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Rarely have I felt such apathy towards a video game. LTTP: Jak II
- Thread starter Kujo
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Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I agree, but I'm sure it never was a great game. In fact, I've yet to play a game that I think is great in one year and think isn't great in another year. Either the gameplay is fun and well-done (then the game is good) or not (then the game sucks). Jak 2 is a clear case of the second option.
Acquiescence
Member
Has there ever been a more polarizing game than Jak II? I love it. I liked the fact that is was bigger and more varied than Jak & Daxter, and that it had something approaching a compelling story.
Yup this. Love it. Found it a good level of challenging too, after Jak and Daxter was disappointingly short and easy (but not bad).
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I don't know about a general consensus, but from my point of view it's exactly the opposite, Jak 1 > Jak 3 > Jak 2 (with the first ">" being actually a ">>").
Breakfast at Noon
Member
loved the first got it on PSN+ 
great game
jak 2.. fucking terrible can not be bothered to play it anymore let alone try the 3rd game.
great gamejak 2.. fucking terrible can not be bothered to play it anymore let alone try the 3rd game.
When this came out, wow I just loved it. I loved the world ND created, really liked the story and just roaming around in the world was fantastic. I still regard it as one of my favourite games of that gen. Never replayed it though but I will probably never will since it will destroy my good memories of the game if I have to believe all the hate it get's around here.
PirateKing
Junior Member
Loved all four Jak games. Haven't played the fifth one yet. Daxter was also amazing on PSP.
It's a product of its time. Most areas are full of filler, the story is AWFUL and the open world structure brought nothing to the table. At the time people were blown away by the tech and coolness of a platformer that hedged towards TPS games.
Today its evident to all that the game sucks even though there are some good platforming beneath all the dung.
Today its evident to all that the game sucks even though there are some good platforming beneath all the dung.
RockmanWhore
Member
Naughty Dog sure has a lot of progress when it comes to story telling. TLOU is has been nomited in pretty much every "best story of the year" of the various GOTY awards.
thewhitehawk
Member
I was appalled and disappointed when I saw how negatively some GAFers felt about Jak 2.
While I understand that some people did not appreciate the change in art direction, some felt the overworld was too big, some didn't like big spikes in difficulty. To me those are all understandable things.
But when looking at Jak 2 as a whole, it's hard for me to consider it inferior to Jak 1. I found Jak 2 much better written as a whole, the new world while very different also had a lot of creativity, it felt a bit like it was honoring some of the big-budget action classics of the 80's or 90's.
Like I said in the previous thread where Jak 2 was brought up very often, I think Jak 2 should be looked at as a game that was a proper sequel. A game that changed how the game was played, brought genuine new content and challenges and new game mechanics that complemented the old.
It's very rare for a franchise to take such a large iterative step in one sequel but Naughty Dog did and in most regards succeeded in bringing a quality product to the masses. Putting this game aside Shadow the Hedgehog is a disservice to gaming in general and quite honestly insulting to the quality of Jak 2. I'm not saying you forcefully have to like Jak 2, but I think it's safe to objectively say it is a better game than Shadow the Hedgehog which was nothing more than a buggy action adventure game. I hate to bring scores into this but Shadow the Hedgehog is a game that sits at 51 on metacritic, whereas if you look for Jak 2 reviews you'll find it sitting comfortably around 9 out of 10.
It's not a bad game. It's a game that had flaws, that I agree. It's a game that could have used more balance, that is true. But when you take into consideration the scope, changes and sheer size of the content available to you it's hard to look at Jak 2 and discredit it for all the good things it brought.
We, consumers, collectively buy millions of copies of Assassin's Creed and that franchise, while being a good one, has been largely iterative and taken very few risks or liberties with their content other than ones that might bring it a bit of "wow" factor to improve sales, yet I rarely see anyone shunning them for such uninspired "sequels" that, despite having very high production values, mostly feel like regurgitated, but spit-shined, content packs.
To me Jak 2 was one of the best games of the Playstation 2 and also one of the best sequels we've ever received. To me it is up there with the best of them, like Dark Cloud 2.
While I understand that some people did not appreciate the change in art direction, some felt the overworld was too big, some didn't like big spikes in difficulty. To me those are all understandable things.
But when looking at Jak 2 as a whole, it's hard for me to consider it inferior to Jak 1. I found Jak 2 much better written as a whole, the new world while very different also had a lot of creativity, it felt a bit like it was honoring some of the big-budget action classics of the 80's or 90's.
Like I said in the previous thread where Jak 2 was brought up very often, I think Jak 2 should be looked at as a game that was a proper sequel. A game that changed how the game was played, brought genuine new content and challenges and new game mechanics that complemented the old.
It's very rare for a franchise to take such a large iterative step in one sequel but Naughty Dog did and in most regards succeeded in bringing a quality product to the masses. Putting this game aside Shadow the Hedgehog is a disservice to gaming in general and quite honestly insulting to the quality of Jak 2. I'm not saying you forcefully have to like Jak 2, but I think it's safe to objectively say it is a better game than Shadow the Hedgehog which was nothing more than a buggy action adventure game. I hate to bring scores into this but Shadow the Hedgehog is a game that sits at 51 on metacritic, whereas if you look for Jak 2 reviews you'll find it sitting comfortably around 9 out of 10.
It's not a bad game. It's a game that had flaws, that I agree. It's a game that could have used more balance, that is true. But when you take into consideration the scope, changes and sheer size of the content available to you it's hard to look at Jak 2 and discredit it for all the good things it brought.
We, consumers, collectively buy millions of copies of Assassin's Creed and that franchise, while being a good one, has been largely iterative and taken very few risks or liberties with their content other than ones that might bring it a bit of "wow" factor to improve sales, yet I rarely see anyone shunning them for such uninspired "sequels" that, despite having very high production values, mostly feel like regurgitated, but spit-shined, content packs.
To me Jak 2 was one of the best games of the Playstation 2 and also one of the best sequels we've ever received. To me it is up there with the best of them, like Dark Cloud 2.
Sephiroth87
Member
Everyone knows it's I >> II > III
Never got around to actually finishing 3 sadly, hope to have a go on the HD remaster...
But yeah, 2 was a nice game, but not that good...
Never got around to actually finishing 3 sadly, hope to have a go on the HD remaster...
But yeah, 2 was a nice game, but not that good...
Jak and Daxter: The Precursor Legacy is still one of my all time favourite games on any platform. At the time I was absolutely blown away by the level design and the aesthetic of the game (would sometimes just leave Jak sitting at the early beach level just to experience the sunrise). Also, the characters were very likeable and mute Jak is a-ok in my book.
Jak II was a bold direction for ND to take the series and at the time it really felt like a breath of fresh air after playing the first one to death. Also, the improved character models were mind blowing at the time (10,000 polys). Now looking back at it it really doesn't hold up as well as the first game for some odd reason. I wouldn't call Jak II a bad game but it definitely doesn't feel "right" anymore.
Jak III did not interest me at all. Even though I completed it at the time, I have no recollection of the events that happened in it. Perhaps it deserves a replay?
Jak II was a bold direction for ND to take the series and at the time it really felt like a breath of fresh air after playing the first one to death. Also, the improved character models were mind blowing at the time (10,000 polys). Now looking back at it it really doesn't hold up as well as the first game for some odd reason. I wouldn't call Jak II a bad game but it definitely doesn't feel "right" anymore.
Jak III did not interest me at all. Even though I completed it at the time, I have no recollection of the events that happened in it. Perhaps it deserves a replay?
JB2448
Member
Though I enjoyed playing through Jak II the first time over a decade ago, when I played through the HD collection, I couldn't be bothered to earn the platinum trophy for it. It was a pretty mediocre experience to get through, honestly. Jak 3 did a much better job of making things at least somewhat lighthearted again (more tongue-in-cheek, I suppose), but Jak and Daxter: The Precursor Legacy is still my favorite game in the trilogy.
I feel like if Naughty Dog were to continue the series, there'd have to be a reboot or some sort of "Infinities" thing where everything that happened after the ending of the first game just, well, didn't (even though it's likely that they had planned something like Jak II in terms of a dramatic tone shift from the beginning, considering the original's 100% ending
).
Daxter on the PSP reminded me of what made the original title great, and I feel like even that would be a better direction to take the franchise than what we saw in either Jak X or The Lost Frontier. This is one of my favorite Sony Computer Entertainment properties, and I do wish for it to end with more of a bang than The Lost Frontier.
I feel like if Naughty Dog were to continue the series, there'd have to be a reboot or some sort of "Infinities" thing where everything that happened after the ending of the first game just, well, didn't (even though it's likely that they had planned something like Jak II in terms of a dramatic tone shift from the beginning, considering the original's 100% ending
/baseless conjecture
Daxter on the PSP reminded me of what made the original title great, and I feel like even that would be a better direction to take the franchise than what we saw in either Jak X or The Lost Frontier. This is one of my favorite Sony Computer Entertainment properties, and I do wish for it to end with more of a bang than The Lost Frontier.
GrotesqueBeauty
Banned
One of the most horribly misguided sequels I've had the displeasure of playing. It's a clumsy mish-mash of every obnoxious trend from that generation, right down to the shitty goatee. There is no sense of cohesion, at all. It wants to be all things to all people, but instead it's Jak of all trades, master of none. Sure, there are bits and snatches of legitimately good content buried somewhere in there, but it's like looking for flecks of gold dust in a bucket full of dung. From a design standpoint Precursor Legacy was light years ahead of it imo.
Sutton Dagger
Member
It's one area where I've always felt Playstation was severely lacking, Sony's platformers have always been shite compared to what you get on Nintendo's systems. Jak & Daxter, Ratchet and clank, they are some of the most boring franchises I've played.
KingpinZero
Member
Oh god, so im not alone! APATHY is the best term to describe jak games. First one was entertaining, but it bored me. The second and third just make me felt apathic to the whole game, actually, sad and bitter too.
Daxter on psp was amazing, and Sly raccoon deserves way more praise than Jak series imho.
Daxter on psp was amazing, and Sly raccoon deserves way more praise than Jak series imho.
Is Jak 1 the only one with Crash Bandicoot vibes? If so I'm avoiding 2 and 3.
Except for the PS1 era. Crash, Spyro and multi-platform wise Croc and Gex, the former of which never came out on N64 and was apparantly the influence for Mario 64.
onimushroom
Member
Gotta get on the hate train: Jak II (on the Vita) is one of the worst games of my recent memory.
A mish-mash of half-assed open world, racing, skateboarding, shooting, platforming, and god knows what else I have yet to endure.
A mish-mash of half-assed open world, racing, skateboarding, shooting, platforming, and god knows what else I have yet to endure.
Absolutely, II and III feel much more GTA/sandbox influenced.
PirateKing
Junior Member
How do I hold,
All this hate?
All this hate?
The Cartographer
Member
I don't like Jak 2 and 3.
I don't like them at all.
I don't like them at all.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
From the slums, to the swamps, to the city, to the forest, to the loading docks/piers, to the farmlands, to the sewers, to capital city, to the racing arena, to the ruins, to the bazaar, the scope and scale of Jak 2 was a sight to behold. It felt "lived in" if that makes any sense. A living, breathing, oppressed city that changed and evolved by your hands as you progressed. There were some shitty difficulty spikes, and driving was a bit cramped and clumsy, but the world of Jak II was so thoroughly realized I felt like I wanted to save it. I wanted to explore it. The guns added some arcadey, fast action to the already solid platforming. I could have used less racing, and ring missions. Dark Jak was a nice shake-up to combat, and each tier of power up to the arsenal really kept things fresh.
My biggest disappointment was honestly the story. From the pacing to the writing, things were written in an uneven, crooked pace, even down to the animation. I'll praise it in the sense that the story events at least managed to bridge the vast world of Jak II in a coherent way.
It is a product of a TEENAGERS DARK EDGY CURSING DAMN FOURTH CHAOS EMERALD reboot. It's funny, didn't Prince of Persia 2 suffer the same fate? Never played it.
My biggest disappointment was honestly the story. From the pacing to the writing, things were written in an uneven, crooked pace, even down to the animation. I'll praise it in the sense that the story events at least managed to bridge the vast world of Jak II in a coherent way.
It is a product of a TEENAGERS DARK EDGY CURSING DAMN FOURTH CHAOS EMERALD reboot. It's funny, didn't Prince of Persia 2 suffer the same fate? Never played it.
JB2448
Member
Oh, and I feel like Michael Stout made a few very relevant points to why the tone shifted so dramatically from The Precursor Legacy to Jak II starting at the eight minute mark of a sort of interview/let's play of R&C: Tools of Destruction hybrid. The relevant discussion goes on for a little over four minutes, but basically, blame GTA III. It's really depressing to hear that something like GTA III's sales could cause such a drastic transformation in what was originally a mascot platformer franchise, but what's done is done, I suppose.
AzureSkies
Member
Prince of Persia: Warrior Within did suffer a similar fate, but at the same time it managed to actually be far more bearable than Jak II and Shadow the Hedgehog. They completely ruined the soundtrack and storyline in the process though. I do love the concept of the Dahaka though, and the game's storyline isn't too bad when not compared to any of the other titles in the series.
Platforming and combat ended up getting a nice improvement and it was overall an enjoyable game, just a complete disappoint coming from Sands of Time. On the bright side, The Two Thrones ended up being a great way to finish the trilogy and made fans of either of the first two titles happy.
I still wonder if anyone from Naughty Dog actually playtested the game, especially Hero Mode and the fucking Drill Platform with its horrible controls.
Naughty Dog developer: "I will just be mean and disable the god mode cheat for the drill platform part tehehe"
And this crap wasn't even fixed in the HD collection.
I had to use a glitch to get past it.
Naughty Dog developer: "I will just be mean and disable the god mode cheat for the drill platform part tehehe"
And this crap wasn't even fixed in the HD collection.
I had to use a glitch to get past it.
Probably my favorite Jak game, though I certainly need to do another playthrough of 3 before I can surely say so. It has challenge, humor, and a world ripe for creating your own playstyle. Even the shitty city was fun to navigate by constantly moving up and down, trying to move up just in time to hit the roof of a building, leaping from one vehicle to another, etc. The generic precursor orb challenges were fun because they were legitimately a challenge, the races actually pushed you to do it until you could do it right, the hoverboard presented countless opportunities for create-your-own-platforming.
And the controls were bliss.
AWESOME game.
And the controls were bliss.
AWESOME game.
nailbombxx
Member
I remember it being really fun when I played it (10 years ago...).
Pinko Marx
Banned
I love Jak I I and will forever defend it. I really don't understand how people can hate it from a game play perspective.
I agree, especially about the controls part. It really feels like having all of Jaks powers at your fingertips.
While it was not as challenging (even disappointingly so), I like Jak 3 even better. Except what they did with Keira, I'll never understand that. Suddenly she looks like retarded bimbo and has like 2 lines the entire game.
IdreamofHIME
Member
It's not an "awful" game, but it did have issues. it's amazing how ND copied the shit out of GTAIII and abandoned the Banjo/Mario formula. Nice characters and graphics, I was a fan back on the PS2.
Great ending too.
Too bad its nearly unplayable on Vita with it's shitty non-customizable button layout and 15fps gameplay.
Who's idea was it to make the touchpad be the controls for moving your vehicle up and down? yikes.
None have a Crash vibe. Jak1 is a Banjo collectathon ripoff and the other 2 are GTA knockoffs. X is a Vehicle combat game and the Lost Frontier is like Crimson Skies.
The PSP's daxter is probably closer to Crash and even has Crash like levels as a homage.
Great ending too.
Too bad its nearly unplayable on Vita with it's shitty non-customizable button layout and 15fps gameplay.
Who's idea was it to make the touchpad be the controls for moving your vehicle up and down? yikes.
None have a Crash vibe. Jak1 is a Banjo collectathon ripoff and the other 2 are GTA knockoffs. X is a Vehicle combat game and the Lost Frontier is like Crimson Skies.
The PSP's daxter is probably closer to Crash and even has Crash like levels as a homage.
tiggerkiddo
Member
I think the setting itself was interesting...there were some very fun platforming sections.
I really liked all of the Jaks actually. I don't think I've ever seen a game change so much though between games in a series, but it wasn't something that scared me and made me not want to touch it ever again.
I may like Jak 2 most of all actually, I found Jak 3...more of the same really and the things it added didn't seem so significant. Driving I guess was the big thing they added to Jak 3 really, and light eco powers obviously.
Jak 2 just had that awe feeling, like the time you first get the hover board in free roam. It reminds like Ratchet + Clank combined with Crash in a way.
Would like to see a Jak 4.., but not sure I want a realistic Jak like naughty dog was planning though, it depends how it goes I guess. I saw the style of Jak as one of its iconic features, but if they can a realistic Jak such as fun, then I guess its fine.
I may like Jak 2 most of all actually, I found Jak 3...more of the same really and the things it added didn't seem so significant. Driving I guess was the big thing they added to Jak 3 really, and light eco powers obviously.
Jak 2 just had that awe feeling, like the time you first get the hover board in free roam. It reminds like Ratchet + Clank combined with Crash in a way.
Would like to see a Jak 4.., but not sure I want a realistic Jak like naughty dog was planning though, it depends how it goes I guess. I saw the style of Jak as one of its iconic features, but if they can a realistic Jak such as fun, then I guess its fine.
While I can almost understand people's hatred of Jak II, I can in no way understand the underlying reasoning in calling it a GTA knockoff. The similarities are so superficial as to be completely throw-away. When someone dismisses it as such, I can't help but dismiss their reasoning.
TyrantGuardian
Member
Hahaha, that IGN quote, geez. Guns and rage = the best emoshuns. Fantastic. I always wanted to play Jak 1, but only owned a Japanese import PS2 by the time I became aware of the game
buddha0991
Member
Man just look at how split opinions are in this very topic!
Except Prince of Persia 2 didn't dramatically change its design/gameplay.
Hahaha. Funny stuff right there. Not only the original Crash Bandicoot and Spyro games are equal to the Nintendo platformers in terms of quality, but Ratchet and Clank games are also really good and charming games, so are the Sly Cooper games and the first J&D. The only ones that has been "shite" are Jak 2 and 3. Stop putting plain untrue stuff as facts.
CecilRousso
Member
I thought it was ok, and Jak 3 was much much better.
And it was worth playing all the games to see the ending of Jak 3.
And it was worth playing all the games to see the ending of Jak 3.