still haven't tried it but will be getting to it again when I'm done with the other games I have at hand. Looking forward to it to be honest, I'm always up to beat bullshit challenges in the ass. I think the hardest thing I did in terms of gaming so far was beat New York Minute Hardcore in Max Payne 3 which is you playing through the entire game while being timed and not dying once. One death and it's back to the start of the game lol.
 
N

Neiteio

Member
The Evil Within was my GOTY 2014, but I didn't bother with Akumu. I'm perfectly content to replay the well-balanced default difficulty over and over.
 
N

NecromorphTX

Member
I loved the AKUMU, i had a really good moment playing that mode.













Just kidding, i almost broke the DS4 in several chapters. Those damn bear traps.
 
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