BrodiemanTTR
Member
Kevar said:
It was the one that guest starred Croal and he basically just repeated what Miyamoto said in this interview.
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Miyamoto: If you want your Nintendo games to do better, put some freakin' effort in
- Thread starter Kobun Heat
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It was the one that guest starred Croal and he basically just repeated what Miyamoto said in this interview.
Xisiqomelir
Member
Kevar said:
IIRC, Luke spewed some venom about "no 1st-rate developer wants to be hampered by the severely lacking hardware of the Wii".
kirbutashi
Member
All I'm saying is that it wouldn't hurt for Nintendo to go on the offensive and actually offer some incentives to get this stuff moving rather than egging them on and hoping someone goes for it. Throw some weight behind co-marketing, like when Microsoft helps Capcom with Lost Planet for example.
Zoramon089
Banned
Really, can anyone name a big GC 3rd party exclusive that didn't sell well? If 3rd parties try hard, their games will sell
Jive Turkey
Unconfirmed Member
What a well thought-out and eloquently stated opinion!Kuroyume said:
Companion Cube
Member
PhoenixDark
Banned
I'm not convinced the games would sell much better either way. You look at a studio like Vicarious Visions who has pushed the DS in every way possible - even 1Uping Nintendo in the online aspect - yet their games don't sell at all. When that keeps on happening, it's not surprising that a publisher would put less effort into making sure the product was of high value.
Publishers have seen this for more than a decade so it's no secret
Publishers have seen this for more than a decade so it's no secret
chibcicylist
Banned
kirbutashi said:
Well, its true. Suck it up and try harder. It's not Nintendo's fault they make great software. Nintendo still has to be nice to them but once the Wii solidifies its lead, I think Nintendo has the right to be picky and tell the third parties to suck it up or go home.
I mean, the Wii's main success is because of Nintendo and Nintendo alone. No free rides. If you want in, go line up and tell me what you can give to me as a Wii owner. And not some ****ing second rate crap or spin offs. I want my Devil May Cries IVs, Resident Evil 5s, Final Fantasy XIIIs and Grand Theft Auto IVs. I want the main ones, the whole she-bang.
Green Biker Dude
Banned
Wii/DS games are cheaper, and lower tier teams are usually asigned to these projects since they're less risky.
Besides, as it was already said, when gems like Brain Training and Wii Sports are outselling everything, money isn't the issue.
Besides, as it was already said, when gems like Brain Training and Wii Sports are outselling everything, money isn't the issue.
Wii play and Wii sports and Wario Ware are basically tech demos that sold millions of copies and probably cost a couple of million (if that) to develop. I'm just saying, how can 3rd parties hope to compete with that?
Nintendo's new age gamers seem to be even more "Nintendo only" than it's regular crowd.
Nintendo's new age gamers seem to be even more "Nintendo only" than it's regular crowd.
chibcicylist said:
Well, actually, yes, it is Nintendo's fault they make great software. I know the word 'fault' carries negative connotations, but when you do good, it's still your 'fault' for doing good.
Kangu said:
So name me the 3rd party developer that released a version of Wii Sports before Nintendo, and the one who released a Brain Training clone before Brain Training was popular? How about the one who released a version of Wario Ware that's even remotely comparable in quality to the one Nintendo made.
It's not like this is anything new here. The rules are the same. If you want to have the best sales, you either have to be the first to market with a new idea, or you have to do it better than the person who created the market.
Kobun Heat
Member
Yeah. The whole "smaller piece of the bigger pie" only definitely works when all else is equal; that is, when you're actually putting the effort in. Nintendo could have a bigger user base, but if your PlayStation 3 games are getting all the attention...
Zoramon089
Banned
PhoenixDark said:
Wow, ONE example. I mean, you completely ignore the success Konami, Sega and SE have had on the DS with multiple titles. Anyway, consoles can't really be compared to handhelds in when it comes to these things
kirbutashi
Member
And its bad for Nintendo to actually try to help make this happen, rather than hope that third parties decide to do it on their own?chibcicylist said:
chibcicylist
Banned
kirbutashi said:
Well, with the Wii's success, you'd be a pretty stupid third party developer to not do this.
Kangu said:
That says alot more to the quality of Nintendo's stuff more than anything else. For what its worth, Warioware: SM is selling as well as Rayman Raving Rabbids in the United States, a very similar game.
I hate how some developers are hypocritical in that respects. They want to be appreciated as artist, yet complain about their working materials. I don't think many 19th century artists were caring (I could be wrong about this) or complaining about the quality of their ink or paper or singers. I think they worked WITH their materials to build their masterpiece, not sit around all day b*tching about how the paper isn't white enough.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Zoramon089 said:
I'm talking about western developers mainly. You've seen the NPD charts, as have we all. And with respect to Konami and others...they haven't seen nearly as much success in the US with their DS games.
I'm not saying "lol third parties don't sell on Nintendo stuff", but it doesn't take a genius to see what's happening with the DS right now, and the Wii to a certain extent in the US
kirbutashi
Member
They would also be stupid to try and pretend to know Nintendo's mysterious release schedule, only to have their game get trampled and forgotten by Mario Galaxy or another first party title, regardless of quality.chibcicylist said:
CrushDance
Banned
Two duct tapes, glued together!
Miyamoto made a fine point. I have high hopes though that as more companies jump on things will get better. In another thread earlier today, I mentioned that devs are really just experimenting right now at the many ways of the Wii setup and when controls start getting "standardized" you'll see areas in games improving overall.
And for anyone who says 3rd parties suck on Nintendo hardware, go look at DS sales or even recently Wii sales.
Miyamoto made a fine point. I have high hopes though that as more companies jump on things will get better. In another thread earlier today, I mentioned that devs are really just experimenting right now at the many ways of the Wii setup and when controls start getting "standardized" you'll see areas in games improving overall.
And for anyone who says 3rd parties suck on Nintendo hardware, go look at DS sales or even recently Wii sales.
chibcicylist
Banned
PhoenixDark said:
That's funny, because Western third parties are doing way better on the Wii than on the PS3.:lol
edit: In the United States
kirbutashi said:
Huh? Nintendo already said that they are pacing thier first party games to give third parties some breathing room. They only released Wii Play in February and did not release anything in March so that SSX Blur, Tiger Woods Wii, Godfather Wii and Sonic and the Secret Rings can have all those timeframe to themselves. Last I heard, Sonic and Tiger Woods Wii are doing well with the former outselling Virtua Fighter 5 last month.
PuppetSlave
Member
PhoenixDark said:
How about you give some examples for thirdparty games that sold really well on non-nintendo systems and really badly on a nintendo-system? Because I am reading what your saying basically as it is because of magic that third-party don't sell and first do.
Now maybe it is so that Nintendofans easier pick up first-party title because of the reputation of high general quality of them. But then they also have a harder time picking up third-party titles because of BAD experiences of earlier titles. You got to earn a reputation the hard way. You can't just make some game and espect everyone to believe in the game right away.
Bah, enough of my ranting.
Zoramon089
Banned
PhoenixDark said:
Well western devs aren't doing too badly. I mean, Rayman and Red Steel have both sold around 300k-400k
chibcicylist
Banned
Zoramon089 said:
And most Wii ports are outselling thier PS3 counterparts. Only Madden PS3 is outselling Madden Wii but the gap is not that big(311K vs 350K).
PhoenixDark said:
Vicarious Visions are great but Activision don't even push their games when it comes to advertising. I myself have purchased a VV DS game and its fabulous but if it weren't for an online forum I would've never thought about it.
I believe that every great games need advertising. Its sad that only the "big" games recieve the push every great game needs when it comes to advertising.
In UK Tiger Woods is the best selling Wii game ATM. Thats saying something. It was a good game and it recieved a nice push in advertising.
:lol
Reading the interview now, but i have to say that i had a recent discussion on the board about this very subject... I had the same view as Miyamoto... If they're marketed well, good games generaly sell better than bad games, so if you want to compete with nintendo, you should actually try to make games that are as good as nintendo games.
Some people disagreed with me, saying that it was more an issue of nintendo monopolizing the marketing and shutting 3rd party's out. I pointed out that RE4 sold very well considering it was on a dying console (AAA title, and very well marketed)... But anyway... I'm still not sure who's right, but i'm glad to see that shiggy and I are on the same page :lol
Reading the interview now, but i have to say that i had a recent discussion on the board about this very subject... I had the same view as Miyamoto... If they're marketed well, good games generaly sell better than bad games, so if you want to compete with nintendo, you should actually try to make games that are as good as nintendo games.
Some people disagreed with me, saying that it was more an issue of nintendo monopolizing the marketing and shutting 3rd party's out. I pointed out that RE4 sold very well considering it was on a dying console (AAA title, and very well marketed)... But anyway... I'm still not sure who's right, but i'm glad to see that shiggy and I are on the same page :lol
Xisiqomelir said:
Maybe someone should tell that the WII is the third most powerful console in existance or how about that devs can't complain about a lack of power when there games are still ps2 level in terms of look. Someones needs to cut out his tounge so his BS can no longer reach anyone's ears. Playing devil's advocate is fine in my book being loud mouth hata with no real point is just annoying after a few months. Simply put miyamoto said what needed to be said after all these months of BS from third parties.
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
BlindN-Fan said:
I don't even know what games Vicarious Visions made. I am lazy. What are they?
chibcicylist
Banned
I don't know who VV is either. :\
CrushDance
Banned
Luke Smith? Who takes that guy at face value? You shouldn't take any game editors at face vlaue.Hatorade said:
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
drohne said:
Yeah, what the hell. I just realized that. What are Nintend's 1st rate development teams working on? Brawl?
PhoenixDark
Banned
PuppetSlave said:
Are you serious?
Many people buy Nintendo consoles just for Nintendo games. Third party games like Madden or Splinter Cell or whatever might sell a boat load on the Xbox, but with Nintendo consoles the audience is not interested in that stuff. So why is it surprising that developers like Ubisoft would just take Prince of Persia and slap on some specific Wii controls? Yes they are testing the market, but at the same time they remember the previous game's preformance on the Gamecube as compared to other systems, for instance.
Developers are starting to realize what works and doesn't work on the DS in Japan right now. They seem to "get it" that many gamers there want more simple, easily accessible games and they're doing a good job with respect to providing that. In the US developers still seem to be fumbling around. On one hand they recognize many of the Wii and DS owners are young so they provide content that suits them. But when it comes to more "mature" games, the priority is clearly more on the Xbox 360 and PS3. Red Steel sold well, but at the same time it was a big time launch game so that was somewhat expected. If a Red Steel type game came out now, would it sell? We'll see. I'm not convinced that the Wii or DS are the systems for that type of stuff, and publishers will find out soon enough. Because right now I don't see how anyone could honestly say many western developers are putting much effort into their Wii titles.
I have ****ing nothing against Nintendo., but I'm not blind, and neither are publishers
Kobun Heat
Member
Except that...PhoenixDark said:
*looks at username*
...I'm not going to say anything.
chibcicylist
Banned
PhoenixDark said:
It's like you glossed over my reply. Most ports found on both the PS3 and the Wii, the Wii ports are outselling the PS3 ports save one.
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
BlindN-Fan said:
I heard Sk8land was great. I should pick that up. Over the Hedge for the DS is the closest you will get to Metal Gear Solid on the DS and its probably the best licensed game in a really long time.
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