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Love Boat [Mafia] |OT| Till Death Do Us Part

Burbeting

Banned
el topo & giant panda (0)
cabot
cabot

launchpadmcq & gorlak (1)
giant panda
ultrajay
coppanuva

kingkitty & hyperactivity (0)
cabot

timeaisis & fluxwavez (1)
gorlak
coppanuva
blargonaut
camjo-z
blargonaut
tl21xx
blargonaut

magnumboy20xx & batsnacks (0)
flame_ac

*splinter & cabot (0)
launchpadmcq

blargonaut & kawl_usc (12)
karkador
zippedpinhead
flame_ac
hyperactivity
*splinter
timeaisis
camjo-z
tl21xx
launchpadmcq
kyanrute
ultrajay
retroid
fluxwavez
batsnacks

hobohodo & ty4on (1)
cabot
cabot
cabot
fluxwavez

coppanuva & flame_ac (1)
dusk soldier

karkador & zippedpinhead (0)
gorlak
ty4on
blargonaut

15 Votes Needed for Majority

red_1456423200.png
 
Forgot to answer the question.

I agree that your situation is roughly equivalent to Kark's, minus the Miller angle. I've never said Kark can't be scum, but he had the advantage (not being a Miller), and actually made an argument for your lynch. You've provided nothing for too long, and now suggested we lynch Flux, which I've already described as garbage.

So that's why my vote is on you (in spirit)

Thank you for finally acknowledging the relative equality between us and Kark's team.

And yes, Kark made an argument for our lynch; now I am making an argument against my lynch.

It took many, many hours to compile this defense of ours and I apologize for the delay, but you all still have an entire day + ~4 hours to consider it.

So why are you being dismissive of our defense by saying there's no time?
 

*Splinter

Member
It is garbage to you because in your entire post above, you have conveniently omitted your own connection to Timeflux in your continually staunch defense of him. Lynching Timeflux is a test of your own alignment as well; thus, lynching them is a source of more intel to Town in the form of more gathered leads (refer to the body of my proposal in Part 2; I counted 5 more leads by lynching Timeflux, compared to 2 if you lynch us).

And of course this plan is intended to delay our own death. Why would I submit a plan to you that advocates my own lynching? That is a nonsense critique.
Let's go back to the first scenario outlined:

1. You flip town
2. Kark flips scum
3. Flux flips scum
4. I flip town

If I'm wrong about everything, I'll be on the chopping block in due course, but in that scenario we'd be down to the final scum and the mislynch won't throw the game for us.



Of course if I'm right it's a lot simpler.

1. You flip scum
2. I get NK'd, and return at the end to accept another 'MVP' award.
 

*Splinter

Member
Thank you for finally acknowledging the relative equality between us and Kark's team.

And yes, Kark made an argument for our lynch; now I am making an argument against my lynch.

It took many, many hours to compile this defense of ours and I apologize for the delay, but you all still have an entire day + ~4 hours to consider it.

So why are you being dismissive of our defense by saying there's no time?
I didn't say there's no time, technically there's plenty of time. I'm saying your vacuum of a defense so far is a contributing factor to you being the vote leader.

That aside, yes I think there is equality here, I don't remember saying otherwise.
 

Karkador

Banned
A couple of quick rebuttals:


1.

Lynching Timeflux is an okay alternative, and I agree that there could possibly be a benefit to both Trackers going to N2 for another round of results. I think, if either of us were scum, the scum team would probably not dare to kill either of us. However, it leaves us open to a bunch of other nighttime shenanigans that will confuse our results (or, we miss). So, there is a risk that the information just wont be useful.

The exception I take to the "Lynch Timeflux Plan" is that you're misrepresenting the interactions I've had with them, and I feel like you will make the case for me being scum, no matter how they flip. If TimeFlux is scum, I colluded with another player. If TimeFlux is good, we just picked off an easy target.



2.

It's rather remarkable that you criticize the metagame discussion for trying to figure out Burb's Design Document, but you apparently draw the line only after insinuating that we could be scum because "X-shot sounds like a suitable counterbalance for a mafia player".

Actually, it doesn't. A scum player is supposed to try to make it to the end of the game. Giving a mafia player an X-shot power is crippling.
 

cabot

Member
- Gorlak pointed out the crab scale point, I was answering a question of El Topo's regarding PR count in the game. I have never stated I agree with Gorlak's assumption, it's conjecture.

The reasons I'll vote for you:

- I read town on Kark up until yesterday (RL) and didn't read town on either you or Kawl.
- I didn't believe your reason in targetting Kark.
- Miller claim needs to be cleaned up.
- I still don't see scum Flux claiming 6 minutes in to something he can't prove.
- You flipping scum or otherwise points us to others, just as much as a Kark or Flux flipping scum would. There's no difference in balance there.
- There's an active clash of roles here, which points to scum more than not.
- I read Kawl not really answering points and then going completely silent the past 1.5 days as scummy than town.

- My metagaming reason was why I thought you claimed Miller, it's not the reason I want to lynch you.
- I'm not convinced a Miller is an adequate balance for unlimited tracking. I can see it as a balance for a scum tracker.
 
So what your saying is the following:

1: we need to slow down
2: part of Kark and my play is to distract us from time/flux
3: it's possible we have two town aligned trackers
4: that Kark and I might be in cahoots with *splinter/Cabot and timeflux
5: with one more night of two trackers we may gain additional information beneficial to town

And your proposal is to lynch time/flux instead, as it offers us the most information relative to your flip and Kark and my team's flip.

I disagree with your assessment of Kark and I being a distraction from time/flux, though you bring up interesting points for Cabot and *splinter...

And I would add one more to your flip
3: by flipping team BLAWL first, you find out whether or not ultrajay X Boo Boo'n are scum in collusion with them, as ultraboo (specifically Boo Boo'n) has been running a weird interference. Agreeing with the points against Blawl but not actively voting for anyone. Ultra had a vote out early against launch but rescinded it.

In the interest of being forthcoming our official role title is this

a Pair of Old People who love to peek at things.

It's also part of the reason we didn't like the role cop claim yesterday. We really are an X shot tracker, though no rationale as to why it is so is in our flavor. Just comments about aggressive birds, itelephones, and micecraft (or was it minedraft?)

I am torn, we could always lynch you tomorrow and policy lynch timeflux for the blatant lies day 1 (your proposal).

We could also lynch you (or ourselves) today, and then figure it out tomorrow based on who lives tonight

Thank you for being objective about all of this, and clarifying your role info. Yes, you've got the gist of our proposal well.

It's understandable that you Zipped would disagree that your team's gambit has drawn away attention from Timeflux Today, but I believe it's the evident truth.

I've never really interacted directly with Ultraboo besides during the relative chaos of the D1 end, and that was mostly jokingly as I proposed to lynch him based off Never Forever's favoured fictional OTP selections. I disagree that we have any tangible connections to Ultraboo, and if he has spoken up in our defense before I must admit I missed it, and I'll have to go back and see what he's said about us. If you sincerely feel we have a connection to Ultraboo like you say, then that brings our total of possible-leads-from-flipping-us to 3; even with the 3 of your team. But I personally believe that our relationship connection to Ultraboo is relatively non-existent.
 

Karkador

Banned
Thank you for finally acknowledging the relative equality between us and Kark's team.

And yes, Kark made an argument for our lynch; now I am making an argument against my lynch.

It took many, many hours to compile this defense of ours and I apologize for the delay, but you all still have an entire day + ~4 hours to consider it.

So why are you being dismissive of our defense by saying there's no time?

This is still bullshit, Blarg. A large part of the game is participating in the discussions, and it's helpful to explain your points clearly; not in a megapost that is difficult to even quote, let alone dissect.

You know, despite your earlier post lamenting your meta-status as the bizarre crazy player, you certainly enjoy the benefit of being able to give us the run-around.
 
Or wait was Kark the x shot one? I don't remember it's not important anyway.

I think it's important because Kark's claim of being x-shot only came after NeverTim's flip on D1, where we all saw they had a 1-shot immunity as Town.

Refer to my point regarding this in Part 1 of our defense post on why I think this is potentially scummy:

*snip*

[re: Team Zippador]

- Claims their Tracker power to be x-shot, limited use. Coincides with Town-aligned NeverTim's 1-shot Immunity we discovered after their flip D1, but Kark claimed x-shot on D2; only after they had clear knowledge of it existing in Town. And even if their x-shot is true; what if Team Zippador are x-shot exactly because they are scum-aligned Trackers? Objectively, an unlimited scum Tracker would be a quite powerful role as they are essentially a scum-aligned Investigator that can suss out the Town power roles as long as they are alive. If Karkador x Zippedpinhead are telling the truth, what if their claimed x-shot quantity is a power nerf placed on them because of that, for balancing?

*snip*
 

cabot

Member
scum-aligned tracker should be powerful, it's 1 of 3 (maybe 4) against 11 (or 12 if neutral).

A town-aligned unlimited tracker is one of a number of PRs on the bigger side of the game
 
This is still bullshit, Blarg. A large part of the game is participating in the discussions, and it's helpful to explain your points clearly; not in a megapost that is difficult to even quote, let alone dissect.

You know, despite your earlier post lamenting your meta-status as the bizarre crazy player, you certainly enjoy the benefit of being able to give us the run-around.

There is still more than a day left, and we're here to participate now. We chose to temporarily withdraw so that we could build a serious case for our defense that wasn't haphazard. I'm sorry it took as long as it did, but I had to balance my time with IRL commitments too.

I feel our defense case is more cohesive and readable for being 2 single posts rather than scattered over tens of pages. It's all self-contained and easier to quote and dissect. I personally feel like I explained our points quite clearly.
 

cabot

Member
I feel our defense case is more cohesive and readable for being 2 single posts rather than scattered over tens of pages. It's all self-contained and easier to quote and dissect. I personally feel like I explained our points quite clearly.

Pure subjective opinion but I'd rather lots of small ones than huge ones. Small ones are easy to search through and quote.
 

El Topo

Member
I actually have to agree with Blarg on this. The long, two-post defense is a lot easier to digest than if it is stretched over half a dozen posts with different quotes and links.
 

cabot

Member
Large posts also have the advantage (for you) of writing in a vacuum, without external interventions to alter thoughts in a more fluid way. You can't catch out someone as easily in a mega pre-written post vs a series of short posts in real time.
 

Kawl_USC

Member
Pure subjective opinion but I'd rather lots of small ones than huge ones. Small ones are easy to search through and quote.
I am both shocked and awed that Splintbot is making an argument that higher posts counts for the same amount of info is pro town.

Oh wait, no I'm not.
 
Large posts also have the advantage (for you) of writing in a vacuum, without external interventions to alter thoughts in a more fluid way. You can't catch out someone as easily in a mega pre-written post vs a series of short posts in real time.

That's where this post-megapost-drop Q&A session that we're currently having right now, comes in. Now that our stance is established, I'm trying to field all the questions and critique of our plan here as best and as fast I can now.
 

*Splinter

Member
I am both shocked and awed that Splintbot is making an argument that higher posts counts for the same amount of info is pro town.

Oh wait, no I'm not.

I had a series of ultimately fruitless posts yesterday that could have been combined into a single mega post. Doing so would have made no change to the word count, and therefore taken just as long to read through, and on the flipside would have been harder to quote parts of (honestly impossible on mobile).

The ONLY advantage to combining them would be to placate people who worry too much about nonsense like post counts.

I'm not sure why I'm responding to this drivel, but I guess we already found our scum today.

/confetti
 

Karkador

Banned
There is still more than a day left, and we're here to participate now. We chose to temporarily withdraw so that we could build a serious case for our defense that wasn't haphazard. I'm sorry it took as long as it did, but I had to balance my time with IRL commitments too.

Or you took all this time to craft the perfect story.
IRL commitments are fine and understandable, but you guys weren't very active D1, either. If you can't find time to play the game, then sub out.

I feel our defense case is more cohesive and readable for being 2 single posts rather than scattered over tens of pages. It's all self-contained and easier to quote and dissect. I personally feel like I explained our points quite clearly.

Right, because you're certainly famous for being clear and upfront with people in these games.

I respond to people fairly quickly, and I explain things as many times as they need to hear it. This opens me up to more scrutiny, but I address it and move on.
 

*Splinter

Member
That's where this post-megapost-drop Q&A session that we're currently having right now, comes in. Now that our stance is established, I'm trying to field all the questions and critique of our plan here as best and as fast I can now.

Great. Care to try and justify lynching Flux (a gut read) before Kark (a direct counterclaim to your own apparent role)?

To reiterate, if you are honest but wrong you'd be putting us in a worse situation than if we lynched you first
 

Gorlak

Banned
Or you took all this time to craft the perfect story.
IRL commitments are fine and understandable, but you guys weren't very active D1, either. If you can't find time to play the game, then sub out.

Stop it right there. This is below the belt and unwanted in this community.
 

El Topo

Member
Stop it right there. This is below the belt and unwanted in this community.

This is the same shit TimeFlux brought up on D1. It's legitimately annoying, especially in a game that has a (vastly) disproportionate amount of posts compared to the other mafia games currently going on.

Love Boat - 2428 -> ~81/participant
Disney Princess -> 679 -> ~28/participant
Ace Attorney -> 1263 -> ~61/participant
 
Or you took all this time to craft the perfect story.
IRL commitments are fine and understandable, but you guys weren't very active D1, either. If you can't find time to play the game, then sub out.

Our "perfect story" is perfectly open to any critique.

And I am not by far the least active in this game. I don't appreciate you asking me to get out because you feel I'm not committing enough of my time to this game. The evidence of my time commitment is in those 2 posts.

Right, because you're certainly famous for being clear and upfront with people in these games.

I respond to people fairly quickly, and I explain things as many times as they need to hear it. This opens me up to more scrutiny, but I address it and move on.

We each have our own play-styles. You may be accustomed to sleek rapid-fire jabs and counters, but I need time to properly process things and make myself actually readable when the game becomes serious. As much as possible, I like to explain myself once very clearly, as I believe that saves time for everyone involved. This caution of mine equally opens me up to as much scrutiny as you garner with your fast-and-loose play-style. I can't play like you do.
 
Great. Care to try and justify lynching Flux (a gut read) before Kark (a direct counterclaim to your own apparent role)?

To reiterate, if you are honest but wrong you'd be putting us in a worse situation than if we lynched you first

My justification for lynching Timeflux first is not a "gut read", nor will it put you (if you're really Town) in a "worse situation".

I have tried my best to quantify the amount of potential leads their lynching compared to ours will provide. They will generate 5 possible leads upon lynching compared to our 2 (3 if you believe Zipped's statement that Ultraboo and us have displayed a tangible relationship, which I personally do not see as of yet).

Refer to my Part 2 post if you want to critique the lead-generation aspect of my proposal, as I believe that's the crux of my argument for lynching Timeflux first.
 

Ty4on

Member
Hey Blarg, does flavour say why you as "best friends" can track people?

Ty4on trackers see both targets as always.

I know, but this part seems to suggest otherwise:
What, that as soon as D2 began, we should have immediately publicly announced and revealed them as a power role capable of visiting others, of unknown alignment? Start ourselves this '1-for-1-pro-Town-trade' gambit that Kark is employing against us? In the light of no kills occurring last Night, do you understand how much more anti-Town the move that you're subtly insinuating we should have done, to be? We would have been eviscerated for calling a power role out like that when you could have been the Doctor or Switcher who saved a couple's life (our life) last Night; yet, they execute this calling-out move on us, and they are cheered for it? Don't forget that no one died last Night, and take that into consideration like we did.

Initially, all we knew is that they visited us. Our post-Night 1 result PM of our Tracking stated that we saw Karkador x Zippedpinhead visit us. This Morning, we didn't know what they were, but since there were no kills last Night they probably weren't the killer themselves, since we saw them and we're obviously still alive. They couldn't have been a Roleblocker, since our power clearly went through on them. But, they could have been a Doctor, even the Doctor who might have stopped the NK from happening if we were its target; they could have been a Switcher, who switched us with someone and that wouldn't have affected our targeting of them.
 

Karkador

Banned
We each have our own play-styles. You may be accustomed to sleek rapid-fire jabs and counters, but I need time to properly process things and make myself actually readable when the game becomes serious. As much as possible, I like to explain myself once very clearly, as I believe that saves time for everyone involved. This caution of mine equally opens me up to as much scrutiny as you garner with your fast-and-loose play-style. I can't play like you do.


The problem is that this game is about communication, and it's timed. You know that people, and the collective discussion, will interpret action AND inaction in different ways.
The nature of the game is that we have to closely look at how people are communicating.

I can break suspension of disbelief and acknowledge that you have other commitments outside the game; easily. I personally stay out of most of these games exactly because the time and mental commitment is so high.

I totally understand if you want to level with us and say you don't have time to play, or that you play it in big bursts instead of a constant stream. At the end of the day, I would rather accomodate you than not accomodate you. But don't act like the game doesn't suffer because of your inaction. We've circled this talking point for days now, without a response from you or your teammate. It's difficult to move any of the discussion forward, and now we have merely a day to digest this huge thing. It starts to become unreasonable. It starts to look like stalling.

In light of that, don't make statements like this,

Undoubtedly, Kark & possible Co. will attempt to pick apart this megapost and divide and conquer it over multiple posts, and they are free to. But remember, quote and post volume =/= valid counter-argument. And while girth doesn't equal it either, please fully consider this content dump I have put forward in these two chunks before you finalize your opinions and your votes, because these huge blocks are easily overwhelmed by mass posting afterwards.

in which you suggest that I'm going for quantity over quality. If you want a concession made for your playstyle, don't try to denigrate other people's contributions along the same lines.
 

El Topo

Member
Lynching TimeFlux today makes no sense. That should have been done D1. Let us first take a general look at the possible scenarios:

1)TimeFlux are town
--------------------------------
They are going to get killed during N2. They role-claimed (name) cop, only to backtrack. Mafia would be foolish to let them roam around, even moreso if they were their target during N1 but survived due to a doctor. Relying on town to do their dirty work is way too risky.

2)TimeFlux are neutral
--------------------------------
They are going to get killed during N2, see above explanation.

3)TimeFlux are mafia
--------------------------------
No one is going to kill them during the night. As a consequence, they are brutally murdered D3, potentially D4 if Bawl flip town and the rest of us descend upon Karkhead.

Now let us look at your analysis regarding information provided by lynching TimeFlux:
By lynching Timeflux first (5 separate pieces of information gained)
  • By flipping Timeflux's alignment, you learn whether or not Karkador x Zippedpinhead are colluding scum who pulled off this gambit to save Timeflux for another Day (besides the inherent scumminess that I find should be a reason for lynching him over us). Kark keeps saying it has to be us, Team BLAWL, or themselves, who must be lynched Today, yet pushes and pushes us with accusatory theories and yet has never been seriously placed on the defensive himself. Timeflux has recently begun to push for our lynching, in the end accepting Kark's claim as "real and only Town Tracker" to be genuine despite nothing confirming his alignment claim whatsoever, and agreeing with Kark's accusations of us in order to save their own skins Today.
  • By flipping Timeflux's alignment, you learn whether or not Splinter x Cabot are scum in collusion, since after Timeflux's D2 "confession", they are the biggest proponents and defenders of Timeflux's innocence, saying that they are just naive Townies who failed in their alleged D1 pro-Town gambit and that their D2 backdown was relatively harmless. They and Kark have been extremely chummy together, as Splint x Cabot has never attempted to really put Kark on the defensive despite being one of the most active pairs in the game, and they both support Timeflux's innocence and avoidance of a policy-lynching despite Timeflux's blatant confessed lie of being a Name Cop and their strange WIFOM requests surrounding their now-retracted claim.
  • By flipping Timeflux's alignment, you learn whether or not Blargonaut x Kawl_USC are scum in collusion with Timeflux with the whole D1 double-claim fiasco as part of some ridiculously far-fetched scum dual open Role-claim mega-gambit of unknown intent and conclusion.
  • By flipping Timeflux's alignment, you remove a WIFOM problem that will have to eventually be confronted anyway. Like us, they are a topic of debate that will not go away unless you lynch them, or, since they have not claimed to be Millers like us, if they are Investigated later (which, if the x-shot mechanic is true for any Investigator out there, is what I consider to be a waste of a non-renewable resource when a well-deserved policy lynch of unlimited use can achieve the same flip). Remember that Timeflux 'apparently ex-Role Name Cop' on D1 explicitly warned away Doctors and other power roles from visiting them at Night. They have gunned for maximum WIFOM in both their lie and in their apparent D2 confession, much moreso than anything Team BLAWL has done. Why?
  • There is greater pro-Town reward to be had by allowing both potentially Town-aligned, confirmed Trackers to collect one more round of Tracking info each this N2 and present it to you all D3. As both mutually-confirmed Trackers, this goes for both Karkador x Zippedpinhead and Blargonaut x Kawl_USC. You need tangible information and we can both provide.

1)Lynching TimeFlux (following D2) is reasonable in any way in my opinion (as I explained on D1 and is obvious from the above reasoning), so as far as I am concerned, Karkhead has delayed nothing. I understand though, that certain players seem to think very differently on this and cabot (iirc) has explicitly used the argument between you and Karkhead as the reason to ignore TimeFlux for the day.

2)I don't disagree that Splinter and cabot are suspicious regarding this, especially cabot who has done a 180° regarding lynching TimeFlux on D2, but I find it hard to imagine that cabot (if he is scum) would have been okay with a mafia member role-claiming cop on D1. Then again, TimeFlux claimed (either way) that he went ahead without an okay by Time.

3)The D1 cop claim is so insane that I cannot really rule out anything, especially if you are involved, Blarg. I would also like to mention that I vaguely recall Kark being rather aggressive towards TimeFlux at the beginning (of D1). Maybe someone could see how Kark's stance and behavior developed on D1?

4)If we lynch you, we clear up a lot of things as well. If you're town, Karkhead is almost guaranteed scum and following your logic (that I don't necessarily agree with) TimeFlux might be doomed as well, no? If you're scum, that means that anything goes.

5)I have played with the idea of "letting things play out", but it is problematic for town, especially since we have three role-claims and two of them are trackers, which makes it likely that one of them is scum.

I'll have to go through more posts to see whether or not it makes sense to lynch Kark over you. Does someone have a reasonable summary of why we should specifically lynch Blarg over Kark? I think there was the whole "x-shot vs. unlimited" contradiction? Anyone willing to investigate how Kark's stance developed on D1 or how the reactions were (and by whom) on D2 when Blarg/Kark revealed?
 

El Topo

Member
I'll probably go through the scenarios a lot more thoroughly at home, the previous post is not satisfying to me. For example, we have ignored throughout this discussion the existence of neutral roles. I mean, something like best friends seems like it would suit a neutral role, no? Not quite love, not quite loveless.
 

Karu

Member
Have to read most of what came after Blarg's two mega posts (exhausting!), but I'll place my vote on Kark. I'm of the believe that we should lynch one of the two, I agree with Blargs assessment of KarkZipped's reactioness behaviour. I don't agree with Blarg's assessment of flux as an alternative right now - it seems like the very thing he accused KarkZipped earlier in his post (I might miss remarks reagarding this from the outline - which quite frankly doesn't sit well with me. There had to be a way to not bloat your points up to a degree where reconstructing and remembering your shit is a pain - possible summarys are eh because possibly reductive of what you actually said).

VOTE: Karkador
 

Timeaisis

Member
You spent 24 hours writing up that essay which basically amounts to "TimeFlux is a better lynch candidate than me"? You could of said that in like a paragraph.

So what happens when Flux and I flip town? What information do you get from that, if any? Town is back where they were on the Kark/Blarg two-tracker debacle, hanging over it's head. Town will still have to pick one of the two eventually.

Lynching Blarg makes more sense to me.

If Blarg flips town, town can go after Karkahead and/or TimeFlux. If Blarg flips scum, well, we got a scum and we can look into who was defending him.

Lynching Flux and myself gains you useful information only if we flip scum, in my opinion. Flip Blarg and either we get a scumkill or we get two possible targets for the next day.
 

*Splinter

Member
Have to read most of what came after Blarg's two mega posts (exhausting!), but I'll place my vote on Kark. I'm of the believe that we should lynch one of the two, I agree with Blargs assessment of KarkZipped's reactioness behaviour. I don't agree with Blarg's assessment of flux as an alternative right now - it seems like the very thing he accused KarkZipped earlier in his post (I might miss remarks reagarding this from the outline - which quite frankly doesn't sit well with me. There had to be a way to not bloat your points up to a degree where reconstructing and remembering your shit is a pain - possible summarys are eh because possibly reductive of what you actually said).

VOTE: Karkador
I'd wager this isn't unintentional, nor is moving the discussion closer to the deadline.
 

Karu

Member
I'd wager this isn't unintentional, nor is moving the discussion closer to the deadline.
I don't assume so, no. But because I do think something's up with KarkZipped I didn't wanna flip based on that alone just yet, especially since it's not required looking at the current Vote-count. I definitely keep that in mind, though.
 
The problem is that this game is about communication, and it's timed. You know that people, and the collective discussion, will interpret action AND inaction in different ways.
The nature of the game is that we have to closely look at how people are communicating.

I can break suspension of disbelief and acknowledge that you have other commitments outside the game; easily. I personally stay out of most of these games exactly because the time and mental commitment is so high.

I totally understand if you want to level with us and say you don't have time to play, or that you play it in big bursts instead of a constant stream. At the end of the day, I would rather accomodate you than not accomodate you. But don't act like the game doesn't suffer because of your inaction. We've circled this talking point for days now, without a response from you or your teammate. It's difficult to move any of the discussion forward, and now we have merely a day to digest this huge thing. It starts to become unreasonable. It starts to look like stalling.

I never said that I don't have time to play. Stop insinuating that I've given up, when the existence of the 2 megaposts contradict you.

I admit that the base content was finally made ready this morning, and that I stalled it for a few hours so that I could make a tandem debut of it with Kawl, due to our difference in timezones. I apologize if my attempt to entertain has hurt anyone's gameplay capability. I do feel though like the cohesive nature of our case summed up in 2 posts mitigates the waiting time you all experienced for them.

But, Kark, you try and leverage this argument of unproductive inactivity against us, and that's where I vehemently disagree with you. While yes, Kawl and I have absent from the debate for many, many hours, we returned with the fruits of our labour from our alleged inactivity, that our 2 defense posts are.

Those 2 posts are proof that we have not been idle in our absence. We have not been inactive in our absence and we came back with proof of it. You asked for an alternative plan from us and now you got it.

Your frustration and whining comes off to me as being irritated that we stood up to you in the end, since you apparently want us gone as quickly as possible and even said as much when you asked for everyone to end the Day early to get us out already. You have not been accommodating of us at all.

In comparison, now, Team BLAWL has been nothing but accommodating of you and your POV as I feel like I have objectively taken it into consideration in our defense posts.

In the interest of moving this discussion onwards like you only say you want; we are very different in our use of time, evidently, so the best we can do is try to keep up with each other. I hope we can come to an accord on this.

So, my proposal is very simple, in the end. The crux of our argument revolves around the section in our Part 2 which states that the greater lead-generation we feel is resultant from a Timeflux lynch than either of us first, is more beneficial to Town.

In light of that, don't make statements like this,



in which you suggest that I'm going for quantity over quality. If you want a concession made for your playstyle, don't try to denigrate other people's contributions along the same lines.

Fine, I agree that may seem like a preemptive jab at your play-style, and I sincerely apologize if I seem like a hypocrite there.

I was trying to more emphasize constructive critique of our proposal regardless of the number of posts such was spread over; I wasn't trying to specifically attack high post-count players for being high post-count. Me, The Silver Medalist himself, of all people, doing that? Honestly, I would never.
 
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