Support NeoGAF

[Unknown Soldier]

Not so hot how? Don't know if you will have better results with a smaller screen unless the problem you are having is that the lower resolutions just look bad when made really big, what with making the jaggies more noticeable. It's good that you aren't thinking CRT since its not the best for either system. There is a small number of games that run on 240p on ps2, but the vast majority go for 480i+.

The PS2, GC, and Wii are best viewed on CRTs. If you're one of those people who actually had a CRT HDTV that supported 480p, you're living the good life. Otherwise 480i looks best on a CRT, the amount of deinterlacing and scaling work that needs to be done to show those consoles on modern flat-panel HDTVs tends to make them look like hash and also introduces a great deal of input lag.

The OG Xbox and Dreamcast had an official VGA cable so that's your best bet for those systems.

 

[HTupolev]

It's good that you aren't thinking CRT since its not the best for either system. There is a small number of games that run on 240p on ps2, but the vast majority go for 480i+.

??? A 480i game would be an excellent match for an SD CRT.

480p is trickier. If you can hook up a 480p CRT, rock on. But a flat panel will usually imply upscaling and input lag, and sometimes also poor static contrast (LCDs), and the result will occasionally IMO be quite inferior to just accepting the interlacing on an SD CRT. Depends on the game and the flat panel in question, though. I don't have a huge amount of sixth-gen stuff, but I usually like having my original Xbox hooked up to my SD CRT.

 

[theSlacker]

A CRT capable of 480p would actually be the best option. And all CRT's are 480i. Infact 240p just fills the 480i screen with every other line being left blank (scanlines).

KyleFedora was asking for something instead of a CRT. I still wouldn't suggest a CRT for PS2 games even if that was on the table since there is a large amount of games that support widescreen as well as 480p. But of course I didn't even think of going 480p CRT since I am so tied to RGB on my CRTs, so you are right, getting a 480p capable CRT would be an option if Kyle wanted to go that route.

Edit: And I now see that I put 480i at the end of my last post instead of 480p. My mistake.
Edit again: And now after making sure to check it seems I was talking out my ass about a "vast majority" even if I did add the p onto that. My double mistake.

 

[Zing]

Also screw sitting on the floor...my legs fall asleep really fast doing that.

I sit on a "Sumo Gamer" bean bag.

As for size, when acquiring my ultimate CRT, I specifically sought out the 27", as I feel it is a good compromise. Plus, it can be moved up and down stairs with only two weak people.

 

[New002]

Not sure about a 60s set, but I have one of these from my childhood still out in my garage today, and it happens to be the very set that I used for NES and C-64 gaming back then. Originally bought it in either 85 or 86:

http://visualalchemy.tv/catalog/13in-and-under-crt-consumer-tvs/13in-sony-kv-1397r/

Friggen thing still works perfect too. It will not die. Though back in the day I did put old unshielded speakers next to it and caused one of the corners to turn a slight green.

I know this post I'm quoting is 3 years old, but I just saw it and it brought back memories because I had this exact same TV growing up.

 

[sixteen-bit]

I know this post I'm quoting is 3 years old, but I just saw it and it brought back memories because I had this exact same TV growing up.

What a handsome looking TV

 

[New002]

What a handsome looking TV

It got all the systems.

 

[Polioliolio]

That's really weird. The game definitely has piracy protection, but I've never heard of region protection on a sufami game. What exactly is the message that comes up?

Are you using a PAL SNES? Some electrical modding is needed to get rid of the lockouts if you're crossing into PAL regions. I wasn't aware of any regioning issues between NTSC regions.

Though, reading up, the game does actually have copy protection routines besides the lockout chip described here.

Although it didn't yield any dirt, I gave it a thorough swabbing, and did the ol' gym card into the cartridge slot w/ an old tshirt method for the system.

I guess because it has the extra protection, it's more sensitive than most games. Maybe a tiny fuzz or particle of some kind was in the way.. After that quick cleaning, the problem didn't appear again.

 

[baphomet]

The PS2, GC, and Wii are best viewed on CRTs. If you're one of those people who actually had a CRT HDTV that supported 480p, you're living the good life. Otherwise 480i looks best on a CRT, the amount of deinterlacing and scaling work that needs to be done to show those consoles on modern flat-panel HDTVs tends to make them look like hash and also introduces a great deal of input lag.

The OG Xbox and Dreamcast had an official VGA cable so that's your best bet for those systems.

The Xbox doesn't have a VGA cable. Its tops out at component.

 

[KyleCross]

I had found a nice CRT (probably about a 20 inch) by the dumpster at my old complex about 2 years ago. I took it home and it still worked... but it only had a coax input. That's it. Didn't even have composite. I guess I should look at Goodwill's more often.

 

[BubbaMc]

I still wouldn't suggest a CRT for PS2 games even if that was on the table since there is a large amount of games that support widescreen as well as 480p.

Anamorphic widescreen though, which generally looks horrible.

The best display for a PS2 is a 4:3 CRT that supports 240p, 480i and 480p (the latter requires component input).

Fuck Sony for not making 480p a standard like Sega did with the Dreamcast. Playing games that are 480i only is just depressing.

Wii looks phenomenal through a 480p CRT.

 

[Borman]

The Xbox doesn't have a VGA cable. Its tops out at component.

But it can be modded for proper VGA output.

 

[Fattony12000]

.

 

[NinjaCatfish]

We got a Bang & Olufsen BeoVision 32 inch...

For free!

It's pretty good. It even came with the motorised base thing that swivels the entire TV around. The remote is also as sick as heck.

That thing looks mad cool!

 

[Fattony12000]

.

 

[sixteen-bit]

interesting Danish design

 

[Ramune]

Asked this in the general RGB done right thread, but it got buried, so maybe this would be the more appropriate place.

I have my brightness and contrast on medium (value 50) and on the Genesis, I notice slight edge noise (or whatever this is called). Is this normal and any suggestions to help fix it? Picture is awesome, but I'd love to have it look even better if possible!

Edit:I'll have to fix the links when I get home. @_@

Saturn version for reference:

 

[lostinblue]

^ Images don't work for me.

 

[Peagles]

Asked this in the general RGB done right thread, but it got buried, so maybe this would be the more appropriate place.

I have my brightness and contrast on medium (value 50) and on the Genesis, I notice slight edge noise (or whatever this is called). Is this normal and any suggestions to help fix it? Picture is awesome, but I'd love to have it look even better if possible!

You should include some details about what type of equipment you're using (display type, etc), so we know where to start. Also is it limited to the Genesis? What model Genesis? Where did you source your RGB cables? Stuff like that. Then we can narrow it down a bit.

Here's the pictures, hope they work. Could be a convergence issue?

 

[Ramune]

You should include some details about what type of equipment you're using (display type, etc), so we know where to start. Also is it limited to the Genesis? What model Genesis? Where did you source your RGB cables? Stuff like that. Then we can narrow it down a bit.

Here's the pictures, hope they work. Could be a convergence issue?

Thanks alot Peagles! Im out of a computer atm, so I have to make due with a dinky tablet and "smart"phone, so linking pics is going to be interesting.

Ok so equipment is:
Olympus OEV203 (rebranded Sony PVM-20M2MDU)
Genesis 1/Master System RGB Scart cable from retro_console_accessories
Genesis model 1 Non-HD system (but good sound model)
And a SCART - BNC cable

Just hooked up my Saturn:
Model 2
JP21 official Sega Saturn RGB cable
JP21 - SCART conversion connector from retro_gaming_cables

And booted up Sonic Jam, and Sonic 1 and there is no double image. Quite clean actually!

https://db.tt/XpwectRG
https://db.tt/uiD9OaWs

The Genesis is the only system that creates such bloom.

 

[Prez]

I'm thinking of getting a cheap used CRT TV for Wii gaming. I currently have a 4:3 50Hz 480i Sony Trinitron. Is getting a widescreen 100Hz CRT worth it? One thing though, is there any way I could get an idea of the approximate age of TVs I see for sale? Most people don't mention the model.

 

[Zing]

I'm thinking of getting a cheap used CRT TV for Wii gaming. I currently have a 4:3 50Hz 480i Sony Trinitron. Is getting a widescreen 100Hz CRT worth it? One thing though, is there any way I could get an idea of the approximate age of TVs I see for sale? Most people don't mention the model.

What's wrong with your existing TV? A Trinitron 4:3 is ideal.

For Wii games, widescreen is anamorphic, so you aren't seeing any more detail in 16:9 than in 4:3*.

*however some games are actually rendered in 16:9 and scaled to 4:3, so 16:9 does have some advantage (Xenoblade, Skyward Sword)

 

[Prez]

What's wrong with your existing TV? A Trinitron 4:3 is ideal.

For Wii games, widescreen is anamorphic, so you aren't seeing any more detail in 16:9 than in 4:3*.

*however some games are actually rendered in 16:9 and scaled to 4:3, so 16:9 does have some advantage (Xenoblade, Skyward Sword)

Aren't games like Super Mario Galaxy and DKC Returns 16:9 as well? Also RE4 Wii should look better on widescreen, no? The black bars should still be there but the actual game image is pretty small on my small 4:3 screen. Then of course there's the advantage of 480p with component cables which my current TV doesn't support.

 

[Zing]

Nope. Those games are just anamorphic. Every first party game I mentioned that supports 16:9 is just 4:3 anamorphic (except the two I mentioned). This means you are shown the same resolution, just with rectangular pixels. Also, due to the ratio change, they simply crop off the top and bottom, not add more content to the sides. They are still worth playing in 16:9, and Nintendo does a nice job of arranging the UI elements so they fit well on both 4:3 and 16:9 displays, but you aren't missing anything in 4:3.

In fact there is a bit of image quality degradation and artifacting due to the anamorphic render. It's noticable mostly in vertical lines or moire patterns. I did a lot of testing on this, as I was putting effort into deciding which ratio was best. The only thing that made me convert was Skyward Sword.

 

[Prez]

Nope. Those games are just anamorphic. Every first party game I mentioned that supports 16:9 is just 4:3 anamorphic (except the two I mentioned). This means you are shown the same resolution, just with rectangular pixels. Also, due to the ratio change, they simply crop off the top and bottom, not add more content to the sides. They are still worth playing in 16:9, and Nintendo does a nice job of arranging the UI elements so they fit well on both 4:3 and 16:9 displays, but you aren't missing anything in 4:3.

In fact there is a bit of image quality degradation and artifacting due to the anamorphic render. It's noticable mostly in vertical lines or moire patterns. I did a lot of testing on this, as I was putting effort into deciding which ratio was best. The only thing that made me convert was Skyward Sword.

Thanks for the clarification. Would it still be worth upgrading to a bigger 4:3 TV with 480p support? My current TV is 20". I haven't seen a single Trinitron TV with component inputs yet though.

edit: apparently in Europe there were very few CRT TVs with component inputs...

 

[Idempotent Button]

Panasonic Superflat all the way.

 

[m_dorian]

Subjective but any of last Philips Matchline would be ok for the job. I sold plenty of them during their time and made quite a few happy customers.

 

[Zing]

Wouldn't Europe just have SCART? Isn't it superior and supported by the Wii?

 

[Prez]

Wouldn't Europe just have SCART? Isn't it superior and supported by the Wii?

SCART is 480i max, you need component for 480p. I'm reading up on it though and it seems that only HD CRTs support 480p. I'm still using a composite cable on my Wii though, I should get an RGB cable for a much better image but it's hard to find nowadays.

 

[Zing]

Yeah, composite is not so hot. I used component 480i. Progressive isn't a deal breaker.

 

[NormalFish]

So I've been asking around a bit, figure I'd try this thread, too.

I'm looking to play PS1, PS2, and GC/Wii games on a CRT. What am I looking for? I understand which brands are good and I understand that I want component. What I don't understand is if a TV that displays 480p is going to be necessary as opposed to 480i, and I'm not sure how to figure out which models support which resolutions outside of just googling and hoping someone else got an answer.

 

[JLynn]

Me and my girl was at a thrift store to get a sewing table. She couldn't find any she liked but she caught me checking the backs of many CRT TV sets. She tapped my shoulder going "Is that a Sony?" I zoomed to towards the small TV. Check the back and saw no S-video however I saw component. She encourage me to get it and I was reluctant considering the lack of space we have in our apartment. To make a long story short I got an early birthday present: a KV-20FS100.

I love my girlfriend.

 

[Zing]

Yeah, the smaller size Sony sets don't have svideo. I guess it was already marginally useful at that time (~2005), so they cut it out to save space and money. The larger FS100 has svideo.

 

[JLynn]

Yeah, the smaller size Sony sets don't have svideo. I guess it was already marginally useful at that time (~2005), so they cut it out to save space and money. The larger FS100 has svideo.

I see. It would have been nice to have an svideo connection but it's not life or death for me.

Crazy thing is we went to another thrift shop and saw a Toshiba 20af42 that does have svideo but I kept the Sony. It's an awesome TV set.

 

[tagrat]

I see. It would have been nice to have an svideo connection but it's not life or death for me.

Crazy thing is we went to another thrift shop and saw a Toshiba 20af42 that does have svideo but I kept the Sony. It's an awesome TV set.

I have that Toshiba. Bought it back in high school when it first came out. Pretty great little set. Mine has taken a few dings through many moves, but overall still is a champ. I need to work on getting some RGB to component going on it.

 

[JLynn]

I have that Toshiba. Bought it back in high school when it first came out. Pretty great little set. Mine has taken a few dings through many moves, but overall still is a champ. I need to work on getting some RGB to component going on it.

I'm trying to do the same thing with my Sony. I know I need to buy a converter.

 

[MasterOfPuppets]

Does anyone have an EDTV they can recommend?

 

[NIGHT-]

Someone is selling this on Facebook. She says it's a Sony trinitron but can't give many more details. Worth $40?

 

[NormalFish]

Someone is selling this on Facebook. She says it's a Sony trinitron but can't give many more details. Worth $40?

I'd ask for a picture of the back (where the inputs and such are) before buying. Don't think I'd buy any TV without a picture like that.

 

[JLynn]

That looks like a 21st century made trinitron (similar to mine). More than likely it'll have component. Ask her for the screen size as well.

 

[GayForMaster]

SONY PVM/BVM OR BUST

 

[Chaotic-Strike]

I got tired of waiting for Nintendo to release the SNES Yoshi's Island on VC and pulled out my old SNES that's going over 20 now.

I'm surprised it still works; unfortunately the one CRT that I still have doesn't have component on the back or S-Video for that matter so I'm going to look around Craig's list for one.

From what I'm reading in this thread Sony Trinitron's are the way to go.

Correct?

 

[sixteen-bit]

I got tired of waiting for Nintendo to release the SNES Yoshi's Island on VC and pulled out my old SNES that's going over 20 now.

I'm surprised it still works; unfortunately the one CRT that I still have doesn't have component on the back or S-Video for that matter so I'm going to look around Craig's list for one.

From what I'm reading in this thread Sony Trinitron's are the way to go.

Correct?

they are good tvs and relatively easy to find, yeah

 

[Zing]

Someone is selling this on Facebook. She says it's a Sony trinitron but can't give many more details. Worth $40?

It's a FS100. Highly recommended. It will have one component and svideo.

 

[Chaotic-Strike]

I went into a couple of different thrift stores with no luck, and the last one had a Sony Trinitron..... that had already been sold just sitting out on the side taunting me.

I am so salty, and I guess I have to go with the runner up a flat screen Apex.

 

[JLynn]

If you can't find a Sony, go with Toshiba and Panasonic. They also made great quality TV sets.

 

[Chaotic-Strike]

If you can't find a Sony, go with Toshiba and Panasonic. They also made great quality TV sets.

Alright thanks for the tip I haven't committed on one just yet but the Apex was the one I was eyeing.

It's hard to find a CRT with a s-video slot for a cheap price.

 

[Chaotic-Strike]

Sorry for the double post but I need to know which would be a better pick.

Dynex DX-R20TV (tube) or Sanyo DS20930(Flat Screen)?

 

[SphericalCrusher]

Speak of the devil. a 48" Sony Trinitron TV showed up at my office work. I can take it home but my wife would kill me... I hate to see it tossed though!

 

[Valonquar]

Sony Trinitons for sure. HOWEVER... you will need at least two strong people who will not be your friends any longer if you ask them to help you move one. When I got rid of my 36" triniton, I told my bud he could have it for free... IF I did not have to move it myself.