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Ico Uses Open Source GPL'd Code!

I

Icy

Banned
Reference: http://astrange.ithinksw.net/ico/

Basically ICO has been found to be using GPL'd code from the library libarc, which handles compressed data. Take a look at the site above in reference for details. Pretty freaking unbelieveable. Discuss!

Information originally found on Slashdot.. thought I'd credit them since NO one credits NeoGAF for anything!
 
L

loosus

Banned
I don't understand GPL. Never have.

What does the agreement entail, as far as how Ico violated it? All I see is that they did indeed fail to give credit. Is that all?
 
W

wsippel

Banned
Freedom = $1.05 said:
Excuse my ignorance but what possible ramifications does this have?
Click to expand...
The GPL is a "viral license". You can't use GPL-code in a proprietary application, or else the whole application becomes GPL. Which means that, if these aren't baseless accusations, and Sony has to release the complete sourcecode or face the consequences.
 
R

Rezbit

Member
*blinks*

.....

robocop.gif
 
I

Icy

Banned
loosus said:
I don't understand GPL. Never have.

What does the agreement entail, as far as how Ico violated it? All I see is that they did indeed fail to give credit. Is that all?
Click to expand...

Short of it. GPL says you use a byte of our code, your crap is open source or prepare to face possible litigation.
 
L

loosus

Banned
wsippel said:
The GPL is a "viral license". You can't use GPL-code in a proprietary application, or else the whole application becomes GPL. Which means that, if these aren't baseless accusations, and Sony has to release the complete sourcecode or face the consequences.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't the more likely scenario be that Sony simply corrects the problem or settles with the authors of the code? I doubt you see Sony releasing the source code.
 
W

wsippel

Banned
Sho Nuff said:
Doesn't the PSP OS mention how it uses GPL in the credits?
Click to expand...
Only LGPL-, BSD- and X11-licensed stuff, as far as I remember. Libtiff and stuff like that. The LGPL isn't a viral license.
 
D

Danj

Member
So wait, does this mean that all second-hand copies of ICO have to be destroyed or something? Cos I never got around to getting it, but I might wanna play it some day, and if it gets nuked that'd be kinda hard.
 
I

Icy

Banned
Danj said:
So wait, does this mean that all second-hand copies of ICO have to be destroyed or something? Cos I never got around to getting it, but I might wanna play it some day, and if it gets nuked that'd be kinda hard.
Click to expand...

lol. Oh yes the GPL is gonna come to your door and force you to destroy copies.. oh yes... :lol
 
V

Valkyr Junkie

Member
There's an interesting discussion on Slashdot. The consensus is that there's really no foul play at hand.

Plus if Sony was violating GPL they would either have to release the source code to the game or cease production of the game. I doubt a copy of Ico has been pressed for many years.
 
W

wsippel

Banned
loosus said:
Wouldn't the more likely scenario be that Sony simply corrects the problem or settles with the authors of the code? I doubt you see Sony releasing the source code.
Click to expand...
They can't really "correct" the problem anymore, and it's very hard to settle with open source projects. They have to either recall the game or release the sourcecode.
 
V

Vennt

Unconfirmed Member
Assuming this is correct, Sony also have another option to solve this, they can immediately cease distribution of the product...

... oh wait...

:p
 
I

Icy

Banned
Valkyr Junkie said:
There's an interesting discussion on Slashdot. The consensus is that there's really no foul play at hand.

Plus if Sony was violating GPL they would either have to release the source code to the game or cease production of the game. I doubt a copy of Ico has been pressed for many years.
Click to expand...

Right. The worse that could happen is Sony releases the game source.
 
L

loosus

Banned
wsippel said:
They can't really "correct" the problem anymore, and it's very hard to settle with open source projects. They have to either recall the game or release the sourcecode.
Click to expand...
Eh...I really doubt you're going to see either one of those things happen. Most likely, if it even becomes a litigation issue (which is unlikely), I bet Sony simply states that it internally corrected the problem. The end.
 
S

sangreal

Member
wsippel said:
The GPL is a "viral license". You can't use GPL-code in a proprietary application, or else the whole application becomes GPL. Which means that, if these aren't baseless accusations, and Sony has to release the complete sourcecode or face the consequences.
Click to expand...

You only have to release the source of software you distribute that is derived from GPL'd code. Using a GPL'd library is not the same thing
 
D

Danne-Danger

Member
wsippel said:
They can't really "correct" the problem anymore, and it's very hard to settle with open source projects. They have to either recall the game or release the sourcecode.
Click to expand...

So basically, either the value goes up, up, up or down, down, down.
 
Z

ZombieSupaStar

Member
I wonder how ID came off relatively clean with the whole super pack dosbox thing. I know they added the readme's, and src, and stuff from dosbox 7.1 after its release. But people still confirmed that the dosbox that comes with the dl of the super pack callsback for steam to be running (thus different/modified from the one you dl from the normal dosbox site).

Of course I use a sourceport for doom etc. anyways and all those needs are the data files, and the steam versions work flawless with that (dont even need steam to be running).
 
D

D2M15

DAFFY DEUS EGGS
Vennt said:
Assuming this is correct, Sony also have another option to solve this, they can immediately cease distribution of the product...
... oh wait...
:p
Click to expand...

Yeah, they did that the week before it came out :(
 
W

wsippel

Banned
sangreal said:
You only have to release the source of software you distribute that is derived from GPL'd code. Using a GPL'd library is not the same thing
Click to expand...
If you link GPL'd code, the license applies as far as I know. That's the difference between GPL and LGPL. You may distribute closed source applications that link to LGPL'd code, but you may not distribute closed source applications that link to GPL'd code.
 
D

duckroll

Member
loosus said:
Eh...I really doubt you're going to see either one of those things happen. Most likely, if it even becomes a litigation issue (which is unlikely), I bet Sony simply states that it internally corrected the problem. The end.
Click to expand...

Yeah just like how they settled that vibration thing internally.... right. :)
 
W

watership

Member
How was this discovered? Do people go around looking for GPL violations in software by backward engineering everythingfor fun?
 
D

Dr_Cogent

Banned
Why write the code if someone has already done a good job of it already and is making it available for free?

ICO using GPL code does not surprise me really.

Oh, hahah,
According to the article, they don't give credit. If this accusation is true, this is not good.
 
V

Vic

Please help me with my bad english
Sho Nuff said:
This is kinda interesting, makes me wonder how much under-the-shelf GPL usage there is in games these days
Click to expand...
Many PC games use the ogg vorbis format for their music soundtrack. PSO I&II and UT2k4 are using it.

It's nice since you don't have to rip shit; just copy -> paste the folder somewhere else and you're done!
 
B

Bojangles

Member
IANAL, but it seems pretty sketchy that the way out is to simply "cease distribution"...

I would expect litigation to go the "large punitive damages + legal fees" route if they fail to release the source. Otherwise, Team ICO gets away with taking the money and running.
 
W

wsippel

Banned
Vic said:
Many PC games use the ogg vorbis format for their music soundtrack. PSO I&II and UT2k4 are using it.

It's nice since you don't have to rip shit; just copy -> paste the folder somewhere else and you're done!
Click to expand...
libogg and libvorbis are BSD, not GPL. It's perfectly fine to use that stuff in closed source applications. Also common are Freetype, libtga, libpng and ODE for example, but those aren't GPL'd, either.
 
I

Icy

Banned
ParticleReality said:
Well grab all the Ico copies you can, it seems that they're going out of print if this gets out of hand.
Click to expand...

fairly sure this crap was Out of print 3 months after it was released. lol.
 
M

Mr YuYu

Member
Danne-Danger said:
So basically, either the value goes up, up, up or down, down, down.
Click to expand...


Let's hope the price goes up.

Just bought the game a few days ago.

second-hand for 10 euro, don't tell astrolad ;-)
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Bojangles said:
IANAL, but it seems pretty sketchy that the way out is to simply "cease distribution"...

I would expect litigation to go the "large punitive damages + legal fees" route if they fail to release the source. Otherwise, Team ICO gets away with taking the money and running.
Click to expand...
no, the litigation would be for releasing the source code. this is why it's difficult to settle with freeware people. they're not looking for money, they're looking for the license to be upheld. victories are moral, not financial. legal fees may come up in this, but thats all that they would hold sony accountable for.
 
M3Freak

M3Freak

Banned
My take (I'm a Linux nerd - in fact, that's how I make a living!):

1. The original author (who then has the copyright to the said GPL code) may have given Sony the right to include the GPL code in their game. If so, then nothing is wrong, and the GPL has not been violated. The copyright owner can do whatever he/she wants with their code, after all.

2. If there is a violation, Sony could:
- negotiate with the copyright owner for distribution rights
- stop distributing the game
- release the necessary bits of the game that are affected

Essentially, this is non-news.
 
D

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
stop distributing the game
Click to expand...
Haven't they already done this? I can't imagine that copies of ICO are still being manufactured at this point. Even if they were, I doubt they'd take issue with ceasing production either.
 
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