So we've had a big resurgence of the infinity engine style CRPG of old, with Pillars trying to be a Baldur's Gate revival, Torment being a spiritual successor to PST, and Tyranny being its own thing that spawned from within this genre. How do we feel about this new wave of games? Do they live up to the old ones?
I think they've suffered in terms of storytelling and mechanics for the most part. The crises in Torment are pretty tedious, and I don't agree with the decision to go turn based. Tyranny and Pillars had combat that were pretty functional, but nothing beyond that. And I was kind of disappointed with the resolution of the story in each game. I'm also not a huge fan of the visuals style afforded to them by the engine, but that's not really a big deal. But before I delve too deep into my views on each, I was wondering how "the community" felt about them. Do these games live up to the legacy of the originals? Where do we go from here next? Will Pillars 2 be the promised land, since it can iterate on an already established formula and setting? Which one is your favorite?
We can also discuss other big budget kickstarter games that aren't necessarily spiritual sequels to the infinity engine games, like Divinity, Wasteland or Shadowrun, but I want to specifically orient the conversation around the IE resurgence games because it's a common frame of reference that can be compared to the older games. Also other games up for discussion include Age of Decadence, Underrail etc. but I would definitely like to keep it limited to isometric role playing games with RTWP or turn based combat (and not strategy RPGs, but instead games primarily based around role playing)
I was pretty disappointed in pillars and tyranny I did not think either game was very good. Torment I liked form the writing but the gameplay was merely okay.
Age of Decadence
Divinity: Original Sin
Pillars of Eternity
Tyranny
Torment: Tides of Numenera
Wasteland 2
Age of Decadence feels dated in visuals and presentation, the story isn't the most interesting, but the universe and the ways you uncover it over multiple playthroughs is intriguing. The game allows for a lot of different approaches bigly impacting what you experience and your character builds really matter. A++ game in my opinion.
Divinity: Original Sin delivered on amazing combat, one of the best in the genre, maybe even the best, tho you kinda get locked out of a lot of fun if you dont play at least with 1 mage. The story was extremely forgettable, but some moments were pretty fun and humorous. The quest design i really liked as well. If DOS2 can also deliver on an engaging plot it's gonna be a modern classic.
Pillars of Eternity was all around solid, tho i felt there was too much bloat dialogue with the backer stories and all that fuss. The combat was not amazing but fun enough, quest design was alright. Story was engaging enough but not exactly mindlowing, i also felt it was a bit too standard fantasy fanfare. I'm very much looking forward to PoE2 as i'm fairly confident it's gonna be an improvement all around.
Tyranny, or PoE2 little brother was interesting but felt too much like the budget game it was. The story basically goes nowhere but the characters were fun enough. I felt the combat was an improvement over Pillars' due to the spellcrafting, but the actual encounters were garbage as you were fighting the same three enemy types throughout the entire game. I really liked the idea
that you got access to weapons of mass destruction, but the game didn't really do anything with that unfortunately.
Torment had an initially intriguing but ultimately pretty bad story
because it was basically nothing more than a worse, more rushed version of the original Planescape
as well as interesting party members whose plotlines mostly go nowhere. The merecasters were cool but as everything in the game, nothing ever reacted to what you did. The crises (Based on the few mandatory ones i had) were neat in concept, especially that you could play through them nonviolently, but they weren't particularly fun to play. The sidequest design was really good for the most part tho.
At the end of the day Torment was solid, but reading how a lot of reviewers legit called it a worthy successor to Planescape and a modern classic, i'm wondering if we played the same game cos Numenera is nowhere near that.
Wasteland 2 i had a surprising amount of fun playing, altho neither the plot nor the combat were particulary good. The combat felt nice, but was overall far too easy and imbalanced to ever require a lot of strategy and i was running around with a fuckton of ammunition a 1/3rd through the game.
Honestly, i don't really have a lot to say about it cos it's by far the most forgettable out of all of them. I still backed W3.
Shadowrun i still have yet to play.
I really love the resurgence of crpg's, but a true modern classic has yet to come out of it. Closest is by far Age of Decadence which is mostly being dragged down by its low production values.
I'm fairly confident they'll just be getting better from here on out and will continue delivering fun games in the future with an occasional masterpiece among them, now that these studios have found their new place in the world.
I can agree with this ranking and assessment. AoD really is the best out of these and it truly lives up to its own promise more so than any of them. It's brutal yet fair, and your character building really does matter.
Divinity is just fun.
Pillars was decent but didn't really wow me in any particular area other than the fact that its existence is kind of a blessing.
Like you said, Tyranny is hampered by its budget. I think conceptually it's the most interesting one but it just doesn't have the chance to fully realize its concept.
Torment I have yet to finish but having read everything in the OT about it, its flaws are pretty annoying. It doesn't live up to PST.
Ironically, the only ones I think live up to the legacy of the IE games are AOD and DOS. The rest comes up short even though they're the "official" successors. Here's to hoping Pillars 2 will make it. These games seem to suffer from cut content and limited budgets, so I hope they can learn to work better in these constraints.
I'm really quite happy with the quality of what I've played so far. PoE, Tyranny, Shadowrun were all excellent modern classics in my books. I think many games from the recent revival get a little more shit from the RPG community than they deserve, especially PoE. At its height, it more than lives up to its legacy.
I didn't especially like what I played of D:OS, but I backed the second game and I hope it'll have more going for it than a battle system this time.
I've yet to play AoD and Torment, though I have both.
I'm hopeful for the next "generation" of these games, but I haven't really been in love with any of the ones I've played so far. I don't think I've completed a full replay on any of them
Shadowrun Returns+Dragonfall were both fine, but the combat was a chore and the stories didn't really grab me. I should give the directors cut a go some time, see if its changed things
Pillars of Eternity was basically a solid Bioware pastiche but no more, and the combat again didn't do much for me. I kind of got the impression that they felt obliged to stay faithful to Baldur's Gate which stopped them doing what they wanted to do.
Age of Decadence was probably the most interesting, but I'm allergic to grimdark. Also I'm not sure the skill system was ideal - the rapid advancement was weird, and it felt like success came more from building your character around the situation rather than working out how to apply the skills you've got. And the game is really ugly - I'd rather have played it as a text based choose your own adventure style thing than deal with the interface and look of it.
(I really should play D:OS, but I'm being a bit of a cheapskate and the price has never got quite low enough for me to pull the trigger)
I'm hopeful for the next "generation" of these games, but I haven't really been in love with any of the ones I've played so far. I don't think I've completed a full replay on any of them
Shadowrun Returns+Dragonfall were both fine, but the combat was a chore and the stories didn't really grab me. I should give the directors cut a go some time, see if its changed things
Pillars of Eternity was basically a solid Bioware pastiche but no more, and the combat again didn't do much for me. I kind of got the impression that they felt obliged to stay faithful to Baldur's Gate which stopped them doing what they wanted to do.
Age of Decadence was probably the most interesting, but I'm allergic to grimdark. Also I'm not sure the skill system was ideal - the rapid advancement was weird, and it felt like success came more from building your character around the situation rather than working out how to apply the skills you've got. And the game is really ugly - I'd rather have played it as a text based choose your own adventure style thing than deal with the interface and look of it.
(I really should play D:OS, but I'm being a bit of a cheapskate and the price has never got quite low enough for me to pull the trigger)
AOD is an acquired taste for sure, but if you can get over the shitty graphics it's really well crafted. Shadowrun's combat was fine for me, better than Pillars I'd say because Pillars kind of devolves into being either too mashy or too difficult.
Divinity really is worth it. I think it's $40 right now, I get if that's beyond what you wanna pay but I think it's the best of the bigger budget new CRPGs.
