Not really, I own one of these... Move charging dock.
Currently just £3.00 new on UK Amazon if anyone wants to get one.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-PlayStation-Move-Charging-Station/dp/B004477IZA/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1456378633&sr=8-4
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30min PSVR technical presentation (Feb.2016)
- Thread starter Man
- Start date
Currently just £3.00 new on UK Amazon if anyone wants to get one.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-PlayStation-Move-Charging-Station/dp/B004477IZA/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1456378633&sr=8-4
Fushichou187
Member
Dope. Thanks for this. I've got that and 2 Move controllers on ordering speed dial should they announce a PSVR+Move bundle that's more expensive than if I were to by them separately.
Just video? Or real time CG engine? I cant imagine that there wouldnt be a VR media player that launches with PSVR that lets you load your own videos. As well as just streaming vids from website with the web browser.
But we will see.
Ninja Sharingan
Banned
I'm sure I have that charging dock somewhere but for the price of a coffee I'll risk getting another.
Anyone know if there are cheap move controllers in the UK or are they releasing a new model?
Anyone know if there are cheap move controllers in the UK or are they releasing a new model?
Muskieratboi
Member
So pretty much identical to what was previously revealed.
I wonder at how fine grained is the 3d audio processing.
They could take continuous stream of head orientation and do the audio accordingly.
Certainly will be interesting to hear how they have interleaved couple of video streams etc.
biglittleps
Member
You can see the 60% more results from sony first party studios games, but not quite from many others because it depends on how much efforts they put to optimize the game by using the low level control PS4 provides and their skills. If the developer is skilled then they can get more out of PS4 otherwise it will be worse which is why many games we see struggle due to lack of optimizations for being multi platform game and their budget/time.
biglittleps
Member
How do you connect PS camera to PC which it needs to work ?
Yep. PS Camera is a propierty connector. I suppose you could maybe use some third party camera. Do they sell cheap stereo web cams? And eventually figure out the tracking algoriths(not sure how easy or hard thatd be) but regardless it wont be anywhere near a day 1 hack I think, nor something straightforward for PC users to even implement once its potetially figured out.
Having more choice is always better. Job Simulator devs target 90fps for all platforms, and they do that so they could simplify their multiplatform development effort.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xu7rmcudGNI
I too think this is the case with timewarp, this way it also provides support for 3d head translation, and I believe PSVR reprojection is a basic 2d rotate / 2d scale / 2d translate, which means it doesn't support a 3d re-projection, but it also means the only artifacting would be because of the 2d resampling. That's probably why they say they now always turn it on, it doesn't make sense to turn it off if it doesn't have off-putting artifacts.
Mac@NeoGAF
Banned
PC with a Vive/Occulus & 970 = Real Sugar
PS4 with PSVR & reprojection = Artificial Sweetener.
AMD recently started to promote 3D audio when they introduced TrueAudio, so I presume many devs are introduced to the concept of spacial rendering of sound.
I expect that devs will be "forced" to start using 3D audio because tools for using it will become easier [streamlined support in Unity/UE4/other engines] and because having it will greatly enhance VR experience. They could later also be "pressure from the public" to make 3D audio standard feature for VR experiences.
One of middleware providers who said something like that was Epic.
https://youtu.be/W8bREFpp2o8?t=1551
http://www.twitch.tv/unrealengine/v/7616153?t=21m52s
They ported street Showdown demo from PC to PS4 without touching any of the assets. According to the dev who ported the demo, PS4 [rendering at 60fps] can provide equivalent VR experience as PC with 970/980 grade card. Of course PC has more CPU resources, so PS4 could be compromised in CPU area.
this is very true
However I also would like the box to create the usual speaker room stuff by default for all games that don't create a true soundfield out of geometry data. Doing this right would make SBX, Dolby Headphone, Sonic Soundstage and all other stuff totally obsolete.
No need for other devices meaning less wires, less clutter etc..
Doesn't most middleware actually support various binaural plugins by now? Older games could get patched in as well so the breakout Box gets all the data and does its "magic". "Speaker room virtualization" could die even sooner. I don't believe in most devs other than Sony doing it however.
To people expecting PSVR on PC (with PC modding/hack), at the 12 minute mark, he said the breakout box had 2 hdmi outs, then corrected himself, saying it had one hdmi out (for the TV) and another connection to the headset, so apparently proprietary connection for the headset? So connecting to the PC will probably not be possible.
Valve's portal demo adjusts scene comolexity o the fly to maintain a steady framerate. I think approaches like that will hopefully become more widespread, which would help to mitigate valid concerns over the variety of PC configurations and the potential difficulty maintaining a solid framerate - it is not valid IMO to put the onus entirely on the user to configure the settings to do that.
Also the gtx970 recommended soec should help with that too
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
I think they are talking about just connecting the breakout box to the PC as well. He doesn't directly say it, but he basically implies that the breakout box connects to the "video out" on the PS4, making HDMI the most likely port the breakout box plugs into seeing as that weird proprietary port they have is occupied by the PS4 camera.
Not that simple. The breakout box handles conversion of audio samples and 3D location data into binaural audio. That data must be sent over the HDMI cable which means that the HDMI signal is carrying data as well as video. I don't know how they are doing that, but it might be that the breakout box won't accept a standard HDMI video signal that a PC would output.
And positional tracking Would have to be done from scratch with a PC webcam as the PS camera has a proprietary connector (or maybe you can hack that into a USB3 plug)
The audio might be possible to do separately via a long headphone cable from the PC, and the headset data is probably going via Bluetooth like a DS4? Didn't see anything about needing a USB cable with PSVR
I got the impression that the data being sent to the breakout box isn't a standard HDMI signal either (has other information as well?). If I followed correctly the only "real" HDMI data is being transmitted from the breakout box on the HDMI out to the TV.
boredandlazy
Member
I'm pretty sure the breakout box connects to the PS4 via USB as well as HDMI.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Well, I don't think people were suggesting you could just plug the breakout box into your GPU and have it magically work. They'd obviously have to hack together some way to send the same kind of data the PS4 is sending. I don't think that would be technically impossible, just pretty hard. So godspeed, hackers.
Could be, but it won't be easy and it definitely won't be day 1, might not even be year 1.
Edit: I mean, it'd require hacking of the GPU drivers to get it to output something other than standard HDMI right? And then there are different drivers for different cards etc.
Eww, front USB socket used? Wonder if the bandwidth is enough to send the audio data that way. Might be simpler than using HDMI as a data channel - not really familiar with how flexible HDMI can be in that regard. Might just use the USB for sending headset movement data back
Sidewinder
Member
3D audio is already a standard feature for VR.
I was talking about the possibility of bringing 3D audio to non-VR experiences (using the dedicated processor of the PSVR PU box for that purpose alone)
Noisepurge
Member
i already bought the camera as those prices will definitely jump back up to 60$
can find one for 20-30$ now.No, it doesn't correct for translation. Also labeling the transformation as "2d" is a bit silly - since the whole point is that you rotate the image around on a "sphere" to correct for rotation - else the effect wouldn't do anything useful.hesido said:
I think we've had historical evidence developers do care since prerecorded binaural had been used in some horror games to great effect. That said - I think the biggest advantage of doing it in VR is positional tracking that you wouldn't get in a normal game, so it's questionable if doing it realtime really adds much to regular games.TTP said:
Noisepurge
Member
which is why i believe they will manufacture a new Move v.2 model later on as well. After they've sold out all the stock of the old model
According to Abrash, everything under 20ms is great and is enough to fool the brain.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
The PS4 has USB 3.0 ports, there's more than enough bandwidth for some tracking data + audio.
SolidusDave
Member
I would say it's very possible as it's really basically just a Mixamp-type device. Any game's 5.1 / 7.1 audio comes in with the HDMI output and gets processed into something resembling e.g. Dolby Headphone so that you can hear surround(3D audio) with normal stereo headphones. They just need to flip a switch for non-VR games.
In fact, do we know how it is set up? Will the HDMI going out from the VR box be the new default HDMI or will it require you to have two HDMI cables and switch between channels on your TV for normal vs. VR games? I highly doubt it will be the latter so once you have PSVR everything should be routed through that box, in which case it's likely that all audio will be converted for headphones by default.
btw I think the USB connection is just for powering the box. Edit: wait no, it also has to transmit the data of the VR helmet sensors of course.
Possibly also to transmit your voice during voice chat (if your headset has a microphone). Sucks that they couldn't just use the port on the back and plug the camera into the box.
VR is going "back" to object-based/geometry data based audio. That's how you do proper 3D audio. By feeding a capable renderer all the geo data of the game world and its objects, especially the elevation information.
Mixamp style is a virtualized flat speaker room and should just be a fall back mode for games that do not release xyz data because the renderer/middleware doesn't allow it and thus simply outputs 7.1/5.1 discrete streams - as we are used to in the almost last 10 years, unfortunately. That would make devices like the mixamp, dss, x7 and co. obsolete.
SolidusDave
Member
Can you expand on why that is needed for VR? Isn't that the point of surround sound in games, rendering it live based on the positional data (usually of the camera/point of view)? I don't get the difference. Why would you need to process the surround audio synced to the camera (i.e. VR helmet) movements afterwards?
PuppetMaster
Member
That slide explains a lot about why Job Simulator is no fun to play..
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Probably, really not an expert here. But this could actually make or break this situation for some GPUs since at least from Maxwell onwards, Nvidia cards need signed drivers so you couldn't even use weird custom ones.
I'm actually not sure. I have no way of trying it.
It's not really a porn app it's just an app connecting your PS4 / Vita to your DMM account. DMM being a site that has videos, browser games, etc. You can't even purchase anything through the PS4 app, it basically just accesses your account and lets you view things on your PS4. It's like calling the built in media player a porn app.
The one thing I am worried about is the actual size of the render targets.
Now PS4 can do 1080P with 60FPS....that's fine.
But VR essentially means splitting this 1920*1080 image, meaning the image we get is considerably less crisp compared to Vive/Rift with their 1512x1680 for each eye.
Although even in the case of Vive/Rift the final image that the player sees is still less than 1080P. But I donno how much of a practical difference that makes when you actually see it. I'd also assume since they are using native resolution displays there would be no upscaling regardless of them using sub 1080P buffers which might make it look good.
Now PS4 can do 1080P with 60FPS....that's fine.
But VR essentially means splitting this 1920*1080 image, meaning the image we get is considerably less crisp compared to Vive/Rift with their 1512x1680 for each eye.
Although even in the case of Vive/Rift the final image that the player sees is still less than 1080P. But I donno how much of a practical difference that makes when you actually see it. I'd also assume since they are using native resolution displays there would be no upscaling regardless of them using sub 1080P buffers which might make it look good.
Vive and Oculus Rift are 1080x1200 per eye, pentile oled @ 90hz.
PSVR is 960x1080 per eye, RGB oled @ 120hz.
2d, as in the re-projection doesn't account for depth in the source, according to the sources so far.
it's kinda hard to explain without going into horrible lengths, but maybe I misunderstood you. The simplest important difference is "granularity" or how precise an object in the space is rendered and thus giving you better locating sounds -> more immersion.
You the player should be part of the world. You should hear the world similarly how you hear when you walk around in the real world and not be the player that has 7.1 speakers strapped around his head like a giant helmet.
Almost all games in the last decade output fully mixed 5.1/7.1 streams through middleware, simply a flat speaker room. Sure you can hear behind you and infront of you and left right and it adds much more to the immersion than 2.0. You can turn around with your character and know where a sound cue is playing but it's not like hearing in real life. It's still vague and approximated. And it's simple as well as it should be able to run off the CPU.
In real life so much more happens (like reflections, waves bouncing off, absorption etc..) and most important: your head and its movement defines how you hear as well, your pinnea too..etc...but that's another topic. The important thing to know is that you turn your head naturally to hear stuff better or to trace a sound. VR absolutely MUST render that too.
A cat is singing and dancing above you? You look up because you can hear it's above you and then the sound changes because you're literally facing it. That's what presence requires. An approximation of natural hearing.
Can you please explain (to someone who has never used VR) what the 'screendoor effect' is.
Thank you in advance.
A visible black border around every pixel, like looking through a screen door.
Sage advice. That's why I'm also stocking up on any available attachments while the price is right.
Official gun attachment - £2.50
PS Move Controller - £10 (was £8 a couple of weeks ago)
FantasticMrSnake
Member
And we know all this for science
and masturbation
Anyway, looking forward for price & release date
Nice tip!, I'm going to go to cex tomorrow, would I need a navigation controller as well or just 2 moves?
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