That isnt how I took it when I watched it and HIGHLY doubt most did as well. Almost anyone who followed Titanfall knows(or should) about the "Believe the Hype" crap, it was everywhere. Very few people, imo, would actually think the 1st time they heard that was in the review. Most of his fans are gamers who follow the industry, beyond that, all the shit in the preview stuff from IGN was worse, they were a mouth piece for that game.
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Angry Joe gets called out by IGNs review editor for misquoting their Titanfall review
- Thread starter Dawg
- Start date
That isnt how I took it when I watched it and HIGHLY doubt most did as well. Almost anyone who followed Titanfall knows(or should) about the "Believe the Hype" crap, it was everywhere. Very few people, imo, would actually think the 1st time they heard that was in the review. Most of his fans are gamers who follow the industry, beyond that, all the shit in the preview stuff from IGN was worse, they were a mouth piece for that game.
Yup, he should have said "this came from a preview not from the review".
Did IGN post 'this is not a review nor indicative of our opinions on the product' at the bottom of their 'believe the hype' preview? No? If not, that's a statement of quality, and I believe fair game. Joe wasn't calling out IGN specifically, he was just using their quotes as one example of the utter cloud of hyperbole that loomed over the buildup to Titanfall's release.
Someone's gotta try. Might as well be these two.
Well, you are charging him with a standard of behavior that does not exist for a random everyday person. It simply isn't the norm to specify in excruciating detail the full context and source of everything you quote no matter what the mode and purpose of your expression. Specific situations, specific content, specific professional standards, etc. may require it. So... what is your basis for requiring it from Joe in that situation?
Right. Stand-up comedians? Talk show hosts? They never juxtapose a few related quotes from different sources for dramatic or comedic effect? Always give full context and full attribution with every quote? ... on what planet?
vinnygambini
Why are strippers at the U.N. bad when they're great at strip clubs???
Name calling does not help illustrate one's argument or predicament; nonetheless, both are in the wrong here to be honest.
They should seek Oprah's help to resolve this amicably.
They should seek Oprah's help to resolve this amicably.
Extra Sauce
Member
So his misrepresentation is okay because his fanbase is well informed. Okay.
TheActtionFigure
Member
From what I understand both the preview & the review were written by the same dude. So saying "Believe the Hype" in the preview and then turning around to write the review seems a little nebulous from an objectivity standpoint to me. Those who'd argue the difference between the preview & review when it's written by the same guy can take those semantics and cram it.
Dan was out of line on this. A supposed "professional" airing out his grievances against a Youtuber on Twitter is asinine and another blemish on the gamez press. Joe was justified in defending himself because that Dan guy came at him outta nowhere. Pacifism is a weakness that's rotting this country (US) from the inside out. We're not supposed to stand up to bullies, government, or ass clowns that begin stupid ass arguments on social media. Kudos to Joe!
Dan was out of line on this. A supposed "professional" airing out his grievances against a Youtuber on Twitter is asinine and another blemish on the gamez press. Joe was justified in defending himself because that Dan guy came at him outta nowhere. Pacifism is a weakness that's rotting this country (US) from the inside out. We're not supposed to stand up to bullies, government, or ass clowns that begin stupid ass arguments on social media. Kudos to Joe!
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Previews and hands on seem to be only meant to draw pre-orders at times...
Vincent Alexander
Member
This is an interesting point to ponder.So if there is a difference between a preview and a review, why are E3 awards on the Titanfall box cover?
This incident is showing how much of an oxymoron the term game journalism is.
You mean his representation. The argument is that most gamers, especially his followers, would understand and not consider it misrepresentation.
"Believe the hype" appeared in multiple advertisements selling Titanfall. The idea that Angry Joe misused the quote is hilarious given that fact.
Speedy Blue Dude
Banned
So if there is a difference between a preview and a review, why are E3 awards on the Titanfall box cover?
This incident is showing how much of an oxymoron the term game journalism is.
Because getting rewards at the biggest gaming event of the year is worth marketing? They show the quality of the title and the hype revolving it's announcement, and it plays off well for showing people how "good" the game is.
No, I dont think he misrepresented. I think he used a sying that was complete hype to explain why so many reviews didnt focus on the the problems in the game or at least still gave them, what he thought, were high scores regardless.
In fairness to IGN Titanfall is pretty front loaded. I was all "believe the hype" from the first second I played it until about 24-30 hours later at which point I became very bored.
They're both right, but the IGN guy arguing is stupid.
Ah whatever, common sense has been dead for a long time now.
They're both right, but the IGN guy arguing is stupid.
Ah whatever, common sense has been dead for a long time now.
R_thanatos
Member
So if there is a difference between a preview and a review, why are E3 awards on the Titanfall box cover?
This incident is showing how much of an oxymoron the term game journalism is.
Exactly my thought.
As long as it's used as a mean of information for the consummers , their effect is pretty much the same in the end.
Dion Blaster
Member
So I gather Angry Joe doesn't know what a campaign is?
Self_Destructive
Member
no wonder they mad
R_thanatos
Member
i believe he was complaining at how a campaign prevented the consummer from getting accurate information.
At least that's how i understood his point when i watched his review
8.9 does not equal 9.0. So that is factually inaccurate. That's just the fact. Whether you think it's stupid that they have a .1 scale or not, it doesn't equal the same thing no matter how you slice it. It's close, but it's not the same. End of story.
But the argument is really, really stupid.
But the argument is really, really stupid.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I don't know why you bothered to link that. I've read it and my opinion is no different.
Treythalomew
Member
no wonder they mad
Aren't most of IGNs views going to be on their own player on their site? Not even a close comparison.
The number is different, but the actual value of the game is not by definition a 8.9 or a 9. The difference is nominal and up to interpritation, no matter how much someone at IGN wants the scoring to mean what they think it means. Unless they can properly contectualize numbers with quality(which even they admitted isn't a science) then a 8.9 can very much be a 9 in the eyes of subjectivity. The rating systems for most websites are mostly nominal.
30 hours of playtime still shits all over average AAA games, for all the bellyaching about "lack of content".
Nydius
Gold Member
Precisely what I was here to say.
Both of them come across as idiots but if I had to pick someone who comes across as the bigger idiot, it would be Dan Stapleton. Honestly arguing about a decimal point and the difference between the preview and review, blah blah blah.
Shit like this and the whole Ubisoft handing out Nexus 7's is why games journalism is a complete and utter joke. Zero transparency and inflated egos all around.
Edit:
Stupid argument indeed, but you can't just dismiss Joe's point of view with your first two lines.
Dan's argument is that 8.9 should round down to 8 because it's not 9 while Joe's argument is that it rounds up to 9 because.. well, that's how rounding works. The idea that 8.9 means it's a "Great" game because it's still an 8 when, in fact, it's closer to 9 is the most idiotic thing I've read from anyone at IGN in a while.
I don't disagree with your point, but the reality is that if 8.9 and 9.0 are different on the IGN scale, you can't say IGN gave it a 9.0. You just can't. That's wrong.
This...
No, but you can say they are effectively the same thing; and in many peoples eyes it is. Unscientific numerical's that close together can very understandably can be considered nominally no different.
Vincent Alexander
Member
Understandable, but it seems ridiculous. Either call the game an 8 or a 9. Cut out the decimals. Or maybe it is IGNs way of being vague to allow easy flip flopping.
Single player games, sure...
So why is there a badge of honor on the cover for a demo that isn't the final product? Isn't that what a preview is? Looking at unfinished code?
They can use this, but Joe can't say that major outlets are hyping the game? Where does a review and preview end? It's at the same arbitrary point were great and amazing meet.
sweetvar26
Member
.
I had the exact same thoughts. Angry Joe is wrong for quoting thr wrong post and the other guy is wrong for arguing about a .1 score.
1) He isn't an everyday random person. He's getting paid for his gaming related content.
2) Normal everyday random people also have to be careful not to misquote or misrepresent people in every day lives. We have learned this in the past two weeks on GAF!!! Need I remind you about famousmort? There are very real consequences for doing so. From getting your ass kicked in the street because you misquoteed Chris down the street about what he said about Ricky, to lawsuits from companies/people.
Come on. Use your head. It's not hard to say "I don't understand why there was an overwhelming hype/buzz for this game! IGN said "believe the hype." "Polygon, such and such and such gave it a 9. These sites gave it a 10!"
It's simple and covers your ass.
Johnny Cage In The Shower
Member
I stopped reading a great NPR article titled "Scientists Spot A Planet That Looks Like 'Earth's Cousin'" to read the Twitter tirade between these two dudes...and now, I feel dirtier and more ashamed of myself than I did that one time after masturbating to that one porn, I don't want to mention.
Now I am going to go back to reading that NPR, NASA article to feel better about myself.
Now I am going to go back to reading that NPR, NASA article to feel better about myself.
faceless007
Member
It doesn't matter what "many people" understand it to be; they aren't different to IGN as they explicitly differentiate on their site that 8-8.9 and 9+ are different labels. You can criticize that rubric if you want, but is nevertheless disingenuous to accuse them of giving one score when, by their own rubric, they explicitly gave one with a different meaning.
Dangoesforth
Member
After watching the review, he just mentions a buzz word basically paraphrasing what a lot of people said before and after the game came out, that IGN had used in their preview then shows the score 8.9 immediately afterwards. I don't think it is a misrepresentation of the review itself at all.
It doesnt matter what they claim if they dont continually show an actually difference between an 8.7 and a 8.8 and ect. The labels are different but they are not properly quantified in text when a game in the same genre gets a .1 difference. That difference and inconsistency, unless supported by very detailed reasons removes the point of differentiation from title to title, which is supposedly part of their reasoning. If I cant read the difference between a 8.9 and a 9.0 consistently, the difference is not there and is only different nominally(meaning there is no real difference).
I can create any numbering system I want, but if it shows inconsistency from people who use it then what's the point. It doesn't matter what my intentions are, all that matters is the results of said system and I dont see anything that properly indicated a real difference fractionally.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
It is also an issue of integrity. Maybe joe should have just apologized and took the 30 seconds to rectify the situation rather than pushing back.
I think it is simple, if he made a mistake he should at least take some simple steps to rectify the situation. Instead he chose another path.
Vincent Alexander
Member
In the end, it is just a dumbass scoring system. If the whole number is truly the only important part, then they need to chop that .9 shit off.
I thought you were going to say cboat. What happened to mort?
Wait. You come in here and post all this and you don't even share a link?! This is a worse offense than this manbaby twitter fight! =(
=)
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=106121033&postcount=1393
Boom.
Trickster
Member
IGN dude is overeacting imo. But on the other hand. Angry Joe is fucking terrible, he's one of those youtube personalities that I just don't get how people want to watch. He's extremely unlikable in his videoes. And apparently also acts like a 14 year old in twitter arguments.
faceless007
Member
OK, so you're criticizing the use of the decimal system inherently. I don't really disagree (or rather, don't really care). Nevertheless, that argument is orthogonal to the argument that if one is going to criticize a score they gave, one should do so accurately. The number doesn't even matter to this point; some sites just use descriptors like "Buy" "Rent" or "Pass" instead of numbers, and I'm sure you would agree that it would be dishonest for someone to criticize a review for saying "Buy" when the review actually said "Rent". This is effectively the same thing because IGN's numbers translate directly to textual labels and they spell this out.
Boom indeed. I remember avoiding that thread. Now I see what I missed out on but speculating on why people left a company can get irritating really quick. Thank you.
He's in-depth. If you can't tolerate his antics you are missing out on some very thorough reviews.
NobleGundam
Banned
0.1% is a cruel number.