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[Tinfoilhatsron]

Why the hell Micheal Bay is in this particular discussion?

The only one invoking his name is you without much context or argument.

Well you caught me. (I dislike Transformers 3) I bought it up because the movies are IMO racist, sexist, and homophpbic and use sterotypes. I understand that its not fully prevalent to gaming and more OT than I thought. Sorry, Its been a long day and I'm not being clear then it is my fault.

 

[Orayn]

But but ... isn't the baddie (Mr Pink) supposed to be defeated so the minority (captured native) rises from the ashes to claim his rightful throne yadda yadda yadda ?

So justice's journey dressed in the guise of racism as a precursor to the Far Cry 4 adventure, (or something), no?

Spoiler

I'm reading too far into how people have read too far into this ... seesh

One potential problem with this kind of plot is that it often depicts the natives as unable to rescue themselves and needing a white guy to do all the work himself or at least lead them.

And no, that's not reading to far into things at all. It's a fairly common type of story with some unsettling racist undertones. People don't like to talk about it because "IT'S JUST A GAME/MOVIE/BOOK, STOP THINKING ABOUT IT!" but the implications are still there and kind of troubling.

 

[Nokagi]

If that's the villain or protagonist, I'm down either way. I hope he's rul cray.

Yep. Hope he's as cool as Vaas was in Far Cry 3. That guy was fucking awesome.

 

[Zeyphersan]

One potential problem with this kind of plot is that it often depicts the natives as unable to rescue themselves and needing a white guy to do all the work himself or at least lead them.

And no, that's not reading to far into things at all. It's a fairly common type of story with some unsettling racist undertones. People don't like to talk about it because "IT'S JUST A GAME/MOVIE/BOOK, STOP THINKING ABOUT IT!" but the implications are still there and kind of troubling.

The "helpless native/strong white outsider" trope is unfortunately a very common one, and a troubling one if you ask most people (myself included)/ The Far Cry series is definitely no stranger to it, so hopefully this game can buck that.

 

[Loxley]

Well this is certainly one of the weirder threads the gaming side has had in a while.

I can't even tell if any of the two characters are supposed to be White or something else.

Villain Guy looks somewhat Asian to me but with pale skin.
Victim Guy looks like he has the same skin color I do when I have a tan. And I am White.

Yep.

 

[spwolf]

LGBT people have classically been antagonists and villains in different things for a long time. Not always overtly, because of censors and stuff. There's probably nothing inherently wrong with it, except for ignoring the context of why people like that have been placed as roles as villains (much like how there were lots of German, Japanese, and Russian villains in stuff throughout the 20th century).

we are talking about gaming here, right?

 

[stang6604]

you realize this is a game right?? who freaking cares

 

[Dennis]

I like the part where OP tries to bolster his argument with random douchenozzles from Twitter.

 

[The Grim Heaper]

These threads have to be satire at this point. This, "western lollies", and Mario Kart being racist all in one day.

I swear the world is going mad. In 50 years time, we will be walking around like zombies scared to look or talk to each other incase we might say something that offends someone.

This is so true and it hurts me that it's going to definitely happen

 

[PixyJunket]

I bought it up because the movies are IMO racist, sexist, and homophpbic and use sterotypes.

I've never seen a better combination of user name and post.

 

[Haunted]

Same writer as Far Cry 3?

That RPS phone interview with him was one of the most surreal developer interviews I've read in a while.

 

[Brutalitops]

Surprised no one posted this yet:

http://www.gamestop.com/xbox-360/games/far-cry-4/115113#bonusFeatures

Look at the suggestive way he is holding that.

I bet he's gay.

Why are gay people being depicted as being careless with guns?

 

[MHWilliams]

Minimum is one word. Basest is another. Because what can be communicated through a single image is limited, what one should infer from it should be limited. Box arts are not for the NeoGAF demographic. They are for a demographic largely not sympathetic to OP's reservation.

What could you infer from this? America, fuck yea. Shoot the (brown) people maybe, and get the 10/10 girl. Ugh. How offensive and stereotypical. Sure the game was not a success in the end, but that interpretation (totally valid from the still image) is inaccurate. Why? Because the game exists.

But box arts are sometimes like movie trailers. The directors don't always have input. The exist as a disparate entity but can be considered fair game in a holistic analysis. But that can only be done after.

Judging the image early on gives you one impression, it's own context. And there's a different context taken with every subsequent trailer, gameplay video, and the final product. Ultimately, the image did not convey the game correctly.

So, the question then becomes why? Because they were aiming for mainstream demographics and that's what they thought that group would like. Discussion about that is perfectly normal. You can dislike the image and what it represents, and your criticism of that image can be perfectly valid. "This trailer or image evokes this." does not preclude "This image does not represent the final product." Merely, this is what the publisher intends to represent the final product.

You see this thread, you see the Mario Kart thread, and some people still believe political correctness isn't a cancer?

Yep. Otherwise, I'd also believe that everyone is dicks because the internet. That's certainly not the case, and I tend to not let poor actions taint the entire pool.

 

[reggie]

I swear the world is going mad. In 50 years time, we will be walking around like zombies scared to look or talk to each other incase we might say something that offends someone.

2050, ladies and gents;

 

[OldKingDoran]

I don't really have much else to say on the subject. I think I've made it pretty clear how I feel about it. A bunch of hypotheticals and arguing if people are walking stereotypes that should be represented aren't furthering anything. I've replied to enough people to get my point of view across.

Amazing thread

 

[RoboPlato]

I really hope the antagonist isn't gay so all the people saying he looks it have to take a long, hard look at who the offensive ones actually are.

 

[Barkley's Justice]

There's still the Gaf thread calling people "Cupcake"

 

[kittenbreath]

I like the part where OP tries to bolster his argument with random douchenozzles from Twitter.

The OP has a PhD candidate on his side. Your opinion is invalid.

 

[Brutalitops]

I really hope the antagonist isn't gay so all the people saying he looks it have to take a long, hard look at who the offensive ones actually are.

It's not offensive to think someone is gay. It's offensive to ridicule them for it.

 

[MxBxM]

People just like to feel offended and act as victims all the time for whatever reason. Reminds me of the people complaining about Resident Evil 5 having black zombies in Africa.

 

[KillerIsJed]

It's all part of the professional victim routine. Make over the top statements regarding something -> receive criticism -> call everyone who criticizes you racists/homophobes/what have you.

I'm not calling anyone who criticizes me anything. All I'm referencing is the people tweeting at myself and the people I've quoted calling us racist and homophobic slurs.

"stererotypes" are bad when they have nothing to do with reality and/or are used to discriminate.

Stereotypes are always bad. Positive stereotypes (and stereotypes in general) set expectations, for the people who believe in them, based on things that aren't directly related to other things, such as race.

If you'd like to read more about why ALL stereotypes are bad click here.

 

[Dr.Bergenstein]

These threads have to be satire at this point. This, "western lollies", and Mario Kart being racist all in one day.


This is so true and it hurts me that it's going to definitely happen

Mario Kart.....ra...racist?!

WTF?

 

[nateeasy]

2050, ladies and gents;

2014 if the OP gets his way.

 

[RetroStu]

People just like to feel offended and act as victims all the time for whatever reason. Reminds me of the people complaining about Resident Evil 5 having black zombies in Africa.

You're kidding me right?, jesus christ.

 

[Apathy]

One potential problem with this kind of plot is that it often depicts the natives as unable to rescue themselves and needing a white guy to do all the work himself or at least lead them.

And no, that's not reading to far into things at all. It's a fairly common type of story with some unsettling racist undertones. People don't like to talk about it because "IT'S JUST A GAME/MOVIE/BOOK, STOP THINKING ABOUT IT!" but the implications are still there and kind of troubling.

I agree with this, hell Far Cry 3 was this all over, but we still don't know anything about this games protagonist (who probably is white but lets see some more info before we jump to that conclusion). http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey

While sticking to those tropes is more laziness or just bad storytelling, we do live in a era where people are a bit too sensitive to some of these issues, specifically white guilt. As a non white person I hate white guilt and hate the people that keep bringing it up. A work of fiction is just that, fiction, let it be. If there really is a reason to be offended the people that it will offend will speak up. Specifically in this case with the OP, if this villain comes out as being gay, and evil and a terrible stereotype, the proper people will get offended, but there is no point in getting offended beforehand. Similarly if the story does a terrible job with issues of race then the appropriate people will get offended and they won't need the help of others to understand why they should be offended.

 

[Gurrry]

Overblown.

Thats all.

 

[MetroidPrimeRib]

You're kidding me right?, jesus christ.

It was a pretty big deal leading up to the game coming out.
It was more about a white man coming into Africa and killing a whole bunch of Africans. But the RE5 racism argument is years old now, no point prodding it again.

 

[Zeyphersan]

You see this thread, you see the Mario Kart thread, and some people still believe political correctness isn't a cancer?

It's possible to think both topics are silly but ALSO not think that political correctness is a cancer

 

[LegoArmo]

Huge parts of history, and present day are racist, or homophobic, if a video game chooses to depict that, I don't see an issue.

I can't really take much from a box art though.

 

[spwolf]

One potential problem with this kind of plot is that it often depicts the natives as unable to rescue themselves and needing a white guy to do all the work himself or at least lead them.

And no, that's not reading to far into things at all. It's a fairly common type of story with some unsettling racist undertones. People don't like to talk about it because "IT'S JUST A GAME/MOVIE/BOOK, STOP THINKING ABOUT IT!" but the implications are still there and kind of troubling.

so you are saying that every action movie or book that had main character come and rescue people of different race is borderline racist because it suggests that those people are weak and cant defend themselves?

You just blew my mind... 99% of the books and movies are now racist in my eyes.
How will I be able to read anything anymore? If it is not the race, then it would be gender, sexuality, ethnicity or any of hundreds of possible reasons for someone to get offended.

How will I watch any standup show?

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

I've never seen a better combination of user name and post.

Thanks .
Might I ask why? Though now it moves way into OT territory, I would appreciate if we could continue this in PMs ya know?

 

[Imbarkus]

Far Fall. Sky Cry.
Am confuse

 

[RoboPlato]

It's not offensive to think someone is gay. It's offensive to ridicule them for it.

I guess it's because I work in a high school but I've never heard "He looks gay" used as a compliment.

 

[zkylon]

hmm too early to judge tho i'd say it does give the vibe, it's in general a pretty cruel image no matter what you dress these people as so it's bound to provoke strong reactions

knowing gaming i bet this will be a trainwreck, i really hope i'm wrong as having a genuinely cool evil gay character sounds great

 

[Dragon]

It's not offensive to think someone is gay. It's offensive to ridicule them for it.

I'd argue that assuming someone is gay because of how they dress is offensive.

 

[TatteredHat]

I'm not calling anyone who criticizes me anything. All I'm referencing is the people tweeting at myself and the people I've quoted calling us racist and homophobic slurs.

In that case, I apologise. There is no need for that, but the edit sort of implies that you were addressing people on this forum.

Aside from that though, this character could be the best written gay character ever and I think it's premature to dismiss him because of the way he sits or dresses.

 

[spwolf]

2014 if the OP gets his way.

this kind of remind me of those movies where in "near future" we would live in police-state and everyone would look, act, and behave same or else.......

 

[DarkFlow]

I'm not calling anyone who criticizes me anything. All I'm referencing is the people tweeting at myself and the people I've quoted calling us racist and homophobic slurs.



Stereotypes are always bad. Positive stereotypes (and stereotypes in general) set expectations, for the people who believe in them, based on things that aren't directly related to other things, such as race.

If you'd like to read more about why ALL stereotypes are bad click here.

So you think the people you quoted saying "ignorant white people" and "you can't be racist to white people" is grounds for calling us all "disgusting" when people call them out on that is A OK?

 

[cpp_is_king]

I guess it's because I work in a high school but I've never heard "He looks gay" used as a compliment.

Statements can be neither compliments nor insults.

 

[nateeasy]

I'd argue that assuming someone is gay because of how they dress is offensive.

Which is what the OP did.

 

[PixyJunket]

Thanks .
Might I ask why? Though now it moves way into OT territory, I would appreciate if we could continue this in PMs ya know?

You called a comic book movie about toy robots and explosions racist, sexist and homophobic.

And no, I will not continue via PM (or here) because I know how discussions on this subject with people who throw those terms around like so many pennies always end up, and I'm not having it.

 

[Orayn]

The "helpless native/strong white outsider" trope is unfortunately a very common one, and a troubling one if you ask most people (myself included)/ The Far Cry series is definitely no stranger to it, so hopefully this game can buck that.

Far Cry 3 seemed like it was trying to criticize the "Mighty Whitey" trope by turning around and depicting both Vaas and the player as bad people, but it still had the mostly powerless natives. And then there's Dennis and Citra...

At least they set it on a fictional island. Pulling this kind of plot in a real world location is asking for even more trouble.

 

[KillerIsJed]

I like the part where OP tries to bolster his argument with random douchenozzles from Twitter.

Oddly enough, I've never said this was racist, other people have. I was just showing other people's opinions on the subject. 9 times out of 10 if someone who isn't white says something is racist, it probably is.

 

[Castle Doctrine]

Finally an edgy and interesting box art and they're gonna ruin that too.

 

[RetroStu]

One potential problem with this kind of plot is that it often depicts the natives as unable to rescue themselves and needing a white guy to do all the work himself or at least lead them.

.

I dissagree with that. Its more the fact that an 'outsider' comes in and changes things, it happens because someone comes who isn't used to whatever is going on and mixes it up a bit.
I never view movies or games like this and think its the developers/producers trying to have a white man come in and save anyone. Having said that, i never pick up on these things in the first place because i'm not looking at being offended in the first place.

 

[scoobidoo112]

I'm not calling anyone who criticizes me anything. All I'm referencing is the people tweeting at myself and the people I've quoted calling us racist and homophobic slurs.



Stereotypes are always bad. Positive stereotypes (and stereotypes in general) set expectations, for the people who believe in them, based on things that aren't directly related to other things, such as race.

If you'd like to read more about why ALL stereotypes are bad click here.

If you'd like to read more about why you are consistently wrong, click here

 

[baconcow]

The OP seems to be nothing more then bait for controversial discussion. Ironic that the OP has an edit calling out the people who were drawn into what was clearly the intention of this topic. I don't see racism in the boxart any more than several other games. How is this boxart any different than Far Cry 3, other than swapping races?

 

[RoboPlato]

Statements can be neither compliments nor insults.

Offensive was probably the wrong word but the stereotyping and getting upset about it without any confirmation or evidence would just make for a very funny eating of crow.

 

[ZehDon]

I woke up, read through this thread, and feel I should just go back to bed and try again tomorrow. This thread is something else.

I think the box cover looks pretty cool, frankly. It's distressing to me that so much has been taken from a single picture, when all I took away from it was "Hey, he looks like an interesting character. Maybe I'll buy the game." Looks like a coked-up Julian Assange, for lack of a better comparison, and I'd like to know more. That's what great and memorable character design is all about.

But, ya know, this box art could also be the herald of the anti-Christ, I guess.

 

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

I just hope he's close to the level of Vaas.