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iPlaywinner Article: What is it that makes for enjoyable commentary?
- Thread starter Fersis
- Start date
CountAntonius
Member
Seeing twitter blow up over it, but I have to agree. More than few times I wished there was a bit more professionalism during streams. I think it is improving though.
Slamtastic
Member
This man.
CountAntonius
Member
+UltraDavid and James Chen.Slamtastic said:
This man.
Really enjoy their commentary.
Face it Tiger..
Banned
Chris Hu & Yipes
Skisonic & S-kill
Ultra david j& chensor
or
Team Spooooky!
Take your pic, none of that west coast no hype commentary
I need the hype in my vains, mayne.
Skisonic & S-kill
Ultra david j& chensor
or
Team Spooooky!
Take your pic, none of that west coast no hype commentary
I need the hype in my vains, mayne.
TetraxShards
Member
It's a necessary move, but part of me will miss the "ICE CREAM!" commentary (as the article writer dubbed it) when it's gone.
Slamtastic said:
This man.
I agree. Seth is the best. The problem is he works for Capcom so in the end it's almost as though it doesn't count. We get him for the really big events and that's great, but the community needs to step up to the plate.
I know this article upset a lot of folks in the community, but you know? If it lights a fire under some of these guys and produces better content then it's better for everyone.
Frustrated_me
Member
<3
I can't think of a single fighting game stream that had three commentators. I think that could help. I greatly enjoy streams when you have one guy who does color commentary and one who gets very technical.
I think it was at Devastation last year when Magus (I think) and some other guy who I'd never seen before both came on the mic and were both mostly joking around with very little insight to the matches that they were watching. In fact, I think they were mostly insulting players and characters. It actually got very irritating after a while but what I remember most is that they weren't really analyzing the matches. I never wanted to watch commentary with Magus again if there wasn't somebody there that was the total opposite, like Seth Killian. At the same time, I don't know if I always want two guys who know every little detail about the characters together. I like listening to people like Juicebox (even though he rarely got on), Chris Hu and James Chen, especially his bits on the history of the fighting game scene. These guys know the characters well but can also get very hyped up when fights intensify.
So basically, you need to strike a balance. That's what works best for me at least.
I think it was at Devastation last year when Magus (I think) and some other guy who I'd never seen before both came on the mic and were both mostly joking around with very little insight to the matches that they were watching. In fact, I think they were mostly insulting players and characters. It actually got very irritating after a while but what I remember most is that they weren't really analyzing the matches. I never wanted to watch commentary with Magus again if there wasn't somebody there that was the total opposite, like Seth Killian. At the same time, I don't know if I always want two guys who know every little detail about the characters together. I like listening to people like Juicebox (even though he rarely got on), Chris Hu and James Chen, especially his bits on the history of the fighting game scene. These guys know the characters well but can also get very hyped up when fights intensify.
So basically, you need to strike a balance. That's what works best for me at least.
Interficium
Banned
The whole nature vs nurture aspect of the fighting game community, especially in the last three to four years, trying to "blow up and become totally professional/bigger than starcraft/ESPORTS YO" versus it's roots in grimy arcades where shit talk and beef were the rules of the road should be somebody's college thesis.
I think when you really boil down the essence of these "we need to grow the FGC/become more professional/get on MLG/become more esports" articles that come out of the fighting game community it comes down to people with dollar signs in their eyes. That's a little bit distressing for a long-time fighting game player.
I think when you really boil down the essence of these "we need to grow the FGC/become more professional/get on MLG/become more esports" articles that come out of the fighting game community it comes down to people with dollar signs in their eyes. That's a little bit distressing for a long-time fighting game player.
Fighting games commentary is amazing. Not sure what this article is trying to say. I think it's other communities that need to step up their commentary game. I didn't understand a god damn thing when I tried to watch the DOTA 2 stream a couple months ago.
Ultra David and James Chen do a great job calling the action, making it easy to understand for any viewer. And I'm not really biased. Many of my friends who don't understand shit about fighting games told me the commentary on the Evo stream was great.
I think having someone like Yipes in there, alongside a play by play voice like Chen/David, still works. Gotta have some hype. Even in professional sports commentary there is the color commentator getting hype. Reggie Miller saying something like "He just got POSTERIZED" is no different from Yipes going off about someone getting "R Kelly'd"
Ultra David and James Chen do a great job calling the action, making it easy to understand for any viewer. And I'm not really biased. Many of my friends who don't understand shit about fighting games told me the commentary on the Evo stream was great.
I think having someone like Yipes in there, alongside a play by play voice like Chen/David, still works. Gotta have some hype. Even in professional sports commentary there is the color commentator getting hype. Reggie Miller saying something like "He just got POSTERIZED" is no different from Yipes going off about someone getting "R Kelly'd"
Seven Force
Banned
I definitely agree there. Always a pleasure to listen to them.CountAntonius said:
I love me some Yipes commentary too, though.
djplaeskool
Member
I'm a fan of Spooky commentary.
It's a very pleasant matter-of-fact flow.
Let's see that OTG. Yeeeeeeees. Now gimme that DHC. Good shit Good shit.
Of course, I love me some Rush Hour...basically Chris Hu and anyone.
Yipes is just a given. The godfather of modern commentary.
It's a very pleasant matter-of-fact flow.
Let's see that OTG. Yeeeeeeees. Now gimme that DHC. Good shit Good shit.
Of course, I love me some Rush Hour...basically Chris Hu and anyone.
Yipes is just a given. The godfather of modern commentary.
LeonSKennedy90
Banned
I'm two minds about it. I think I can safely go the rest of my life without hearing Jaha again on the mic, making stupid jokes and harping on based swag god memes, hyping up the idiot stream monsters who constantly post in all caps and post Lil' B gifs. But I also don't want SkiSonic and James Chen just going at the videos play by play, as they can be a very dull combination. You need somebody who can be funny, and somebody who can actually commentate on the nature of the match.
And I don't mean describe what the moves are(I can clearly see those), but WHY the moves are happening. Give us some insight into what the players are probably thinking in this situation, what the character can do to escape situations, tell us why this is happening, not just what is happening. A lot of fighting game commentators forget this and just give us a radio teleplay of what's going on, which is redundant and boring. UltraDavid and S-Kill were REALLY good about this at EVO, always giving us a great analysis of the match, never falling back on lazy commentator crutches like constant shoutouts every minute, or rambling on anecdotes nobody cares about like James Chen and Keats.
But, and I'm hypocritical about this but so be it, I don't want to become too professional. I don't wanna lose the homegrown arcadey feel of Team Spooky's stream, or keeping guys like Ares and Yipes off the mic so they don't offend anybody. I think it robs a lot of the fun and camaraderie that speaks from the community when you put a mute button on that. This may sound melodramatic, but if become more "mainstream" and commercialized comes at the cost of the soul and competitive, rowdy spirit of the community, was it really worth it? Do you really wanna sell out and lose something vital in the process?
My $0.02
And I don't mean describe what the moves are(I can clearly see those), but WHY the moves are happening. Give us some insight into what the players are probably thinking in this situation, what the character can do to escape situations, tell us why this is happening, not just what is happening. A lot of fighting game commentators forget this and just give us a radio teleplay of what's going on, which is redundant and boring. UltraDavid and S-Kill were REALLY good about this at EVO, always giving us a great analysis of the match, never falling back on lazy commentator crutches like constant shoutouts every minute, or rambling on anecdotes nobody cares about like James Chen and Keats.
But, and I'm hypocritical about this but so be it, I don't want to become too professional. I don't wanna lose the homegrown arcadey feel of Team Spooky's stream, or keeping guys like Ares and Yipes off the mic so they don't offend anybody. I think it robs a lot of the fun and camaraderie that speaks from the community when you put a mute button on that. This may sound melodramatic, but if become more "mainstream" and commercialized comes at the cost of the soul and competitive, rowdy spirit of the community, was it really worth it? Do you really wanna sell out and lose something vital in the process?
My $0.02
CountAntonius
Member
I don't think it's necessary to "sell out" the scene to make it better. Some commentary is downright awful. I love the hype Yipes brings combine that with a good play by play guy like UltraDavid and I think we are golden.
But there have been instances where I have groaned at commentary. Slurs being thrown out casually, off topic banter that lasts for a couple of matches etc. I don't think the scene needs to sell out as much as mature a little bit.
But there have been instances where I have groaned at commentary. Slurs being thrown out casually, off topic banter that lasts for a couple of matches etc. I don't think the scene needs to sell out as much as mature a little bit.
ShockingAlberto
Member
I absolutely agree. I find most (non-Killian) fighting game commentary to be absolutely putrid, driven completely by two screaming jackals repeating memes and laughing to themselves.
There was a UMvC3 stream a little while back where the commentators were falling over themselves to make repeatable nicknames for every move. In one match, while Dr. Strange did a move that involves a book a few times, the two kept screaming
"READ A MOTHERFUCKING BOOK"
"THAT'S SOME READING RAINBOW SHIT"
"TAKE A LOOK, IT'S IN A GODDAMN BOOK MOTHERFUCKER"
over and over and over and over. And this is between all the "DR. DOOM IS BRINGING THE FOOD DRIVE, AM I RIGHT" lines repeated ad nauseum.
It's not even kind of clever. It's the basest, least intelligent jokes you can make in any situation and adds nothing informative or entertaining to what I'm watching.
99% of the time, EVO finals accepted, I have to mute the entire stream's volume because of an annoying, overly excitable commentator who doesn't know he's not funny, which sucks because I do like hearing the game's audio. A commentator-less stream would be fantastic.
There was a UMvC3 stream a little while back where the commentators were falling over themselves to make repeatable nicknames for every move. In one match, while Dr. Strange did a move that involves a book a few times, the two kept screaming
"READ A MOTHERFUCKING BOOK"
"THAT'S SOME READING RAINBOW SHIT"
"TAKE A LOOK, IT'S IN A GODDAMN BOOK MOTHERFUCKER"
over and over and over and over. And this is between all the "DR. DOOM IS BRINGING THE FOOD DRIVE, AM I RIGHT" lines repeated ad nauseum.
It's not even kind of clever. It's the basest, least intelligent jokes you can make in any situation and adds nothing informative or entertaining to what I'm watching.
99% of the time, EVO finals accepted, I have to mute the entire stream's volume because of an annoying, overly excitable commentator who doesn't know he's not funny, which sucks because I do like hearing the game's audio. A commentator-less stream would be fantastic.
I think that first comment is very insightful. It's damn hard to do good fighting game commentary, because it happens so fast. In Starcraft, any strategy takes time to develop, and matches play out over 15 minutes, while a round of Street Fighter is done in about a minute, and something is almost always happening. You need to be very selective about what things you call out if you're going to do a good job.
Seth is my favorite commentator, because he is good at commenting on things like player mindset and overall tactics that give the viewer a better sense not just of what has happened, but what is going to happen. Watching his commentary, you get a better sense of exactly what is going on behind the visuals, you understand the game better, and it's more enjoyable to watch. You can learn something from every match. That's what good commentary should do, and that kind of thing can be done best by someone who really understands the game.
I really appreciated the one time I saw Juicebox on commentary, because he had a lot of interesting technical knowledge of the game. And sometimes, hype or humor makes things worthwhile. But I don't often find the kind of insight in commentary that Seth provides. It's hard to hate, because it's a tough thing that these guys are doing for free, and they try their best and put a lot of enthusiasm into it, but it'd be great to see that kind of thing go up another level.
Seth is my favorite commentator, because he is good at commenting on things like player mindset and overall tactics that give the viewer a better sense not just of what has happened, but what is going to happen. Watching his commentary, you get a better sense of exactly what is going on behind the visuals, you understand the game better, and it's more enjoyable to watch. You can learn something from every match. That's what good commentary should do, and that kind of thing can be done best by someone who really understands the game.
I really appreciated the one time I saw Juicebox on commentary, because he had a lot of interesting technical knowledge of the game. And sometimes, hype or humor makes things worthwhile. But I don't often find the kind of insight in commentary that Seth provides. It's hard to hate, because it's a tough thing that these guys are doing for free, and they try their best and put a lot of enthusiasm into it, but it'd be great to see that kind of thing go up another level.
DryEyeRelief
Member
it's just talking.
darry's right in the the fact that people who prioritize commentary are more concerned with showmanship than the games themselves.
darry's right in the the fact that people who prioritize commentary are more concerned with showmanship than the games themselves.
I like it the way it is. Sure, sometimes it doesn't work out when some random dude gets on the mic, but you can always count on people like Yipes to bring the knowledge and hype.
When people talk about being put off by too technical commentary, they're probably not watching or listening closely enough. I have never in my life played either Street Fighter 4 or Marvel Vs. Capcom 3, and i still know everything that's going on in the matches.
When people talk about being put off by too technical commentary, they're probably not watching or listening closely enough. I have never in my life played either Street Fighter 4 or Marvel Vs. Capcom 3, and i still know everything that's going on in the matches.
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
I like Yipes and UltraDavid, or Chen.
I don't know, I like the grimy, vulgar stuff sometimes. I find it humorous.
Or we can teach Gus Johnson about fighting games.
I do see the point though of the article.
I think Aris is good when he keeps it PG-13 as well.
I don't know, I like the grimy, vulgar stuff sometimes. I find it humorous.
Or we can teach Gus Johnson about fighting games.
I do see the point though of the article.
I think Aris is good when he keeps it PG-13 as well.
LeonSKennedy90
Banned
Also, you kinda get what you pay for, ya know? Street Fighter commentators aren't like Starcraft commentators. No one is being paid for this. Its a thankless job where volunteers sit in a booth for several hours trying to provide entertaining insight into hundreds of matches a day.
But yeah, we can get rid of all the Jahas on the world and I think I'll live.
But yeah, we can get rid of all the Jahas on the world and I think I'll live.
FormallyFamicom
Member
+1 for UltraDavid and Seth, not so much for Chen since he tends to ramble endlessly. But while a duo like Yipes and Chris Matrix might be totally inappropriate, I'd be sad to not have that option since they're also hilarious.
The same thing that's worked for sports for years. Just need informative play-by-play, and interesting colour commentary to keep things lively. It's a formula that works!
Seth Killian is great because he knows his stuff, but that's great play by play. He needs a great colour partner to truly shine as well.
edit: Some level of maturity is nice as well.... but sadly rare.
Seth Killian is great because he knows his stuff, but that's great play by play. He needs a great colour partner to truly shine as well.
edit: Some level of maturity is nice as well.... but sadly rare.
corporate cheerleader
Member
A pleasant voice also helps. There's this recurring hoarse guy for eVo whose voice is just distracting to me.
LeonSKennedy90
Banned
ShaneB said:
I always thought we need a JR/Jerry Lawyer set-up
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
Requeim said:
I found them entertaining, but I didn't think it think it was that great of actual commentating. I can't explain it.
Fubarduck said:
Dunno who fubar is talking about.
It seems like a hard balance to reach between 'mainstream' and 'hood' commentary.
ie: SouthTownArcade KOFXIII streams are 'hood' like while other majors like Devastation or Evo are more 'mainstream'
I would like less screams and profanities though.
Thats why i made the thread dood. Your article struck a chord within the FGC.Mr Jared said:
sixteen-bit
Member
Wow, people like skisonic and james chen? They're forever keits tier to me.
S-kill and Ultradavid are excellent.
S-kill and Ultradavid are excellent.
LeonSKennedy90 said:
I agree with this to a point. Guys like Day9 didn't just wake up one day to a point and say "Hey, you're going to pay me to do this." He worked hard at building his commentary skills with his daily series for ages before he got to that point.
The fighting game community is in this weird state where everyone knows what direction it needs to go in, but not many want to either commit or put in the effort. We're just sort of floundering aimlessly.
ObligatoryCountAntonius said:
Stabby McSter
Member
i can't stand skisonic. james chen, i'm indifferent._dementia said:
also, i enjoy ifc JJJJJJJEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAANNNNNNN yipes once in awhile. his commentary is somewhat calm, yet outtacontrol! plus, it's kinda fun to see him get salty.
Rufus said:
Yeah, I honestly couldn't help but laugh off that twitter post. There are people all different creeds who are guilty of the behaviors I talk about in the article and to come to the conclusion that I'm somehow racist for not enjoying fighting game commentary anymore is beyond silly.