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[-Eddman-]

I'm actually ok with this. It's not like Shenmue had many other options and people wouldn't have accepted a graphically modest title with a conservative scope if Suzuki announced it as a big "PS exclusive and Sony funded" game.

 

[BabyFaceKillah]

Not necessarily, Sony has helped fund independent games that later on released on Xbox before. Like Joe Danger.

lets be real we know its not coming to Xbox ever

 

[MassiveNights]

You know that people can cancel their pledges if this upsets them right? Literally no-one contributing currently is bothered, so why are other people?

 

[FordGTGuy]

Kickstarters *really* need to make it clear when their aim is only to gain major publisher support.

No kidding, that's really sketchy if the only reason they asked for $2 million was to justify Sony funding it.

 

[Amused]

Sony was not confident in the game. Made a deal, we will give you major exposure at E3, you will prove that the interest is real by raising 2 million dollars. If it is successful and interest is real, we will partner with you an make this happen.

Win, win, win. YS Net wins by getting major exposure, boosting the chances of the kickstarter succeeding. Sony wins gamers hearts and a great console exclusive. Customers wins Shenmue 3. And a higher quality Shenmue 3 than kickstarter alone could have gotten us at that.

 

[3rdamention]

Many of us said this from the beginning, it's exactly the situation that Dylan Jobe explained, but people continued to say that Sony was getting exclusivity without even funding it....


I'm just glad people are getting it..

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

Because they only wanted to gauge interest, if that's true, they should close it and fund the rest themselves and accept traditional preorders going forward.

They've reached their goalz now's the time to show that this wasn't just a cash grab.

Yea, i think to avoid shadiness, they should close out the Kickstarter. The projected earnings of the Kickstarter is more than enough proof that interest is through the roof.

 

[MaddenNFL64]

so how much do you think it will cost now?

Not $70 million.

They had to integrate systems that were never combined in 1999. , full virtualized world with NPC's following AI routines linked to a system of timekeeping, day/night cycle, dynamic weather system, all in 3d space. Shock to the senses that game was back then.

 

[Extra Sauce]

This is the gaming industry. The minute you buy a game, you are donating to a corporation. Where are ya'll heads at today?

Donating and buying aren't the same thing.

I would argue that most backers are essentially pre-ordering the game (which is fine) but shelling out hundreds of dollars seems peculiar once you know that Sony is behind the project.

 

[eso76]

S-s-so this means it'll actually be a full, big, real Shenmue game?

You done good, Suzuki!

Yep, that's the part I'm interested in.

 

[thepeaguy]

I'm happy to support the production of Shenmue 3 with my money, even though it will receive backing from Sony.

Now, if Shining Force IV happened, I'd be even happier.

 

[MrCunningham]

WTF is this. Put Ryo in Street Fighter V now.

Ryu vs Ryo, go!

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I am not sure if it means being self righteous, just rather wishing that kickstarter was a more idealistic funding platform.

I like the idea of less large corporations being involved. Call me old fashioned perhaps.

For a AAA game? You think a game of this size has any chance on Kickstarter!? This isn't a fricken Castlevania successor.

You guys are just being ridiculous

 

[TimeEffect]

Cool. I'm not sure I really understand the "gauge interest" thing. Can't you just make people sign a petition to show interest?

Or is $2 Million super crucial that Sony can't add it to their existing budget?

Sorry if off topic, but is this also the deal with Final Fantasy 7? I assume it will come to PC, but what about XBox?

 

[Kayant]

OP you should put this in the OP -

Just for those wondering about the 'budget':

Also Timestamp/Stream about 33:40 -

https://youtu.be/XUh5_BdJrl8

Edit - Let to the party as always

 

[indigo-cyclops]

This news couldn't get any better. Dev support from Sony and funding will help Shenmue 3 be the best it could be. I'm just ecstatic.

 

[Mendax]

Great news, my condolences to Xbox owners who were hoping this would be on the Xbox One.

With Sony officially backing the product, we know we're going to get some high quality stuff, Suzuki's bringing his own guys over and I'm sure Sony will lend them some help from their top drawer first party development teams.

it's coming through "third party relations program"

this does not meet definitive exclusive

No kidding, that's really sketchy if the only reason they asked for $2 million was to justify Sony funding it.

why

 

[DeepEnigma]

I just think that there is a better way to gauge fan interest then with a kickstarter that was obviously going to be funded.

Money is the most effective way in a business that is about making money.

Polls and petitions mean squat.

If there is a better way, do share some ideas, because currently, the "money where your mouth is nostalgic hardcore niche fans" is the best way I can think of in the current economic times and Hollywood like budgets.

 

[Kinyou]

So can they now take care of the subtitle translation? That still seems like such a silly strechgoal for a game that has publisher support.

 

[Stone Ocean]

So having a contrary opinion is "hating" now?

I'm glad for Shenmue fans, but the ramifications of this will be big.

What ramifications lol

Are people seriously expecting companies like EA putting shit on Kickstarter now?

If you're worried about such a thing just... dont fund it!

 

[Pathfinder]

This thread is incredible.

Let's break this down: Shenmue 3 is getting made because it was partially funded by fans on Kickstarter, and partially funded by a major publisher.

I don't see the problem. Don't buy it if you don't want to support...standard capitalistic practices, I guess?

I think the problem people have is Sony wasn't upfront about helping out with development.

 

[KnightHart]

Apparently all the bombs last night dried out the oceans and there's nothing but salt left around here.

Some of these posts today...smh.

The entire Sony press conference is just salt flavoured bait now. Like, it's driving people to madness in all meanings of the word, positive and negative

I'm just glad the game is just being made now. Like, it's fucking real, or it will be

Excuse me while I lie in fetal position in the corner crying, while holding a picture of Valkyria Chronicles 3 on my phone, just quietly murmuring to myself "It's okay dreams come true"

 

[Moofers]

Take it from a guy who works in software (not me) who put it to me this way:

In 1999, you needed kitana dev kits, and very specialized engineers to write assembly using archaic tools. Plus, the expense of corporate salaries at Sega. Now they're using Unreal 4. Off the shelf, cheap to license, and very easy to dev for. Of course its going to be cheaper. Plus QA costs are going to be in the basement because they can focus on debugging gameplay, not an engine they had to build for the game.

I think he nailed it there. Also, now that Sony is committed, concerns of limited resources are even further squashed.

Oh, and I'll also add that while Shenmue 1 and 2 were open-world games, they were open-world in 1999/2000. That's a very different open-world from now. Think of the way each area was basically a series of outdoor hallways and you start to understand that it was a big game for the time, but if the new game uses that same style of world-building and traveling through it, that's a much less daunting goal to reach than say, trying to make a world like the one in GTA V.

So yeah, I don't think its reasonable to think this will demand a budget of $50M or anything near that. I bet they could do it in $10M to $15M.

 

[GWX]

This game is a massive risk, how do you think that this game does not need a Kickstarter to gauge interest? It may have all worked out without it, but why does it matter if PC and PS4 gamers put money and buy the game for cheap and the game gets made anyways? How does this affect anyone negatively who would have gotten the game anyway? Please explain. Make sure not to spare any details.

If you are not an Xbox only gamer who is a fan and are complaining in this thread, you're acting like a petulant child (or might be one at this rate). This is addressing everyone in general, not just the poster I'm quoting.

I think I was pretty reasonable with my argument. If you read my posts in the Salsa thread, you should know I was happy for having Shenmue 3 either way, and I still am. I just think that KS should be about making things happen that otherwise wouldn't, and not allowing major companies to ask people for money to check market viability, while coming forward with the info that they're funding the game one day later. Then again, this is just my opinion, and KS should be whatever it wants or it can be, as it's a great tool most of the time.

And I never had an Xbox in my life, lol.

 

[Soi-Fong]

Damn it's the dead sea in here.. So much salt...

 

[FreddieQuell]

This practice just rubs me the wrong way entirely - I think it's the first time a Kickstarter has been created with the developers KNOWING they have direct financial support from a multinational corporation?

Adam Boyes: "We have nothing to do with this!!!"

Shady.

Such a shame too, I love Shenmue and Yu Suzuki.

Such a shame, you'll get to play Shenmue 3.

 

[Newtype-001]

Kickstarter is probably one of the best ways to "gauge" interest. Would you rather decide the fate of a franchise with your wallets or a circle of execs looking at some spreadsheets.

 

[Withnail]

It's still not clear cut until we see who the publisher is.

If Sony is funding it properly then they will be listed as the publisher.

If it turns out to be self-published by Ys Net, then it's more likely to be a pub-fund type arrangement where Sony is basically loaning cash against future revenue and providing publicity.

I'm guessing it's the latter, because of the PC version.

 

[creatchee]

This thread is incredible.

Let's break this down: Shenmue 3 is getting made because it was partially funded by fans on Kickstarter, and partially funded by a major publisher.

I don't see the problem. Don't buy it if you don't want to support...standard capitalistic practices, I guess?

It's not the practice - it's the misleading presentation.

Or did everyone forget the barely-hat-in-hand "Save Shenmue" plea last night?

 

[The Albatross]

Why?

Honestly, there have been a bunch of games from established developers to go through Kickstarter now. Most of them require outside funding, either from the studio itself or from investors. What this Kickstarter does is A) signal that there is interest in a Shenmue sequel, B) give huge fans a chance to either get the game cheaper than it will likely retail for or to grab a bunch of cool Shenmue media/swag that wouldn't exist otherwise, and C) have some input on the creative process.

I'm not really seeing a downside. People have waited close to 15 years for a Shenmue 3 announcement.

There is a significant downside to the Kickstart model, for one, only about 35% of successfully funded projects actually ship something finished to customers, with some $21m of successfully dispersed funds going into Kickstart limbo (e.g., funds successfully disbursed to developers/publishers, but no game delivered), compared to only about $17m going to games that actually shipped a completed product.

On the plus side, Kickstarter can definitely work for seasoned developers in the industry who can estimate costs and develop/execute a project plan, so I think the model will work fine for Shenmue. But, let's be honest, if this were Ubisoft, Electronic Arts, or even Microsoft, the reaction would be very negative. If Microsoft announced that Rare was starting a kickstarter for a Goldeneye reboot, or if EA announced that they were going to do a kickstarter for NFL Blitz, there would be a lot of skepticism. Sony has earned a lot of trust over the last 3 or 4 years so people are willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

[AyaisMUsikWhore]

I am not sure if it means being self righteous, just rather wishing that kickstarter was a more idealistic funding platform.

I like the idea of less large corporations being involved. Call me old fashioned perhaps.

The running joke is Sony is less large so there's that

 

[Punkster_NY]

HHour said the same thing, their kickstarter was just to show publishers that people were actually interested in the game and they got funding after that.

 

[SkylineRKR]

I think we created this beast. Polls have to be proven to be bullshit and not enough people are actually coming through.

With KS people are coming through. These KS backers are a lock.

Backing 10k is huge but only reserved for like 4 guys. I'm sure though are huge fans who can also miss this amount of cash, and might've done it also if this option was there as a pre order outside of KS. They get one time stuff and meet YS.

 

[wildfire]

I would imagine now that they are coming out as officially backing it they will close the KS but it was the only way this game was getting made guys. The last game didn't set the world on fire sales wise and the only way for Sony to see if this has any viable true market interest and is not just the deafening cry repeated over and over by the most loyal fans was a chance to get them to put their money where their mouth was. I don't understand how people don't get this

While I'm ok in general with companies getting additional funding from investors I agree with others that they should disclose this from the start. Since Sony didn't disclose this they should consider cancelling the campaign. In reality what I would prefer is stronger government regulation on crowdfunding in certain areas and a weakening of regulation in other areas.

 

[nOoblet16]

That's bullshit. No game of worth was fully funded with Kickstarter. It's just supposed to kickstart something and not to replace a business plan.

You might want to see this game called star citizen.

because those two can probably self fund their new IP from constant game making or from being a TV star with a decent amount of cash. Yu couldn't do any of that.

Yet he is getting money from Sony now.
Those two got money from fans due to their popularity as people "love/like them" , Shenmue managed to get money from fans due to the emotional attachment to the franchise as people love the franchise...if that wasn't the case then it wouldn't have hit the goal in less than 24 hours. Imo it's the same idea here and the same principles apply here too.

 

[Palette Swap]

So now that they've gauged the interest Sony knows it will be successful and cancel the kickstarter right? I mean they don't need the money

Let me guess: you didn't pledge a cent in the KS?

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

No kidding, that's really sketchy if the only reason they asked for $2 million was to justify Sony funding it.

To be fair, this is explicitly stated in other major KS campaigns. Notably Bloodstained.

Not really a new development in KS if you've been paying attention to the platform.

 

[Porcile]

The buzz and all the noise around this will raise attention. Every record that the campaign breaks it's free marketing for the game. Being on stage for one of the hardware companies conference was invaluable for that too, it raised its profile immensely with new eyeballs turning to this game and trying to understand what the hell was the fuss all about. It's a big symbiotic process.

Yeah, but it's Shenmue 3. Who do they expect the audience to be for a third game in a long dead franchise which is right in the middle of its story arc? Besides the hardcore fans who just bought the game? This game could either be a great template for future games, or it could be disaster which kills a lot of these types projects. There needs to be 1+2 HD port for sure.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Why are people complaining? The majority of people who have contributed so far are getting a copy of the game for $29.

Yes please, that's a bargain.

If anything I am happier Sony have stepped in as it pretty much guarantees its completion. The risks associated have become much, much smaller.

Right? People have lost it.

 

[amstradcpc]

Well.Shenmue 2 had near 50 millions of budget.I dont want to imagine the 3 with only 2 millions.

 

[Wagram]

Fans have been begging for this title for years. It's either back it or never see it. I'm sure true fans will back the damn thing.

 

[Sticky&Sweet]

Such a shame, you'll get to play Shenmue 3.

Besides the point entirely.

Jesus.

 

[Zeyphersan]

So all the $30 backers are going to turn in their game and buy it a release for $60 right?

I'm just saying, let's stop being disingenuous. If Sony JUST wanted to gauge interest, then that experiment is over. The interest is there. Cancel the kickstarter.

But Sony also wants the money from the people so they can spend less. Money that they possess as of this very moment themselves to use.

(For the record, before someone calls me out, I hold this opinion with every Kickstarter that goes for external funding, not just this one)

 

[kamakazi5]

Cool. I'm not sure I really understand the "gauge interest" thing. Can't you just make people sign a petition to show interest?

Or is $2 Million super crucial that Sony can't add it to their existing budget?

Sorry if off topic, but is this also the deal with Final Fantasy 7? I assume it will come to PC, but what about XBox?

No idea about FF7 but a petition doesn't speak nearly as loud as cash. Could they have done this without Kickstarter? Yes, but it's a much riskier move given the history (the fact that it didn't sell nearly as well as it needed to originally).

 

[Piggus]

Shouldn't even have had a kickstarter if Sony was going to do this.

Again, Kickstarters in this situation are used to judge public interest, not fund the project entirely. Those who support the project are rewarded with a copy of the game at a likely discounted rate.

It's really not that hard of a concept to figure out.

I'm going to say this again because apparently some people can't put two and two together: publishers have had over ten god damn years to make this game happen. None of them jumped on it despite the vocal community that wants the game to happen. This kickstarter demonstrated that a lot of people do indeed want this to happen, which has apparently resulted in Sony throwing their full weight behind it.

If this is somehow a bad thing to you, then clearly you have no idea how Kickstarter works.

So now that they've gauged the interest Sony knows it will be successful and cancel the kickstarter right? I mean they don't need the money

In what universe would that make sense?

Ugh, I'm done.

 

[Corto]

That's a nice way of taking advantage of the fans and getting free money, I guess. Kudos to them.

We're all big boys and girls and we spend our money on whatever we feel like. But thanks for the concern. I'll be proud to know that Shenmue 3 was made possible because of my little contribution. And everyone that feels that the Kickstarter is unsavoury can wait for the release and buy the game then. Or not.

 

[riskVSreward]

so how much do you think it will cost now?

I have no idea tbh, just nowhere near 70 million that's ridiculous. That was the cost for both games back then btw. They had to create everything from the ground up, there was no middleware for basically anything. Maybe video compression, that's about it. They also spent way more money than was even necessary like fully voicing every innocuous NPC that roamed around with answers to probably over 100 questions. They recorded over 150+ footsteps so everyone would have their own... There is literally no reason at all to expect development cost to match the older games.

I'm sorry, there's so many assumptions and bold claims in here that to someone like me who has been following the series since '99 is too much to handle.

 

[shadowsdarknes]

the reality is that videogames are too expensive. i'm sure if they got rid of middle-management, i'm sure they could make uncharted 4 or shenmue on a budget of 3 million. the problem with companies is that they to act more like a family, where money is limited and you have to budget. there is too much waste in the gaming industry, they just need to make sure they budget properly like a real family does.

Say a game made of 40 people that takes 3 years to develop.

Even 50k on average puts the budget at 6 million. And this is only for staffing. Senior staff will tip the average above 50k.
Then there are operating costs such as equipment and buildingenergy costs, distribution costs, and various things you have to outsource.

Naughty Dog is comprised of 250 people. Game budgets are big for a reason.

 

[Danielsan]

Anyone thinking this game could be made with 2 million dollars is fooling themselves hard. It was pretty much guaranteed from the get go that the Kickstarter was to measure interest and ensure funding. I have no problems with this.

 

[BranVan3000]

Really not a fan of this approach.

I am

I mean Sony is taking on an IP they don't own which never got a sequel because the first two just weren't that popular. The fact that Sony are involved in this at all amazes me

But how else were they going to estimate legitimate demand for this?