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Sonic the Hedgehog 4 - Wii/PS3/360; downloadable episodic release - [Update: $15?]

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
RagnarokX said:
Difficult because of bad cameras, wonky homing attack targeting, and endless rail grinds over bottomless pits?
No, because of high required scores in order to get an A-Rank / S-Rank. There are only three levels with excessive rail grinding in the two mentioned games (all in Sonic Adventure 2) and homing attack targeting is absolutely predictable, at least in Sonic Unleashed, because there are marks on what Sonic aims at. While Sonic Adventure 2's camera was a bit problematic sometimes (when not played right - as in as fast as possible - or when playing Knuckles/Rouge), Sonic Unleashed was really reliable and I didn't have any problems at all in this game.

Ten-Song said:
The only difficulty in newer Sonic games, comes from glitches, and memorization, as you're often going at a speed where the sudden and abrupt placement of objects requires you to have telepathy to not run into some obstacles your first time through. Rather than relying on interesting mechanics and good level design relying on said mechanics, it's a lot of boost buttons and sudden stops around bottomless pits.
This is factually wrong, it is totally possible to not collide with any obstacle, even in Sonic Unleashed, the first time through. Memorization is a big advantage, but I got quite a few S Ranks in Sonic Unleashed on my first try (which requires not to be hit, as rings give a huge amount of points).
 
Yoshi said:
What makes you say there is no skill involved with the newer style Sonic games? Sonic Adventure 2 and Sonic Unleashed (as well as quite a few other newer Sonic games) are way more difficult to (really) complete than any of the first three games.

My childhood begs to differ. (I played Adventure 1 first)
 

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Adventure 1 didn't have the ranking system of Adventure 2 / Unleashed. It did have the additional missions with the third one being a bit more difficult, but it was by far the easiest 3D Sonic game (despite the unbelievably shitty Sonic & Black Knight).
 

MAtgS

Member
Andrex said:
1w4mr.jpg
canvy.jpg

Kinda a recurring problem with "her".
 

KamenSenshi

Junior Member
I didnt know anyone even considered the modern sonic games difficult for reasons other than glitches our not so great level layouts. shouldn't be surprised as every game has its defenders but wow. I guess at most you can make the new games challenging but it doesn't start off in a good challenging manner.
 
All this talk about Sonic 3 got me thinking about Sonic 2.

Am I the only person that prefers 2 over 3&K? For some reason I just really disliked a lot of the levels in 3, while some of my favorites are in 2.
 

Ten-Song

Member
I have always prefered Sonic CD and Sonic 2 over Sonic 3 and Knuckles.

Chao said:
Wow, the art is terrible I swear I made better Sonic comics at the age of 9. I am not kidding by any means. Why do they sell these?

The Archie comics will always exist because of the creepy furries that keep creaming their pants over the horrible art and stories.
 

Ten-Song

Member
RobbieNick said:

Fuck, the worst thing ever is when people try to treat Sonic characters like normal people. Sonic and the gang dressed like big Linkin Park fans is almost as bad as the old women that dress their small dogs up on a daily basis, only it's slightly more creepy and pathetic. Especially when a goddamn robot is wearing a bunch of emo clothing while... I guess he's trying to jab a finger into Amy's asshole? I don't know.

It always confuses me as a human being how Sega could want to intentionally pander to these weird fuckers. Like, I can't possibly imagine a marketing dude coming in with a picture of an emo robot attempting to initiate anal sex with a slutty rodent and scream to the rest of the marketing team "You see this? THIS is our bread and butter right here! We need to get us some of this!"
 

Sciz

Member
Chao said:
Wow, the art is terrible I swear I made better Sonic comics at the age of 9. I am not kidding by any means. Why do they sell these?
That's from something like ~130 issues back, when there wasn't much concern over the artists staying on model because the book was selling regardless. There eventually came a point where both art and writing got so catastrophically out of control that people were abandoning the series in droves. They got some new people on board and I suspect Sega forced Archie to institute a degree of actual quality control, and things have been improving ever since.

There's still the odd moment of QUALITY art and Ian Flynn still has some stuff to learn about pacing, but it's a more-or-less respectable kids' comic these days.
 

-PXG-

Member
Yoshi said:
What makes you say there is no skill involved with the newer style Sonic games? Sonic Adventure 2 and Sonic Unleashed (as well as quite a few other newer Sonic games) are way more difficult to (really) complete than any of the first three games.
They're "harder" because of bad design horribly implemented mechanics. Mega Man is a difficult game that, on the most part, has good design.
 
Ten-Song said:
It always confuses me as a human being how Sega could want to intentionally pander to these weird fuckers. Like, I can't possibly imagine a marketing dude coming in with a picture of an emo robot attempting to initiate anal sex with a slutty rodent and scream to the rest of the marketing team "You see this? THIS is our bread and butter right here! We need to get us some of this!"

Yep.

At some point, Sega forgot that the original Sonic game for the megadrive became successful because it tried to appeal to everybody. There were no Sonic fans before 'Sonic 1', so they had to start somewhere.

However, after a while it seems as though Sega has narrowed their focus to try to appeal almost exclusively to the smaller, more hardcore segment of their audience.

That's where the Mario and Sonic series of games seem to differ the most. It would be so easy for Nintendo to fall into the same bottomless pits with mario as Sega has with sonic. But they understand the need to focus and keep the attention of the gamer on what's really important. They realize that if they filled their games up with superfluous crap, it would alienate a good portion of the larger, less-hardcore part of their overall audience.

It's great to throw some fan service towards your fans every once in a while. Why, just look at the Koopalings returning in NSMBWii. They returned because fans asked for them to come back. And that's great, but they don't detract at all from the game. But with Sega, it seems as though the fan service is the primary reason for their games to exist at all.

I don't think Sega understands this philosophy and is primarily why the series is in the situation it is in today.
 

luka

Loves Robotech S1
jman2050 said:
Sonic 3 has a more consistent quality to its levels (Marble Garden being the low yet decent point) while Sonic and Knuckles has the best levels in the game (Flying Battery, Lava Reef) and the worst (Sandapolis, Death Egg). Hard to tell which is preferable for me.

I dunno. I'd consider Marble Garden to be right up there with Sandopolis in shittiness. They're both way too damn long for their own good. Death Egg would be a lot better without all those pointless launcher things that do nothing but waste time.

I was under the impression that everyone these days understood that they're meant to be played as a single game. Judging them separately seems kind of silly and contrived at this point.

SonicMegaDrive said:
It's great to throw some fan service towards your fans every once in a while. Why, just look at the Koopalings returning in NSMBWii. They returned because fans asked for them to come back. And that's great, but they don't detract at all from the game. But with Sega, it seems as though the fan service is the primary reason for their games to exist at all.

Service Games. They take it to heart. >_>
 

Chao

Member
Ten-Song said:
:lol

Only thing it's missing is a picture of a mine cart in there somewhere.

-Mine cart
-Iizuka happy face on that pic with Andy Garcia
-Green eyes
-Feet animation

and this will be perfect!
 

Ten-Song

Member
Chao said:
-Mine cart
-Iizuka happy face on that pic with Andy Garcia
-Green eyes
-Feet animation

and this will be perfect!

Actually, replace feet animation with Sonic standing perfectly still on a vertical wall.
 

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
RagnarokX said:
Pretty much this now:

33wqvxw.jpg
Exactly why I stopped keeping up with this thread weeks ago. This thread has become full of bitter tears and bitching. All hype for Sonic 4 deflated.
 

Iknos

Junior Member
Zen said:
Anyone who defends this game is ignorant. - You

I see a difference between liking it and defending it.

People saying the graphics are just like the classic games or that it's 2D and we should be happy with it...that's what I mean by "defending". It's already been discussed how wrong these viewpoints are but people keep reiterating it...they're being ignorant.

Anyone saying that this could be a fun game...I think they could be right. I think Sonic Rush is a decent game. Not a good Sonic game but a decent videogame. Unleashed was a decent videogame too. Not what I had in mind for Sonic and I think there can still be a 3D Sonic that is done right and Unleashed wasn't it.

Both are great rollercoaster rides...not so good platformers.

Sonic Spinball was a great game I thought. Not the Sonic title I was anticipating but decent and fun.

Sonic 4 looks broken to me at this point but it could be fun once I try it out. The homing attack will make the game a joke and it will be easy to beat the game in an hour I suspect...but I could be mildly amused.

Just against the idea of this game being called Sonic 4 because it represents a sad attempt to cash in on the Sonic name and cashing in on the highly regarded 16-bit platformers.
 
Seeing such a spectacular epic fail in motion here makes me glad I stopped caring about Sonic after playing SA. Ten years later and I don't even feel a thing. It's a good time to not care.

RIP, Sonic.
 

Ten-Song

Member
on the subject of Sonic as a franchise becoming a black hole of misery, an anecdote:

So I'm reading this mostly awful book, and the key point of interest is an artifact that is super evil and all that jazz. Not only is it filled with negativity, it actively attracts terrible things to it, and has become this magnet for awful things to happen, as it feeds off of this horror as it perpetuates it. At one point as a character was describing how it functioned and why it must be destroyed, I thought to myself "Oh, so it's basically like the Sonic franchise then..."
 

RagnarokX

Member
Ten-Song said:
on the subject of Sonic as a franchise becoming a black hole of misery, an anecdote:

So I'm reading this mostly awful book, and the key point of interest is an artifact that is super evil and all that jazz. Not only is it filled with negativity, it actively attracts terrible things to it, and has become this magnet for awful things to happen, as it feeds off of this horror as it perpetuates it. At one point as a character was describing how it functioned and why it must be destroyed, I thought to myself "Oh, so it's basically like the Sonic franchise then..."
It Came From Beneath the Sink!?
 

Brashnir

Member
ShockingAlberto said:
Stage 4: Depression

I've moved on to acceptance. This game is what it is, and really... the franchise is what it is at this point - Which is to say that it's basically Crash Bandicoot. It was once a series with great games, but now consists of titles which are a notch or two above shovelware. The people in charge of the franchise lack the talent to live up to the early games, and they're not going to magically become more talented.

The only difference is that Sonic is still made by a team called "Sonic Team," while Crash has gone to a completely new company, making the disconnect more apparent - so people stopped caring about Crash long ago.

It's time to stop caring about Sonic.
 

celebi23

Member
Brashnir said:
I've moved on to acceptance. This game is what it is, and really... the franchise is what it is at this point - Which is to say that it's basically Crash Bandicoot. It was once a series with great games, but now consists of titles which are a notch or two above shovelware. The people in charge of the franchise lack the talent to live up to the early games, and they're not going to magically become more talented.

The only difference is that Sonic is still made by a team called "Sonic Team," while Crash has gone to a completely new company, making the disconnect more apparent - so people stopped caring about Crash long ago.

It's time to stop caring about Sonic.

QFT. Time to bury the hedgehog, the fox & the echidna & move on......
 

Ten-Song

Member
celebi23 said:
QFT. Time to bury the hedgehog, the fox & the echidna & the other hedgehogs & the armadillo & the bear & the birds & the robots & the crocodile & the bat & the chameleon & the bee & the rabbit & the cat & the god knows what else & move on......

Fixed.
 
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