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The Last of Us: do you consider 'The Infected' to be 'zombies' ?
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Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
It's already been pointed out, but it's a very famous thing in zombies movies that they often don't actually call them zombies. Some parody movies have poked fun at this, even House of the Dead: Overkill did, "SHHH, we don't say the Z-word." It's been toyed around a lot, especially in films where the monsters are obviously zombies, but they won't call them zombies for whatever reason.
They act like zombies so to all intents and purposes their zombies regardless of the origin story. They didn't create a new seperate "infected" genre. For most people if you found yourself in that apocalypse you'd be calling them zombies not worrying if your using the right term.
I'm not sure even RE throws around the term "zombie" either. In the first I'm pretty sure they just say "monsters". It's like there's a taboo to use the word.
I'm not sure even RE throws around the term "zombie" either. In the first I'm pretty sure they just say "monsters". It's like there's a taboo to use the word.
No. Had I not heard about how they're based around mushrooms, I would have said yes.
Are they really unintelligent? Runners can actually see you and does a war cry when you're spotted, and even run around looking for you after you get spotted, that's far and above a Zombie just reacting to sound with a rotted brain.
But it based on fact, while the Cordyceps jump from insect to human is fictional, doesn't mean it can't potentially happen and is as dismissive as reanimating a dead corpse.
so yes, Last of Us infecteds are zombies!
they are unintelligent shambling enemies that were once normal humans = zombies.
Are they really unintelligent? Runners can actually see you and does a war cry when you're spotted, and even run around looking for you after you get spotted, that's far and above a Zombie just reacting to sound with a rotted brain.
But it based on fact, while the Cordyceps jump from insect to human is fictional, doesn't mean it can't potentially happen and is as dismissive as reanimating a dead corpse.
I see Naughty Dog as a company that typically targets very specific industry trends. That's why Crash had so many similarities to the Donkey Kong Country series, why the first Jak was like Mario 64 and the followup went in the direction of Grand Theft Auto. In a generation known for cinematic games like Half-Life and Call of Duty, they made their own take on the genre and as zombies and games with apocalyptic settings became the thing to do, of course they did one of those.
So yes, they're zombies, no matter what they call them.
That's not to say the game isn't good, I'd probably call it the best cinematic game I've played, but it's also a very clearly a game made to appeal to specific industry trends (it even has XP/crafting/unneeded multiplayer in addition to the zombie apocalypse theme, covering every base and being about as mainstream as you can get).
So yes, they're zombies, no matter what they call them.
That's not to say the game isn't good, I'd probably call it the best cinematic game I've played, but it's also a very clearly a game made to appeal to specific industry trends (it even has XP/crafting/unneeded multiplayer in addition to the zombie apocalypse theme, covering every base and being about as mainstream as you can get).
No, the biting and ability to infect people by doing so is the same and the survival story is common with traditional zombie outbreak stories.
But due to the "science" behind it, these are some very significant changes:
-Several stages of infection, leading to major changes in abilities and behaviour.
-Runners still show some form of basic intelligence. Clickers and Bloaters are stages where the differences are larger. The former is blind and uses sounds to see and the latter can throw spores at you.
-The infected are still in fact live people, thus vurnable to the same hazards and with similar strenght to regular people (the exception being Bloaters where the spores form the majority of the body)
-Eventually the infected are shown to die by "natural" causes.
I usually consider zombies to be living dead, regardless of the reason being a lack of space in hell or some nasty virus by mad scientists. It is obvious TLOU took the concept of zombie survival stories, but I do not call them zombies.
But due to the "science" behind it, these are some very significant changes:
-Several stages of infection, leading to major changes in abilities and behaviour.
-Runners still show some form of basic intelligence. Clickers and Bloaters are stages where the differences are larger. The former is blind and uses sounds to see and the latter can throw spores at you.
-The infected are still in fact live people, thus vurnable to the same hazards and with similar strenght to regular people (the exception being Bloaters where the spores form the majority of the body)
-Eventually the infected are shown to die by "natural" causes.
I usually consider zombies to be living dead, regardless of the reason being a lack of space in hell or some nasty virus by mad scientists. It is obvious TLOU took the concept of zombie survival stories, but I do not call them zombies.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
Those with the science argument, that they aren't zombies because they have more science behind them, really need to watch more zombie movies and read more zombie fiction. It sounds like many haven't seen much outside of your staple _____ of the Dead movies.
They are pretty much zombies, though I do call them infected. All that's different is the look compared to a stereotypical zombie and the means of which a dead person has now begun walking again.
Technically in TLOU it's more just parasites making use of the dead body, while in other versions, a zombie has been reanimated due to a virus or "magic" ha ha.
So doesn't really matter to me, just TLOU may be walking and acting based off the will of the parasite while other zombies, it seems it's just the very basic functions of the brain are active and they're in their most primitive form (which involves eating people apparently), still both zombies in the sense a dead corpse has begun walking again.
Technically in TLOU it's more just parasites making use of the dead body, while in other versions, a zombie has been reanimated due to a virus or "magic" ha ha.
So doesn't really matter to me, just TLOU may be walking and acting based off the will of the parasite while other zombies, it seems it's just the very basic functions of the brain are active and they're in their most primitive form (which involves eating people apparently), still both zombies in the sense a dead corpse has begun walking again.
I guess it's just part of pop-culture where fictional characters don't call zombies, zombies.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NotUsingTheZWord
But they are fucking zombies.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NotUsingTheZWord
But they are fucking zombies.
Earthpainting
Member
They're Not-Zombies that functionally act similarly to zombies, like so many properties before it. There's even a TVTropes entry about it if you're interested. I have no issues with anyone calling it another Zombie story though, since the monsters are usually secondary in zombie fiction for a while now. It's always secretly about the same human elements over and over again. They are basically high school personality dramas with adults that go through the same betrayals, keeping quiet about being infected, token rapist and/or paedophile encounter and usual gang wars.
*edit*
Curse you, Molemitts. A zombie voodoo curse to be specific.
*edit*
Curse you, Molemitts. A zombie voodoo curse to be specific.
Werewolf Jones
Gold Member
That's just a descent into madness but going by Marvin in RE2 it's definitely after.
DustyVonEric
Member
Nah, zombies are ever-"living" if left alone.
TLoU Infected will eventually die, with fungi growing out of them, spitting spores.
Plus, I think the people's consciousness is trapped and probably turned crazy, controlled, or can't help themselves in Infected, while zombies are completely mindless.
TLoU Infected will eventually die, with fungi growing out of them, spitting spores.
Plus, I think the people's consciousness is trapped and probably turned crazy, controlled, or can't help themselves in Infected, while zombies are completely mindless.
schwabdizzle
Banned
No. They are inspired by zombies but not zombies.
Sparrowhawk
Member
They're hosts to a parasitic fungus.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
I'll just say this as my final point. The reason I'm somewhat vocal on this is because I think there's no reason to categorize something as different if it really isn't different. Categories exist for the very reason to create categories for similar things, not exactly the same things, but general things.
Last of Us most certainly is deeply inspired by zombie movies and has several direct references to zombie media, and the infected definitely behave similar to depictions of zombies. The story also hits a lot of the same notes as a zombie story. Downfall of our known civilization by cause of some form of infection. Focus on characters, drama, social messages, and symbolism using zombies as a backdrop and a catalyst for other elements.
Basically, if they look like zombies, act like zombies, sound like zombies, have everything in common with zombies, even not being called zombies they have in common with zombies, and in a story that is the same sort of thing you'll see in zombie movies, then yes, they are zombies.
The Last of Us and Resident Evil Zombies are also listed on the Zombie wikipedia as type of zombie: http://zombie.wikia.com/wiki/Types_of_Zombies
It's not really important, zombies are zombies. That's a-okay. What I don't like is people trying to say they aren't zombies because of some perceived notion that makes what Last of Us does less interesting or meritable, because zombies are overused or some trife like that. It's like some people are afraid to call it like it is because of some pre-conceived notion of the word zombies because of over-representation which might delude something they hold special and want to stand above the norm. But that's achieved by personal merits, and pulling off what it does well. And it pulls off zombies well. But they're zombies.
Last of Us most certainly is deeply inspired by zombie movies and has several direct references to zombie media, and the infected definitely behave similar to depictions of zombies. The story also hits a lot of the same notes as a zombie story. Downfall of our known civilization by cause of some form of infection. Focus on characters, drama, social messages, and symbolism using zombies as a backdrop and a catalyst for other elements.
Basically, if they look like zombies, act like zombies, sound like zombies, have everything in common with zombies, even not being called zombies they have in common with zombies, and in a story that is the same sort of thing you'll see in zombie movies, then yes, they are zombies.
The Last of Us and Resident Evil Zombies are also listed on the Zombie wikipedia as type of zombie: http://zombie.wikia.com/wiki/Types_of_Zombies
It's not really important, zombies are zombies. That's a-okay. What I don't like is people trying to say they aren't zombies because of some perceived notion that makes what Last of Us does less interesting or meritable, because zombies are overused or some trife like that. It's like some people are afraid to call it like it is because of some pre-conceived notion of the word zombies because of over-representation which might delude something they hold special and want to stand above the norm. But that's achieved by personal merits, and pulling off what it does well. And it pulls off zombies well. But they're zombies.
I agree, but like I said in my post above, I think the whole concept is still significantly different from zombies. To me, zombies were always undead/reanimated corpses, be it due to magic or mad scientists.
But I do not consider (feral) ghouls from Fallout and the Las Plagas in RE4 zombies either, btw.
I cannot say people calling them a subgroup of zombies is wrong. But to me, the distinction I make is in the same line of thinking like the distinction of animal species/categories on basis of a specific trait, even though some animals of different species are still nearly identical. For example, some animals look nearly the same as a some mammals but are not because of a single trait, even though they behave and look nearly identical to another mammal. It is the way my biologist mind works I guess, heh.
Also, zombies or not, it does not affect the quality of a story in any way to me.
I really should, it's just more believable that a mushroom could take over my bodily functions tomorrow versus some random outbreak virus created by some scientific organisation.
Fun disclaimer: I stopped calling Resident Evil "zombies" from 4 onwards, with the exception of the early parts of Leon's campaign in Resident Evil Si- *barf*
It's a game where the setting and core plot points are straight out of every zombie apocalypse film, book, comic and tv series going. The monsters were once human, and now shamble around infecting survivors, with the harsh-yet-understandable panicked response to contagion offering up all kinds of for-the-greater-good arguments.
The infected technically aren't zombies if we use the definition of a witchcraft or Romero one, but it's a very superficial line. It's a zombie story. A bit like how there are plenty of 'vampire' stories where the monsters have been given their own unique traits to distinguish them, but it's still about blood, sex, immortality and desire.
It still doesn't mean that plague-based apocalypses aren't currently the most over-used setting in games.
The infected technically aren't zombies if we use the definition of a witchcraft or Romero one, but it's a very superficial line. It's a zombie story. A bit like how there are plenty of 'vampire' stories where the monsters have been given their own unique traits to distinguish them, but it's still about blood, sex, immortality and desire.
It still doesn't mean that plague-based apocalypses aren't currently the most over-used setting in games.
They are zombies.
There's a billion variation on the "lore" of the concept of zombies to make them fit with the themes of the story. The last of Us is really no different here, in fact i'd call it's approach to the zombie apocalypse generic.
The infected are zombies in practice. Not that i think there's anything wrong with a zombie story.
There's a billion variation on the "lore" of the concept of zombies to make them fit with the themes of the story. The last of Us is really no different here, in fact i'd call it's approach to the zombie apocalypse generic.
The infected are zombies in practice. Not that i think there's anything wrong with a zombie story.
martino
Member
Not according to this :
if i remember well the virus only make decomposition last 5 years at best
And i like this "version "
I don't mind them being zombies, I'm just surprised some people are so eager to use the fiction to suggest they're somehow more ambitious than what you find in The Walking Dead or other games, when they're functionally identical.
flatearthpandas
Member
For all intents and purposes. Don't see the point in getting into a semantic debate about it or trying to differentiate them. Zombies, infected. Same shit.
They're Zombies in all but name. Obviously Naughty Dog put a decent amount of effort in to ground them in pseudo-science and to make them unique and imposing. And although they aren't the reanimated corpses of classic zombie movies they still fulfil all of the needs of that archetype. A virus/force spreading over night, bringing society to its knees, bites as a death sentence and a constant overwhelming presence/threat.
Basically like 28 Days Later, even though they aren't technically zombies they fill all the roles and themes that go with the zombie apocalypse genre.
I don't think using zombie themes and tropes is a bad thing. I love that shit.
Basically like 28 Days Later, even though they aren't technically zombies they fill all the roles and themes that go with the zombie apocalypse genre.
I don't think using zombie themes and tropes is a bad thing. I love that shit.
three_muffins
Member
There is no real life baselinefor what is considered a zombie. They are make-believe, fiction.
I consider a zombie a former human being, now dead, slow, no intelligence, instict based, wanders the streets in hordes, eats anything that moves.
So.....yap, last of us has zombies.
I consider a zombie a former human being, now dead, slow, no intelligence, instict based, wanders the streets in hordes, eats anything that moves.
So.....yap, last of us has zombies.
Vroadstar
Member
But they are not zombies, they are simply called Infected for a reason. Zombies tag now is widely known as animated corpses like the classic George Romero movies.
CouchMaster
Member
They're just fun-guys.
VaultBoy101
Member
Technically, no.
For all intents and purposes, yes.
For all intents and purposes, yes.
three_muffins
Member
Technically? Seriously? In a work of fiction?
The only difference we are talking about here are the means by which they turned into zombies. Last of us obviously is an infection.
What else is there, magic, a curse, something supernatural, virus, gen-manipulation. The Setting may change, but a zombie is still a zombie.
Mendax
Member
Technically? Seriously? In a work of fiction?
The only difference we are talking about here are the means by which they turned into zombies. Last of us obviously is an infection.
What else is there, magic, a curse, something supernatural, virus, gen-manipulation. The Setting may change, but a zombie is still a zombie.
Yeah an infection is an infection, whether it is fungal (last of us) or bacterial (many other zombitches) doesnt matter. They are zombies.
Technically? Seriously? In a work of fiction?
The only difference we are talking about here are the means by which they turned into zombies. Last of us obviously is an infection.
What else is there, magic, a curse, something supernatural, virus, gen-manipulation. The Setting may change, but a zombie is still a zombie.
I see many people stating this and I am no expert on all Zombie fiction, but technically speaking, aren't zombies always considered living dead? To me that always seems to be the common feature, regardless of the comic, film, game or novel. Are there exemplary zombie works that deviate from this? (and actually stating them as zombies). TLOU infected are not dead and shown to be vurnable in the same manner are regular people.
StoppedInTracks
Member
Zombie is a living dead. In order to be a zombie you have to die first.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
The Last of Us infected are definitely inspired by the infected from 28 Days Later/28 Weeks Later films. Those are called Infected as well in their movies, but they behave similar to the infected in Last of Us. Besides behaving similarly, they aren't actually dead, they are living, but they have an new form of rabies that was passed onto humans from monkeys that make people excruciatingly violent and mindless, which has been come to be known as simply, 'The Rage Virus'. You can read up about it here: http://28dayslater.wikia.com/wiki/Rage_Virus
28 Days Later was a very successful film, and probably one of the most influential zombie movies that spawned a lot of different movies with different ideas of what defines and makes a 'zombie'. Others movies had before this, but this popularized that concept as well as running zombies. Last of Us definitely comes off the 28 Days Later-styled zombies rather than the Romero-style ones, they behave the same and have a similar 'infected' status which is used by many 28 Days Later inspired works, and in many of those the zombies aren't dead, just their mindless and being influenced by something or another to become monstrous and zombies in the braindead violent category.
The movie was also well known for its theme song, which plays in the final moments in the first movie when a twisted colony of mad people learn the hard way they can't contain the infection in the way they hope, nature will always find a way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6OtF7daIPM
Some of the running themes of 28 Days Later and similar films are also in Last of Us, though Last of Us pulls inspiration from other works as well.
Pretty sure no one in this thread implied that, did they? Why point it out?
Vroadstar
Member
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
There are zombie movies where the zombies have consciousness and can talk. Even one of the oldest zombie movies displayed this:
Day of the Dead being one famous one
Return of the Living Dead II being an infamous one.
There's others too that show zombies with more humane characteristics or recollections of their past life once they're dead.
There's also zombies who aren't dead in many zombie fictions, just infected with something. Sometimes they are still themselves, but unknowingly being driven into a state of mindless aggression and hunger as their infection worsens.
Herbspiceguy
Member
Have zombies become so mainstream/filthy casual/overdone that it's important to make this distinction?
Sometimes I feel the devoted feels it cheapens the story for the infected to be called zomies.
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