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[tuna_love]

I think the problems people have with the story is the most baffling to me, and I wonder if there had been significant content there if people would even complain at all? Like, is the sore spot that you'd didn't play for that terribly long and thus you should get to play these other threads?

Yes some things are left hanging in the overarching world, but I don't see how that means the story is unfinished. The story was one of Gallahad and his realization that the order wasn't what he thought it was, and how he came to leave it. He goes through complete arc in the game. The moment the game ends is the moment it needed to for that story.

Yes you don't know where the lycans came from or what ultimately happens to the rebellion, etc, but you don't know that shit in a lot of stories. You don't really know where the infection comes from in The Last of Us. You don't know what happens to Joel and Ellie. You don't know what happens to some of the groups you interact with in the world. But that works, because that was a character story, and so is this. In a character story you just want to solve a specific arc with that character. With this we saw Gallahad go from trusted company man to skeptic to outright rebel. He found the corrupt person in The Order and killed him, and that punctuated his end with the group and as a knight. I'm not going to pretend it's anywhere near as good as TLOU, but I think that still stands.

When I heard people were pissed at the ending I guess I was expecting Final Fantasy XIII-2 levels of GODDAMMIT. I got to the end and was just confused. I liked the arc.

I don't care about the ending I just thought the whole story was pretty shit.

 

[Oersted]

My one problem with his review is he complains about how the story felt unfinished and was too busy setting up a sequel, but don't A LOT of games attempting to establish a franchise do this?

Halo did it, Mass Effect did it, Gears of War did it, etc.

Not fair to complain when those games got a pass. The game definitely has flaws, but that one could be tied to dozens of major releases over the last number of years.

Did he give those games a pass in the way you describe it?

 

[Reallink]

No I'm not mixing it up marketing and design(because I didn't even pay attention to the marketing). The Order is much of a cover based shooter as Gears in terms of it being a 3rd person shooter; its just how they approached the game was very different. The thing is a good portion of your time IS shooting people and going to places while shooting people with a lot of interactive\cutscense in between. Of course the game wasn't designed as Gears or I can guess the intention wasn't, but so wasn't billions of other 3rd person shooters. The game was designed to play as a 3rd person shooter so it will get criticized as one. Its just different to other shooters because it uses tons more OTEs, walking segments( which gears had a lot of too), and cutscenes than normally.

Gone Home and Heavy Rain is very different in such a way that to some people they barely video games , but how they make the player engage with the story and the game itself makes it vastly different then how the Order approach things. One game is straight mostly interactive cutscenes with heavy amount of choice and very little control of the character. The other other have lots of exploring and very little or no cutscense. The games are heavily story-based but so is many of the other games( sometimes linear) that got tons of praise.

I guess it's really a matter of semantics and opinion. Can you really say something is "X" (a cover shooter) when X actually comprises the minority of the experience? Personally, I say no. To me the game is an interactive movie, not a shooter. The shooter components are an afterthought existing solely for variety--to break up the monotony of the narrative, not to define product. I guess maybe you have to actually play a large portion of the game to understand that, but the "shooting gameplay" is a shockingly minor component (completely contrary to how the marketing has tried to represent it). My sense after finishing the game is that I only spent about 25% of my total play time shooting the 50 or so enemies who comprise the entirety of the game, that's how minor a component it feels like. Now I didn't count my time or the enemies, but that's how it felt to me. Admittedly I spent a lot of time gawking at and exploring the environments, so my sense may be tilted compared to others.

 

[Supermanisdead]

To be honest, arguing about something you have no idea about is pretty immature behaviour. But I was expecting it from the beginning so I won't pretend I'm surprised. Here's a video of me running around just to show that attacks happen in various places and from different directions, just like in that DS2 video. I'll leave it here against your "facts" which contradict it. Anybody can check my PSN profile to see that I finished this game, Dead Space or whatever. You go where you belong - to the ignore list, with other "Youtube gamers" who, ironically, value gameplay so much that they don't play games but watch them being played instead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFhu6AlXaVs

wtf this looks terrible

?????????

 

[Inuhanyou]

He's thoroughly unentertaining and unfunny.

If you're going to joke around about a game at least be as funny as Zero Punctuation (which I look forward to reviewing The Order, even though I liked the game!)

Joe's one of the coolest guys around, he works his ass off on his material. ZP and Total Biscut and eveyone else have their own shtick, maybe his reviews just arent for you instead of saying they are unfunny like you seem to suggest.

 

[twobear]

I have never seen a case where people try to convince everyone that a particular game is shit and those that like it simply like plates of shit. After taking the horse out behind the shed and putting it down why keep kicking it? Its already dead.

You wouldn't believe how many people came in and canceled their preorders saying "The game is all QTE and Cut scenes" or "I can beat it in 4 hours so why bother?" The media has done a real job on this game and its pretty sad to see. Also all of the comments in here (Without calling anyone out specifically.) "4/10 is justified" get the fuck out of here with that nonsense. So the Order is as bad as Alien colonial marines? Yea ok.

Edited to add

I had better not see another thread asking for a new Shenmue game.

It's happened a load of times over the last few months, with Destiny and Unity in particular (and TitanFall before that).

Why would you be surprised about people cancelling their preorder when reviews agree that the game is mediocre? That's a sign of being a healthy and sensible consumer—waiting for feedback before spending money.

To be honest, arguing about something you have no idea about is pretty immature behaviour. But I was expecting it from the beginning so I won't pretend I'm surprised. Here's a video of me running around just to show that attacks happen in various places and from different directions, just like in that DS2 video. I'll leave it here against your "facts" which contradict it. Anybody can check my PSN profile to see that I finished this game, Dead Space or whatever. You go where you belong - to the ignore list, with other "Youtube gamers" who, ironically, value gameplay so much that they don't play games but watch them being played instead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFhu6AlXaVs

I mean this video makes the game look basically like trash.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I don't know if you actually saw the ending to Gears of War dude.

They do sequel tease, but they do end it definitively by wiping out a portion of the locust horde while still saying there are some around. Same with 2 where they wipe out a majority of the horde and drown the city while setting up the lambent for 3. You can still have unresolved plot threads and questions without having the game feel like the end is cutting off the game halfway through. Jim also talked about it in his own review about how the game felt half finished narrative wise

 

[rosaceadude2112]

The lack of body movement is a bit weird. They just stand straight and talk with barely any movement and hardly any facial expressions.

It's bizarre isn't it? The "camera" work is nothing more functional, sticking mostly to medium shots and close ups and the editing is noticeably shoddy with those awkward fades that are supposed to signal the passage of time. I mean there are plenty of other, more intuitive ways of communicating exactly that. Off the top of my head, establish a single spot that any of the speakers inhabit when giving testimony. Choose an angle to show this spot. When someone is done speaking, keep that angle and make a clean cut to the next speaker. Bam, you have just depicted the passage of time in an effortless and clean manner that the audience interprets naturally.

And the whole game is plagued by the inclusion of the faux-victorian dialogue. It's a natural side effect of the setting, but it acts as another of the game's detriments here. In a period drama, like say Mr. Turner for a recent example, that style of dialogue can be really entertaining when the characters use it to attempt to insult or impress each other in these really roundabout ways. Another story might use it to emphasize the divide between upper class and lower class people, or use it's natural stuffiness to show how a character is uncomfortable with the pressures of their social strata or ANYTHING really. In the Order though, it really just highlights how little is being said by these characters. The attempts to make people talking about steampunk werewolves sound dignified ends up sounding ridiculous, especially when everyone still shouts REBEL DOWN I'M RELOADING OSCAR MIKE on their steam walkie talkies.

It's honestly hard to believe sometimes that storytelling was the main focus of this title.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

What was FeiRR trying to prove with that video? Because that's not good shilling if that's what he was doing. He made the game look TERRIBLE.

The Lycan encounters are already bad, but god he made them look like the worst thing ever created.

 

[Hubble]

I can't believe the audio logs collected in the game are told by a voice over in-menu. Who the hell would sit there in the menu for 3 minutes to hear it?

 

[Freshmaker]

DSP didn't think too highly of the Order either.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oTBvJYb0Yw

(Review starts at 7:30)

 

[T.O.P]

I can't believe the audio logs collected in the game are told by a voice over in-menu. Who the hell would sit there in the menu for 3 minutes to hear it?

Considering how many times the gameplay cuts to a (even small) cutscene or you're slowly walking with another character talking it would be really rare to finish a single audio log

 

[Rogue_Ledr]

OK I just watched the review in its entirety.

While, I feel the review was VERY harsh and he harped on certain criticisms too much, his points about the game were valid.

The Order:1886 is a weird game to critique in my mind, because there are so many design choices that seem malapropos and incongruous to the game's seeming tone and themes.

Its a game about an ancient order that fights monsters. Yet, 90% of the game is fighting humans.

It wants to be an intense 3rd person action titles, but incessantly throws extended, slow "walking" segments into the mix that interrupt the action.

I definitely have to agree with his assessment of QTE's. QTE's need to die in 2015. They are getting REALLY tiresome and it is even debatable if they count as "gameplay". I don't understand why RAD chose to feature them so heavily.

 

[boredandlazy]

Hasn't stopped you from posting 10+ posts in this thread. So why do care so much if you don't like him?

Why don't you say the same about people posting in regards to the game this thread is based on?
It's funny to look back at the Order review thread, where the most frequent posters were people who didn't own(and never intended to own) the game.

 

[Melchiah]

I can't believe the audio logs collected in the game are told by a voice over in-menu. Who the hell would sit there in the menu for 3 minutes to hear it?

I did. People are too impatient nowadays if that's a problem to them. While I would prefer them not to be tied to the menu, it could create issues if you listened to them during the gameplay, and stumbled onto a dialogue scene. In Bioshock I constantly ran into firefights when I was listening to the audio logs, and after a while I just stopped moving forward while listening to them.

 

[EatinOlives]

My one problem with his review is he complains about how the story felt unfinished and was too busy setting up a sequel, but don't A LOT of games attempting to establish a franchise do this?

Halo did it, Mass Effect did it, Gears of War did it, etc.

Not fair to complain when those games got a pass. The game definitely has flaws, but that one could be tied to dozens of major releases over the last number of years.

Well there's two things about that:

1) Story half-assing final acts to cop a "cliffhanger ending" is something a lot of games get criticized for. It's one of the main complaints of Bulletstorm and RAGE, because those games, like Order 1886, aren't billed as "trilogies" and don't have a guaranteed sequel. Setting up a story for a sequel when the sequel is nowhere near confirmed turns out stupid when the game never gets the sequel (e.g. Bulletstorm, RAGE). It was obvious Mass Effect was going to have its 2 sequels, so people didn't mind. This is absolutely NOT the first time people have complained about this.

2) Story-wise, you have to look at how these kinds of endings are written. You can have a well-thought-out story that ends with the plot still going but still manages to tie up some loose ends and be an "episode" of the larger picture of its own. People have more of a problem with these stories when they simply stop. I'm not saying that's necessarily what happened with Order 1886, but I'm saying this is how someone could arrive to the conclusion that they didn't like the ending of the game. It's not like they have something against stories that set up sequels, it really could just be about stories that set up sequels badly.

I did. People are too impatient nowadays if that's a problem to them. While I would prefer them not to be tied to the menu, it could create issues if you listened to them during the gameplay, and stumbled onto a dialogue scene. In Bioshock I constantly ran into firefights when I was listening to the audio logs, and after a while I just stopped moving forward while listening to them.

Yeah, this is why I don't really like audiologs in general. I typically read text logs much faster than the VA can read them, and I either have two options: standing around awkwardly listening in-game to the audio log because I don't want dialog and explosions to prevent me from hearing the log, or sitting in a menu listening and doing nothing while I listen to a super-slow DRAMATIQUE reading of text. Bioshock Infinite was terrible with its audiologs, because toward the end of the game they spammed a bunch of logs really close to each other, so you're running along the level and I stopped to listen to a log, then walked two steps to stop to listen to another, then walked two more steps again to listen.

 

[Rogue_Ledr]

I did. People are too impatient nowadays if that's a problem to them. While I would prefer them not to be tied to the menu, it could create issues if you listened to them during the gameplay, and stumbled onto a dialogue scene. In Bioshock I constantly ran into firefights when I was listening to the audio logs, and after a while I just stopped moving forward while listening to them.

That wouldn't be an issue here, because there is no combat during the "exploration" segments.

If you happened to run into a dialogue moment, they could just stop or pause the audio log.

 

[Melchiah]

That wouldn't be an issue here, because there is no combat during the "exploration" segments.

If you happened to run into a dialogue moment, they could just stop or pause the audio log.

Like TOP already said...

Considering how many times the gameplay cuts to a (even small) cutscene or you're slowly walking with another character talking it would be really rare to finish a single audio log

...I don't think it would work well that way. Hell, it didn't even work in Bioshock Infinite, where Elizabeth was constantly talking over the audio logs.


EDIT:

Yeah, this is why I don't really like audiologs in general. I typically read text logs much faster than the VA can read them, and I either have two options: standing around awkwardly listening in-game to the audio log because I don't want dialog and explosions to prevent me from hearing the log, or sitting in a menu listening and doing nothing while I listen to a super-slow DRAMATIQUE reading of text. Bioshock Infinite was terrible with its audiologs, because toward the end of the game they spammed a bunch of logs really close to each other, so you're running along the level and I stopped to listen to a log, then walked two steps to stop to listen to another, then walked two more steps again to listen.

I think they were implented pretty well in Killzone: Shadow Fall. They were generally shorter and less frequently found than those of Bioshock trilogy, and the fact the audio logs played through the DS4 speaker was a nice touch, which also helped them being more distinct from the background ambience.

 

[Allonym]

Omg that was amazing. I haven't played the game, yet in spite of all these negative to tepid reviews I'm still interested in at least "gameflying" the game and trying it out. I have to admit though that the review here is seriously hilarious. I died at the parts with the lamp, dickbutt, the lycanthropes repeating their A.I. routines, useless A.I. partners and the shotgunners.

 

[Shouta]

My one problem with his review is he complains about how the story felt unfinished and was too busy setting up a sequel, but don't A LOT of games attempting to establish a franchise do this?

Halo did it, Mass Effect did it, Gears of War did it, etc.

Not fair to complain when those games got a pass. The game definitely has flaws, but that one could be tied to dozens of major releases over the last number of years.

I don't remember GoW's story but Halo and ME have self-contained stories that have hooks for a sequel. I think the issue Joe brings up is where they cut the story at the knees to make for a sequel instead of telling a whole tale. I haven't played the Order, so i can't say but it seems like it's that case going by his review.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Although I had some entertainment with The Order, AJ is absolutely correct in every facet of his review.

Whatever random number I would assign to the game as opposed to him is meaningless, because the real review, what was said, I agree with 100%.

My only gripe with Joe's review is he went too far with the spoilers.

I hope RAD takes The Order's feedback seriously, because the potential is there in spades. And the Thermite and lightning guns are the baddest guns I've ever seen in a game.

 

[Prine]

To be honest, arguing about something you have no idea about is pretty immature behaviour. But I was expecting it from the beginning so I won't pretend I'm surprised. Here's a video of me running around just to show that attacks happen in various places and from different directions, just like in that DS2 video. I'll leave it here against your "facts" which contradict it. Anybody can check my PSN profile to see that I finished this game, Dead Space or whatever. You go where you belong - to the ignore list, with other "Youtube gamers" who, ironically, value gameplay so much that they don't play games but watch them being played instead.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFhu6AlXaVs

This is painful, youve turned your back on the lycan and assumed people would be fooled into thinking this is a varied display of intelligence ? The pattern is the same but you manufactured an artificial obstruction.

 

[Xplatformer]

Holy shit at that Lycan encounter he shows...holy fucking shit.

This. Because I love the graphics and the setting I can overlook most except for two things.

• The Lycans fight scenes were either too scripted or QTEs.
• The main character never spoke up to defend himself to the other members of the order.

 

[Melchiah]

I don't remember GoW's story but Halo and ME have self-contained stories that have hooks for a sequel. I think the issue Joe brings up is where they cut the story at the knees to make for a sequel instead of telling a whole tale. I haven't played the Order, so i can't say but it seems like it's that case going by his review.

I agree with RDreamer's previous post about the story, and I personally considered the story a self-contained one, with the major problem being the predictable villain "twist" instead of loose ends.

I think the problems people have with the story is the most baffling to me, and I wonder if there had been significant content there if people would even complain at all? Like, is the sore spot that you'd didn't play for that terribly long and thus you should get to play these other threads?

Yes some things are left hanging in the overarching world, but I don't see how that means the story is unfinished. The story was one of Gallahad and his realization that the order wasn't what he thought it was, and how he came to leave it. He goes through complete arc in the game. The moment the game ends is the moment it needed to for that story.

Yes you don't know where the lycans came from or what ultimately happens to the rebellion, etc, but you don't know that shit in a lot of stories. You don't really know where the infection comes from in The Last of Us. You don't know what happens to Joel and Ellie. You don't know what happens to some of the groups you interact with in the world. But that works, because that was a character story, and so is this. In a character story you just want to solve a specific arc with that character. With this we saw Gallahad go from trusted company man to skeptic to outright rebel. He found the corrupt person in The Order and killed him, and that punctuated his end with the group and as a knight. I'm not going to pretend it's anywhere near as good as TLOU, but I think that still stands.

When I heard people were pissed at the ending I guess I was expecting Final Fantasy XIII-2 levels of GODDAMMIT. I got to the end and was just confused. I liked the arc.

 

[Viruz]

I don't remember GoW's story but Halo and ME have self-contained stories that have hooks for a sequel. I think the issue Joe brings up is where they cut the story at the knees to make for a sequel instead of telling a whole tale. I haven't played the Order, so i can't say but it seems like it's that case going by his review.

I agree and I'm angry ok with his opinion. But I do not think the devs made the story short on purpose. It's just RAD didn't have the time to make a good game.
The next one will be great, I hope.

 

[Parakeetman]

I don't remember GoW's story but Halo and ME have self-contained stories that have hooks for a sequel. I think the issue Joe brings up is where they cut the story at the knees to make for a sequel instead of telling a whole tale. I haven't played the Order, so i can't say but it seems like it's that case going by his review.

It is pretty much.

Nothing major below in the spoiler tag section but for those who have not played would suggest not reading it regardless.

Spoiler

They made far too many changes / buildup for various things yet nothing is really resolved by the time the player finishes the game which leaves quite an unsatisfying feeling for the overall experience plotwise.

 

[BPoole]

I agree and I'm angry ok with his opinion. But I do not think the devs made the story short on purpose. It's just RAD didn't have the time to make a good game.
The next one will be great, I hope.

Didn't it take them 5 years to make this?

Consider that Naughty Dog works on a 2 year dev cycle

 

[Septic360]

I don't remember GoW's story but Halo and ME have self-contained stories that have hooks for a sequel. I think the issue Joe brings up is where they cut the story at the knees to make for a sequel instead of telling a whole tale. I haven't played the Order, so i can't say but it seems like it's that case going by his review.

That IS the case. It literally feels like a prologue.

 

[Hollabootsey]

I like and respect Joe's work and watching the review could feel that he struggled with this one. I disagree with 4/10 but it's all good, only opinions.

However, he mentions the force walking or walking sections as a negative and this is definitely one of the universal knocks the game has received. I've also seen talk about not being to pull your weapons at will while walking and how that removes tension like in the hospital section.

I can see the point about removing tension but I don't understand how waking became such a knock. Literally, every character based game involves walking somewhere. Many times, you just want to get from point A to B because that just moves the thing along. But I thought the pace of walking added a level of realism that enhanced the story. And call it a tech demo all you want, you'll want to stop and just take in the world.

 

[funkypie]

did you play the game?

As always the order defence is to question if someone played the game first. Yes I played the game, would you like some proof?

 

[cool_dude]

Haha, fierrio YouTube video backfire.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

I like Angry Joe. I dont always see eye to eye with him, like now for instance, but I like him. He is entertaining.

 

[RDreamer]

I don't remember GoW's story but Halo and ME have self-contained stories that have hooks for a sequel. I think the issue Joe brings up is where they cut the story at the knees to make for a sequel instead of telling a whole tale. I haven't played the Order, so i can't say but it seems like it's that case going by his review.

I really didn't get the feeling the story was cut at the knees. I think you should play it and see for yourself. As I said in my previous post, the story is more of a character story. It's the story of Gallahad, and how he turns from company man to skeptic to outright rebel. It's a pretty full arc. I hate to keep using The Last of Us in my examples because obviously I'm not trying to say The Order's story is as impactful as that, but in the end you don't know what happens to Ellie and Joel, but you've seen their character arc happen. You don't know how or if the infection gets solved. You don't know what happens to some of the groups. But you know more about them and you know the big choice that they would and did make in the game. Also, the entire trajectory of the game would change past that point, since the original quest is done. Like that, the trajectory of the game would change past the point we've seen.

 

[Septic360]

As always the order defence is to question if someone played the game first. Yes I played the game, would you like some proof?

Tnat Vile Self guy who did that God awful review that Pessino latched onto asked me the same shit when i critiqued him.

 

[hwalker84]

Can't disagree with a single point of his review. The game is the definition of bland and uninspired. I'd say 5-6/10 though.

 

[nib95]

Didn't it take them 5 years to make this?

Consider that Naughty Dog works on a 2 year dev cycle

Uncharted (Drake's Fortune) took Naughty Dog three years including preliminary engine building, but they at least had a prior foundation of working on console platforms. I'd imagine dev time for The Order's sequel (if it gets one, which I think it should), will be far less. Credit where it's due, Ready at Dawn have created one of the most advanced game engine's out there, and done it with a relatively small team of people comparative to other AAA studios, and as their console debut no less.

 

[Tidus_Great]

He praised the 'brushed over' points you mention in the video. It didn't score four points for nothing.

it deserves well higher than 4/10. He spent way too much time talking about picking stuff up and looking at it. who gives a crap. the gunplay is solid, the story is good, the presentation is top tier. those are the points that matter the most. He's being overly critical because everyone is on the order hater bandwagon now :/

 

[DevilFox]

Didn't it take them 5 years to make this?

Consider that Naughty Dog works on a 2 year dev cycle

Right, let's compare the newcomers at their first experience with AAA, first experience on home console, with their first new IP and new everything (engine included) to one of the best studio in the industry that just has 30 years of experience.
Let's also compare games that are totally fantasy made with one that required some serious effort for fidelity (research, photos etc).
Does it sound fair? How much time do you think TLOU took, 2 years? It was in pre production way longer than that, just after Uncharted 2 release and that's 2009.

 

[Viruz]

Didn't it take them 5 years to make this?

Consider that Naughty Dog works on a 2 year dev cycle

I don't belong to any dev team, but it takes years I guess/think to build an engine so great.
But RAD has now a solid engine they can build games on, like ND.
1886 is a demo a really good demo, I can't wait for their next game.

 

[timetokill]

it deserves well higher than 4/10. He spent way too much time talking about picking stuff up and looking at it. who gives a crap. the gunplay is solid, the story is good, the presentation is top tier. those are the points that matter the most. He's being overly critical because everyone is on the order hater bandwagon now :/

Those aren't the points that matter the most. He explained it quite well: graphics aren't everything. And literally the only thing The Order has going for it is its presentation. It's a lot of lipstick on a pig.

You think the gameplay is solid, but for many it's unremarkable. It's functional at best, and the spots of imagination and fun are cut short by cutscenes that take away your guns and only give you little shooting galleries to enjoy them in. Also, gunplay against terrible AI still results in a mediocre experience. Picking up and looking at things and being forced to walk slowly comes across as tedium, especially when the gameplay in the game is already so sparse.

On the other hand, the story is terrible, and it's completely cut off at the knees because they needed to get a game out and make some money. The characters do nonsensical things (as shown in the review, so much could be avoided if the guy would just SAY SOMETHING), and it ends on a completely disappointing note.

The word "prologue" is tossed around a lot with this game, and it's because it feels like the story hasn't even really started, or is maybe JUST starting, by the time the game ends.

 

[Metal-Geo]

Uncharted (Drake's Fortune) took Naughty Dog three years including preliminary engine building, but they at least had a prior foundation of working on console platforms. I'd imagine dev time for The Order's sequel (if it gets one, which I think it should), will be far less. Credit where it's due, Ready at Dawn have created one of the most advanced game engine's out there, and done it with a relatively small team of people comparative to other AAA studios, and as their console debut no less.

Is it?

 

[timetokill]

Is it?

I think he means just graphically, which is really only part of a game engine. But it's certainly good at that.

 

[RoboPlato]

Uncharted (Drake's Fortune) took Naughty Dog three years including preliminary engine building, but they at least had a prior foundation of working on console platforms. I'd imagine dev time for The Order's sequel (if it gets one, which I think it should), will be far less. Credit where it's due, Ready at Dawn have created one of the most advanced game engine's out there, and done it with a relatively small team of people comparative to other AAA studios, and as their console debut no less.

It's kind of odd but the stuff RAD nailed on this game is what usually takes devs a few titles in the AAA space to do and they did it all from scratch. They have the TPS mechanics down, they have the engine in place, now they need to focus on revamping the base design and gameplay loop. The one major benefit of the cliffhanger ending is that since it sets up for 1887 instead of a time jump, lots of assets can be reused and they can focus on taking feedback and improving the core game.

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

it deserves well higher than 4/10. He spent way too much time talking about picking stuff up and looking at it. who gives a crap. the gunplay is solid, the story is good, the presentation is top tier. those are the points that matter the most. He's being overly critical because everyone is on the order hater bandwagon now :/

 

[Mman235]

You're missing quite a few important differences.

The Stalker AI attacks from different directions instead of all attacking from the same direction, meaning you have to watch not just the passage ahead but the passages around you. This adds tension, and also adds a strategic element of keeping track of where the Stalkers are.

When the Stalker AI runs away, it doesn't run away in a straight line; instead, it turns left or right into the alleyways so that it's hidden from the player's line of sight quickly. Enough time to let loose a few shots, nowhere near enough to really focus fire.

The Stalkers attack in a group. While you are focused on the movement of one Stalker, it will often distract you from one actually moving towards you from another direction.

The lack of a dodge QTE means you're encouraged to stop the Stalkers before they reach you, because otherwise you will get hit. This also places more importance on knowing where they are so you can kill them before getting hit.

Overall, the Stalker battle in Dead Space 2 really demonstrates how to design a close-range pack enemy, and the Order's laughable Lycan battles demonstrate how not to.

On top of that even if Stalkers were the same in design the context is completely different; DS2 has limited resources/non-regenerating health, and also limited saves depending on difficulty, so screwing up actually has consequences vs the Lycans where the worst consequence is going back to the last checkpoint.

Also lol at that video.

 

[Angry Puppy]

it deserves well higher than 4/10. He spent way too much time talking about picking stuff up and looking at it. who gives a crap. the gunplay is solid, the story is good, the presentation is top tier. those are the points that matter the most. He's being overly critical because everyone is on the order hater bandwagon now :/

The order deserves those scores. There is no huge hater bandwagon. The game is just bad.

 

[nib95]

Is it?

Yes, speaking from a technical and graphical perspective, of course. Even from a gameplay systems perspective, many of the fundamentals are down and very polished, such as actual controls, aiming, gunplay, feel and mechanics of the weapons, camera implementation, general feedback and animations etc. They just have to tweak overall pacing, degree of player control, level and encounter design, as well as improve enemy AI somewhat (I'm not too bothered about friendly AI as I prefer to do most of my own work). But the foundation they now have to work on a sequel with is solid. Before this the only new projects they had worked on were PSP titles remember, not even PS Vita one's, so this was no doubt a tall order (pun intended) for them from the get go.

The order deserves those scores. There is no huge hater bandwagon. The game is just bad.

Not according to the vast majority of GAFers that have played it, and posted impressions or reviews for it.

It's kind of odd but the stuff RAD nailed on this game is what usually takes devs a few titles in the AAA space to do and they did it all from scratch. They have the TPS mechanics down, they have the engine in place, now they need to focus on revamping the base design and gameplay loop. The one major benefit of the cliffhanger ending is that since it sets up for 1887 instead of a time jump, lots of assets can be reused and they can focus on taking feedback and improving the core game.

Agreed.

 

[Ferrio]

Haha, fierrio YouTube video backfire.

Talking to me?

 

[Metal-Geo]

Yes, speaking from a technical and graphical perspective, of course. Even from a gameplay systems perspective, many of the fundamentals are down and very polished, such as actual controls, aiming, gunplay, feel and mechanics of the weapons, camera implementation, general feedback and animations etc. They just have to tweak overall pacing, degree of player control, level and encounter design, as well as improve enemy AI somewhat (I'm not too bothered about friendly AI as I prefer to do most of my own work). But the foundation they now have to work on a sequel with is solid. Before this the only new projects they had worked on were PSP titles remember, not even PS Vita one's, so this was no doubt a tall order (pun intended) for them from the get go.

That doesn't make a game engine necessarily advanced though. Just good at what it's intended to do.

 

[Dereck]

Those aren't the points that matter the most. He explained it quite well: graphics aren't everything. And literally the only thing The Order has going for it is its presentation. It's a lot of lipstick on a pig.

You think the gameplay is solid, but for many it's unremarkable. It's functional at best, and the spots of imagination and fun are cut short by cutscenes that take away your guns and only give you little shooting galleries to enjoy them in. Also, gunplay against terrible AI still results in a mediocre experience. Picking up and looking at things and being forced to walk slowly comes across as tedium, especially when the gameplay in the game is already so sparse.

On the other hand, the story is terrible, and it's completely cut off at the knees because they needed to get a game out and make some money. The characters do nonsensical things (as shown in the review, so much could be avoided if the guy would just SAY SOMETHING), and it ends on a completely disappointing note.

The word "prologue" is tossed around a lot with this game, and it's because it feels like the story hasn't even really started, or is maybe JUST starting, by the time the game ends.

Thanks for this post