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Jonathan Blow On The Berkeley/Milo Situation

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sazzy

sazzy

Member
Jonathan Blow, developer of Braid and The Witness, spoke up against the violence and for free speech:
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Sourced from this tweet: https://twitter.com/stillgray/status/827404247704621057

Quick Background:

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http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-38837142
 
S

Spring-Loaded

Member
MLKquote.jpg

Sick of the tut-tutting about imperfect, destructive protest in response to people who actively engage in hate speech, and who advocate for violence against oppressed groups on an idealogical level (i.e. milo).

Blow has tunnel vision here—can't plead ignorance about Yoannopolous hike dumping all scrutiny on the protest.
 
B

Bold One

Member
More rich white guys normalising real fascism, I am shocked!



no, not really


I refuse to live in a world where Nazis are a protected class
 
H

Human Trashcan

Banned
You might want to include in this background that last time Milo spoke at a college he outed a trans student and basically called trans people sub-human.

Blow is a fucking dumbass. "If you replace fascists with something else" yeah but that's kind of the point innit, they're fascists. Where Spencer is concerned, he literally calls for genocide of people of color. Milo encourages violence against minorities. Also proceeds to admit he hasn't read Milo in a follow-up post, but still feels compelled to chime in. Fuck him, and everyone else who thinks politeness is more moral than preventing hate speech and violence against minorities.
 
Lanrutcon

Lanrutcon

Member
I live in a third world country where violent protest is such a common occurrence that it doesn't even qualify as front page news anymore.

Want free education? Why, just burn down a few schools to make a point! Then complain about how you have nowhere to go for schooling and how the world owes you for your suffering.

That shit has no place in the civilized world.
 
Surface of Me

Surface of Me

I'm not an NPC. And neither are we.
Bold One said:
More rich white guys normalising real fascism, I am shocked!



no, not really


I refuse to live in a world where Nazis are a protected class
Click to expand...

His point about "Punch Nazi in face!" is pretty good and reminds me a lot of McCarthyism. Take a look at the latest South Park thread in the OT to see how little you have to do to be labeled "alt right scum".
 
styl3s

styl3s

Member
Human Trashcan said:
You might want to include in this background that last time Milo spoke at a college he outed a trans student and basically called trans people sub-human.

Blow is a fucking dumbass. "If you replace fascists with something else" yeah but that's kind of the point innit, they're fascists. Where Spencer is concerned, he literally calls for genocide of blacks. Milo encourages violence against minorities. Also proceeds to admit he hasn't read Milo in a follow-up post, but still feels compelled to chime in. Fuck him, and everyone else who thinks politeness is more moral than preventing hate speech and violence against minorities.
Click to expand...
Politeness especially in protest is absolutely more moral and the right thing to do. Burning down your college and hurting people makes you no better and it's not the answer no matter how much you hate milo and his nazi scum friends.

You are doing the very thing you call wrong and protest against. You don't assault people because you disagree with them and you certainly don't riot and every rational sane human should understand that.
 
d00d3n

d00d3n

Member
Human Trashcan said:
You might want to include in this background that last time Milo spoke at a college he outed a trans student and basically called trans people sub-human.

Blow is a fucking dumbass. "If you replace fascists with something else" yeah but that's kind of the point innit, they're fascists. Where Spencer is concerned, he literally calls for genocide of blacks. Milo encourages violence against minorities. Also proceeds to admit he hasn't read Milo in a follow-up post, but still feels compelled to chime in. Fuck him, and everyone else who thinks politeness is more moral than preventing hate speech and violence against minorities.
Click to expand...

I think what you wanted to say is that Blow is a genius game developer that made one of the most thoughtful and intelligent puzzle games of the last couple of years, but that you disagree with his political opinions.
 
F

Fliesen

Member
(a) if you replace 'fascist' with some more-normal-sounding subgroup, ore a more-innocious phrase like "people i dislike", that sounds a lot like terrorism
Click to expand...

yeah, but the term 'fascist' is very well defined.

I'm not really willing to side with the slippery slope of hypothetical 'left violence might lead to leftwing fascism' when we're currently observing a drift towards a right-wing autocracy.
 
G

gdt

Member
I'm so tired of privileged people telling me what my anger level should be. There IS NOT an epedemic of nazis getting punched and rioting going on right now (there probably should be though), so when you sit there and type a speech decrying it all you are doing is falling for the alt right bullshit and essentially helping their cause.

I won't get into the "I'm not on the left anymore"......bye Felicia.
 
I

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony
I understand his point...but its a pretty shitty argument to make when our society is literally being pulled apart right by now fascists in power in addition to the unrest of civilians borne by politicians in general being absolute scum in both parties in large swaths.

Instead of talking about the literal CEO of Exxon mobile as secretary of state, now its all about how the left are bad because a segment of violence broke out at one college when 99% of protests against what's been happening have largely been peaceful.

Why does it only apply in one instance? Because it got front page news? Well i guess every other instance of 'polite protest' doesn't matter then?

THis country is tearing itself apart right now, that's what happens in a time of upheaval and what happend during every time of social movement. If Johnathan Blow wants to see uncivilized, go to europe and see what they do when shit hits the fan. Cause he hasn't seen it in America yet.

I'm not advocating for violence, but picking out one instance of violence and then saying something something both sides essentially is what is normalizing the radicalization of rightwing extremism that is gaining steam.
 
T

The_Kid

Member
I don't think Blow understands. Punching a Nazi wasn't the first resort. This is after attempts at reason and decency have fallen on deaf ears throughout the country. Milo has continually made hate speech at his rallies and targeted individuals, being left alone for the most part because of "free speech."

They don't want to debate, or listen, or back down, they want to destroy what decency there is left. Violence, riots, this is the resistance of people who feel like they have no other option. Everyone is scared. I'm scared.

The whole "you're a fascist if you even raise a hand against a bigot" argument is bullshit. It's the argument made for living in an ideal world where logic trumps all, not a world with... well Trump. People always want an ideal protest, one that is not only not violent and also respectable, but also doesn't inconvenience anyone. Those protests (if you can even call them that) don't solve anything. They don't people that you mean business, that you're willing to fight.

It's past the point of debate. Resist, resist, resist.
 
Noboru Wataya

Noboru Wataya

Banned
Fair play to Blow for getting across a point that I agree 100% with but am unable to find the words to express myself.

People are becoming unreasonable on both sites, but this "fuck you, you don't agree with me, nazi" attitude is immature and conversation killing.
 
R

Rainmaker

Banned
Noboru Wataya said:
Fair play to Blow for getting across a point that I agree 100% with but am unable to find the words to express myself.

People are becoming unreasonable on both sites, but this "fuck you, you don't agree with me, nazi" attitude is immature and conversation killing.
Click to expand...

Conversations aren't working. They haven't been for a long time.
 
S

Spring-Loaded

Member
Human Trashcan said:
You might want to include in this background that last time Milo spoke at a college he outed a trans student and basically called trans people sub-human.

Blow is a fucking dumbass. "If you replace fascists with something else" yeah but that's kind of the point innit, they're fascists. Where Spencer is concerned, he literally calls for genocide of blacks. Milo encourages violence against minorities. Also proceeds to admit he hasn't read Milo in a follow-up post, but still feels compelled to chime in. Fuck him, and everyone else who thinks politeness is more moral than preventing hate speech and violence against minorities.
Click to expand...

When people grow up thinking that being a good person simply means "be polite and don't engage in violence," this is the result.

That "come together" line at the end of the screenshot above is so divirc d from reality. These popular new-nazis have already rejected that notion and rally for violence against groups who are not hate groups, and who aren't represented and legitimized by the current POTUS.
 
C

Chichikov

Member
"We are a civilized country because we have a social contract that it is not okay to do this".
I get it that he probably heard the term "social contract" before and really wanted to use it, but he should have really spend five minutes on wikipedia reading about what it means first.

As for the rest, well, I don't agree, but I think I've covered it all in the Richard Spencer thread.
And that one had awesome gifs to keep me entertained.
 
J

Jonnax

Member
Alt righters, Nazis etc. Talk about inflicting violence upon minorities, foreign countries etc. They have gained significant popularity worldwide so their message is suceeding.

Sitting down and trying to talk it out with these kinds of people is ridiculous because they aren't burdened by decency.
 
M

mp1990

Banned
Noboru Wataya said:
Fair play to Blow for getting across a point that I agree 100% with but am unable to find the words to express myself.

People are becoming unreasonable on both sites, but this "fuck you, you don't agree with me, nazi" attitude is immature and conversation killing.
Click to expand...

what would you call people who advocate for ethnic cleansing then friend
 
L

Lime

Member
If you're more angry about broken windows or destroyed property than Milo harassing a young trans woman out of her education or outing immigrants for Trumps deportation, then you need to take a look at your priorities

Meanwhile, I'm not seeing any outrage over a Trump and Milo supporter shooting an anti racist last week. Where was Blow and the rest of the concerned liberals there?
 
F

forknknife

Banned
Peaceful protesting is the way to go. But very noisey and relentless protesting, of course.

I get what blow is saying but him saying he doesn't consider himself left wing oriented anymore just because of the actions of some groups in the left is a bit ridiculous.

This is about either having a progressive and humanitarian secular society or a regressive reactionary protectionist one that is just going against the common interest of humanity as a whole. Either you are with the first group or you are against it.

All these equidistant positions some people like Blow or Collin from Kinda Funny feel comfortable adopting will just not fix anything and just works to make them feel better about not doing anything to fix the problem which is, obviously, an educational deficit and a lack of a humanitarian culture and realistic world view.

We have huge issues to solve in the next 3 decades and we will get nowhere if every country is just screaming "My country first!".
 
H

Heckler456

Banned
Jonnax said:
Alt righters, Nazis etc. Talk about inflicting violence upon minorities, foreign countries etc. They have gained significant popularity worldwide so their message is suceeding.

Sitting down and trying to talk it out with these kinds of people is ridiculous because they aren't burdened by decency.
Click to expand...

No one said anything about sitting down. You sit down when they want to talk, but until then, protest.

bytesized said:
Peaceful protesting is the way to go. But very noisey and relentless protesting, of course.
Click to expand...

Exactly.
 
S

suddenlyissoon

Member
If the Blues Brothers have taught me anything it's tolerance to all people except Nazis and white supremacists. You punch them in the face
 
S

Social

Member
Oh yes, I have really been waiting for Blow to speak out about violence and for free speech. It's important that we hear what he has to say...
 
N

Nibel

Member
peLKXOl.png


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..then why you even talk about him

Where were you when someone got shot at a Milo rally

jwjzzmcpfsce.gif


This the man who gave us Braid and Witness brehs
 
I

iMax

Member
Human Trashcan said:
You might want to include in this background that last time Milo spoke at a college he outed a trans student and basically called trans people sub-human.

Blow is a fucking dumbass. "If you replace fascists with something else" yeah but that's kind of the point innit, they're fascists. Where Spencer is concerned, he literally calls for genocide of blacks. Milo encourages violence against minorities. Also proceeds to admit he hasn't read Milo in a follow-up post, but still feels compelled to chime in. Fuck him, and everyone else who thinks politeness is more moral than preventing hate speech and violence against minorities.
Click to expand...

I have to agree. Blow's stance is right in principle but it only applies when there is actual debate occurring.

Considering Milo just straight-up abuses everyone, I think universities have just as much of a right to protect their students from it as he does to spout his unsubstantiated vitriol.

There is something to be said for one of the areas he touched on though, which is the binary assessment of everyone to be either a liberal or a fascist (n.b. some of them definitely are, no doubt); a trait I keep seeing more and more on social networks. There are an infinite number of degrees on the political spectrum – and for the moderates on both sides, friendly discourse and debate is very healthy.
 
A

Atomski

Member
cap-punching-hitler-630x387-1464367261.jpg


While we all want to go punch Nazi's its part of their plan. If they can make opposition look like a bunch of violent crazy people it just gives them free reign. They call us out as if we are some sort of monsters trying to take away their freedom of speech and such. Also when their members do something violent they just point the finger back. Its painfully obvious.. this is Milos whole plan.
 
T

TheSpoiler

Member
"Okay listen.

I was silent when that women was being harassed.

I was silent as our country started kicking out anyone who's remotely brown.

But I will NOT be silent when people are burning and breaking things due to social frustrations and society's lack of remorse dealing with the marginalized and minority groups.

You guys are no better than Donald Trump himself!"

Always good to see people rally together against an evil cause.
 
K

Killthee

helped a brotha out on multiple separate occasions!
Human Trashcan said:
You might want to include in this background that last time Milo spoke at a college he outed a trans student and basically called trans people sub-human.

Blow is a fucking dumbass. "If you replace fascists with something else" yeah but that's kind of the point innit, they're fascists. Where Spencer is concerned, he literally calls for genocide of people of color. Milo encourages violence against minorities. Also proceeds to admit he hasn't read Milo in a follow-up post, but still feels compelled to chime in. Fuck him, and everyone else who thinks politeness is more moral than preventing hate speech and violence against minorities.
Click to expand...
Should also add that he's telling people to call ICE on fellow students who they might suspect are here illegally.

During his talk at the University of New Mexico, MILO, “in the spirit of Trump’s agenda,” displayed the ICE (Immigration and Customs Enforcement) hotline for reporting illegal immigrants, and encouraged students to use it.

This number can be called if you suspect anyone of being an illegal alien. MILO told his audience that he would like them to “think hard about working class people, about poor people; think hard about the disabled who are desperately in need of state care; think hard about students in public universities in need of federal funding; and think hard, and mostly, about women and homosexuals,” highlighting those groups in society who are most at risk of the adverse effects of illegal immigration.

http://www.breitbart.com/milo/2017/01/28/milo-unm-heres-ices-phone-number-use-wisely/
Click to expand...
 
Y

Yamibito

Member
Violence isn't the answer, but planting ideas of genocide into the minds of silly people is just awful. Inciting hatred like Milo does will, funnily enough, incite hatred from not just the speaker but the subjects. So maybe if he wasn't saying all that shit there wouldn't be protests and/or riots? What a crazy thought!

Don't be a goof, Blow.
 
I

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony
His point would have been easier taken if he said "violent protests are bad, you should not do that". Like, no shit.

But then you have to false equivalence about the entirety of "the left", going a stone's throw away from calling everyone an "SJW" and then talking about other unrelated stuff that will now only embolden those same rightwing extremists.

Its unfortunate that one thinks they can dictate mental thought in this way when such bad shit is going down.
 
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