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Yugoslavia provided USA with necessary technology to win the Space Race

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A

amar212

Member
Upcoming Slovenian 2013 docudrama "Houston We Have a Problem" will reveal one of the biggest secrets of space race during cold war - Yugoslavian space program and it's crucial impact to USA effort to catch the USSR in the Space Race.

Post WWII Yugoslavian leadership made rapid development based on unknown diaries of Yugoslav and world space pioneer Herman Potocnik - Noordung. Technical solutions described in Potocnik's unpublished papers were the basis for establishing secret Yugoslavian space programme in 1948, after Josip Broz Tito's conflict with Stalin.

In late 1960, CIA discovered that Yugoslavia already had an operational space-flight technology.
In March 1961 Yugoslavia secretly sold complete space programme to USA.
In May 1961, Kennedy announced USA choose to go to the Moon.

Directed by Academy Award nominated Slovenian director Ziga Virc, this documentary will reveal the reasons for Yugoslavian leader and post WWII lifetime president Josip Broz Tito to build and maintain the biggest secret underground space centre in Europe, in army base Zeljava with code name "Object 505".

Huston We Have A Problem Movie Trailer

About Herman Potocnik Noodrung
At the end of 1928, he published his sole book, Das Problem der Befahrung des Weltraums - der Raketen-Motor (The Problem of Space Travel - The Rocket Motor) in Berlin. The publisher, Richard Carl Schmidt, printed the year 1929 as a publishing date, probably from a purely business motive (to keep the book looking new throughout the coming year) and this date is often mistakenly given as the actual date of publication. In 188 pages and 100 handmade illustrations, Potočnik set out a plan for a breakthrough into space and the establishment of a permanent human presence there. He conceived a space station in detail and was the first man to calculate the geostationary orbit, on which the station would orbit the Earth. He described the use of orbiting spacecraft for detailed observation of the ground for peaceful and military purposes, and described how the special conditions of space could be useful for scientific experiments.[1] Potočnik expressed strong doubts of the potentially destructive military use of these fresh discoveries.

With his many ideas he became one of the founders of astronautics. His concepts were first taken seriously only by the amateur rocketry movement in Germany, the Verein für Raumschiffahrt (VfR - "Spaceflight Society"), centered on Hermann Oberth and his co-workers. In its Russian edition, the book may also have influenced Sergey Korolev's circle. More locally, Viennese engineers dismissed his work as fantasy.

Potočnik's book described geostationary satellites (first put forward by Konstantin Tsiolkovsky) and discussed communication between them and the ground using radio, but fell short of the idea of using satellites for mass broadcasting and as telecommunications relays (developed by Arthur C. Clarke in his Wireless World article of 1945). The wheel-shaped space station served as an inspiration for further development by Wernher von Braun (another former VfR member) in 1952. Von Braun saw orbiting space stations as a stepping stone to travel to other planets. In 1968, Stanley Kubrick's ground-breaking film, 2001: A Space Odyssey, depicted such a role for "Space Station V".

Wikipedia link
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Much more about Herman Potocnik and his book is available on the dedicated site here

NASA 1995 english publication of the Das Problem der Befahrung des Weltraums - der Raketen-Motor book available here

YouTube movie about Zeljava airbase and Object 505 from Yugoslavian TV in '80s

Zeljava and Object 505 today, 15 years after the ex-Yugoslavia war > post on Croatian forum with photographs

>> for easier understanding of the subject:

Modern Yugoslavia ended in 1991 with terminating of the federal state and establishing of independence of the Yugoslavian republics: Slovenia (authors of documentary are Slovenians), Croatia (Zeljava airbase is today on Croatian territory and Croatian capital Zagreb was the main centre for aeronautics and nuclear researches in Yugoslavia), Bosnia and Herzegovina (underground parts of the base partially lies on Bosnian territory), Serbia (Yugoslav capital of Belgrade and main military development centre was there), Montenegro and Macedonia.

Worth noticing is another subject, similar in significancy - Yugoslav Nuclear Weapon Development Programme, also ceased in 60's without any particular reason. Conspiracy theorists believe how nuclear programme was only a shadow-curtain for the development of the space programme, all ended after Tito and Kennedy negotiated the exchange of the developments for economic funds.

"Houston We Have a Problem" will be presented in early 2013.
 
T

Timedog

good credit (by proxy)
YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's not technically a conspiracy theory until US officials repudiate the claims, right?
 
DiscoJer

DiscoJer

Member
And here's a picture of their space capsule

Yugo_Koral.jpg
 
R

Rocket Scientist

Member
Highly interesting. When my father used to talk about how advanced yugoslavia was and that they had an airbase in a mountain I thought it was partly true, but also a lot of just him believing in the good ol' commie propaganda. Guess I'm eating crow now.
 
DiscoJer

DiscoJer

Member
In all seriousness, this guy was a visionary (he didn't actually do anything practical), but the real genius behind spaceflight is Tsiolkovsky. He published his work on rockets in 1903! We could hardly even fly then
 
desertdroog

desertdroog

Member
Stalin was known for sending his rocket and aeronautics scientists to the gulag during WWII for failed prototypes and other paranoid reasons.

This retarded Russia's industry up until the cold war.
 
R

Rocket Scientist

Member
desertdroog said:
Stalin was known for sending his rocket and aeronautics scientists to the gulag during WWII for failed prototypes and other paranoid reasons.

This retarded Russia's industry up until the cold war.
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Sometimes I think certain dictators knew what they were doing, but then you just read one too many things about them and realize they were just batshit insane morons.
 
S

Stet

Banned
It's not like it was American scientists in the first place. Yugoslavian tech and German minds, what a twist!
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Weren't America and Yugoslavia constantly in bed with one another? I heard that Yugoslavia's communist model only succeeded for the duration of its time due to U.S. aid/help.
 
R

Rocket Scientist

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
Weren't America and Yugoslavia constantly in bed with one another? I heard that Yugoslavia's communist model only succeeded for the duration of its time due to U.S. aid/help.
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Yugoslavia was in bed with all sides. Communists all over the world, capitalist in the west, Muslims in Africa and the Middle East. They worked all angles and were successful until Tito died and nationalism started brewing in the different republics
 
L

Lagspike_exe

Member
Yugoslavia also had a working prototype of a railgun back in the 1980s. We had a very advanced weapons programme.

The Yugoslavian MTI (MTI - Military - technology institute) developed, within a project named EDO-0, a rail gun with 7 kJ kinetic energy, in 1985. In 1987 a successor was created, project EDO-1, that used projectile with a mass of 0.7 kg and achieved speeds of 3,000 m/s, and with a mass of 1.1 kg reached speeds of 2,400 m/s. It used a track length of 0.7 m. According to those working on it, with other modifications it was able to achieve a speed of 4,500 m/s. The aim was to achieve projectile speed of 7,000 m/s. At the time, it was considered a military secret.[citation needed]
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F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Rocket Scientist said:
Yugoslavia was in bed with all sides. Communists all over the world, capitalist in the west, Muslims in Africa and the Middle East. They worked all angles and were successful until Tito died and nationalism started brewing in the different republics
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So why did communist Yugoslavia die if it was so successful?
 
M

MrOogieBoogie

BioShock Infinite is like playing some homeless guy's vivid imagination
DieH@rd said:
I am from Serbia, and i cant wait to see this documentary.
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I'm originally from Montenegro, and what I've noticed about most Yugoslavians, be it those born in Yugoslavia or elsewhere, is that they are some of the most prideful and nationalistic people I've ever met.

Almost to a ridiculous point, actually. Especially the young kids who were born in the U.S. and have some weird fucking pride about a country they've only maybe stepped foot in one summer ago.
 
R

Rocket Scientist

Member
Flying_Phoenix said:
So why did communist Yugoslavia die if it was so successful?
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Because when it's dictator died, it's forced and faux unity died with him. Yugoslavia consisted of a few different countries that had very different cultures but one thing in comon: they all hated each others guts. Tito new how to keep things together and make everyone feel at least content but also proud of Yugoslavia and it's achievements. The people that came into power after he died were much more focused on their own republics than Yugoslavia.
 
R

Rocket Scientist

Member
I agree with oogieboogie, Yugostalgija is a hell of a drug =) I watched Orkestar this summer and while it paints a bit of both sides of former Yugoslavia, you can't help but wish you'd experienced at least some of it yourself. I would recommend the documentary. It was pretty interesting.
 
L

Lagspike_exe

Member
MrOogieBoogie said:
I'm originally from Montenegro, and what I've noticed about most Yugoslavians, be it those born in Yugoslavia or elsewhere, is that they are some of the most prideful and nationalistic people I've ever met.

Almost to a ridiculous point, actually. Especially the young kids who were born in the U.S. and have some weird fucking pride about a country they've only maybe stepped foot in one summer ago.
Click to expand...

That's not true at all. I have a number of friends who are very nationalistic, but I also know a lot of people who don't care about nationalism at all. Besides, if we were so obsessed with nationalism, how would left-wing parties get so many votes?
 
S

SovietStriker

Member
Very interesting, if true he should have launched it himself (nationally). The international prestige from the moon landing would have been great for Yugoslavia.
 
L

Lagspike_exe

Member
SovietStriker said:
Very interesting, if true he should have launched it himself (nationally). The international prestige from the moon landing would have been great for Yugoslavia.
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I haven't seen the documentary so I can't say for certain, but I really can's see how Yugoslavia could launch a succesfull Moon landing. The tech wasn't there. The political will was focused on providing improvements to the living standard and I really doubt that the party would dedicate so much resources necessery to land a man on the Moon to the project.
Some parts, maybe. But an entire project? I doubt that.
 
O

overcast

Member
MrOogieBoogie said:
I'm originally from Montenegro, and what I've noticed about most Yugoslavians, be it those born in Yugoslavia or elsewhere, is that they are some of the most prideful and nationalistic people I've ever met.

Almost to a ridiculous point, actually. Especially the young kids who were born in the U.S. and have some weird fucking pride about a country they've only maybe stepped foot in one summer ago.
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My parents are both from Montenegro.. This is absolutely true. The young Albanians I encounter suck.

Also, this is fascinating.
 
M

MrOogieBoogie

BioShock Infinite is like playing some homeless guy's vivid imagination
overcast said:
My parents are both from Montenegro.. This is absolutely true. The young Albanians I encounter suck.

Also, this is fascinating.
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Albanians in general suck. :p

Joking, but that's the kind of attitude young Serbs or Croats might have despite having never met an Albanian. It's an annoying culture built on mistrust that's somehow permeated into the American-born generation.

Most of my cousins and relatives think I'm too "Americanized," which is probably why I don't get along with any of them. But I can't help it when kids 16, 17, 18 are congregated outside restaurants, clubs, or cafes, with their stupid slick-back hairs, their shitty dress shirts/pants, while puffing a cigarette for the fourth time in an hour, carelessly throwing around the n-word, and ending every sentence in "bro."

The younger generation (which I'm a part of) is fucking disgusting and I do not want to be affiliated with it in any way. I hate so much about Yugoslavian culture, I'm sorry.
 
E

Emwitus

Member
Well, do you guys think all the german-nazi scientists were locked up in prisons or somethin.

EDIT: Figures since recently they were looking for junk yard parts to get clues on how we did it.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Rocket Scientist said:
Because when it's dictator died, it's forced and faux unity died with him. Yugoslavia consisted of a few different countries that had very different cultures but one thing in comon: they all hated each others guts. Tito new how to keep things together and make everyone feel at least content but also proud of Yugoslavia and it's achievements. The people that came into power after he died were much more focused on their own republics than Yugoslavia.
Click to expand...

So Yugoslavia actually found a way to make Communism legitimately work? Hmm so just make it a dictatorship...
 
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